Heisly's Frustration

[finnegan]

There have been other teams like Memphis who were good enough to get you excited, and are on the cusp of making it to the next level.

But I think that it is unfair that they have to extend Max contracts to their best players, because that doesn't necessarily take them to the next level, and those best player are clearly not getting it done. On the other hand, if Memphis were to do a major shakeup to make it to the next level, like Orlando did when they had Ben Wallace, then the team will live to regret that too.

I don't claim to know the answer on what to do for a team on the cusp, but Chicago opening their checkbook for a plyer like Carlos Boozer, certainly seems to be a move in the right direction. I am not sure what Heisly is thinking, as it seems that there were essentially no major transactions over the summer. Isn't that the definition of insanity -- doing the same thing and expecting a different result.

TI hope that Memphis holds out on ZBo, and only pays what another team is willing to pay him in the open market. I am glad that a player with his skills found a home in Memphis, but I don't think that he deserves anywhere near a max extension, since both hard and soft skills determine everyones value in an open market, and Zbo has burned lots of bridges.

If you sign Gasol and ZBo to Max contracts (or close to that), then I don't see that taking you to where you want to go, since you'll be maxed out for many years with Gay, Conely, Gasol, and ZBo. Just my opinion.

[GrizzledGrizzFan]

I hope that the Grizz remain focused on Marc as the first option. I'm not sold on Zach as a long term piece at the price he's reportedly seeking. Don't get me wrong, Zach has every right and should try to get every $ he can - at/near max money I just hope it's not with the Grizz.

This whole seasons just been bizarre as all get out for the Grizz.

[vanjulio]

Ben Wallace played for Orlando?

Heisley shouldn't surprised at all. They low-balled the 2 rookie contracts and sold the thrid at a yard sale price to Dallas. Their big offseason move was overpaying Rudy Gay one day 0 of free agency and then hiring a 10th man from Boston for $3M.

Overall the team has gotten worse too. Tony Parker and Tim Duncan are worse but the team has improved by adding certain players and changing roles (Manu is now the top gun). for example.

[finnegan]

Ben Wallace played for Orlando?

Yes. And they were about as good as Memphis is now, except they did it with a bunch of "no-names" (at the time). Made a decent run in the playoffs if I remember correctly.

But management being management, they thought that it was good managment that created good teams, and not good players. So they blew up the team and let Wallace go to Detroit for essentially nothing in return.

The truth is, it takes good managment and good players, who fit together well!

Memphis needs to something in between of what Oralndo did during the period I described, and what they themselves did last summer (i.e., nothing but hand out undeserved max contracts), if they want to make it to the playoffs.

[jman3134]

Not sure Tony Allen is really a 10th man on an NBA roster. I think the major concern is that he has not fit in with out system, which isn't very structured at all. Allen is a system player and thus it's clear why he is struggling to adjust. I think we just need to give him more time.

The problem lies primarily with OJ Mayo and Marc Gasol regressing this season. It's not that our bench did not get better. Instead, it's that our starters got worse.

[finnegan]

I saw a highlight where Gasol recevied a pass near the free throw line, and took it in for a layup.

I could have swore that it was in slow motion!

Has he never been very mobile, or is he suffering from some sort of injury? His brother Pau is pretty dang mobile.

[GrizzledGrizzFan]

I saw a highlight where Gasol recevied a pass near the free throw line, and took it in for a layup.

I could have swore that it was in slow motion!

Has he never been very mobile, or is he suffering from some sort of injury? His brother Pau is pretty dang mobile.

Marc's currently recovering from a severely sprained ankle suffered the day before the first game of the season. He missed one game (instead of sitting out 2-4 weeks). That said, Marc is a true 5. He's not, never has been and never will be as mobile as Pau.

[Downtown]

Early on Gasol battled an ankle problem so I think he might be still less than 100%, but no one knows for sure. He certainly isn't at the level he was last season.

And that's one of the issues, among others, as I see it. Last season him and Randolph were argueably the most physical duo in the league, which not only wore frontlines down, it also opened up a bit more room for their perimiter players since teams collapsed more. Like GrizzledGrizz Fan said, it's bizarre this year. That duo isn't working well. Who knows what has got into Mayo's head. He has proved he's much, much better than how he's playing this year. Gay has been more productive and so has Conley. And the bench is still a weak spot in my opinion.

