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Round 2: G6: Grizzlies(2-3) @ Warriors(3-2)

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Re: Round 2: G6: Grizzlies(2-3) @ Warriors(3-2) 

Post#101 » by bobobolas10 » Sat May 16, 2015 10:30 am

I agree that was the most disapointing playoff appearance in the last 5 years.

With our back against the wall, I expected a Gasol like the 10 first games of the season, a ZBO as any other playoff game from the past years, Mike Conley had an excuse but still, poor perfomance. To be honest Id rather play an injured Conley than Calathes. Vince Carter did a good job, I havent seen him playing like that in a Grizz jersey, He attacked the rim, can you believe that? Courtney Lee was our so called "shooter", a poor shooter but a shooter after all, still poor performance and yeah, we can blame him. Jeff Green does not fit in the team. He is a slight improve to Prince but he did not meet the expectations...

Guys, remember the time when Gasol and ZBO earned the nickname "gazebo"? They used to feed each other for easy layups, a missed shot had a high percentage of becoming an offensive board, they would grab most of defensive rebounds, ... Nowadays, our opponents would grab offensive boards without jumping, the would shot below 40%, missing plenty FT, the ony passes from the high to the low post.

All in all, the Warriors were better than us overall. So lets start thinkning about next season...
"Take that for Data!"
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Re: Round 2: G6: Grizzlies(2-3) @ Warriors(3-2) 

Post#102 » by jman3134 » Sat May 16, 2015 4:58 pm

The Warriors executed their gameplan through the last 3 games of the season and there was no reason our coach couldn't make the adjustments to secure a decent post up. Watching the games live, the spacing was clearly off - overload on the perimeter and Randolph and Gasol were forced into long 2 point field goals, essentially the worst shot in the game. If you take it in rhythm and make it, I can understand. But, Gasol had not hit a long 2 throughout most of this series, yet he kept sticking with it. I understand that this is what keeps the defenses honest and opens up the lanes, but you need to do a better job of iso - ing your post man and then spread the wealth. The ball movement was atrocious along the perimeter and the team just look unprepared to be honest.

Rotation-wise Calathes should never have seen the light of day at the end of the bench. No sets were run for Jeff Green on the offensive end, so while he was terrible, it is really tough for me to say that he was the reason we lost the past few games. Every shot he took was off of a solid one on one move from what I can remember.

Conley wasn't himself and Tony Allen sat out most of the last game. We were hobbled coming into the playoffs, and we looked it down the stretch. The most concerning part is the defense and the inability to defend the spread offense by closing out. The hedging was okay at times by our bigs, but the second help man never recovered to the right spot. So, it would go something like this: Curry gets a screen and a weak hedge that doesn't prevent a perimeter pass, the big setting the screen rolls to the hoop and one of our help guys cuts off the passing lane. They are then left with two perimeter options to swing to for wide open jump shots if the hedge is not hard enough. You have to counter this defensively.

I would keep the entire team and see how we look fully healthy, but would add a true rim protector off the bench, which is what we have been missing. Koufas is a tremendous player, but he cannot recover quickly enough on the defensive end to make spectacular plays. Marc Gasol just had a bad series - not much else to say. We need him and a good draft to put us back in the mix next year.
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Re: Round 2: G6: Grizzlies(2-3) @ Warriors(3-2) 

Post#103 » by bakesale » Sun May 17, 2015 12:27 pm

vanjulio wrote:In my opinion this was the most disappointing season of the last 5 playoff appearances, #1 this is by far the best talented roster we ever had. [[[. or is it overrated? ]]] #2. The Grizzled have always been overachievers and fighters. Even with the inspiration of Conley playing with his face injury they could not rally to the occasion, softball female teams have nmre tenacity than I saw tonight,

#3. Grizzled have the deepest bench since I began watching them after they moved from Vancouver. The bench has been non-existent in this series until tonight where VC and kk finally got going.

