Tournament of Champions 2020 (Post-Merger) - Discussion Thread

[Zion Wembanyama]

Go time

[Kiwifan]

Thanks MJ23 for sorting the quote, was battling on my phone so just logged my computer on.

Was tossing up between 3 players there, decided to go for Duncan who can anchor the defense, be a 1A/1B on offence and is low FGA.
Lets see how it goes.

[wackbone]

Thanks MJ23 for sorting the quote, was battling on my phone so just logged my computer on.

Was tossing up between 3 players there, decided to go for Duncan who can anchor the defense, be a 1A/1B on offence and is low FGA.
Lets see how it goes.

I always tend to avoid Duncan. Obviously a great player, but he’s too big/slow to guard the small ball 4s, and it’s not ideal to have him guard the ATG 5s. Seems like a tough build. Again, he’s obviously an amazing player, just hard to figure out a defensive build with him, in my opinion/experience.

[Fadeaway_J]

Thanks MJ23 for sorting the quote, was battling on my phone so just logged my computer on.

Was tossing up between 3 players there, decided to go for Duncan who can anchor the defense, be a 1A/1B on offence and is low FGA.
Lets see how it goes.

I always tend to avoid Duncan. Obviously a great player, but he’s too big/slow to guard the small ball 4s, and it’s not ideal to have him guard the ATG 5s. Seems like a tough build. Again, he’s obviously an amazing player, just hard to figure out a defensive build with him, in my opinion/experience.

Why not?

[wackbone]

Thanks MJ23 for sorting the quote, was battling on my phone so just logged my computer on.

Was tossing up between 3 players there, decided to go for Duncan who can anchor the defense, be a 1A/1B on offence and is low FGA.
Lets see how it goes.

I always tend to avoid Duncan. Obviously a great player, but he’s too big/slow to guard the small ball 4s, and it’s not ideal to have him guard the ATG 5s. Seems like a tough build. Again, he’s obviously an amazing player, just hard to figure out a defensive build with him, in my opinion/experience.

Why not?

I don’t know, he’s not going to get burned, but there are a ton of Cs I’d prefer to guard those guys than him. I know he played most of his career at C, but that was also after most of the ATG Cs had retired. He can hold his own, but there is at least some doubt in my mind about having him guard those guys 1 on 1.

I might just be overthinking it, don’t know.

[Jordan Syndrome]

I always tend to avoid Duncan. Obviously a great player, but he’s too big/slow to guard the small ball 4s, and it’s not ideal to have him guard the ATG 5s. Seems like a tough build. Again, he’s obviously an amazing player, just hard to figure out a defensive build with him, in my opinion/experience.

Why not?

I don’t know, he’s not going to get burned, but there are a ton of Cs I’d prefer to guard those guys than him. I know he played most of his career at C, but that was also after most of the ATG Cs had retired. He can hold his own, but there is at least some doubt in my mind about having him guard those guys 1 on 1.

I might just be overthinking it, don’t know.

He arguably outplayed Peak Shaq in 2003 and 2004. The fact he can fit next to 4s and 5s makes him more valuable, not less.

Duncan isn't as mobile as Garnett at the 4, nobody is, but that isn't a slight on him.

[Kiwifan]

I always tend to avoid Duncan. Obviously a great player, but he’s too big/slow to guard the small ball 4s, and it’s not ideal to have him guard the ATG 5s. Seems like a tough build. Again, he’s obviously an amazing player, just hard to figure out a defensive build with him, in my opinion/experience.

Why not?

I don’t know, he’s not going to get burned, but there are a ton of Cs I’d prefer to guard those guys than him. I know he played most of his career at C, but that was also after most of the ATG Cs had retired. He can hold his own, but there is at least some doubt in my mind about having him guard those guys 1 on 1.

I might just be overthinking it, don’t know.

I think people tend to overthink/overestimate individual defensive matchups (I’m guilty as well) but defence is more importantly a team scheme and Duncan was one of the best ever. I’d happily take him matched up against any of the ATG centers, and in this pool there’s only 1 maybe 2 ATG centre who I think would do a better job against their peers (not including role players).

Regarding Duncan vs a stretch or small ball 4, I think his defence against them will be far superior to the defence they can offer against him on the other end on most occasions he will easily win that matchup.

[Kiwifan]

I feel Duncan gets undervalued both in real life and in these because he wasn’t a ‘flashy or sexy’ player. Not directed at you Wack, just a general observation.

[Jordan Syndrome]

I feel Duncan gets undervalued both in real life and in these because he wasn’t a ‘flashy or sexy’ player. Not directed at you Wack, just a general observation.

