TT '09 - DEAD Thread

[Trader_Joe]

J.Alexander, W.Sharpe*, 2011 #2 for TPE

Including a draft pick and a youngster just to get rid of Alexander? Plus as previously stated, this isn't a trade that can be done now.

ORIGINALITY - 7
FEASIBILITY - 0
EFFECTIVENESS - 1

As pointed out by Euch and CD, it can be counted, since the rules were not explicit, and techinically Alexander and the #2 could be traded for part of the TPE, the remainder of the TPE
could be used for W. Sharpe.

As for the logic, the Bucks have tried to pawn off Alexander in the past, including to NJ in a pure salary dump move.. Ridnour and Alexander for Swift and Ager (wish NJ did that one)
http://www.brewhoop.com/2009/3/6/783484 ... -ridnour-a

Sharpe is a scrub, that was simply included to shave 3.3m total for Milwuakee so they could match a Sessions offer. Both Sharpe and Alexander are expendable as Milwuakee has LRMM, Warrick, K.Thomas and A.Johnson, as forwards, though Sessions is not exendable. They need to keep him, and clearing up 3.3m in salary helps accomplish that. A 2nd rounder 2 years out, is the extra compensation for Miami adding 6.6 in payroll (salary and tax).

[InBoobieWeTrust]

Sacramento gets: $6 million TPE
Orlando gets: Beno Udrih

Originality: 5
Feasibility: 1
Effectiveness: 3

I haven't seen Beno to Orlando discussed a lot, but I feel that this is a waste of their TPE. Beno has a contract that gives him negative value as a player. Orlando may need a back-up PG, but they also run an offense where the PG doesn't even necessarily control the ball for a lot of the time. That's too much money and too many years to give to a back-up, even though a team goes into the luxury tax, their moves are calculated. This is reckless spending.

[N.O.R.E.]

I wouldn't be arguing Trader Joe, my deal got graded harsher than yours and the Bucks were pawining off Charlie Bell's contract. I don't really understand the comment "the Clippers haven't shown any interest in Bell" as most of the deals that go through aren't rumoured deals. Also, how is Bell not an upgrade as a back-up 2?
J. Alexander is on a cheap contract and must have some potential, its not as if the Clippers are in desperate salary dump mode after getting rid of Zach.

[ecuhus1981]

I'm going to cut off the judging tonight and midnight ET, and start seeding tomorrow. 4 judgings is enough if need be, but feel free to complete yours tonight, InBoobieWeTrust and klomp44. (IBWT, did you realize that you only submitted one judgment? Didn't know if you had copied and pasted incorrectly or what...)

[InBoobieWeTrust]

Note: I'm judging originality not based on specific finalized ideas, but if it's a general idea that's been floated..I'm taking points off, but still giving you some leeway. As for feasibility, trades are always an unlikely thing so my scores will generally be under 5, especially in three team trades. As for effectiveness, I weigh the positives and negatives for both teams

LA Lakers
Outgoing: $2.22 mil TPE from Chris Mihm
Incoming: Acie Law

GS Warriors
Outgoing: Acie Law
Incoming: $2.2 mil TPE from Chris Mihm

Originality: 8
Feasibility: 3
Effectiveness: 4

I haven't seen Acie Law mentioned, because I figured the Warriors were just going to keep him around if C.J. Watson does end up leaving. Relatively original at least. However, Shannon Brown, Farmar, and Fisher already create a glut at the PG position, and I don't think you could say Acie Law is better than any of them. Some sources say Dr. Buss balked at the tax bill to bring Odom back until Phil talked him into his senses, I don't see him throwing away millions of dollars(salary+tax) for this years Sun-Yue.