Conclusion:
Do not resign Marc Gasol. He is overrated. As much as I love him... its time to embrace the change of the NBA and go another direction, grit grind is dead.
We need a roster overhaul. ZBO is my favorite but objectively he did not help the team this series. We can't hold both ZBO and Gasol and expect the championship in Memphis . this was our window and it closed. Let gasol go. Keep zbo on his contract and move forward.

Obviously we have to part ways with Jeff Green and find a SF that fits the Grizzled team and is a winner. It might take draft or by a miracle we can get a free agent. I don't know. But our roster has to be redone. This loss tonight has no excuse. Really we lost mental physically and spiritually. I wish them luck in the offseasonandlook forward to analyzing our options goin forward. I had little to say until tonight because I believed our team was elite. I WAS WRONG. I doubt my own knowledge now of NBA and will likely take a step back from the sport as I no longer have the savvy I once I had


As an outsider looking in watching the Grizzlies play I tend to disagree. I think Marc Gasol was easily your best player. He led your team in scoring and rebounding and is an excellent passer. He almost single handedly brought them back into the game in game 6 with his tremendous defence that included 5 blocks. As your best scorer and your best defender on a team that won 57 games, it's definitely not Gasol who is overrated. His low post moves are great and he has an outside shot that is practically automatic. He's your best player by a long way at the moment. He works bloody hard and has one of the highest iqs period.

As for Zbo he was dominant early on in the series as he looked like a match up nightmare for the warriors down low. But as the series wore on he became all too predictable. The fact that the much undersized barnes could do a solid job of guarding him and keep his fg% relatively low in the latter stages of the series is indicative of how Zbo is some what predictable. Watch the tape it's obvious that Zbo is constantly trying to turn over his right shoulder so he can put up a lefty jump hook and the warriors guarded him that way all day long and it seemed to work for the most part. In saying that he still has a very good jump shot, is of course a tremendous rebounder and a much improved defender. Having said all that I wouldn't get rid of Zbo, but as for Marc Gasol, if I was you I'd hold on to him for dear life, I think he is THAT good!

I do agree with getting rid of Jeff Green. I think he's inconsistent, not only with his shooting etc but his general demeanour and effort. I get the sense that he brings the forth the effort "when he feels like it". I don't get to see him as much as you guys do but that's the impression I get from him for a few years now... Having a guy where I can't rely on him bringing 100% effort every game would bother me to no end. He's fairly talented and I think he could do more with it ie on paper he looks like a good fit, but well, the results just aren't as advertised.

As for the roster in general, the most obvious thing you need more than anything is 3 point shooting. You not only not shoot it often, you don't shoot it well. You need maybe at least one or two 3 point specialists. A great fit would be of the mold of Demarre Carroll or Anthony Morrow. Both play with the defensive grit and effort that the Griz love to play with and are both legitimate 40% from 3s which seems to be the standard for good 3 point shooting. An ideal fit would be Klay Thompson or a Wes Matthews. If you had either of those 2 and managed to stay healthy, you be an almost dead certainty to win the championship, but of course I doubt either of them will become available to you. Although you never know what might happen with Portland if Aldridge decides to leave...

How you obtain your 3 point shooting players is a conundrum though. I don't think Jeff Green's value will be very high and I dare say Tony Allen is starting to age and so I'd be hard pressed to think of a team that would give up a good 3 and d guy for either of those 2 right now. But one way or another you need that shooting...