He was voted 5th in the Top 100 Project on the PC Board--that's a fair ranking. I do agree he is often seen as a lesser player than Peak Shaq or Hakeem and I don't think its clear who was better.

[wackbone]

I feel Duncan gets undervalued both in real life and in these because he wasn’t a ‘flashy or sexy’ player. Not directed at you Wack, just a general observation.

We operate with players in one specific season. I don't think Duncan has any individual season that are as good as most first round talent in these. His legend is based on his consistency and longevity. Few players have anywhere near the length of a prime that he had. But with these games it's usually about one specific season, not their career as a whole.

[wackbone]

Like I said he won't be burned by any means. He can certainly hold his own. Just not ***ideal*** against bigger/stronger Cs. In this pool there are only a few of them, so he should be fine.

[wackbone]

I am also extremely guilty at looking at individual matchups. It is usually difficult to separate teams in these games as most/all are just so talented, so in my head an individual matchup can be the main difference when talent and fit are relatively even.

[Jordan Syndrome]

I feel Duncan gets undervalued both in real life and in these because he wasn’t a ‘flashy or sexy’ player. Not directed at you Wack, just a general observation.

We operate with players in one specific season. I don't think Duncan has any individual season that are as good as most first round talent in these. His legend is based on his consistency and longevity. Few players have anywhere near the length of a prime that he had. But with these games it's usually about one specific season, not their career as a whole.

Uhh 2003 Duncan is an all-time great season--Top 5 in my book as a peak.

[Kiwifan]

I feel Duncan gets undervalued both in real life and in these because he wasn’t a ‘flashy or sexy’ player. Not directed at you Wack, just a general observation.

We operate with players in one specific season. I don't think Duncan has any individual season that are as good as most first round talent in these. His legend is based on his consistency and longevity. Few players have anywhere near the length of a prime that he had. But with these games it's usually about one specific season, not their career as a whole.

Uhh 2003 Duncan is an all-time great season--Top 5 in my book as a peak.

For this pool of seasons I have a clear top3 peaks (MJ/lebron and another yet to be picked)

Then a group whom you could argue any of in my mind (Duncan, Bird, Magic, and a few yet to be picked).

[wackbone]

I feel Duncan gets undervalued both in real life and in these because he wasn’t a ‘flashy or sexy’ player. Not directed at you Wack, just a general observation.

We operate with players in one specific season. I don't think Duncan has any individual season that are as good as most first round talent in these. His legend is based on his consistency and longevity. Few players have anywhere near the length of a prime that he had. But with these games it's usually about one specific season, not their career as a whole.

Uhh 2003 Duncan is an all-time great season--Top 5 in my book as a peak.

We're going to have to agree to disagree on that. I don't have a specific ranking for that season amongst other peaks, but I wouldn't put that season near my top.

[wackbone]

We operate with players in one specific season. I don't think Duncan has any individual season that are as good as most first round talent in these. His legend is based on his consistency and longevity. Few players have anywhere near the length of a prime that he had. But with these games it's usually about one specific season, not their career as a whole.

Uhh 2003 Duncan is an all-time great season--Top 5 in my book as a peak.

For this pool of seasons I have a clear top3 peaks (MJ/lebron and another yet to be picked)

Then a group whom you could argue any of in my mind (Duncan, Bird, Magic, and a few yet to be picked).

I would agree with this. MJ/LeBron/you know who and then probably about 10 players with a similar peak

[Jordan Syndrome]

We operate with players in one specific season. I don't think Duncan has any individual season that are as good as most first round talent in these. His legend is based on his consistency and longevity. Few players have anywhere near the length of a prime that he had. But with these games it's usually about one specific season, not their career as a whole.

Uhh 2003 Duncan is an all-time great season--Top 5 in my book as a peak.

For this pool of seasons I have a clear top3 peaks (MJ/lebron and another yet to be picked)

Then a group whom you could argue any of in my mind (Duncan, Bird, Magic, and a few yet to be picked).

I have Jordan/LeBron tier 0, 6-7 guys in tier 1 and about 10 in the next tier.

[wackbone]

Saying that, lower-mid end of the first is probably the place to be. Get one of the best players and still a good 2nd option. This draft pool will thin out quick

[wackbone]

By the way, in no way am I trying to knock the pick. My original point was that I avoid drafting him for my own fit reasons. He is obviously first round talent

[Kiwifan]

By the way, in no way am I trying to knock the pick. My original point was that I avoid drafting him for my own fit reasons. He is obviously first round talent

No worries I knew you weren’t knocking it. just thought it a good opportunity for some basketball discussion with like minded individuals!