TPE Trade:

Denver Nuggets Trade:
Allen Iverson TPE for 5.2 million
Chucky Atkins TPE for 1.7 million

Denver Nuggets Receive:
Kyle Korver
Francisco Elson

Utah Jazz Trade:
Kyle Korver

Utah Jazz Receive:
Allen Iverson TPE for 5.2 million

Milwaukee Bucks Trade:
Francisco Elson

Milwaukee Bucks Receive:
Chucky Atkins TPE for 1.7 million

Originality: 7
Feasibility: 3
Effectiveness: 5

I see the motives for all teams here, though I don't think Denver would be willing to foot the tax bill that Korver and Elson will brong on them when they already have JR Smith and a decent big-man rotation. If they wouldn't pay Kleiza, they won't pay Korver that kind of money. Also, trades involving multiple teams are automatically low in the feasibility department.

MIA gets: Brandan Wright
MIA trades: 2.7 mil TPE, MIA 2010 1st rounder, Cash

GSW get: 2.7 mil TPE, MIA 2010 1st rounder, Cash
GSW trade: Brandan Wright

Originality: 5
Feasibility: 1
Effectiveness: 1

This is a steal for Miami. Wright is still a good prospect on a great rookie contract. Miami's first probably won't even be a lottery pick. GSW isn't this desperate to save money. Wright is a guy I see being moved in a package for talent maybe, but he won't be salary dumped for a mediocre draft pick. I haven't seen it much, but there's no way it happens and it does nothing for GSW.

New Orleans out / New Jersey in:
Julian Wright $2.00M

New Jersey out / New Orleans in:
$2.00M TPE, using a part of NJ's larger TE
2010 NJ 2nd round pick

Originality: 3
Feasibility: 3
Effectiveness: 3

I've seen New Orleans salary dump every player they have ten times on this board, but with this trade it's effective in the sense that NJ gets a nice piece to add to their rebuilding phase. However, with the Okafur trade, it's pretty evident that NOH is looking to compete, or at least at the moment are looking to compete. JuJu showed some nice flashes last year and should fit well on the wings with CP3 where they sorely lack athleticism.

New York trades: $1.1M TE, protected 2010 2nd round pick
New York receives: Devin Brown

Originality: 3
Feasibility: 2
Effectiveness: 3

Again, I've seen a million trades with NOH dumping salary. I just don't see a reason for the Knicks to do this. They can pick up any random crappy but scrappy guard to play for the minimum where they don't even have to foot most of the bill. No point in trading a 2nd or spending money.

Denver trades Renaldo Balkman (1 year/$2.1 million) for Phoenix TPE $2 million.

Originality: 5
Feasibility: 0
Effectiveness: 0

Balkman isn't a very good player and Robert Sarver isn't going to open his wallet for this guy. Phoenix has no motivation to add unnecessary money to their payroll.

Travis Diener (1.74M) to ORL for 1.74M of Turkoglu TPE and a heavily protected future 2nd round pick.

Originality: 6
Feasibility: 4
Effectiveness: 8

Not bad, not bad at all. A lot of talk about Orlando getting a back-up PG. I'm not necessarily sure that Bird would even want to trade Diener(team image thing that he's into), and I'm not sure Orlando would want to use some of their very valuable TPE on Diener, as for feasibility, I'm not sure if it could happen. However, it would be effective in saving Indiana money and filling a need for the Magic.

Denver Sends: Most of the $2.1 Million TPE
Denver Receives: Jarvis Hayes

New Jersey Sends: Jarvis Hayes
New Jersey Receives: Most of the $2.1 Million TPE

Originality: 5
Feasibility: 2
Effectiveness: 5

It's a relatively new idea, and it fills a need for both teams, but it's not feasible. Denver has shown this off-season that they're worried about the tax and aren't willing to delve into it for even Kleiza, much less a guy like Jarvis Hayes. Won't happen.

LAC Sends: 5.2 Million TPE, heavily protected future 2nd Rounder
LAC Gets: Kyle Korver

Originality: 7
Feasibility: 6
Effectiveness: 8

Nice trade all around. Utah dumps money and saves on the tax and LAC gets a knockdown shooter for their ball-club. The only things I see snagging this deal are the fact that Korver is Utah's only true marksman outside Okur, and the Clippers might just opt to bring Novak back, that's why it got a 6 for feasibility.