As for Joerger I really like him as a coach. I think he's well spoken, intelligent and really knows his basketball inside and out. I think maybe he needs an assistant to help him with offence. The structure of the half court offence is as good as any but someone like D'Antoni would be a great assistant to make the most of Conley and give the know how to play with increased pace when needed and that know how to find open shooters and have good spacing in general. But definitely keep Joerger as the head coach. I'd be happy with Joerger at the helm.
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Re: Round 2: G6: Grizzlies(2-3) @ Warriors(3-2) 

Post#104 » by jman3134 » Sun May 17, 2015 4:54 pm

bakesale wrote:
vanjulio wrote:In my opinion this was the most disappointing season of the last 5 playoff appearances, #1 this is by far the best talented roster we ever had. [[[. or is it overrated? ]]] #2. The Grizzled have always been overachievers and fighters. Even with the inspiration of Conley playing with his face injury they could not rally to the occasion, softball female teams have nmre tenacity than I saw tonight,

#3. Grizzled have the deepest bench since I began watching them after they moved from Vancouver. The bench has been non-existent in this series until tonight where VC and kk finally got going.

Conclusion:
Do not resign Marc Gasol. He is overrated. As much as I love him... its time to embrace the change of the NBA and go another direction, grit grind is dead.
We need a roster overhaul. ZBO is my favorite but objectively he did not help the team this series. We can't hold both ZBO and Gasol and expect the championship in Memphis . this was our window and it closed. Let gasol go. Keep zbo on his contract and move forward.

Obviously we have to part ways with Jeff Green and find a SF that fits the Grizzled team and is a winner. It might take draft or by a miracle we can get a free agent. I don't know. But our roster has to be redone. This loss tonight has no excuse. Really we lost mental physically and spiritually. I wish them luck in the offseasonandlook forward to analyzing our options goin forward. I had little to say until tonight because I believed our team was elite. I WAS WRONG. I doubt my own knowledge now of NBA and will likely take a step back from the sport as I no longer have the savvy I once I had


As an outsider looking in watching the Grizzlies play I tend to disagree. I think Marc Gasol was easily your best player. He led your team in scoring and rebounding and is an excellent passer. He almost single handedly brought them back into the game in game 6 with his tremendous defence that included 5 blocks. As your best scorer and your best defender on a team that won 57 games, it's definitely not Gasol who is overrated. His low post moves are great and he has an outside shot that is practically automatic. He's your best player by a long way at the moment. He works bloody hard and has one of the highest iqs period.

As for Zbo he was dominant early on in the series as he looked like a match up nightmare for the warriors down low. But as the series wore on he became all too predictable. The fact that the much undersized barnes could do a solid job of guarding him and keep his fg% relatively low in the latter stages of the series is indicative of how Zbo is some what predictable. Watch the tape it's obvious that Zbo is constantly trying to turn over his right shoulder so he can put up a lefty jump hook and the warriors guarded him that way all day long and it seemed to work for the most part. In saying that he still has a very good jump shot, is of course a tremendous rebounder and a much improved defender. Having said all that I wouldn't get rid of Zbo, but as for Marc Gasol, if I was you I'd hold on to him for dear life, I think he is THAT good!

I do agree with getting rid of Jeff Green. I think he's inconsistent, not only with his shooting etc but his general demeanour and effort. I get the sense that he brings the forth the effort "when he feels like it". I don't get to see him as much as you guys do but that's the impression I get from him for a few years now... Having a guy where I can't rely on him bringing 100% effort every game would bother me to no end. He's fairly talented and I think he could do more with it ie on paper he looks like a good fit, but well, the results just aren't as advertised.

As for the roster in general, the most obvious thing you need more than anything is 3 point shooting. You not only not shoot it often, you don't shoot it well. You need maybe at least one or two 3 point specialists. A great fit would be of the mold of Demarre Carroll or Anthony Morrow. Both play with the defensive grit and effort that the Griz love to play with and are both legitimate 40% from 3s which seems to be the standard for good 3 point shooting. An ideal fit would be Klay Thompson or a Wes Matthews. If you had either of those 2 and managed to stay healthy, you be an almost dead certainty to win the championship, but of course I doubt either of them will become available to you. Although you never know what might happen with Portland if Aldridge decides to leave...

