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Grizzlies Trade Thread

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Re: Grizzlies Trade Thread 

Post#341 » by VCfor3 » Tue Dec 15, 2020 11:06 pm

Whole Truth wrote:If Mitch Robinson agrees to an extension.

Memphis trade - (DIeng, GS 2024 top 4) for (Robinson, 16m TE)

I'd want to know if there is something we can use the TPE for now since we will lose it next offseason. Also I wonder how far his value has fallen.
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Re: Grizzlies Trade Thread 

Post#342 » by Whole Truth » Wed Dec 16, 2020 3:31 pm

VCfor3 wrote:
Whole Truth wrote:If Mitch Robinson agrees to an extension.

Memphis trade - (DIeng, GS 2024 top 4) for (Robinson, 16m TE)

I'd want to know if there is something we can use the TPE for now since we will lose it next offseason. Also I wonder how far his value has fallen.


How far did his value fall ?. The Knick poster suggested on the trade board, they'd be willing to take on salary. It's basically a salary dump, savings trade he suggested. The value of the 2 are conflated.

Reading the Knicks board, some want to be proactive on his value because they're coming to the conclusion/belief his offense is not going to progress like they had hoped. Doesn't help because of where he was drafted, that he's set to become a UFA in 21-22. So for a team still struggling to rebuild, the goal here would be to reset his value, rookie scale & control with "the best pick possible" as suggested by the Knick fan on the trade board for a player that might not reach his ceiling or end up resigning. They're basically trying to cash in before he loses his "potential" tag & team control.

There's nothing lined up for that TE as of now but it wouldn't shock me to see some teams get desperate at the deadline but Mitchell would have to be worth it to take that chance to double up on the 2024 pick value. Where, if Memphis does find value for that TE, they basically signed Mitchell as free agent not unlike the Winslow trade.. (Is Mitchell alone worth the 2024 pick?) Who knows, Memphis could possibly work a trade with GS for the Minnesota pick, offering up a big wing defender (Winslow) who's had hopefully a good first half along with some cap relief (16m virtual cap sace) to aid with their tax repeater bill & need to contend... Maybe, Mitchell ends up the player that helps grease the deal, even if a third team has to be involved after Ja helps elevate his value.

For Memphis, that 2024 pick could very well be in the 4-10 range, if everything breaks right. However, after drafting Wiseman this season, Minnesota looks like they could gift wrap GS a 5-10 pick next year, which would help them retool faster & muddy that possibility.

For Mitchell, a change of scenery from a struggling, toxic situation, with a more structured, unselfish offensive team like Memphis & Ja in transition should theoretically help elevate his game/value ... At worse, he upgrades Dieng with youth & potential, becomes a solid defensive depth option with 3J not proving he can stay healthy for a full season.
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Re: Grizzlies Trade Thread 

Post#343 » by VCfor3 » Wed Dec 16, 2020 11:35 pm

Whole Truth wrote:
VCfor3 wrote:
Whole Truth wrote:If Mitch Robinson agrees to an extension.

Memphis trade - (DIeng, GS 2024 top 4) for (Robinson, 16m TE)

I'd want to know if there is something we can use the TPE for now since we will lose it next offseason. Also I wonder how far his value has fallen.


How far did his value fall ?. The Knick poster suggested on the trade board, they'd be willing to take on salary. It's basically a salary dump, savings trade he suggested. The value of the 2 are conflated.

Reading the Knicks board, some want to be proactive on his value because they're coming to the conclusion/belief his offense is not going to progress like they had hoped. Doesn't help because of where he was drafted, that he's set to become a UFA in 21-22. So for a team still struggling to rebuild, the goal here would be to reset his value, rookie scale & control with "the best pick possible" as suggested by the Knick fan on the trade board for a player that might not reach his ceiling or end up resigning. They're basically trying to cash in before he loses his "potential" tag & team control.

There's nothing lined up for that TE as of now but it wouldn't shock me to see some teams get desperate at the deadline but Mitchell would have to be worth it to take that chance to double up on the 2024 pick value. Where, if Memphis does find value for that TE, they basically signed Mitchell as free agent not unlike the Winslow trade.. (Is Mitchell alone worth the 2024 pick?) Who knows, Memphis could possibly work a trade with GS for the Minnesota pick, offering up a big wing defender (Winslow) who's had hopefully a good first half along with some cap relief (16m virtual cap sace) to aid with their tax repeater bill & need to contend... Maybe, Mitchell ends up the player that helps grease the deal, even if a third team has to be involved after Ja helps elevate his value.

