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Post#101 » by xxSnEaKyPxx » Mon Feb 4, 2008 4:41 am

#1knickfan wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



It only happened once b4 but it was a previous game. I'm still pissed off about it but its the past. I don't think the guy should be banned for being devious and manipulative of facts. People really just need to double and triple check every deal they make.


Its happened twice. Why let some guy who basically cheats play? This is suppose to be about fun, not lies and deception.

He's a pretty sucky GM to have to manipulate his trades anyway. Pretty pathetic if you ask me. Who is it? I won't do a deal with him.

I agree, its everyones responsibility to check the trades, but lets have fun with it, not be paranoid that someone will try to screw you over.
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Post#102 » by roseorbust » Mon Feb 4, 2008 4:41 am

Duncanfan wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



I don't think anyone can put a gun to your head to do a trade. It is afterall your responsibility to recheck every trade you agree to. You agreed to what he posted, the responsibility completely rests with you, especially when you even explain the trade later on. I just did a trade with Indiana and Charlotte, do you think that they we all didn't recheck what was written down? As far as his reputation is concerned, I have dealt with him in the past, he seemed pretty honest.
Not according to at least three people I've talked to. I know I messed up. But the bottom line is do you want to reward a guy who decieved me and will not make ANY sort of compromise or do you want to reward the kid who made one careless mistake out of excitement, and has offered a 2nd round pick to pay for this.
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Post#103 » by TMACFORMVP » Mon Feb 4, 2008 4:43 am

I say the trade gets vetoed, it's still early in the game like dcash said and it happens. Next time it happens, I would just let it go through but we are still only on the second day, and mistakes happen.
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Post#104 » by roseorbust » Mon Feb 4, 2008 4:45 am

DGrangeRx33 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Its happened twice. Why let some guy who basically cheats play? This is suppose to be about fun, not lies and deception.

He's a pretty sucky GM to have to manipulate his trades anyway. Pretty pathetic if you ask me. Who is it? I won't do a deal with him.

I agree, its everyones responsibility to check the trades, but lets have fun with it, not be paranoid that someone will try to screw you over.
Please don't label him. He seemed like a decent guy, but he just slipped one little trick in there. Just vote for me, and then we can get back to the game.
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Post#105 » by zong » Mon Feb 4, 2008 4:47 am

by reading carefully, it looks like its just a mistake out of excitement, i think the trade should get vetoed and all these posts get deleted for a good fresh start again
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Post#106 » by DanTown8587 » Mon Feb 4, 2008 4:54 am

I vote to veto the trade. Look, this is the problem with not having third parties make sure trades get done. Also, it being early in the tourney means we should not have any problem with this. So i vote #2.
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Post#107 » by Klomp » Mon Feb 4, 2008 4:58 am

Veto.
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Post#108 » by Raptors90102 » Mon Feb 4, 2008 5:07 am

DGrangeRx33 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Its happened twice. Why let some guy who basically cheats play? This is suppose to be about fun, not lies and deception.

He's a pretty sucky GM to have to manipulate his trades anyway. Pretty pathetic if you ask me. Who is it? I won't do a deal with him.

I agree, its everyones responsibility to check the trades, but lets have fun with it, not be paranoid that someone will try to screw you over.


Do you even f'in know me?? Have you ever dealt with me before? Do you even know what happened the last time I was involved in a situation like this? What gives you a right to make assumptions about me? Don't start judging people if you don't have a clue of what you're talking about.

The last time it happened was between me and #1knickfan (the knicks GM). I sent him Nick Young (16th pick player) and the NY first pick for Al Thornton (14th pick player). He agreed and I posted the trade. Later he flatly refused to admit that he ever accepted the deal when EVERYONE could see that he had actually accepted my posted deal and even gave a brief explaination for doing the deal. He flatly denied putting that post up. He accused me of hacking into his account and accepting the trade on his behalf. Can you believe it? Why would I waste so much time trying to hack into someone's account for a stupid game? Does that make sense to you. Everyone could see his post right there where he accepted and then he went as far as saying that he never put that post up and when he woke up in the morning, the post was already there and that I somehow hacked into his account to post it. This game isn't that important for me to hack into people's accounts.