Clippers trade:
3.945 Trade Exception
for:
1) Rasual Butler

Originality: 3
Feasibility: 2
Effectiveness: 2

Way too many NOH salary dumps. Butler is a useful player for them, and the Okafur trade showed me that they're going to at least attempt to compete this year. They won't be dumping younger useful athletic players for nothing.

LA Clippers Trade: 7.5 TPE

Sacramento Kings Trade: Andres Nocioni

Originality: 5
Feasibility: 2
Effectiveness: 2

Haven't seen much of Noc to LAC, but I don't think it's feasible or effective. Sterling isn't going spend his TPE on Nocioni. An older veteran glue guy who's owed a lot of money isn't the direction the Clippers seem to be going. He has post 2010 money on his deal as well. Also, with Thorton and possibly bringing back Novak, this is just a way too much money for a guy who won't have much of a role.

Chicago Bulls give: Kirk Hinrich
Chicago Bulls get: Jordan Farmar, Luke Ridnour, Future Second Round Pick

Los Angeles Lakers give: Jordan Farmar, D.J. Mbenga, Adam Morrison, 2 Future Second Round Picks
Los Angeles Lakers get: Francisco Elson, Kirk Hinrich

Milwaukee Bucks give: Francisco Elson, Luke Ridnour
Milwaukee Bucks get: D.J. Mbenga, Adam Morrison, Future Second Round Pick

Originality: 2
Feasibility: 1
Effectiveness: 3

I've seen Hinrich to L.A. a million times. A few things to consider are that Milwaukee has no business in this trade, they really don't save much money and Skiles likes Ridnour. Chicago, who just lost their best scorer, loses even more offense on their team in a player like Hinrich. They get back two guys who make it a glut at PG and they really don't get much besides dumping Hinrich's salary for a year. The Lakers rob everyone, but I don't think Buss will be willing to shell out the cash for Hinrich. I think the Lakers are mostly done this off-season. Plus, I don't see a TPE in play....

Miami sends:
TPE
2nd round pick

Milwaukee sends:
Kurt Thomas

Originality: 9
Feasibility: 5
Effectiveness: 8

I really like this deal for Miami and it saves Milwaukee money and gets rid of Kurt who, behind Bogut and Warrick and Amir ...won't be very useful. Kohl would be happy to get out of his contract. I think Miami could really use Kurt's rebounding presence. However, Riley has already said what his intentions are...and after striking out on Odom it looks like the Heat, for better or worse, will stand pat this year and not spend money when they can't truly compete.

Golden State trades:

PG: Acie Law

Orlando trades:

2.2 million TPE

Originality: 5
Feasibility: 4
Effectivness: 4

I don't see Orlando using a chunk of their TPE on Acie Law. I don't think he's good enough or big enough of an upgrade over anyone to warrant it, let alone to warrant paying more luxury tax for him. I think they'll go after a guy who's just as proven as Acie and get him for the Vet Min. If anything, Watson is the guy from GS they want.

Clippers Receive: Charlie Bell, J. Alexander

Bucks Receive: TPE, 2nd

Originality: 4
Feasibility: 0
Effectiveness: 0

I don't see the Clips paying all that extra money to get a redundant, raw, Joe Alexander and to pay Charlie Bell for multiple years when they already have Baron Davis locked up.

J.Alexander, W.Sharpe*, 2011 #2 for TPE

Originality: 7
Feasibility: 1
Effectiveness: 4

Could be a slight help or motivation for a team to spend money on Joe, but I don't think he's worth it and I'm not sure many teams do. Joe could be a solid pick-up for a team though, if he can develop.



End Note: Sorry if my judgments are a bit late, I didn't realize they were due so early. If you want to use them, here they are.

