BaNT 1st round playoffs: TOP BRACKET - votes due 2day!

[dockingsched]

This thread will be used for the top bracket of the first round. Please use this thread to create a post with your roster, offensive strategy, defensive strategy, and overall plan of attack against your specific opponent. Rebuttals are also allowed, along with inquiries from all participants (including bottom bracket players). Official votes may be placed after approx 48 hrs after the end of the 10th round. A specific time will be set later.

1. BlackIce v 16. Vintage

8. SnakeBites v 9. Teddy KGB

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4. CellarDoor v 13. john2jer

5. knicksfan v. 12. Miller4ever

[BlackIce]

Black Magic vs. Vintage.


Williams (38)/Gordon (10)
Carter (24)/Gordon (24)
Marion (26)/Barnes (8)/Carter (14)
Brand (34)/Haslem (10)/Marion (8)
Okur (34)/Thabeet (14)

Injury Reserve/Spot Minutes:
Ilgauskas (In case Thabeet/Brand need help, pretty much)

Starters


Bench
Guards


Forwards


Centers


Writeup

Defense

Our plan is to disrupt Billups and make life hard for him. With Williams on him, he doesn't have the size advantage that he usually does. He can't do to Williams what he did to Paul in the playoffs, and he doesn't have Melo or Rip/Sheed to take the attention off of him. We will not be playing the passing lanes that much, we prefer to play straight man to man because of the lack of "creators" on the wings. JR Smith is a streaky shooter at this point of his career, and though he can be a 20ppg guy, he doesn't have Melo, or anyone else who demands a double team on this team. Carter is an underrated defender (and player in general) and will be able to contain Smith.

Our MO is to make the other team put the ball on the ground because we won't let them beat us with the 3. Marion will be guarding Battier who is a smart player, and a tremendous defender but on offense he is a spot up shooter, a corner 3 guy who depends on a Mcgrady or a Yao to draw his man off him. He can't create his own shoot. The lack of wing scorers allows us to put the onus on West and Billups. Brand (a great defender) will be guarding West and we believe that the lack of dribble-drive penetration on the other team will really hurt the ability of West to get those open shots that he gets in New Orleans. Billups (like Williams) is a guy that sets up the offense and looks for scoring chances. Paul is a guy that creates them off of dribble-drive penetration.

We will pay particular attention to the pick and roll/pop of Billups/West because that if one of the only ways that they will be able to create opportunities. Okur is not a good perimeter defender and needs help covering Dirk/Bosh types, but he is a good post defender because the same thing that hurts him on perimeter, being big and having poor lateral quicks, helps him in the post. He uses his size well and we feel that he can handle Oden who is mostly a put-back guy, defender, rebounder at this stage. He doesn't have a strong post game so we will concentrate on keeping him off the offensive boards.

Since our best defender, Marion, is guarding a weak offensive guy in Battier, he will be providing help on what little penetration the other team can muster. Marion's versatility, his ability to lock-down anyone from Billups to West will help a great deal on switches.

Brand is a good defensive anchor and Thabeet is a guy that will blocks shots and deter players from getting to the paint.

Offense

Spacing. We feel that we have spaced the floor perfectly, Okur will give Brand plenty of room to work in the post, and open up the floor for Williams/Carter/Marion to drive. Our bread and butter will be Williams/Brand pick and roll, Williams/Okur pick and pop, and Carter in iso's. Carter is a fantastic play-maker and Williams is the best PG in this game with Paul out, and this will really help Marion. Marion's role on offense will be alley's, put backs, picks, all those little things that a team needs to win. With Battier on Carter, Marion will have an easy time with either Smith (a poor defender) or Hill if they choose to start him (I hope they do). You going to see a lot of back door cuts for Marion

We will have Okur pull either West or Oden (probably West) away from the basket, with the 3 point range of Williams/Carter/Okur you can't pack the paint or you'll get killed from the outside. Brand is a very savvy post player and although Oden is a great post defender, he has had a history of foul trouble. With Williams and Carter going to the basket we will try to put the pressure on Oden to make quick decisions and hopefully get into foul trouble early.

