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#WaiveWinslow

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E S V L
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#WaiveWinslow 

Post#1 » by E S V L » Fri Apr 30, 2021 1:20 pm

https://www.grizzlybearblues.com/2021/4/30/22409641/memphis-has-a-justise-winslow-problem-grizzlies-nba

While I understand the goal of maximizing values of our assets, this particular case, unlike all others, is harming our chemistry and development of other players, most importantly - Ja, who deserves to play in PO. He is a winner - it is more important to maintain his identity than to get a late 1st for Winslow. We have reached the point where ROI doesn`t "work" anymore. It`s time to write off this asset and move forward.

I vote for waving Winslow effective immediately. It would be a mutually beneficial decision.

You gyus?
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Re: #WaiveWinslow 

Post#2 » by VCfor3 » Fri Apr 30, 2021 2:25 pm

It sucks. The potential idea of Winslow is great as a lockdown wing defender. The problem honestly is that his offense is too bad right now for him to start, and his defense is minimized by the fact that he usually isn't on the court with the opposing team's best wing. I think part of the reason we are letting him run point off the bench is to try and see if he can get into a playmaking groove that would allow him to potentially create in the starting lineup and let Ja have more run off ball (and to rest every few plays ha). That way he can contribute on the offensive end enough to not hurt us too bad and then can guard the opposing wings.

Unfortunately he is hella rough offensively which is understandable given his last few years. Honestly he needs a full offseason and training camp where he is healthy and can actually work on his basketball skills. He is basically learning his new post-injury body on the fly since there are very rarely any practices given the schedule. Add in that the season is slowly drawing to a close and there isn't enough time to let him work on his own for a stretch and then get re-inserted back into the team/games. So I think the team is basically trying to see as much as they can in order to see if there is potential or not for them to capitalize on.

I don't think there is a great solution, but if it were me I'd roll with Tyus again and use Winslow when others are out due to injury. I definitely wouldn't waive him and the only way we get a 1st for him next year would be if we are eating some really bad salary. I would be okay if we cut our losses and declined the TO and let him walk, but I think the smart play would be to decline the TO and if Powell or one of the few other solid SF/SG types aren't available for what we can offer I'd offer Winslow something like 2/12 with a TO on the second year. Lets us see him after a full offseason of work and if it doesn't work out you just decline the TO. If it does work out then you have him locked up for one more year.
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Re: #WaiveWinslow 

Post#3 » by E S V L » Fri Apr 30, 2021 3:44 pm

VCfor3 wrote:I don't think there is a great solution, but if it were me I'd roll with Tyus again and use Winslow when others are out due to injury. I definitely wouldn't waive him and the only way we get a 1st for him next year would be if we are eating some really bad salary. I would be okay if we cut our losses and declined the TO and let him walk, but I think the smart play would be to decline the TO and if Powell or one of the few other solid SF/SG types aren't available for what we can offer I'd offer Winslow something like 2/12 with a TO on the second year. Lets us see him after a full offseason of work and if it doesn't work out you just decline the TO. If it does work out then you have him locked up for one more year.


My view is different due to the following premises:

1. Unlike Solomon Hill, Winslow is not a guy who can contribute to the team while sitting on the bench. I see 0 reason for doing this. It will hurt our chemistry similarly to how Winslow`s presences on the court hurt our offence.

2. Brooks looks like a decent SF. Fortunately, our need for a good version of Winslow is not as desperate as it was 6 months ago.

3. We have enough capspace, assets, and picks not to worry about loosing Winslow for nothing, now or later.

Let`s just move forward. Let`s make some noise in the PO 2021.

