Forgotten Stars Finals - BdeRegt vs. pelifan*

[Laimbeer]

Here is a quick list of what you need in your writeup.

1. Specific years for each player on your team
2. Rotations and minutes for each player
3. Reasoning as to why your team will win and/or why people should vote for you.

Do not vote in this thread until both managers have submitted their writeups.

If writeups aren't posted within 24 hours, we will vote solely based on the players they have drafted (and any rotations they have posted on roster page).

**First to 4 votes advances**

..

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[BdeRegt]

1. Larry Bird - 1986 - 19.6
2. Steph Curry - 2015 - 16.8
3. Andre Iguodala - 2017 - 5.5
4. Carmelo Anthony - 2013 - 0
5. Danny Green - 2017 - 6.6
6. Artis Gilmore - 1973 - 12.41
7. Joel Anthony - 2011 - 1.3
8. Eric Snow - 1997 - 2.4

Total: 64.61/65

Steph Curry (40) / Eric Snow (8)
Danny Green (36) / Andre Iguodala (12)
Carmelo Anthony (28) / Andre Iguodala (20)
Larry Bird (38) / Carmelo Anthony (10)
Artis Gilmore (40) / Joel Anthony (8)

Pelifan has built a very nice team but I think final year Wilt (not even NBA Finals Wilt), post-peak West, and well past-prime Jones allows me to pull this one out. I hope people look at years chosen not just the names.

For starters, peak Gilmore will outplay this version of WIlt and most importantly, can battle Wilt to a draw on the boards. MVP-Curry at PG gives me an edge here as well. Even if you consider these positions a wash, the wings is where the strength of my team lies. Carmelo and Bird are both excellent scorers that Barkley has no chance of stopping.

Defensively, I have set my rotation for how people will defend. Curry works hard defensively so fine with him on PGs. Green will take Drexler/West, while Melo takes Bowen and Bird guards Barkley. When Pelifan goes small, I have Iguodala off the bench to take Drexler at SF while Green can guard West. When Jones is in the game, my weakest defender will rest on him.

Just breakdown of individual talent:
Gilmore > Wilt (this version, obviously not better than peak Wilt and I'd have this very close if it was even '72 Wilt)
Bird > Barkley
Melo > Bowen
Green < Drexler
Curry > West
Iguodala < Tiny
Snow < Jones (don't expect either to have an impact with version of Jones chosen)
Anthony > Anderson

[pelifan]

1973 Wilt Chamberlain 6.0
1990 Charles Barkley 14.9
1971 Jerry West 16.7
2008 Bruce Bowen 5.3
1991 Clyde Drexler 16.3
1985 Bobby Jones 4.8
1996 Greg Anderson 1.0
1973 Nate "Tiny" Archibald

65.0

PG: West (12) / Arhibald (36)
SG: Drexler (22) / West (26)
SF: Bowen (28) / Drexler (15) / Barkley (5)
PF: Barkley (34) / Jones (14)
C: Chamberlain (39) / Jones (1) / Anderson (8)

lol wut 73 Wilt's team made finals.

I'm sure BD would say being the only person to vote against me the last two rounds for basketball reasons. I know the truth, BD scared.

You can see it in the writeup full of silly nonsense

Watch on YouTube

100% 73 Chamberlain better than 73 "non peak" Gilmore you can see it in retro player of the year project on PC board. Worst opinion I've read in a while.

Like the team

[BdeRegt]

Sorry, I meant NBA Finals MVP Wilt from '72. '73 Wilt was probably 3rd or 4th best player on the Lakers behind Goodrich, West, and how you view McMillian.

[Laimbeer]

I think 1973 Wilt is fine, but I also give an advantage to Bird over Barkley. West was still playing at a level comparable to Steph. Then we have Drexler and Melo as secondary scorers, and they are good ones. I'd have liked to hear more about how Pel plans to defend, particularly with Barkley.

Two really talented teams, but it comes down to fit for me. I don't like Tiny as a point in this setting, at least not nearly as much as Steph. Steph running the show with that shooting is the difference for me.

Vote: Bde

[pelifan]

Sorry, I meant NBA Finals MVP Wilt from '72. '73 Wilt was probably 3rd or 4th best player on the Lakers behind Goodrich, West, and how you view McMillian.

Wrong. Wilt was the best player on the Lakers after 71. Stop saying dumb things.

[pelifan]

I think 1973 Wilt is fine, but I also give an advantage to Bird over Barkley. West was still playing at a level comparable to Steph. Then we have Drexler and Melo as secondary scorers, and they are good ones. I'd have liked to hear more about how Pel plans to defend, particularly with Barkley.

Two really talented teams, but it comes down to fit for me. I don't like Tiny as a point in this setting, at least not nearly as much as Steph. Steph running the show with that shooting is the difference for me.

Vote: Bde

Pretty obvious Barkley never guards Bird and Tiny never guards Steph, all you really have to worry about. If BD wants to ISO Melo on Barkley that's fine with me.

BDs defense is noticeably weaker and has more options to worry about defending.