If I need a game winner, a clutch shot I have Williams/Gordon/Carter to choose from. Outside of Billups (who we will guard heavily in those situations) who is gonna do it for the other team?

Bench
We have the better bench, Thabeet/Haslem/Barnes are defensive guys that know their role, and Haslem in particular brings a lot of toughness to the team. Gordon is my 6th man and he will be playing 30+ minutes. The best bench player on the other team, Scola, is playing behind David West and can't play C or SF so how many minutes can he get? With Gordon coming off the bench he is gonna shred Blake and Foye.

To conclude, I'd reiterate that Williams has never had this many weapons to work with. With Carter/Gordon in the back-court with him you can't key in on his or your going to get killed by the off-guard, and with his size he can guard SG's while Gordon guards PG's (which he does quite well).

In short we have a much, much better offense, a balanced one were everyone has a role and a PG that can run the show like no other, and with guys like Marion/Brand who are elite defenders, Williams/Carter who are good ones, and a defensive bench, we have a comparable defense.

EDIT:
West is only playing 28 minutes? I guess they have to do that to get Scola burn, but now their 1st option on offense isn't playing enough minutes to have the biggest impact he could. Scola is a good player and a starter on most teams and we will give him the same attention that West will receive when he is in the game.

Billups is only playing 30 minutes. Steve Blake is playing 18. Pleasant surpise for us. We will enjoy watching Blake trying to guard Williams or Gordon. What a mis-match.

Also just saw (had a feeling it was coming) that Hill is starting. Goody. He is 36 years old, and put up 12 ppg last season. He is a defensive upgrade over Smith, but a considerable downgrade offensively. Marion will have a tougher time sure, but this really helps us on defense. Hill at this point in his career is a very good guy to have off the bench, a smart vet that doesn't have the athletic ability he used to but is still able to contribute in other ways. But he can't break down a defense, can't create his own shot, and thats what they really needed beside Battier. Smith off the bench won't counter Gordon off the bench, and is play 26 minutes to Gordon's 32.

If Billups isn't perfect the other teams offense will go stagnant quickly, and the Smith/Hill only makes a bad problem worst.

[CellarDoor]

Never sure why people reserve spots, but meh.

Line-up: (pending my opponent's)

Rose/Felton
Brewer/Morrow
Durant/AK47
Smoove/Bargniani/Collison
Perkins/Bargniani/Collison

Towel boys: Vintage and Gremz

Defensive philosophy: we lucked out with these match-ups in a few ways: Nelson thrives off shooting the jumper or playing a pick-n-roll game. We have the luxury of not having to double cover TD so his jumper is going to be heavily contested by the ultra athletic and much improved defensively Derrick Rose. Additionally, we've got Brewer playing their probably 1a/1b option. We drafted Brewer specifically to put him on team's top options and let him use his defensive skills and natural gifts to bother players. Since J2J has two lights out shooters we're going to stray away from the zone and play straight up man defense. Smith will be playing off of the always shaky jumpshooting Lamar Odom to play the weakside and help where needed, though I don't expect anything other than an occasional swipe at Duncan and some help with a slashing Wallace to be necessary. In the event that my worst defender, Kevin Durant is for some reason getting exploited by their 4th option (in which case I'll be a very happy person since that means the first three options aren't getting shots), I can switch Smoove onto Wallace and play Durant on Odom.