For Memphis, that 2024 pick could very well be in the 4-10 range, if everything breaks right. However, after drafting Wiseman this season, Minnesota looks like they could gift wrap GS a 5-10 pick next year, which would help them retool faster & muddy that possibility.

For Mitchell, a change of scenery from a struggling, toxic situation, with a more structured, unselfish offensive team like Memphis & Ja in transition should theoretically help elevate his game/value ... At worse, he upgrades Dieng with youth & potential, becomes a solid defensive depth option with 3J not proving he can stay healthy for a full season.

I mean isn't Tillman also supposed to help provide bench depth at center moving forward? If we don't see Robinson as a starter for us I'd rather see what happens with the GSW pick. There also is a chance GSW trades the pick for win-now help as Curry finishes out his prime leaving the 2024 pick looking like a lottery pick. I just think that pick is maybe more valuable unless our FO thinks Robinson is a long term option at C and JJJ may ultimately play mostly at PF.
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Re: Grizzlies Trade Thread 

Post#344 » by SD2042 » Thu Dec 17, 2020 6:47 am

The question would be for the Grizzlies what do they see in MR for risking the move for the 2024 pick and Dieng? Given this is the Knicks were talking about. His defense has been solid as blocks and rebounding. Most of his offense is mostly putbacks and dunks based on his metrics. That said, MR hasn't exactly measured up to the numbers to be worth trading the 2024 pick for now. If anything, if he's a UFA and the Grizzlies may have some interest in him, I say that that chance then and see what happens.
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Re: Grizzlies Trade Thread 

Post#345 » by Whole Truth » Thu Dec 17, 2020 5:04 pm

VCfor3 wrote: I mean isn't Tillman also supposed to help provide bench depth at center moving forward? If we don't see Robinson as a starter for us I'd rather see what happens with the GSW pick. There also is a chance GSW trades the pick for win-now help as Curry finishes out his prime leaving the 2024 pick looking like a lottery pick. I just think that pick is maybe more valuable unless our FO thinks Robinson is a long term option at C and JJJ may ultimately play mostly at PF.


Tillman hasn't proven anything, for all we know, he might not be a viable option at all. Neither are the other upside big men who are injury risks as well.

For me It comes down to how you're projecting the 2024 pick?. It's why I mentioned Minnesota looking like they could give GS potentially a 5-10 pick in the 21 draft to add to Wiseman, which for me changes the projection of the pick. It would give GS a 2yr head start on a retool. IF they only hit on a wing in 21, kiss that pick good bye.

Robinson will start off the bench but it's not where he's being projected. With him & Clarke Memphis can sandwich 3J between 2 defenders either at the 5 or 4, where Robinson has the length Clarke doesn't. I also saw video of him hitting 3's in the offseason, he looked capable but not something the Knicks can afford to bank on in their situation. Just to note, It was a knock on Clarke's game as well ... I think Memphis development team can get the most of him like they did with Clarke, who is a couple years older & further along in his development.

Not a knock on Tillman but surrounding 3J with Jonas, Robinson & Clarke makes Memphis one of the best front courts in the league with Robinson having the potential to one day replace Jonas, who's soon to be expiring, which also gives Memphis options & leverage in free agency.

So depending on the GS 24 picks projected value, I think this trade help Memphis solidify their front court for the foreseeable future regardless of what happens with Jonas. Along with Ja & Tyus solidifying the PG position, it leaves only SG & SF to shake through with the Utah pick still in hand. The reason I held onto the Utah pick over the GS pick is with the slightest of hopes, it lands 8-14 in 21.
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Re: Grizzlies Trade Thread 

Post#346 » by VCfor3 » Thu Dec 17, 2020 8:10 pm

Whole Truth wrote:
VCfor3 wrote: I mean isn't Tillman also supposed to help provide bench depth at center moving forward? If we don't see Robinson as a starter for us I'd rather see what happens with the GSW pick. There also is a chance GSW trades the pick for win-now help as Curry finishes out his prime leaving the 2024 pick looking like a lottery pick. I just think that pick is maybe more valuable unless our FO thinks Robinson is a long term option at C and JJJ may ultimately play mostly at PF.