[GeorgeMarcus]

4 out of the 6 best players, and chemistry that works well enough.

Vote - pelifan

[Statlanta]

Pretty obvious Barkley never guards Bird and Tiny never guards Steph, all you really have to worry about. If BD wants to ISO Melo on Barkley that's fine with me.

BDs defense is noticeably weaker and has more options to worry about defending.

It actually isn't obvious when you only defend Wilt's season in your write-up. The general public is going to have to assume matchups if you won't post it in your writeup. I actually thought the same as Laimbeer as well.

[Statlanta]

Vote: pelifan
I think the overall talent outweighs the spacing advantage

[lilroddyb]

Pel has the talent advantage but lacks outsite shooting, BdeRegt has the better fit and spacing advandtage, this is close but I'll vote BdeRegt

[pelifan]

Pretty obvious Barkley never guards Bird and Tiny never guards Steph, all you really have to worry about. If BD wants to ISO Melo on Barkley that's fine with me.

BDs defense is noticeably weaker and has more options to worry about defending.

It actually isn't obvious when you only defend Wilt's season in your write-up. The general public is going to have to assume matchups if you won't post it in your writeup. I actually thought the same as Laimbeer as well.

I don't know in general I assume everyone would assume match ups based on what makes the most sense. I'm not a basketball coach and unless I say I'm putting Barkley on Steph Curry you gotta assume that my team is going to do what's best to win. Just one of the reasons I hate write ups.

In general I think it's pretty clear you want to hide your weak defenders wherever you can.

[BdeRegt]

Sorry, I meant NBA Finals MVP Wilt from '72. '73 Wilt was probably 3rd or 4th best player on the Lakers behind Goodrich, West, and how you view McMillian.

Wrong. Wilt was the best player on the Lakers after 71. Stop saying dumb things.

Considering West was first team All-NBA and WIlt didn't make either team, I think most people at the time agree with me. Wilt was basically just a defender and rebounder on the Lakers (very good at each, but still not the dominant player like his prime. You took this version of WIlt to save FGAs. Its hard to act like he is going to be scoring 20 PPG or anything. Wilt is still good player but clear that he isn't a game changing force in season chosen.

Pretty obvious Barkley never guards Bird and Tiny never guards Steph, all you really have to worry about. If BD wants to ISO Melo on Barkley that's fine with me.

BDs defense is noticeably weaker and has more options to worry about defending.

I wouldn't ISO Melo but will do a lot of actions with Melo screening for Bird and Curry and even do Curry/Green or Iguodala action to get Tiny on him. This would make for really advantageous Curry/Bird pick and roll against Tiny/Barkley. It is pretty easy to match up hunt with my team.

[Laimbeer]

Tied 2-2

[pelifan]

Sorry, I meant NBA Finals MVP Wilt from '72. '73 Wilt was probably 3rd or 4th best player on the Lakers behind Goodrich, West, and how you view McMillian.

Wrong. Wilt was the best player on the Lakers after 71. Stop saying dumb things.

Considering West was first team All-NBA and WIlt didn't make either team, I think most people at the time agree with me. Wilt was basically just a defender and rebounder on the Lakers (very good at each, but still not the dominant player like his prime. You took this version of WIlt to save FGAs. Its hard to act like he is going to be scoring 20 PPG or anything. Wilt is still good player but clear that he isn't a game changing force in season chosen.

Pretty obvious Barkley never guards Bird and Tiny never guards Steph, all you really have to worry about. If BD wants to ISO Melo on Barkley that's fine with me.

BDs defense is noticeably weaker and has more options to worry about defending.

I wouldn't ISO Melo but will do a lot of actions with Melo screening for Bird and Curry and even do Curry/Green or Iguodala action to get Tiny on him. This would make for really advantageous Curry/Bird pick and roll against Tiny/Barkley. It is pretty easy to match up hunt with my team.

Like I said, look at advanced stats and retro player of the year projects. Wilt is a dominant defensive force who can pass and let his offense take a back seat. Gilmore isn't anywhere near as good defensively. Kareem was better and that's it in 73.

You're really triggering me. Wilt maybe the 4th best player on the Lakers? But you also wanted to take him in the draft we just had.

Just stop talking. Your opinion is totally baseless and ignore consensus thought, and it's becoming a pattern. I didn't want to get involved in this write up things, but you just continue to astound me with your ability to just pass off misinformation as fact.

Penbeast is one of the most well informed posters I know about basketball history and has Wilt Chamberlain as the 2nd best player in the league in 73.

viewtopic.php?f=64&t=1045902

8 pages and not a single one has Gilmore over Wilt.

Melo doesn't play your modern innovative offense. Never has. He is who he is. You also have to stagger Bird and Currys minutes on the court because you can't do anything without them. There probably wouldn't be more than 10-15 minutes with all of Bird, Curry, Barkley and Tiny on the court based on how 8 man rotations have to work.

[BdeRegt]

Wrong. Wilt was the best player on the Lakers after 71. Stop saying dumb things.