So there you go, do you think that these situations are similar?? Next time, don't judge people, without knowing the facts. We're all here for fun, but we gotta take responsibilities for the trades we accept. I am not a problem creator, have had good relationships with the fellow GM's. This is my 3rd game. Do you think if I had such a reputation, these guys would let me even join in the first place?

For me, its a matter of principle, I don't want to be called a lier or a deciever. I made a fair and sqaure trade. If I wanted to just cheat, I wouldn't have written down the trade with every inch of detail. We all can get excited for doing a trade and might overlook trade details, but that doesn't mean that we start accusing of others of cheating and lying. I refused to back out of the trade because of this, I had to cancel two other trade proposals that I had gotten brewer involved in.

Its unfair to label me as a cheater when I put everything in black and white for the whole board to read. You don't want to deal with me, thats fine. But I suggest, you start respecting your fellow posters especially when you don't know anything about them, k?

Let me ask you this, if you and I make a deal in the future and I accept the deal only to later say that I got excited and accepted the deal without looking at what you had typed on your post and that it was not the deal we had agreed upon. Would you not be pissed? Would you give me and everyone who comes up with the same reason a free pass and void the trade?

I guess I could use this excuse next time someone fleeces me on a deal.. I didn't hide anything. If you guys want to void the trade, thats fine. But DON'T LABEL ME FOR SOMETHING WHICH IS NOT MY FAULT. I SUGGEST YOU KEEP YOUR REMARKS TO YOURSELF. CAPICHE?
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Post#109 » by xxSnEaKyPxx » Mon Feb 4, 2008 5:12 am

You're right, I should not have judged you. I apologize for that.

I was going off what others told me, I shouldn't have done that.

However, if you did actually change the deal that ya'll agreed upon, then that is pretty shady. I understand that you wrote everything down in detail, and he should have read it more carefully. But why can't you just let this one go? Especially if you did actually change the original deal. I'm sure those other GM's would still make the deal with you.

Anyway, I do apologize for judging, I did not know the situation, I was just going off what others had posted. Sorry for that.
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Post#110 » by Raptors90102 » Mon Feb 4, 2008 5:18 am

DGrangeRx33 wrote:You're right, I should not have judged you. I apologize for that.

I was going off what others told me, I shouldn't have done that.

However, if you did actually change the deal that ya'll agreed upon, then that is pretty shady. I understand that you wrote everything down in detail, and he should have read it more carefully. But why can't you just let this one go? Especially if you did actually change the original deal. I'm sure those other GM's would still make the deal with you.

Anyway, I do apologize for judging, I did not know the situation, I was just going off what others had posted. Sorry for that.


Man, I am not lying, that was the exact deal we had agreed upon. Maybe the Philly GM overlooked the details when we were negotiating the deal just like he did with my post. If anything, the blame for misreading lies with him.

But thats fine, go ahead and veto the trade, but I suggest the everyone reads what they're agreeing to, and don't make preassumptions when dealing with me, I am a good guy, a good player and far from a cheater. Just frustrated for all the time wasted and all the other lost deals.
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Post#111 » by xxSnEaKyPxx » Mon Feb 4, 2008 5:30 am

Raptors90102 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Man, I am not lying, that was the exact deal we had agreed upon. Maybe the Philly GM overlooked the details when we were negotiating the deal just like he did with my post. If anything, the blame for misreading lies with him.

But thats fine, go ahead and veto the trade, but I suggest the everyone reads what they're agreeing to, and don't make preassumptions when dealing with me, I am a good guy, a good player and far from a cheater. Just frustrated for all the time wasted and all the other lost deals.


Your right, I shouldn't have assumed.

Since apparently there are 2 sides to this, I'm just going to stay out of it. Again, I am sorry for jumping to conclusions, good luck this season, and if theres any Bobcat players you would like, I'd be open to a trade. :-)
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Post#112 » by moocow007 » Mon Feb 4, 2008 6:30 am

What are the rules for signing free agents?
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Post#113 » by revprodeji » Mon Feb 4, 2008 6:39 am

Instead of a GM based veto plan it would make sense to have 3 unbias judges who would make the rulling for if a trade was fair as well as decide where free agents go. I think this is very important otherwise someone will claim they were screwed.
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Post#114 » by xxSnEaKyPxx » Mon Feb 4, 2008 6:46 am