How you obtain your 3 point shooting players is a conundrum though. I don't think Jeff Green's value will be very high and I dare say Tony Allen is starting to age and so I'd be hard pressed to think of a team that would give up a good 3 and d guy for either of those 2 right now. But one way or another you need that shooting...

As for Joerger I really like him as a coach. I think he's well spoken, intelligent and really knows his basketball inside and out. I think maybe he needs an assistant to help him with offence. The structure of the half court offence is as good as any but someone like D'Antoni would be a great assistant to make the most of Conley and give the know how to play with increased pace when needed and that know how to find open shooters and have good spacing in general. But definitely keep Joerger as the head coach. I'd be happy with Joerger at the helm.



Agree with your conclusions (keeping MGasol, Randolph and trading Jeff Green), but disagree with your observations.

Zach Randolph had a bad final game, but he was far from overmatched by Barnes etc. On film, the Warriors converged on him with a double and forced it out of his hands a bunch of times. When he went up with it against 2-3 defenders, no one was on the glass to rebound. It was literally the worst situation imaginable.

Marc Gasol's offense was downright atrocious and he missed BIG shots at critical junctures. And, what makes it worse is that most of these misses were long two point jump shots, which we were trading for threes on the other end. He was not aggressive in his hedging part of the time and the Warriors used that to spread the Grizzlies around.

Joerger never made the right adjustments defensively. The action was simply ball screen and roll with the rest of the team spreading the floor. Once you see them hit a bunch of jumpers you play the passing lanes like we did in games 3 and 4. Marc and Zach did not do a good enough job recovering inside if someone was beat off the bounce (except for those blocks you referenced, most of which, if I remember correctly, came after Curry fed a big man). The issue is that we are missing a lengthy shot blocker off the bench. Marc is a good defender (very overrated in this area), but clearly isn't better than first team all defense himself.
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Re: Round 2: G6: Grizzlies(2-3) @ Warriors(3-2) 

Post#105 » by vanjulio » Mon May 18, 2015 12:30 am

Thanks for weighing in Bakesale and everyone else. I was really mad when I wrote that post... I knew my immediate reaction would be knee jerk. gasol definitely has skills that you just can't go out and buy and to let him just "go" would be foolhardy. After time to think it over I desire to keep him as the face of the Grit Grind Grizzled. Grizz will be back. I just dont' think even marc gasol Is the guy you can build around for goin to the NBA finals or to win the championship. He is an anchor - very strong anchor - and enforcer and physical presence that can't be matched right now in this league... but certainly can be overcome as the Warriors demonstrated emasculately. These are crazy playoffs. Would njever. Expect Clippers to go down like they did. Will be rooting for Marries Speight and Demarr Carroll from here on out
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Re: Round 2: G6: Grizzlies(2-3) @ Warriors(3-2) 

Post#106 » by vanjulio » Mon May 18, 2015 12:32 am

I also feel bad saying "our team was ELITE> I was wrong". What a drama QUEEN! WE WERE ELITE! GRIZZ. Were in the top of the NBA. BELIEVE MEMPHIS!!!
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Re: Round 2: G6: Grizzlies(2-3) @ Warriors(3-2) 

Post#107 » by SD2042 » Mon May 18, 2015 6:42 pm

vanjulio wrote:I also feel bad saying "our team was ELITE> I was wrong". What a drama QUEEN! WE WERE ELITE! GRIZZ. Were in the top of the NBA. BELIEVE MEMPHIS!!!



It's okay to have high hopes and confidence in the team. That's what every fan requires. Something or someone to believe in to clear the hurdles no matter the adversity and challenges that comes their way. Sometimes I think we as fans tend to forget to keep a sense of logic in mind that the next opponent we face could be a lot better than we are. We were better than Portland in-spite of the circumstances to both teams. The Warriors were a lot better than we were in-spite of the circumstances. We just have to make better time to make adjustments and do our best to fight a better battle to win the war next season.

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