Considering West was first team All-NBA and WIlt didn't make either team, I think most people at the time agree with me. Wilt was basically just a defender and rebounder on the Lakers (very good at each, but still not the dominant player like his prime. You took this version of WIlt to save FGAs. Its hard to act like he is going to be scoring 20 PPG or anything. Wilt is still good player but clear that he isn't a game changing force in season chosen.

Pretty obvious Barkley never guards Bird and Tiny never guards Steph, all you really have to worry about. If BD wants to ISO Melo on Barkley that's fine with me.

BDs defense is noticeably weaker and has more options to worry about defending.

I wouldn't ISO Melo but will do a lot of actions with Melo screening for Bird and Curry and even do Curry/Green or Iguodala action to get Tiny on him. This would make for really advantageous Curry/Bird pick and roll against Tiny/Barkley. It is pretty easy to match up hunt with my team.

Like I said, look at advanced stats and retro player of the year projects. Wilt is a dominant defensive force who can pass and let his offense take a back seat. Gilmore isn't anywhere near as good defensively. Kareem was better and that's it in 73.

You're really triggering me. Wilt maybe the 4th best player on the Lakers? But you also wanted to take him in the draft we just had.

Just stop talking. Your opinion is totally baseless and ignore consensus thought, and it's becoming a pattern. I didn't want to get involved in this write up things, but you just continue to astound me with your ability to just pass off misinformation as fact.

Penbeast is one of the most well informed posters I know about basketball history and has Wilt Chamberlain as the 2nd best player in the league in 73.

viewtopic.php?f=64&t=1045902

8 pages and not a single one has Gilmore over Wilt.

Melo doesn't play your modern innovative offense. Never has. He is who he is. You also have to stagger Bird and Currys minutes on the court because you can't do anything without them. There probably wouldn't be more than 5 minutes with all of Bird, Curry, Barkley and Tiny on the court based on how 8 man rotations have to work.

Screens is now modern and innovative offense. Melo has thrived in a floor spacing, pass happy offense with Team USA. I believe he will thrive if he ends up in Houston in a similar offense this season. I'd also keep Bird/Curry together personally in my rotation in the same manner Warriors did with KD/Curry. I'd have them both sit start of 2nd/4th and let Melo/Gilmore carry offense in that period.

For advanced stats, Gilmore was 2nd in WS in '73 only behind Kareem with Wilt 3rd. I disagree with consensus obviously. I don't get why you are so focused on consensus opinions over forming your own. I think West and Goodrich had more to do with the Lakers success early in the 70s. Was Wilt a crucial and key part of the team? Absolutely but I prefer West and Goodrich.

For the current draft, I absolutely wanted Wilt. I planned to use his earlier days when he was dominating for the Warriors. I even stated that I would only use his Lakers years if I could get someone else to be the go to offensive threat. Pretty consistent with what I have stated here.

[pelifan]

Lol I could thrive for team USA. The talent advantage is so large you can do whatever you want.

Also I thought this was obvious but your team is pretty slow and defense weaker than mine. I'd just repeated roll you just by playing fast and getting to the rim.

Its one thing to be against consensus opinion it's another to not have a single opinion that agrees with you. When it comes to basketball that usually means you are wrong. Chamberlain even got the better of Gilmore head to head as I showed in that clip and while good at everything rim protection is probably Gilmores worst attribute as far as what you want your center to do. And with Curry, Melo, Bird, having to guard athletic nightmares (with exception of Bowen) you have more problems defensively than me.

[BdeRegt]

Lol I could thrive for team USA. The talent advantage is so large you can do whatever you want.

Also I thought this was obvious but your team is pretty slow and defense weaker than mine. I'd just repeated roll you just by playing fast and getting to the rim.

Its one thing to be against consensus opinion it's another to not have a single opinion that agrees with you. When it comes to basketball that usually means you are wrong. Chamberlain even got the better of Gilmore head to head as I showed in that clip and while good at everything rim protection is probably Gilmores worst attribute as far as what you want your center to do. And with Curry, Melo, Bird, having to guard athletic nightmares (with exception of Bowen) you have more problems defensively than me.

So All-star games matter but Team USA doesn't? Got it.

Gilmore a bad rim protector? He has ABA record for career blocks and blocks in a season.

Either way, whether Wilt is better or not, I think the rest of my team has the advantage with the spacing and threats of Curry/Melo/Bird. This match up would come down to the perimeter.

[Tony Snell]

The front courts are about a wash in my book. Peli's guards are a head above. Melo is the better swing man. Tiny is handily the best bench piece. While there are some potentially exploitable matchups (going both ways), pelifan's defense as a whole is superior. I don't see the perceived lack of shooting hindering peli's team nearly enough to offset these other factors.

Vote: peli

[Snakebites]

I do give Wilt the edge over Gilmore.

More than that, I think the amazing perimeter talent that pelifan has definitely can take it to Bdregt's high powered team, and I also think that while Bird wasn't a bad defender at the 4, that Barkley has the overall game to be very effective against him.

I think the talent is a touch better overall for pelifan, too, so I

Vote Pelifan