PS All those Powell discussions make me really frustrated. Please, guys. I don`t even know where to start.
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Re: #WaiveWinslow 

Post#4 » by VCfor3 » Fri Apr 30, 2021 4:45 pm

E S V L wrote:
VCfor3 wrote:I don't think there is a great solution, but if it were me I'd roll with Tyus again and use Winslow when others are out due to injury. I definitely wouldn't waive him and the only way we get a 1st for him next year would be if we are eating some really bad salary. I would be okay if we cut our losses and declined the TO and let him walk, but I think the smart play would be to decline the TO and if Powell or one of the few other solid SF/SG types aren't available for what we can offer I'd offer Winslow something like 2/12 with a TO on the second year. Lets us see him after a full offseason of work and if it doesn't work out you just decline the TO. If it does work out then you have him locked up for one more year.


My view is different due to the following premises:

1. Unlike Solomon Hill, Winslow is not a guy who can contribute to the team while sitting on the bench. I see 0 reason for doing this. It will hurt our chemistry similarly to how Winslow`s presences on the court hurt our offence.

2. Brooks looks like a decent SF. Fortunately, our need for a good version of Winslow is not as desperate as it was 6 months ago.

3. We have enough capspace, assets, and picks not to worry about loosing Winslow for nothing, now or later.

Let`s just move forward. Let`s make some noise in the PO 2021.

PS All those Powell discussions make me really frustrated. Please, guys. I don`t even know where to start.

1/2. He is depth and may be useful in the playoffs. Brooks can't guard big wings well. He is best at guarding high level SGs. As far as him chilling on the bench, I don't think it is an issue. He probably would be happy to have time to get right and he isn't taking minutes from anyone while on the bench.

3. I was just commenting on your mention of getting a 1st for him. I don't think he has value beyond being an expiring if we accept his TO. I'm not worried about his asset-value. Keep him if he helps, let him walk if he doesn't. Simple as that .

4. Why are you against getting Powell in FA? It costs us no assets since I don't see any better options with our cap space and he would provide scoring and spacing for Ja. It isn't like we are offering him a max contract plus I'd rather have him in the lineup than Allen.
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Re: #WaiveWinslow 

Post#5 » by E S V L » Fri Apr 30, 2021 5:26 pm

VCfor3 wrote:1/2. He is depth and may be useful in the playoffs. Brooks can't guard big wings well. He is best at guarding high level SGs. As far as him chilling on the bench, I don't think it is an issue. He probably would be happy to have time to get right and he isn't taking minutes from anyone while on the bench.

3. I was just commenting on your mention of getting a 1st for him. I don't think he has value beyond being an expiring if we accept his TO. I'm not worried about his asset-value. Keep him if he helps, let him walk if he doesn't. Simple as that .

4. Why are you against getting Powell in FA? It costs us no assets since I don't see any better options with our cap space and he would provide scoring and spacing for Ja. It isn't like we are offering him a max contract plus I'd rather have him in the lineup than Allen.


1/2. If the chemistry isn`t an issue, then of course I am fine with him on the bench. I would be even happy :) But I don`t think he can easily swallow his failure and accept he is a #11 option next to Konchar.

4. How much and whose minutes would Powell take?
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Re: #WaiveWinslow 

Post#6 » by Whole Truth » Fri Apr 30, 2021 10:34 pm

This is a tough decision but I think I'm on the same page as you ESVL.
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Re: #WaiveWinslow 

Post#7 » by VCfor3 » Fri Apr 30, 2021 10:38 pm

E S V L wrote:
VCfor3 wrote:1/2. He is depth and may be useful in the playoffs. Brooks can't guard big wings well. He is best at guarding high level SGs. As far as him chilling on the bench, I don't think it is an issue. He probably would be happy to have time to get right and he isn't taking minutes from anyone while on the bench.

3. I was just commenting on your mention of getting a 1st for him. I don't think he has value beyond being an expiring if we accept his TO. I'm not worried about his asset-value. Keep him if he helps, let him walk if he doesn't. Simple as that .

4. Why are you against getting Powell in FA? It costs us no assets since I don't see any better options with our cap space and he would provide scoring and spacing for Ja. It isn't like we are offering him a max contract plus I'd rather have him in the lineup than Allen.


