Pacific Division Draft - R2 - BdeRegt vs Pelifan

[BdeRegt]

First to 4 votes

[BdeRegt]

1. Kevin Durant - 2017 - 16.5
2. Bob McAdoo - 1975 - 22.2 -
3. Andre Iguodala - 2017 - 5.5
4. Latrell Sprewell - 1994 - 17.3
5. Harrison Barnes - 2015 - 8.0
6. Nick Van Exel - 1998 - 11.6
7. Pat McCaw - 2017 - 3.5
8. Clifford Ray - 1975 - 7.0*.85 = 5.95 = 6.0

Total: 89.6/90

Nick Van Exel (36) / McCaw(12)
Sprewell (36) / Iguodala (8) / McCaw (4)
Durant (26) / Iguodala (22)
Barnes (30) / Durant (10) / McAdoo (8)
McAdoo (28) / Ray (20)

My team is built with excellent shooting throughout the lineup with everyone being a threat from the outside. As Bill Russell described McAdoo, "He's the greatest shooter of all time, period. Forget that bit about the 'greatest shooting big man.' " This spacing will really allow KD/McAdoo to utilize their incredible scoring ability with Sprewell being a great third option.

Match Up:

I think my team has the two best players in this match up in KD/McAdoo (Nash can fit in wherever with them, I prefer KD/McAdoo for this match up as guys who can drop 30+ any night) and don't think Pelifan has a great defensive option for either of them. My team will run through them and allow each of the other players to space the floor. I will also run a lot of Van Exel with KD/McAdoo to involve Nash defensively.

Defensively, my team will guard straight up. Nash will do well against Van Exel but I think I match up well to defend the other players forcing Nash into more of a scorer. Sprewell has the size to guard DJ well. Durant's length/athleticism is good counter to Barry. Barnes is a very good defender who can guard inside/out to handle Hawkins. McAdoo has quickness to stay with McDyess. Most importantly to my defense though is my bench. McCaw/Iguodala/Ray are all excellent defenders and gives my team the ability to switch a lot of actions.

Overall, I really like the floor spacing my team has with everyone in the starting lineup being a good shooter allowing two of the greatest scorers of all-time in KD/McAdoo go to work.

[pelifan]

2005 Steve Nash 11.4 MVP
1975 Rick Barry 23.6 All NBA first
1983 Dennis Johnson 11.2 All Defense first
1970 Connie Hawkins 15.3 All NBA first
2017 Shaun Livingston 4.2
1998 Antonio McDyess 11.4 All Pelifan first
1992 Mario Elie 5.4
2011 Marcin Gortat 7.5

Nash (38) / Livingston (10)
Johnson (36) / Elie (12)
Barry (40) / Livingston (8)
Hawkins (38) / McDyess (10)
McDyess (24) / Gortat (24)

Barry > McAdoo
Nash > McAdoo

[8on]

I love BdeRegt's bench, except for Pat McCaw playing point guard (?). The physicality of Hawkins and McDyess might make this tough for McAdoo and Barnes defensively, but I like Durant and McAdoo as the best offensive players here.

vote: BdeRegt

[BdeRegt]

I love BdeRegt's bench, except for Pat McCaw playing point guard (?). The physicality of Hawkins and McDyess might make this tough for McAdoo and Barnes defensively, but I like Durant and McAdoo as the best offensive players here.

vote: BdeRegt

McCaw will defend PGs. Offensively he is asked just to hit open shots. Very similar to the Warriors as I have KD/Iguodala to initiate/run the offense.

[Fadeaway_J]

Two high-powered offenses, but I prefer BdeRegt's defensive personnel a bit more - particularly at the wing positions.

Vote: BdeRegt

[ChicagoSportsFan21]

Vote:

Spoiler:

BdeRegt

Reasoning: The two headed monster of Durant-McAdoo will prevail again as I don't see solid defensive answers on pelifan's team for him to stop. Nash/McDyess will get theirs too, but it won't be enough. Durant should do a solid job on Barry.

[pelifan]

Two high-powered offenses, but I prefer BdeRegt's defensive personnel a bit more - particularly at the wing positions.

Vote: BdeRegt

I don't think you are wrong that BDs team is better defensively. But the wing positions is not true. Johnson is the best wing defender here by a large margin. Barry is also a very good, smart team defender who lead the NBA in steals. Considering Durant's defensive value also comes through his help defense, Im not even sure there's a gap between the two. Livingston, Elie off the bench too to match Mcaw AI so no I don't think BDs wing defense is more impressive. The bigman spots are a different story however.

Also I don't think anyone has figured out that any half decent coach would put Johnson on Durant.

[8on]

Also I don't think anyone has figured out that any half decent coach would put Johnson on Durant.

I suppose a writeup would solve that.

[poopdamoop]

Two high-powered offenses, but I prefer BdeRegt's defensive personnel a bit more - particularly at the wing positions.

