FFDL [draft starts this Saturday!]

[Stanford]

You're confusing a problem with a brilliant strategy.

I don't think a season limit works. If someone gets injured mid season and his owner hasn't used any moves, that leaves him to stream for the rest of the year.

[Young_Star11]

I see where you are coming from - you needed to do what you did in order to win.

Another suggestion - weekly lineups

[bww78]

Let's just make a weekly limit. That's what they do on ESPN.

[writersblock]

So yes, I do think there's an advantage and it would be a shame if WB makes it into the playoffs due to excessive streaming instead of one of the better teams that will probably be on the bubble (AlciG, TheMan, Ham).

Except that on average, I've had 3 guys off and on my roster a week (which isn't egregious), and as many have said, sometimes it's 2 guys on the same day, as I can't make up my mind sometimes. My team has been legitimately strong all season, with big surprises from guys like Channing Frye, Jerebko, and the now-injured Louis Williams. Bottom line is, I'm legitimately a playoff contender. Now, this week, everyone has played pretty crappy. My team would be much stronger with Curry and Turk. Vince has been a dud, Ford sucks (for now) and Barbosa is injured. As I said, that trade with Sly WAS for the future. I think Ford will be better in the future seasons, but this one, he sucks. Barbosa will be better come the new year.

Another point on my streaming, I SHOULD have streamed in CJ Miles on Thursday. I even had him on Wednesday night, but then realized that I'd rather have the better player than get an edge on you this week, so I dropped him. Just my luck, he dropped 20+ points that Thursday game.

Fact is, if Carl wants to talk streaming, let's talk about strategically adding guys you're not going to keep just to beat someone in a category. The only category that I own that Carl could take is Blocks, and he strategically added the guy with the highest blocks on waivers: James Johnson. Is that foul-play? Heck no. I applaud Carl for it. It might give him a 7-2 win. I think it'll stay 6-3, but 7-2 is now possible.

I don't consider Brian a streamer. Unlike Fran, who added Leon Powe specifically on Saturday for a Sunday night game on about seven occasions, you will find that Brian makes moves to find in-form players...and when they fade, he finds others. Also, as George mentioned, he's also changes his mind quite often.

I agree with Jordan here. Across leagues, my strategy is always to have 2 flex spots, where I rotate players in and out like an open door until one fits. Sometimes it works, sometimes it has cost me. I've lost guys just when they were getting going, like Casspi and even Ben Wallace (surprised I got him back this year).

I also agree with Sly. I don't think streaming works. I've added and dropped this week like CRAZY...is it streaming? That's up to you. I legitimately thought that guys like Ridnour were done, so I went fishing for someone better. Turns out, Ridnour put up good numbers in limited minutes, so I was LUCKY enough to get him back. I think you pay the price for dropping someone in any competitive league like this. Streaming might be a short-term gain...MIGHT be...but it's a long-term loss. See "Lawson, Ty" and Coady's predicament. there have only been a few teams that I think it has even helped. Coady's come from behind win was probably more of a result of Paul coming back than his streaming, no matter what he says.

I think a weekly limit, or season-wide limit will only complicate things, and will hurt more people than be a help to guard against streaming.

[Stanford]

a limit won't complicate anything. It can be programmed into the league settings. It takes care of itself.

[CFan21]

Fact is, if Carl wants to talk streaming, let's talk about strategically adding guys you're not going to keep just to beat someone in a category. The only category that I own that Carl could take is Blocks, and he strategically added the guy with the highest blocks on waivers: James Johnson. Is that foul-play? Heck no. I applaud Carl for it. It might give him a 7-2 win. I think it'll stay 6-3, but 7-2 is now possible.

Not to get all snipey, but oh what the hell. I added James Johnson because he's a high upside, relatively high draft pick and I read an article recently that the front office was demanding Del Negro get him more minutes. I also had a 34-year-old stopgap point guard that scored a grand total of 2 points in his last two games and I watched Stan Van trust Anthony Johnson with the important minutes last night. Obviously, there's no future there and I saw the first sniff at a potential home run pick in a while given that Johnson is young, athletic and long and on a team that rewards those qualities.

I'm within my suggestion of five moves a week buddy and includes dropping Hinrich to the IL, then having him come back sooner than expected. You have made 8 moves so far this week, with no outside incentive (i.e. an IL player) and only one of them was an oh-whoops-decided-I-want-the-other-guy move. Your last move you dropped 22-year-old CJ Miles with better production for 31-year-old journeyman role player Mo Evans, who happens to play Sunday. That wasn't streaming?

[writersblock]

Fact is, if Carl wants to talk streaming, let's talk about strategically adding guys you're not going to keep just to beat someone in a category. The only category that I own that Carl could take is Blocks, and he strategically added the guy with the highest blocks on waivers: James Johnson. Is that foul-play? Heck no. I applaud Carl for it. It might give him a 7-2 win. I think it'll stay 6-3, but 7-2 is now possible.