1/2. If the chemistry isn`t an issue, then of course I am fine with him on the bench. I would be even happy :) But I don`t think he can easily swallow his failure and accept he is a #11 option next to Konchar.

4. How much and whose minutes would Powell take?

1/2. Honestly he probably will have an opportunity to play half the games due to our normal injury history ha. So I'm sure he won't mind given his own injury history.

4. I'd give him all of Allen's minutes
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Re: #WaiveWinslow 

Post#8 » by E S V L » Sat May 1, 2021 1:22 am

VCfor3 wrote:4. I'd give him all of Allen's minutes


What about Melton and Bane?
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Re: #WaiveWinslow 

Post#9 » by VCfor3 » Sat May 1, 2021 2:20 am

E S V L wrote:
VCfor3 wrote:4. I'd give him all of Allen's minutes


What about Melton and Bane?

Off the bench

Ja/Tyus
Powell/Bane
Brooks/Melton
JJJ/Anderson
JV/Clarke

It hurts me to have Tillman out of the rotation, but maybe we have a consolidation trade at some point that gets us to 10 rotation players instead of 11.
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Re: #WaiveWinslow 

Post#10 » by E S V L » Sat May 1, 2021 3:09 am

VCfor3 wrote:
E S V L wrote:
VCfor3 wrote:4. I'd give him all of Allen's minutes


What about Melton and Bane?

Off the bench

Ja/Tyus
Powell/Bane
Brooks/Melton
JJJ/Anderson
JV/Clarke

It hurts me to have Tillman out of the rotation, but maybe we have a consolidation trade at some point that gets us to 10 rotation players instead of 11.


I can’t believe you prefer Powell over Melton going forward.
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Re: #WaiveWinslow 

Post#11 » by VCfor3 » Sat May 1, 2021 3:01 pm

E S V L wrote:
VCfor3 wrote:
E S V L wrote:
What about Melton and Bane?

Off the bench

Ja/Tyus
Powell/Bane
Brooks/Melton
JJJ/Anderson
JV/Clarke

It hurts me to have Tillman out of the rotation, but maybe we have a consolidation trade at some point that gets us to 10 rotation players instead of 11.


I can’t believe you prefer Powell over Melton going forward.

If Melton can't even get a pity start last night when Allen is out, I doubt the coaching staff sees him as a future starter. It's infuriating.
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Re: #WaiveWinslow 

Post#12 » by E S V L » Sat May 1, 2021 3:15 pm

VCfor3 wrote:
E S V L wrote:
VCfor3 wrote:Off the bench

Ja/Tyus
Powell/Bane
Brooks/Melton
JJJ/Anderson
JV/Clarke

It hurts me to have Tillman out of the rotation, but maybe we have a consolidation trade at some point that gets us to 10 rotation players instead of 11.


I can’t believe you prefer Powell over Melton going forward.

If Melton can't even get a pity start last night when Allen is out, I doubt the coaching staff sees him as a future starter. It's infuriating.


He is 22. Some might say that it is too early to give up on him and pay 15/y for 3 years to the mediocre veteran who isn’t even in the top-20 at his position. This guy at 22 was nothing compare to Melton.
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Re: #WaiveWinslow 

Post#13 » by VCfor3 » Sat May 1, 2021 6:01 pm

E S V L wrote:
VCfor3 wrote:
E S V L wrote:
I can’t believe you prefer Powell over Melton going forward.

If Melton can't even get a pity start last night when Allen is out, I doubt the coaching staff sees him as a future starter. It's infuriating.


He is 22. Some might say that it is too early to give up on him and pay 15/y for 3 years to the mediocre veteran who isn’t even in the top-20 at his position. This guy at 22 was nothing compare to Melton.

I'm not giving up on him. I'm just trying to maximize a roster that the coaching staff would correctly use. If Melton surpasses Powell then Powell becomes a super 6th man type. If he gets upset with that role then trade him for an asset.

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