Tillman hasn't proven anything, for all we know, he might not be a viable option at all. Neither are the other upside big men who are injury risks as well.

For me It comes down to how you're projecting the 2024 pick?. It's why I mentioned Minnesota looking like they could give GS potentially a 5-10 pick in the 21 draft to add to Wiseman, which for me changes the projection of the pick. It would give GS a 2yr head start on a retool. IF they only hit on a wing in 21, kiss that pick good bye.

Robinson will start off the bench but it's not where he's being projected. With him & Clarke Memphis can sandwich 3J between 2 defenders either at the 5 or 4, where Robinson has the length Clarke doesn't. I also saw video of him hitting 3's in the offseason, he looked capable but not something the Knicks can afford to bank on in their situation. Just to note, It was a knock on Clarke's game as well ... I think Memphis development team can get the most of him like they did with Clarke, who is a couple years older & further along in his development.

Not a knock on Tillman but surrounding 3J with Jonas, Robinson & Clarke makes Memphis one of the best front courts in the league with Robinson having the potential to one day replace Jonas, who's soon to be expiring, which also gives Memphis options & leverage in free agency.

So depending on the GS 24 picks projected value, I think this trade help Memphis solidify their front court for the foreseeable future regardless of what happens with Jonas. Along with Ja & Tyus solidifying the PG position, it leaves only SG & SF to shake through with the Utah pick still in hand. The reason I held onto the Utah pick over the GS pick is with the slightest of hopes, it lands 8-14 in 21.

I see Wiseman as a good complimentary piece, but he isn't going to net a bunch of wins without help. The way I see the draft is that there are five guys I think are truly elite. The MIN pick is protected 1-3 so GSW won't get it if it ends up there. That locks them out of Cade for sure and probably Green. Suggs may get taken as well. Mobley is a center who is repetitive with Wiseman. Kuminga is the other and I kinda want to see him play first before speculating too much. There is a real chance that the pick falls outside the top 5 or doesn't convey till 2022. That means GSW either gets a really good but not elite player who will help them win but maybe not enough to make the playoffs or they have to wait until 2022 when MIN will hopefully be better with another top 3 pick on their team.

I think we have a shot at a late lottery pick with the 2024 GSW pick. If our team develops like we hope, we will be a playoff team and maybe fringe contender at that time. That lottery pick may be our best chance to fill any final holes our team may have. I'm fine with us using the pick, but I want to make sure our FO firmly believes it is worth it.
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Re: Grizzlies Trade Thread 

Post#347 » by Whole Truth » Thu Dec 17, 2020 11:20 pm

VCfor3 wrote: I see Wiseman as a good complimentary piece, but he isn't going to net a bunch of wins without help. The way I see the draft is that there are five guys I think are truly elite. The MIN pick is protected 1-3 so GSW won't get it if it ends up there. That locks them out of Cade for sure and probably Green. Suggs may get taken as well. Mobley is a center who is repetitive with Wiseman. Kuminga is the other and I kinda want to see him play first before speculating too much. There is a real chance that the pick falls outside the top 5 or doesn't convey till 2022. That means GSW either gets a really good but not elite player who will help them win but maybe not enough to make the playoffs or they have to wait until 2022 when MIN will hopefully be better with another top 3 pick on their team.

I think we have a shot at a late lottery pick with the 2024 GSW pick. If our team develops like we hope, we will be a playoff team and maybe fringe contender at that time. That lottery pick may be our best chance to fill any final holes our team may have. I'm fine with us using the pick, but I want to make sure our FO firmly believes it is worth it.


There's 2 scenario's, where the pick could be more or less the value of Robinson. That is part of the trades risk factor.

In trading Dieng's 17m for Robinsons 1m, the 16m TE opens an avenue for Memphis to take on salary in this Covid financial environment to recoup that pick more or less the value of it (17m TE for GS 2024), it's an unknown potential benefit of the deal to potentially net Robinson & a pick back. I don't have the ability too talk to teams but if Memphis could line up use for that TPE, it erases some of my guess work value here.