Not to get all snipey, but oh what the hell. I added James Johnson because he's a high upside, relatively high draft pick and I read an article recently that the front office was demanding Del Negro get him more minutes. I also had a 34-year-old stopgap point guard that scored a grand total of 2 points in his last two games and I watched Stan Van trust Anthony Johnson with the important minutes last night. Obviously, there's no future there and I saw the first sniff at a potential home run pick in a while given that Johnson is young, athletic and long and on a team that rewards those qualities.

I'm with my suggestion of five moves a week buddy and includes dropping Hinrich to the IL, then having him come back sooner than expected. You have made 8 moves so far this week, with no outside incentive (i.e. an IL player) and only one of them was an oh-whoops-decided-I-want-the-other-guy move. Your last move you dropped 22-year-old CJ Miles with better production for 31-year-old journeyman role player Mo Evans, who happens to play Sunday. That wasn't streaming?

No, not really. If I liked CJ Miles enough, I would have just kept him, but I think that Miles is an inconsistent player, and I just noticed today that Mo Evans has started to go on a tear. I've been waiting for him to do that all year. He should have been getting this kind of run all year, taking the place of Flip's minutes.

As for James Johnson...nice try. They've been saying that about him for the last 2 weeks. I know because I've been waiting to SEE them actually live up to that demand, as I've had my trigger finger ready to add him. Anyone can see that he's a small 5-10 minute player who gets great blocks in limited time. Nice try though.

Either way, no amount of my 8 drops would have changed the outcome of our week. I've added and dropped guards, and frankly, I have no chance of beating you in points, 3s, or assists. So the logic doesn't hold there. In fact, adding and dropping guards should have killed one of my advantages--TOs. You'll win this one 6-3, unless James Johnson gives you an advantage in blocks...as you planned.

[CFan21]

Broheim, that doesn't even make sense. CJ was out because of thumb surgery and has been consistently getting 20+ minutes since he returned. Evans played 20 minutes for first time in a month and that's only because the Hawks last two games were blowouts.

Say what you like about me secretly trying to steal blocks, but the fact is that Johnson has been getting consistent minutes since that warning to Del Negro and I saw what might have been a breakthrough game. The 8 of 8 at the free throw line was actually what caught my eye more than the blocks, although I won't complain if he helps me there too.

I will say that the Mo-stream was clever because it looks like another blowout tonight against New Jersey and more minutes for the . All I can hope for is that you've managed to talk yourself into having to hold on to Mo and accepting his future 14 mpg (did I mention that he's never averaged 10 points a season and has no upside!) or else you prove to everyone that you're a fraud. Either way I win really, but anyways, back to the vote on streaming.

[CFan21]

For any of you just joining us, so it doesn't get lost amongst the bickering between Brian and I.

So let's take a vote:
Post whether you're for or against a move limit, whether it be weekly or yearly. If you don't post, I'll take it that you don't care.

We can take it from there.

I'm for a weekly move limit.

I'm for a move limit. My suggestion would be either 5/week or a cap of 100 per season.

5 moves per week sounds good to me.

5 moves per week sounds fine if we go that route. I'm also ok if we don't put a moves limit, for reasons previously stated.

We can make a change now to add some boundaries to increase fair play.

My suggestion is: 50 moves for the season and 5 moves a week for playoff rounds, and 7 moves for the final 'week'.

Let's just make a weekly limit. That's what they do on ESPN.

I think a weekly limit, or season-wide limit will only complicate things, and will hurt more people than be a help to guard against streaming.

a limit won't complicate anything. It can be programmed into the league settings. It takes care of itself.

[writersblock]

Broheim, that doesn't even make sense. CJ was out because of thumb surgery and has been consistently getting 20+ minutes since he returned. Evans played 20 minutes for first time in a month and that's only because the Hawks last two games were blowouts.

Say what you like about me secretly trying to steal blocks, but the fact is that Johnson has been getting consistent minutes since that warning to Del Negro and I saw what might have been a breakthrough game. The 8 of 8 at the free throw line was actually what caught my eye more than the blocks, although I won't complain if he helps me there too.

I will say that the Mo-stream was clever because it looks like another blowout tonight against New Jersey and more minutes for the . All I can hope for is that you've managed to talk yourself into having to hold on to Mo and accepting his future 14 mpg (did I mention that he's never averaged 10 points a season and has no upside!) or else you prove to everyone that you're a fraud. Either way I win really, but anyways, back to the vote on streaming.