The difficult part for the team is that there really isn't one thing you can put your finger on and say if we shore that up things will improve. It just seems like they aren't tight as a starting five like last year. What makes it more frustrating is that they showed that cohesiveness in pre season.

I definitely don't care for Heisley, but I think he spoke for many Grizzlies followers when he said it makes yopu scratch your head trying to figure out what has gone wrong and it's very dissapointing how this team that figured to take the next step has regressed with the same starting group.

Trades may be the answer but I don't exactly know what would be the right change. Obviously the easiest place to point your finger is at OJ Mayo. But his value is low, he is a better player than he's showing at the moment, and I honestly don't know what they could get in return for him that would make the Grizzlies turn around the season.

I hate to say it but yet again I agree with Heisley that working through this slump until the allstar break might be the only route to take. It's not easy .

[finnegan]

It just seems like they aren't tight as a starting five like last year.

This may be the thing that I was missing. Is Memphis's record worse this year than it was at the same time last year? If so, then I can see why he is frustrated, especially after rewarding with inflated contracts.

However; if the record is approximately the same as it was at this point last year, then I am still confused, since history usually repeats itself. Why would Heisley expect a different result.

Some people take a while to get in a groove, and I would anticipate that happening again, if your players had a better second half of last season then they did at the first half.

[jman3134]

There's little intrinsically different about the beginning of the year. We came together at the end of last year and then Rudy and Conley improved over the summer. Gasol and OJ have since regressed. (I'm sure their statistics are different from last year around this time) Thus, these losses should not be expected because they do not parallel last year's at all.

[vanjulio]

we went on a really amazing win streak in December around this time last year though.... which carried until February. That has to happen again for us to consider this year as successful as last year. Hollins said many times to the press that this team "overachieved" last season. I think that is his way of saying they needed more firepower to reach those playoff expectations.

[dark-child]

We are entirely too young to compete at the level necessary to sustain annual playoff participation. Therefore we are too dependent upon guys who don't really know the game and how to win and the veterans we do have do not make a big enough impact in the lineup. College Basketball is the only place where a young team can have success and grow together minus a true superstar player leading the way.

IMO a trade is the only option, as it is highly unlikely the light will go off and the team begin to understand game situations, clearly defined roles, defensive rotations, pick & roll defense, transition basketball, and team unity.

[Shootdabull]

Ben Wallace played for Orlando?

Yes. And they were about as good as Memphis is now, except they did it with a bunch of "no-names" (at the time). Made a decent run in the playoffs if I remember correctly.

But management being management, they thought that it was good managment that created good teams, and not good players. So they blew up the team and let Wallace go to Detroit for essentially nothing in return.

The truth is, it takes good managment and good players, who fit together well!

Memphis needs to something in between of what Oralndo did during the period I described, and what they themselves did last summer (i.e., nothing but hand out undeserved max contracts), if they want to make it to the playoffs.

Actually if memory serves me correctly, Orlando had Miami heat like plan at the time. They went the top free agents in Grant Hill and Tim Duncan. Duncan decided to stay with the spurs so they turned to t-mac. For Grant Hill they worked out a sign and trade and sent Wallace as part of the package to Detroit. The magic looked to be in great shaped but Hill got injured and his large salary ended up hand cuffing them as he played very limited games/minutes. The sign and trade ended up working out well for the pistons as Wallace became defensive stallwart until he sign the big contract with the bulls when he turned from big ben to big bum.
I don't think you are going to have the salary flexability to pull off a magic like plan. I think you will get caught in the salary pinch that we were in a couple of years ago when we had to let Ben Gordon walk, because we had a bunch of good players going for that second contract.

[mid-post]

I don't think you are going to have the salary flexability to pull off a magic like plan. I think you will get caught in the salary pinch that we were in a couple of years ago when we had to let Ben Gordon walk, because we had a bunch of good players going for that second contract.