Vote: BdeRegt

I don't think you are wrong that BDs team is better defensively. But the wing positions is not true. Johnson is the best wing defender here by a large margin. Barry is also a very good, smart team defender who lead the NBA in steals. Considering Durant's defensive value also comes through his help defense, Im not even sure there's a gap between the two. Livingston, Elie off the bench too to match Mcaw AI so no I don't think BDs wing defense is more impressive. The bigman spots are a different story however.

Also I don't think anyone has figured out that any half decent coach would put Johnson on Durant.

Johnson on Durant might have worked on OKC KD, but I think he's gotten strong enough and smart enough where that height advantage would just be too much. I also think Durant's help D is pretty significantly more impactful than Barry's, though I agree DJ is better than Spree.

Overall I gotta vote Bde here, I like Hawkins as a Marion/Amar'e hybrid running with Nash but I don't know if DJ/Barry are great fits next to him from a playstyle perspective

[BdeRegt]

BdeRegt advances

[pelifan]

Two high-powered offenses, but I prefer BdeRegt's defensive personnel a bit more - particularly at the wing positions.

Vote: BdeRegt

I don't think you are wrong that BDs team is better defensively. But the wing positions is not true. Johnson is the best wing defender here by a large margin. Barry is also a very good, smart team defender who lead the NBA in steals. Considering Durant's defensive value also comes through his help defense, Im not even sure there's a gap between the two. Livingston, Elie off the bench too to match Mcaw AI so no I don't think BDs wing defense is more impressive. The bigman spots are a different story however.

Also I don't think anyone has figured out that any half decent coach would put Johnson on Durant.

Johnson on Durant might have worked on OKC KD, but I think he's gotten strong enough and smart enough where that height advantage would just be too much. I also think Durant's help D is pretty significantly more impactful than Barry's, though I agree DJ is better than Spree.

Overall I gotta vote Bde here, I like Hawkins as a Marion/Amar'e hybrid running with Nash but I don't know if DJ/Barry are great fits next to him from a playstyle perspective

i dont know how durant now is any different from a year ago. He's getting the overrated flavor of the month treatment just because he won a championship, just like Curry and Korver before him (not a championship but still went from 3rd rounder to meh). Fact of the matter is small peskier defenders have bothered Durant his whole career and his man defense isn't anything more than solid, and his help D is still more flash than substance. When you consider 75 RIck Barry's team was 5th in DRTG and he was maybe the best defender on the team that says alot to me, I think OKC might have even gotten better defensively without KD.

this isnt an argument for my team type of thing, I just think Durant has been way overrated in general when he's definitely worse than Barkley, I'd put him in the same category as Karl Malone really.

[BdeRegt]

I don't think you are wrong that BDs team is better defensively. But the wing positions is not true. Johnson is the best wing defender here by a large margin. Barry is also a very good, smart team defender who lead the NBA in steals. Considering Durant's defensive value also comes through his help defense, Im not even sure there's a gap between the two. Livingston, Elie off the bench too to match Mcaw AI so no I don't think BDs wing defense is more impressive. The bigman spots are a different story however.

Also I don't think anyone has figured out that any half decent coach would put Johnson on Durant.

Johnson on Durant might have worked on OKC KD, but I think he's gotten strong enough and smart enough where that height advantage would just be too much. I also think Durant's help D is pretty significantly more impactful than Barry's, though I agree DJ is better than Spree.

Overall I gotta vote Bde here, I like Hawkins as a Marion/Amar'e hybrid running with Nash but I don't know if DJ/Barry are great fits next to him from a playstyle perspective

i dont know how durant now is any different from a year ago. He's getting the overrated flavor of the month treatment just because he won a championship, just like Curry and Korver before him (not a championship but still went from 3rd rounder to meh). Fact of the matter is small peskier defenders have bothered Durant his whole career and his man defense isn't anything more than solid, and his help D is still more flash than substance. When you consider 75 RIck Barry's team was 5th in DRTG and he was maybe the best defender on the team that says alot to me, I think OKC might have even gotten better defensively without KD.

this isnt an argument for my team type of thing, I just think Durant has been way overrated in general when he's definitely worse than Barkley, I'd put him in the same category as Karl Malone really.

Durant's defense took another step forward this year defensively being back re-united with Ron Adams. He still was susceptible to back door cuts but less than previously and locked down further. I don't get the argument about Barry being on a 5th ranked defensive team when KD was part of an all-time great Warriors defense. Draymond has the most to do with that but KD helped the defense improve this year. For these games, the only difference to me for KD though is that he is cheaper. It is an added benefit that he has proved his effectiveness as a PF. I think he should be a first round pick in any format because of his shooting and ability to enable a small-ball lineup.

As for Barkley, I'd say Karl Malone is better than him as 3rd best PF ever behind Duncan and KG. Barkley would be 5th to me behind those 3 and Dirk. PF is a nice position in that peak/career rankings actually match for me.

[Fadeaway_J]

I don't feel drastically different about KD as an overall player based on last season. I mean we're talking about a guy who has been top 3-5 in the league for years and won an MVP in 2014. What makes 2016-17 more appealing is the fact that he's much cheaper than usual and had his most consistent season on the defensive end.