With some good fortune, the deal could be (Robinson, bad contract, FRP better or worse than GS 2024) for (Dieng, 2024 better or worse than Robinson). Preferably getting a team to give up a more recent pick (GS/Minnesota 21) than one further down the road.

Worse case scenario, Robinson is traded for a pick who's value we don't know will be better or worse than him.

Then there's the factor of getting a good young big man now, with the young team looking like they could compete sooner, rather than later over waiting 4 yrs wasting several yrs off of 3J & Ja's career & rookie scale, for a pick/rookie we don't know will be better or worse than Robinson.
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Re: Grizzlies Trade Thread 

Post#348 » by VCfor3 » Fri Dec 18, 2020 4:41 pm

Whole Truth wrote:
VCfor3 wrote: I see Wiseman as a good complimentary piece, but he isn't going to net a bunch of wins without help. The way I see the draft is that there are five guys I think are truly elite. The MIN pick is protected 1-3 so GSW won't get it if it ends up there. That locks them out of Cade for sure and probably Green. Suggs may get taken as well. Mobley is a center who is repetitive with Wiseman. Kuminga is the other and I kinda want to see him play first before speculating too much. There is a real chance that the pick falls outside the top 5 or doesn't convey till 2022. That means GSW either gets a really good but not elite player who will help them win but maybe not enough to make the playoffs or they have to wait until 2022 when MIN will hopefully be better with another top 3 pick on their team.

I think we have a shot at a late lottery pick with the 2024 GSW pick. If our team develops like we hope, we will be a playoff team and maybe fringe contender at that time. That lottery pick may be our best chance to fill any final holes our team may have. I'm fine with us using the pick, but I want to make sure our FO firmly believes it is worth it.


There's 2 scenario's, where the pick could be more or less the value of Robinson. That is part of the trades risk factor.

In trading Dieng's 17m for Robinsons 1m, the 16m TE opens an avenue for Memphis to take on salary in this Covid financial environment to recoup that pick more or less the value of it (17m TE for GS 2024), it's an unknown potential benefit of the deal to potentially net Robinson & a pick back. I don't have the ability too talk to teams but if Memphis could line up use for that TPE, it erases some of my guess work value here.

With some good fortune, the deal could be (Robinson, bad contract, FRP better or worse than GS 2024) for (Dieng, 2024 better or worse than Robinson). Preferably getting a team to give up a more recent pick (GS/Minnesota 21) than one further down the road.

Worse case scenario, Robinson is traded for a pick who's value we don't know will be better or worse than him.

Then there's the factor of getting a good young big man now, with the young team looking like they could compete sooner, rather than later over waiting 4 yrs wasting several yrs off of 3J & Ja's career & rookie scale, for a pick/rookie we don't know will be better or worse than Robinson.

I don't see a team willing to dump much salary right now especially for a 1st. Otherwise they would have likely done so already to NYK who announced they were looking for dumps earlier this offseason. The only slightly likely big dump would be Taurean Prince from BKN but again I think they would have already done that this past draft if that was something they were actually interested in doing. The next likely round of salary dumps would be next offseason but the TPE will be gone then since we will have cap space.
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Re: Grizzlies Trade Thread 

Post#349 » by Whole Truth » Sun Dec 20, 2020 4:17 pm

What would it take for Memphis to step into this Rockets/Philly trade rumor to get Simmons out of it?.
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Re: Grizzlies Trade Thread 

Post#350 » by VCfor3 » Sun Dec 20, 2020 5:49 pm

Whole Truth wrote:What would it take for Memphis to step into this Rockets/Philly trade rumor to get Simmons out of it?.

I'm not sure. The Rockets owe picks before too long (not to mention the immediate swap this year) so an established piece like Simmons is likely more appealing than the package of Clarke+picks we can offer.
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Re: Grizzlies Trade Thread 

Post#351 » by Whole Truth » Sun Dec 20, 2020 6:49 pm

VCfor3 wrote:
Whole Truth wrote:What would it take for Memphis to step into this Rockets/Philly trade rumor to get Simmons out of it?.

I'm not sure. The Rockets owe picks before too long (not to mention the immediate swap this year) so an established piece like Simmons is likely more appealing than the package of Clarke+picks we can offer.