Offensive Philosophy: The ball is almost always going to be in KD or Derrick's hands. There will be three main plays for Derrick depending on my personnel: Perkins screening at the top of the key and letting Derrick attack the basket (or Bargniani if he's in who adds a pick and pop option to the fold a la Brad Miller shredding the Celtics last year), PnR with Smith rolling to the basket using his quickness advantage to finish and iso with Derrick on either one of J2J's astoundingly horrible PG defenders. Neither one of them is known to be a good defender, in fact both are "bad" defenders, with Calderon in the discussion for worst defensive PG in the league. To add to this, Rose is the most athletically and physically gifted PG in the league with terrific finishing ability. Luck is again on my side on this side of the ball for this match-up as not only am I facing horrible offense for my 2nd option, my first option is facing an average man defender. I love Crash and think he's an excellent help defender, but ask any Charlotte fan or any non-Charlotte fan that watches their games (one of the other 3 in the world) and you'll see a consensus that he is average at best on that side of the ball. It helps to have Duncan behind you, but when Durant 's game is predicated on getting his own shot off farther from the basket than Duncan can stray, that's not going to help. The other three guys (Perkins, Smith, Brewer) will be looking for baskets within the offense off what is likely to be frequent double teams or soft zones on Rose and Durant. Brewer is excellent at moving towards the basket without the ball, we all know what Smith can do, and unfortunately I learned what Perkins can do from time to time during the POs last year. As match-ups dictate we'll bring in a few guys off the bench who present interesting opportunities as well. Bargniani and Morrow are lights out shooters that prevent double teams, and both can actually get their own shots off (especially Morrow being guarded by Redd), AK47 has been known to make a nice passing play or two in addition to a solid mid range game, and the entire book on Felton is on his ability to shoot or dribble drive for baskets. Collison...well, Collison can rebound

Special factors: At this stage in their careers, there isn't one match-up on the floor where I feel like my guy is going to be out-quicked or is lacking in athleticism in any way to his counterpart. This mean's Duncan and to a lesser extent Crash are going to be busy with a lot of help D when the guard play breaks down or Odom gets burned. Even Crash himself is at best even in terms of physical gifts with KD.

[Miller4ever]

Why am I seeded 12th? Grr....

The Stereotypes


Rotations

Westbrook(30)/Sessions(18)
Ariza(30)/Fernandez(18)
Granger(36)/Harrington(12)
Millsap(30)/Harrington(18)
Lopez(32)/Gortat(16)

Offense

Key points:
-Pick-and-roll to get the two big men involved
-Ariza stretches the floor and takes advantage of opportunities created by Granger and Westbrook
-Granger does his thing pretty easily
-Easily keep the defense out of their comfort zone

Westbrook plays close to the triple-double line, but his real advantage against his starting opponent is speed. Jason Kidd is old, and his wheels have worn down considerably. Westbrook will be able to both speed past Kidd and shoot over Nate. Both opposing point guards can get punished by picks, which Millsap and Lopez happily set. Westbrook will be free all game. If the big men can't roll after the pick, then they clear out and Westbrook cuts into the paint. Sessions spells Westbrook and continues to run the pick-and-roll. Sessions distributes a little better, and will likely run against Nate Robinson as a better shooting threat over Nate. Ariza will also be able to set some picks and pop for open 3's. Ariza just needs to stay open and several opportunities will open up against an imbalanced defense. Granger will either be facing Igoudala or Johnson, and will have an easy time against them. He is 31-58 against Joe Johnson for the last season. He can also tear apart backup Al Thornton. Millsap matches up against David Lee, who gets run ragged when switching on pick-and-rolls. If Lee doesn't switch, he'll have to chase a hard-rolling Millsap and face him in the post, where he can't block shots well. Millsap will be able to muscle in easily. Lopez faces Charlie Villanueva. This is an interesting matchup because why Charlie Villanueva playing C? Either way, Lopez can post the heck out of and shoot over Villanueva and David Lee. Dalembert is seeing significant minutes, so Lopez will have to pump fake to score. Since Lopez will be setting many picks, Dalembert will be forced to make decisions on switches, and Lopez can take advantage of Dalembert's over-aggressiveness. Lopez will always get the ball in close, and try and get fouls on Dalembert to take him out of the game. Fernandez can come off the bench and supply some great shooting. Al Harrington can challenge Igoudala in the paint and make David Lee step out of his defensive comfort zone out to the perimeter. Griffin and Thornton don't have the defensive experience or prowess required to stymie Al Harrington. Gortat can set picks and brings a different hustle.