[pelifan]

Johnson on Durant might have worked on OKC KD, but I think he's gotten strong enough and smart enough where that height advantage would just be too much. I also think Durant's help D is pretty significantly more impactful than Barry's, though I agree DJ is better than Spree.

Overall I gotta vote Bde here, I like Hawkins as a Marion/Amar'e hybrid running with Nash but I don't know if DJ/Barry are great fits next to him from a playstyle perspective

i dont know how durant now is any different from a year ago. He's getting the overrated flavor of the month treatment just because he won a championship, just like Curry and Korver before him (not a championship but still went from 3rd rounder to meh). Fact of the matter is small peskier defenders have bothered Durant his whole career and his man defense isn't anything more than solid, and his help D is still more flash than substance. When you consider 75 RIck Barry's team was 5th in DRTG and he was maybe the best defender on the team that says alot to me, I think OKC might have even gotten better defensively without KD.

this isnt an argument for my team type of thing, I just think Durant has been way overrated in general when he's definitely worse than Barkley, I'd put him in the same category as Karl Malone really.

Durant's defense took another step forward this year defensively being back re-united with Ron Adams. He still was susceptible to back door cuts but less than previously and locked down further. I don't get the argument about Barry being on a 5th ranked defensive team when KD was part of an all-time great Warriors defense. Draymond has the most to do with that but KD helped the defense improve this year. For these games, the only difference to me for KD though is that he is cheaper. It is an added benefit that he has proved his effectiveness as a PF. I think he should be a first round pick in any format because of his shooting and ability to enable a small-ball lineup.

As for Barkley, I'd say Karl Malone is better than him as 3rd best PF ever behind Duncan and KG. Barkley would be 5th to me behind those 3 and Dirk. PF is a nice position in that peak/career rankings actually match for me.

Warriors defensive rating was worse this season than last season, sure they went from 5th to 2nd but they went from 103.8 to 104.1. Warriors defense was at its best in 2015 with Bogut when they leaned on that end to win games. Also if you are susceptible to offball movement Barry is one of the worst players in history for you to guard.

Peak Barkley in 90 is better than peak Malone. Anybody who knows anything would probably tell you that. The gap between that season of Barkley and that season of Magic and Jordan wasn't even bigger than the gap between Barkley and the 4th best player that season.

Barkley had the same offensive impact as peak Dirk in my opinion when you look at his teams offensive ratings in the late 80s early 90s.

[BdeRegt]

i dont know how durant now is any different from a year ago. He's getting the overrated flavor of the month treatment just because he won a championship, just like Curry and Korver before him (not a championship but still went from 3rd rounder to meh). Fact of the matter is small peskier defenders have bothered Durant his whole career and his man defense isn't anything more than solid, and his help D is still more flash than substance. When you consider 75 RIck Barry's team was 5th in DRTG and he was maybe the best defender on the team that says alot to me, I think OKC might have even gotten better defensively without KD.

this isnt an argument for my team type of thing, I just think Durant has been way overrated in general when he's definitely worse than Barkley, I'd put him in the same category as Karl Malone really.

Durant's defense took another step forward this year defensively being back re-united with Ron Adams. He still was susceptible to back door cuts but less than previously and locked down further. I don't get the argument about Barry being on a 5th ranked defensive team when KD was part of an all-time great Warriors defense. Draymond has the most to do with that but KD helped the defense improve this year. For these games, the only difference to me for KD though is that he is cheaper. It is an added benefit that he has proved his effectiveness as a PF. I think he should be a first round pick in any format because of his shooting and ability to enable a small-ball lineup.

As for Barkley, I'd say Karl Malone is better than him as 3rd best PF ever behind Duncan and KG. Barkley would be 5th to me behind those 3 and Dirk. PF is a nice position in that peak/career rankings actually match for me.

Warriors defensive rating was worse this season than last season, sure they went from 5th to 2nd but they went from 103.8 to 104.1. Warriors defense was at its best in 2015 with Bogut when they leaned on that end to win games. Also if you are susceptible to offball movement Barry is one of the worst players in history for you to guard.

Peak Barkley in 90 is better than peak Malone. Anybody who knows anything would probably tell you that. The gap between that season of Barkley and that season of Magic and Jordan wasn't even bigger than the gap between Barkley and the 4th best player that season.

Barkley had the same offensive impact as peak Dirk in my opinion when you look at his teams offensive ratings in the late 80s early 90s.

I don't have the final numbers but I know during the finals the Warriors were on pace to have the best defensive performance EVER in a playoffs when you look at points/100 allowed compared to league average. I watch every Warriors game and they were definitely better this year than 2015 in large part because of Durant being better than Barnes although mostly because Draymond has gone to another level taking command of the team since 2015. Bogut was a big part of the defense but the bench defense has gotten better without Ezeli/Speights/Barbosa and discovering the death lineup. People talk about that lineup offensively but I believe the biggest strength of it is the defense and switching that the Warriors do.

For me, Malone has a much better all-around game with his solid defense and really underrated passing. I think Barkley gets drafted higher because he is a lot cheaper. I've proved long ago that I don't know anything though.