It depends on how the Grizzlies handle Randolph and OJ. If they sign ZBo to a $12 million+/yr contract instead of trading him (or OJ), then yeah, they could be stuck with inflexibility. But OJ isn't going to be getting a Deng-level offer. He'll struggle to garner a Hinrich-level offer at this point. And there's no way that Randolph, at 30, is getting anything more than $13 million a year or more than 4 years.
The Bulls front office made the decision to sign Hinrich, Deng and pick up Ben Wallace. BG wanted more than what Reinsdorf was comfortable with. Ultimately the Bulls still could have kept him (at the cost of going into lux tax) but their gamble only halfway worked out; they lost Gordon but you guys still wound up with a very nice team (mostly due to draft picks).
Zach's a fairly important part of this offense, but I'm not sure the front office is going to keep this roster together through February if Memphis hasn't made serious strides to be in solid playoff contention. Or, come April, made some noise in the playoffs.
The Bulls were kind of painted into a corner because their roster had made the playoffs and had pretty successful seasons for multiple years; management probably didn't want to blow up the squad. I don't know if Memphis is going to be handcuffed by success like the Bulls were.

[Shootdabull]

It depends on how the Grizzlies handle Randolph and OJ. If they sign ZBo to a $12 million+/yr contract instead of trading him (or OJ), then yeah, they could be stuck with inflexibility. But OJ isn't going to be getting a Deng-level offer. He'll struggle to garner a Hinrich-level offer at this point. And there's no way that Randolph, at 30, is getting anything more than $13 million a year or more than 4 years.

I agree and this is where your tough choices are going to be. You have two productive big men coming up for contracts and atleast Gasol is in for a huge raise even if you can keep zbo at around $13M. OJ still has alot potential and while he may not get deng $$ I think he will get a good payday maybe like ben gordon. With how productive zbo has been for you it would be tough to let him walk away as a free agent. The decision is do you lock into a good team conley/mayo/gay/zbo/gasol and hope improvement comes from within mayo/thabeet/henry or do you decide henry is a better fit than Mayo so to to trade him for picks or a young PF. Then use the zbo dollars for your cap flexibility. I think this is why heisley is frustrated as he would like to see this as a playoff team, but by struggling he is almost forced to start switching out some pieces probably sooner than he would like.

[mid-post]

I hear you. But honestly, other than his reputation for "potential," OJ hasn't done anything to receive the kind of offer the Pistons gave to Gordon. Not to mention Gordon was/is considered overpaid by a fair number of people.

Just compare their career stats:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... obe01.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... ooj01.html

I'd be really surprised if OJ got anything more than $10 million per year at this point. Of course he might just be tanking to get traded, but it seems more like a case where he is struggling mightily in his reserve role.

[mid-post]

I don't think it's been updated to account for Conley's deal, but this is where the Grizz stand financially:
http://www.shamsports.com/content/pages ... zzlies.jsp
It's really not that bad now. It could get worse, but it looks like Memphis has more than enough room to sign Marc and move OJ and/or ZBo in sign+trades if that's what it comes to.

[Shootdabull]

I hear you. But honestly, other than his reputation for "potential," OJ hasn't done anything to receive the kind of offer the Pistons gave to Gordon. Not to mention Gordon was/is considered overpaid by a fair number of people.

Just compare their career stats:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... obe01.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... ooj01.html

I'd be really surprised if OJ got anything more than $10 million per year at this point. Of course he might just be tanking to get traded, but it seems more like a case where he is struggling mightily in his reserve role.

I am assuming that OJ show enough improvement to keep teams interested in getting him. I know the bulls board would to like have him but the nay sayers do point out how bad he is struggling. I just look at Tyrus Thomas, always showing flashes but never really improving. We gave up on him - got a pick and he got a good deal I think starting around $7.5M. I would think OJ could match that amount as free agent today. I realize my assuptions that he will show improvement maybe flawed as I kept thinking TT would improve. I did take a look at the salary structure on the link you sent and you are in better shape than I thought. I forgot about Jaric and I thought the conley deal was reasonable. it will be interesting to see if you keep Zach or go off after another FA. Also, if the team is struggling you may get more for OJ at this trade deadline than next year while the potential tag is still. I think we could have gotten more for TT if we traded him a year earlier.