The apparent "Mo-stream" might have been clever, if it would help me. There's no way I'm going to catch you in the stats Mo offers up (points, 3s). It's like I said, he's a place holder. If you want to lead the charge on calling out any streamers, Senator McCarthy, then go ahead. I'll go along with it. I think it'll cause more problems than it's worth, but it'll probably make me less fickle on my players and really commit...which might actually make my team even better. So, yeah, I'm fine with a weekly limit or season-limit. I'm not fine with going from a daily to a weekly roster set up. I just think it negates your bench too much and it makes the game annoying.

I will say this...If you weren't so dead set on trash talking me and my team, I probably wouldn't have cared about our little game this week, and not cared that I had the best possible players when I was playing you, and therefore, left my loser players on my team most of the week with no thought about replacing them.

Either way, 1) you're going to win 6-3 this week, so the point is moot and 2) RIP is back tonight (finally), so I'll be one flexible roster spot down. Now...who to drop...who to drop?

[theman]

As for James Johnson...nice try. They've been saying that about him for the last 2 weeks. I know because I've been waiting to SEE them actually live up to that demand, as I've had my trigger finger ready to add him. Anyone can see that he's a small 5-10 minute player who gets great blocks in limited time. Nice try though.

So why didn't you hold on to him when you had him if he is such a great talent?

Either way, no amount of my 8 drops would have changed the outcome of our week.

So why do it? Please, explain your plan because if you are not streaming what exactly are you doing. Do you just suck at evaluating talent?

I believe in my players. Perhaps I have too much faith that some will turn it around. However, I have been payed of handsomely (when YS isn't destroying my plans). Look at Carmello. Last season he had a bit of a down season and people offered me crap for him. He is an MVP candidate this season.

I've added and dropped guards, and frankly, I have no chance of beating you in points, 3s, or assists. So the logic doesn't hold there. In fact, adding and dropping guards should have killed one of my advantages--TOs. You'll win this one 6-3, unless James Johnson gives you an advantage in blocks...as you planned.

Don't be crying about him streaming in one guy.

No, not really. If I liked CJ Miles enough, I would have just kept him, but I think that Miles is an inconsistent player, and I just noticed today that Mo Evans has started to go on a tear. I've been waiting for him to do that all year. He should have been getting this kind of run all year, taking the place of Flip's minutes.

The apparent "Mo-stream" might have been clever, if it would help me. There's no way I'm going to catch you in the stats Mo offers up (points, 3s). It's like I said, he's a place holder.

So which is it? Is he a place holder of a great talent you just picked up?

[theman]

Is there a way, instead of pointing in a move limit instead saying a player must remain on a roster for a certain number of games before being dropped?

I have a hunch that Mo Evans (whoever that is) will be back on the waiver wire by Tuesday.

I hate streamers. I find it childish and annoying. If a manager can not draft players he believes in perhaps you should stick with Yahoo public leagues. I am in another league that does have a limit of 3 moves per week ( I think Fran was in it at one point, thus the limit) and I have only once hit that and my team stinks (auto picked). I sort of prefer a seasonal limit only because some times you need to make more moves. Fifty moves in a season should be plenty.

As for the rules changing. I hate to change rules mid season or even at all. I would like to saw no rule changes, however, if certain people can not control themselves I will have to vote for a limit.

[Stanford]

If a manager can not draft players he believes in perhaps you should stick with Yahoo public leagues.

A) That doesn't really apply to this league.

B) And if your top draft pick has a career ending injury?

Your ideals for this league are nice and poetic and all, but they're not based in reality.

[insfo]

I'm ok with a weekly limit .. 4 would be even better.

Whats the deal with Oden? Is he fair game since he was dropped before missing his 5th game?

[Stanford]

Wait, what?

[Stanford]

Oh ffs, I was just looking at points and not minutes.

I'll have to use my waiver priority on him

****

Edit: Can't do that either. Guess he's themans now

Damn

[Young_Star11]

Why can't you use the #1 priority?

If theman adds Oden, he will have to wait five games.

[writersblock]

Why did you implement the weekly limit without any official vote outside of Carl's rantings?

Now I can't add RIP off the IL.

I thought we would at least wait until the new season. We usually don't make changes like this in the middle of the season. If you're going to make a change, at least wait until this week is up.

Another problem, btw, with weekly limits is that trades cost you move points, and if I want to do a trade, I can't now. I highly doubt that trades should count as streaming.

EDIT: Nevermind. Thanks Jordan for switching it back. I'll be switching Barbosa to the IL for Hamilton on Tuesday

[theman]

Why can't you use the #1 priority?

If theman adds Oden, he will have to wait five games.

Isn't this the Blake Griffin rule? If not, I will gladly take him.

[Stanford]

Why can't you use the #1 priority?

You can't put a waiver claim on a player you've dropped.

Isn't this the Blake Griffin rule?

Did we even decide what that rule was? The way I see it, Jordan only got Griffin back because a) He's the commisioner and b) I bitched about it enough.

Obviously I'd be thrilled to take the extra five game penalty.