Defense

Key points:
-Wipe out the passing game
-Play them into the baseline
-Force turnovers

As a whole the starting lineup of our defense averaged something like 8 steals and 7 blocks last season. The defense will thrive on creating turnovers. Westbrook and Sessions are both quick point guards that can both chase Kidd and bully Robinson. Ariza can handle Joe Johnson and Jason Richardson, and Rudy Fernandez can come off the bench against Jason Richardson. Granger is an above-average defender, a thief and a shot-blocker, a la Julius Erving. Since Igoudala isn't a great shooter and he basically only slashes, on defense Granger might cover the outside shooting of Villanueva a bit better. Either way, this team is playing a 3-2 zone since Millsap, Harrington, Gortat, Lopez, and Landry can more than cover the interior against their weak post game, allowing us to focus on eliminating their shooting. This way, we also play the passing lanes and force turnovers. Mainly our strategy is to force everyone into the corners and the baseline. None of the shooters on that team shoot well from the sides of the basket. Our 3-2 will play it more inside, taking away the penetration of Kidd, Nate, and Igoudala. They need to beat us with the 3, which no team has been able to do.

Overall

Key Points
-Stamina
-Balanced attack
-Size

Every championship team needs legitimate post presence. We have two. My opponent has Charlie Villanueva starting at center. While it is a weird matchup for Brook Lopez, it's not maximizing Villanueva's already limited skillset. My team also possesses a better balance with each individual player's offense and defense. My team also possesses all levelheaded guys with great leadership in Danny Granger. My team takes pressure off of each other and every one of the young guys is poised to make a big step in the coming season.

[VintaGe36]

VINTAGE36 vs. BLACKICE

Rotation:
Chauncey Billups(38)/Steve Blake(10)
Shane Battier(30)/JR Smith(18)
David West(15)/Grant Hill(33)
Luis Scola(28)/David West(20)
Greg Oden(30)/Antonio McDyess(18)

Outlook: As you can see, I'm running a less than conventional line up. I'm featuring David West out of position at the 3, which to some, may seem odd, but for my current match up, plays to my favor.

Offense: On Offense, Chauncey Billups, will be running the show, Deron is hardly a stopper on defense, and though he is bigger, so Billups won't be able to post him up, but that isn't the only part of Billups game, I really don't see Billups being completely nullified this round, and vice versa for Billups guarding Deron.

My Offense will obviously run through Billups/Blake I'm gonna run the pick and roll with Scola and Oden all day. Brand is a solid defender, but hardly the anchor BlackIce is making him out to be, if hes content following Scola or Oden, or West, to the perimeter, ill burn him, since nobody is apt to strong post defense in his frontcourt. I'll also be using David West, and the pick and pop. Billups isn't the quickest guard, but with three guys capable of setting good hard screens, he'll find openings in the defense. West has the range, and versatility, to make my PnR and PnP work to my advantage, and Oden and Scolare physical enough to make the PnR doable. If they don't switch, or react, Billups and Blake have the range to make them pay. Battier, will perch on the outside, waiting for openings to hit 3's. He isn't the greatest offensive player, but if my PnR starts clicking, and Ice starts to pack the lane, Battier, will keep them honest.

Defense: This, is where I have a clear advantage IMO. My team, is tailor made, to be an elite squad defensively. Marion, at the 3, allows me to play West at the 3 as well. Marion has never used his quickness to his advantage. Marion, really doesn't have much of an offensive game to speak of, and so sticking West on him, wont be such a huge liability. Battier, will shut Carter down, and take him out of the game. Billups pretty much cancels out Deron, for the most part anyways. Brand and Okur aren't post players at all, so Oden won't get into foul trouble, and Scola and Oden aren't so athletically challenged, that they can't deal with them. Grant Hill off the bench, is a solid veteran, who can score, defend, and do the little things on the court, and McDyess is a beastly rebounder and defender, and since Ice has no bruising big man period(nothing but jump shooters by my counts) can enforce his will on the game along with Oden. I can clearly out match my opponent with brute force, and the rebounding edge I'll have here, goes without saying. My rebounding edge, should give me a significant edge in this series.

In the end, my team is built better defensively, and has better rebounders, though my team may not have the individual offensive talent to the tune of a premier swingman, we do have a strong cohesive unit, with solid defense from top to bottom, the ability to shut his team down, and a capable offensive scheme that will allow my best ball handler(Billups) to thrive.