If that's the case, what is the reason behind Rockets wanting a 3rd team in dealing with Philly as rumored by WOJ?.
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Re: Grizzlies Trade Thread 

Post#352 » by VCfor3 » Sun Dec 20, 2020 6:51 pm

Whole Truth wrote:
VCfor3 wrote:
Whole Truth wrote:What would it take for Memphis to step into this Rockets/Philly trade rumor to get Simmons out of it?.

I'm not sure. The Rockets owe picks before too long (not to mention the immediate swap this year) so an established piece like Simmons is likely more appealing than the package of Clarke+picks we can offer.


If that's the case, what is the reason behind Rockets wanting a 3rd team in dealing with Philly as rumored by WOJ?.

Because if they go with the Brooklyn deal, they will want to flip some of those players for assets/players they prefer. There also could be non-Simmons trade ideas being thrown around and someone like Tobias needing to be rerouted.
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Re: Grizzlies Trade Thread 

Post#353 » by giannis and 1 » Mon Dec 21, 2020 3:20 am

Would the Grizzlies trade Jones and if yes, what would you guys want in return? I'd have interest from the Bucks.
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Re: Grizzlies Trade Thread 

Post#354 » by SD2042 » Mon Dec 21, 2020 1:01 pm

giannis and 1 wrote:Would the Grizzlies trade Jones and if yes, what would you guys want in return? I'd have interest from the Bucks.



Just looking through the roster of the Bucks, I don't see a specific player that the Grizzlies could use trade wise to want to get off JV right now. To this point, it seems like the Grizzlies are willing to stand pat unless they get approach with an offer they cam't refuse betwwen now and the trade deadline.
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Re: Grizzlies Trade Thread 

Post#355 » by Whole Truth » Mon Dec 21, 2020 9:22 pm

The Sixers have to offer up their two-time 24-year-old All-Star Ben Simmons. That's not all. According to a handful of reports, the Rockets also want several first-round picks and possibly a young player on a rookie contract as well. As expected, the Sixers didn't pounce with that price as it's an expensive cost.

https://www.si.com/nba/76ers/news/nba-insider-daryl-morey-willing-trade-sixers-ben-simmons

Davis trade - landed Ingram, Ball, Hart , 3 picks & a pick swap.

Here's the stipulations

2019 No. 4 pick
2021 pick goes to NOLA if top 8, L.A. if 9-30
2022 pick to NOLA unprotected if pick doesn't confer
2023 swap
2024 unprotected first BUT Pels get right to defer pick to 2025

It's basically #4 2019 pick, unprotected 2022 pick, unprotected 2025 pick. With James extended to 2024, NO's can defer the pick to 2025 but Davis would still be under contract by team option. The 25 pick has on outside chance of being lotto but both unprotected picks are projected mid to late firsts.

So the deal's projected value is Ingram, Ball, Hart, #4, & 2 mid to late firsts (with opportunity). For a young franchise player.

For Harden in his 30's, Houston is asking for - Simmons, young player & 3 picks from Philly ?

Memphis trade - (Dieng, Winslow, Clarke, 21 top 4, Utah 22 top 6, GS top 4) for (Simmons).
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Re: Grizzlies Trade Thread 

Post#356 » by VCfor3 » Mon Dec 21, 2020 11:48 pm

SD2042 wrote:
giannis and 1 wrote:Would the Grizzlies trade Jones and if yes, what would you guys want in return? I'd have interest from the Bucks.



Just looking through the roster of the Bucks, I don't see a specific player that the Grizzlies could use trade wise to want to get off JV right now. To this point, it seems like the Grizzlies are willing to stand pat unless they get approach with an offer they cam't refuse betwwen now and the trade deadline.

I think he meant Tyus Jones. But given that your 1sts are locked up and I personally like Tyus more than DDV (I am not very familiar with him so maybe the FO or other fans feel differently), I think a deal would be kinda hard to come by that makes sense for both teams. If for some reason we feel we need additional cap space next offseason then a deal would be a little more likely though I think there are other players we'd move before Tyus. Our team really needs his ball handling and facilitating so we'd probably want a way to help replenish that which would take a third team.

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