How does this work? Is it over at seasons end? I think it would be a fun thing to just kinda continue and see where we end up. Kinda sucks when your a bad team and have half a year to turn things around.
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Post#115 » by #1knickfan » Mon Feb 4, 2008 1:39 pm

Raptors90102 wrote:The last time it happened was between me and #1knickfan (the knicks GM). I sent him Nick Young (16th pick player) and the NY first pick for Al Thornton (14th pick player). He agreed and I posted the trade. Later he flatly refused to admit that he ever accepted the deal when EVERYONE could see that he had actually accepted my posted deal and even gave a brief explaination for doing the deal. He flatly denied putting that post up. He accused me of hacking into his account and accepting the trade on his behalf. Can you believe it? Why would I waste so much time trying to hack into someone's account for a stupid game? Does that make sense to you. Everyone could see his post right there where he accepted and then he went as far as saying that he never put that post up and when he woke up in the morning, the post was already there and that I somehow hacked into his account to post it. This game isn't that important for me to hack into people's accounts.


Now, lets call a spade a spade but when it comes to offering trades but you certainly do seem to have a history of manipulating or hiding facts. For example, the deal in question was posted originally on the site and in your emailed offer almost exactly as you wrote it in the bolded part of the above message. Nick Young and the 2009 Knicks first rounder for Al Thorton. That is the deal I accepted and quoted. Sometime after that someone, who that someone is you could answer better than me, changed it to include all those protections that ensure the pick wasn't going to be mines until 2010. But even though you or your friend did such an awesome manipulation job that I looked completely bat$hit for complaining about the deal as vigorously as I did but I still stand by that I did not post those stipulations in my acceptance of the deal nor were those stipulations there when I originally quoted and then requoted the deal.

Now, while it still pisses me off that I was screwed over I don't care enough about it to even keep me from making a future deal with you. But don't deny you ever manipulated any information with me when it seems clear that you must have done so again. One time is a coincidence but 2 times is a pattern. Just be happy that he doesn't seem nearly as pissed off about it as I was and still am.
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Post#116 » by Raptors90102 » Mon Feb 4, 2008 2:34 pm

#1knickfan wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Now, lets call a spade a spade but when it comes to offering trades but you certainly do seem to have a history of manipulating or hiding facts. For example, the deal in question was posted originally on the site and in your emailed offer almost exactly as you wrote it in the bolded part of the above message. Nick Young and the 2009 Knicks first rounder for Al Thorton. That is the deal I accepted and quoted. Sometime after that someone, who that someone is you could answer better than me, changed it to include all those protections that ensure the pick wasn't going to be mines until 2010. But even though you or your friend did such an awesome manipulation job that I looked completely bat$hit for complaining about the deal as vigorously as I did but I still stand by that I did not post those stipulations in my acceptance of the deal nor were those stipulations there when I originally quoted and then requoted the deal.

Now, while it still pisses me off that I was screwed over I don't care enough about it to even keep me from making a future deal with you. But don't deny you ever manipulated any information with me when it seems clear that you must have done so again. One time is a coincidence but 2 times is a pattern. Just be happy that he doesn't seem nearly as pissed off about it as I was and still am.


Haha.. seriously dude, this whole "hacking" story was the funniest thing I have read on these board. How much of a loser does one have to be in order to make the effort to hack one's account only to change a deal for a player who is just going to play on a FANTASY ROSTER!!! Its funny and sad at the same time. You claim to be a NYK fan, and don't tell me you didn't know that your 08 first pick was heavily protected!!!? (your accepting post indicated very well that you knew exactly what you got). But I havne't held any bad feelings about you openly accusing of me of something that not only challenged my character but also hurt my reputation among all the other GM's. And for your kind info, that protest of yours was flatly refused by the other GM's for it sheer baslessness and outright hilarity.

I don't know where the Philly GM got his info from, but he actually accused me of being habitual cheater and deceiver, and he sad that a lot of GM's told him that about me. As far as I remember, you're the only GM that I had a disagreement with over our trade, I have no clue which other GM gave him that negative impression about me. I'd like to know who those guys are. And if you were one of the guys who gave him this impression about me, than you should have told him the entire story and what exactly happened. And if you did tell him how "cunning" and "deceiving" of a guy I am, than I am very disappointed that you actually would hold a baseless grudge for so long over a F'IN GAME to actually hurt my reputation.