[ecuhus1981]

I think we should use them, since you took the time and effort to complete it. klomp44, we'll look forward to hearing from you in the rounds to come.

I need to average the scores from this preliminary round, and hopefully at some point today I will release the "bracket". I am planning on making all of the 1st-round assignments, but if another judge has fresh ideas they'd like to share, let me know via this thread, and feel free to shoulder some of this load!

[ecuhus1981]

I have to stick by my guns, and disallow bigjabroni from the competition. Even after you account for the "+100K" rule, Balkman's salary is over 12K too large for the PHX TPE to handle. The trade just doesn't work. bj, if you're out there, I hope you understand, and better luck next time.

Alright, the preliminary round scores are tallied, and it just so happens that 16 participants are left. Here is how it all shook out:

vincecarter4pres - 20.4
KiDdFrESh - 19
RTM - 18.6
sammydavis - 18
legacyinthemakin89c - 16.4
sterncohen - 16.2
poopdamoop - 15
ws26 - 14.6
mikero - 14
eitanr - 14
mhd - 13.4
N.O.R.E. - 13.2
Finger Roll - 12.8
ClipperDomination - 12.6
SW567 - 11.2
Trader_Joe - 9.4

I have seeded the "bracket" portion of this tournament by prelims score (1 vs. 16, 2 vs. 15 etc.), and assignments should be on their way.

[ClipperDomination]

Here is my trade:

Clippers trade:
3.945 Trade Exception
for:
1) Rasual Butler

You, sir, are greatness.

[eitanr]

That's pretty amazing that someone already predicted the Butler deal. I think he gets a first round buy in round 2. Serious kudos there.

[ecuhus1981]

^

I know, I feel sick after seeing that trade completed. I guess we truly have no clue what GMs are goin to do next...

I can't award you any extra points, mhd, but you have my sincerest admiration for hitting this trade on the head! :8

[mhd]

I should have added that 2nd round pick to be the exact trade!

[CellarDoor]

Unbelievable. Who knew the Clippers were that stupid?


Wait, I think I actually did.

[vincecarter4pres]

Here is my trade:

Clippers trade:
3.945 Trade Exception
for:
1) Rasual Butler

You, sir, are greatness.

+1

[vincecarter4pres]

vincecarter4pres - 20.4

Hey look at that. Even after one of the judges gave me one of the lowest scores he handed out for the entire 1st round period, I still took top honors.
I feel like an American figure skater vs a Russian and French scoring panel.

Just bustin' balls Ecuhus, felt I had to.

[dockingsched]

i'm sorry mhd for the 3

[ecuhus1981]

vincecarter4pres - 20.4

Hey look at that. Even after one of the judges gave me one of the lowest scores he handed out for the entire 1st round period, I still took top honors.
I feel like an American figure skater vs a Russian and French scoring panel.

Just bustin' balls Ecuhus, felt I had to.

All I can do is salute ya!

At least no one will claim I'm a Nets homer in this competition!

[InBoobieWeTrust]

Wow, I really didn't think NOH would dump salary like that after the Emeka trade and I graded mhd's Rasual Butler trade low.

Consider this me officially eating crow on that one.

Oh well.

[deviljets7]

Wow, I really didn't think NOH would dump salary like that after the Emeka trade and I graded mhd's Rasual Butler trade low.

Consider this me officially eating crow on that one.

Oh well.

Not sure how big of a factor this was, but while they took on years in the Emeka trade, they actually saved money in terms of this year and next. After accounting for the tax, they saved around $2.2 mil from it for 09/10.

[dockingsched]

echus, feel free to start a new thread for the next round if you want. now that its here in the game board, you have a lot more freedom with your threads, hopefully to cut down on the clutter. sometimes its hard to find the newest scenarios if the thread is already 11 pages long.

[dockingsched]

also, u can start a thread on the main trade board guiding people over to this board similar to the one i have up there. i'll replace mine with yours that way u can edit the title when u see fit.