Having said that, whatever happened, happened. I am not going to force anyone to deal with me. I do my deals fairly and clearly. If anyone has a problem with that than its their loss, not mine.
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Post#117 » by #1knickfan » Mon Feb 4, 2008 3:58 pm

Well I don't know who were the people who have spoken to him directly regarding other things you supposedly did because it wasn't me. The only time I ever contacted him was to express my desire to trade for Samuel Dalemburt and as of now he still hasn't gotten back to me because he's probably been distracted by what's going on with his trade with you.

As for hacking, deny it all you want but as you so readily admit I am a Knick fan and I knew the stipulations on the pick and had you given me any inclination that those stipulations hadn't been waived I would have rejected the deal. I have said so repeatedly. With all the trades going by (our transaction thread was over 90 pages by the time I complained) and with all the bad trades the Knicks GM was making it was impossible to keep track of especially since people around the league because of scheduling issues, veto questions or just waiting for league confirmation did not update their rosters regularly. More to the point, when listing the picks you possessed on your teams roster page you listed the pick as the Knicks 2009 first rounder with no mention of any stipulations. It was easy for someone to assume you had aquired full protection of the pick during one of the previous 89 pages of listed transactions.

But whats done is done and although everyone thought I was nuts I still stand firmly by that the posts were manipulated after the fact. But lets move on with this because I don't want this league to get bogged down with this stuff from almost a year ago. We both know what you did and it apparently happened again. Hopefully, people will still be willing to trade with you as long as they are extra cautious. You may not like that people don't trust you but when funny things happen in two different trades regarding the same future draft pick you have to expect it.
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Post#118 » by Raptors90102 » Mon Feb 4, 2008 4:27 pm

#1knickfan wrote:Well I don't know who were the people who have spoken to him directly regarding other things you supposedly did because it wasn't me. The only time I ever contacted him was to express my desire to trade for Samuel Dalemburt and as of now he still hasn't gotten back to me because he's probably been distracted by what's going on with his trade with you.

As for hacking, deny it all you want but as you so readily admit I am a Knick fan and I knew the stipulations on the pick and had you given me any inclination that those stipulations hadn't been waived I would have rejected the deal. I have said so repeatedly. With all the trades going by (our transaction thread was over 90 pages by the time I complained) and with all the bad trades the Knicks GM was making it was impossible to keep track of especially since people around the league because of scheduling issues, veto questions or just waiting for league confirmation did not update their rosters regularly. More to the point, when listing the picks you possessed on your teams roster page you listed the pick as the Knicks 2009 first rounder with no mention of any stipulations. It was easy for someone to assume you had aquired full protection of the pick during one of the previous 89 pages of listed transactions.

But whats done is done and although everyone thought I was nuts I still stand firmly by that the posts were manipulated after the fact. But lets move on with this because I don't want this league to get bogged down with this stuff from almost a year ago. We both know what you did and it apparently happened again. Hopefully, people will still be willing to trade with you as long as they are extra cautious. You may not like that people don't trust you but when funny things happen in two different trades regarding the same future draft pick you have to expect it.


Lol.. you still think I hacked into your account? Haha.. I still find it funny. But thats OK, I see what you're still trying to do. Blame me for your mistake. Thats fine. If thats what makes you happy, so be it. I admire your belief though. You're relentless with your insistance that it was me who fooled you and the fact that you had a change of heart after accepting the deal had nothing to do with it. People shouldn't trust anybody, hence, the need to recheck every deal rather than "assuming" and "overlooking details" of the trade only to cry foul afterwards to get out of the deal.

But thats fine man, you keep telling yourself that I magically hacked into your account. If thats what makes you feel better about yourself, so be it.

I again stress, I am not out here to fleece anyone. So whenever you guys deal with anyone, make sure you guys are not drunk/tired/sleepy and not reading things that haven't been offered by the other GM. Read everything carefully before you wrongly accuse people of foul play.
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Post#119 » by revprodeji » Mon Feb 4, 2008 4:35 pm

The arguing will make this whole thing die off.
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Post#120 » by b_roy7 » Mon Feb 4, 2008 4:37 pm

revprodeji wrote:The arguing will make this whole thing die off.
I know, really. Only 1/10 of the posts have actually been related to the game.

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