[knicksfan3232]

Team Krypto-Nate

line-up
PG: Jason Kidd(26)/ Nate Robinson(22)
SG: Joe Johnson(36)/ Jason Richardson(14)
SF: Andre Iguodala(36)/ Al Thornton(10)
PF: David Lee(30)/ Blake Griffin(18)
C: Samuel Dalembert(24)/ Charlie Villanueva(24)

Starting Line-Up


Offense

This team is going to play the run-and-gun, freestyle offense. We will model our offense after that of the old Suns and current Knicks. Even at the age of 36, Jason Kidd is still one of the best playmakers in the game. He will be able to run and feed the ball to our extremely athletic wingmen who are capable of doing everything. Even when Jason Kidd needs a break, we don’t lose a step by bringing in the energetic Krypto-Nate. He can come off the bench and be that instant spark that every team needs when their not playing at their best. We will sub at the PG position very often to make sure there are fresh legs ready to lead our team at all times. The SG and SF, Joe Johnson and Andre Iguodala, are the superstars of the team. Joe Johnson is just the all-around package on offense. He is a lethal shooter, can drive the ball at will and is great at finding his teammates for open shots. Andre Iguodala has exceptional strength and is able to use that to his advantage when driving to the basket. Jason Richardson will also be used a lot as a back up at the SG position. He is another sharp shooter who will have a major impact off the bench. Richardson and Johnson will often see the floor together, giving us a huge advantage since they can both run the floor and shoot the ball from the outside so well. The big men, David Lee, Samuel Dalembert, Blake Griffin and Charlie Villanueva, will be setting plenty of off the ball screens to free up our wingmen. After setting these screens, David Lee and Charlie Villanueva will utilize their mid range jumper capabilities and spread the floor to create easy scoring opportunities. Blake Griffin and Samuel Dalembert will roll to the basket, looking for a dish off for an easy lay in. Other than Dalembert, the rest of the big men are great at running the floor and will succeed in this run and gun offensive style. All of these big men are exceptional offensive rebounders and will crash the glass on every jumper.

Defense

On the defensive end, we will man up against this team. Danny Granger is clearly the best offensive threat that they have, but we feel that Iguodala’s strength advantage will disrupt Granger. When Jason Kidd’s in the game he will use his quickness to stay with Westbrook and try to deflect or tip any passes he makes. When Nate Robinson comes in, he will use his clear strength advantage to bully Westrbook around and force him to make bad decisions. Joe Johnson is an excellent on ball defender and will be able to stick with their SG, whether it’s Ariza or Fernandez. Whenever possible, our PG or SG will try and leave their man to set up a quick double team to force a turnover. David Lee is very capable of handling Milsap in the post. He will make Milsap try and do some moves to beat him or force him to stay outside and shoot jump shots. Brook Lopez isn’t that strong and doesn’t have much of a height advantage over either of my centers. They will be able to body up with him and force him into taking bad shots. This team just isn’t much of a threat for us when they are on offensive since everyone on the team can be handled one on one, without the need to double team.

Overall

Overall I feel that this team just won’t be much of a threat when they are on offense. I know Danny Granger is a great scorer, but he will be out muscled for almost the entire game by Andre Iguodala and has never had success vs. him in the past either. In Danny Granger’s 4 year career he has played the 76ers 15 times and has only scored over 20 points once. We also have too many weapons on the offensive end for them to stop. Most teams don’t have one player who is capable of stopping wingmen like Joe Johnson and Andre Iguodala, let alone two. Also, my team is extremely deep and doesn’t lose a step when our reserves step on the floor. We will run all game on this team and it will lead us to an easy victory.

[Snakebites]

Sorry, had this finished last night but unexpectedly fell asleep before submitting.

Rotation:

Tyson Chandler (27)/Anderson Varejao (14)/ Pau Gasol (7)
Pau Gasol (28)/ Michael Beasley (11)/ Anderson Varejao (9)
Tayshaun Prince (36)/ Michael Beasley (12)
Kevin Martin (36)/ Jason Terry (12)
Kirk Hinrich (32) Jason Terry (16)

Offense: Pau Gasol and Kevin Martin are the cornerstones of our offense, and our surrounded by effective complementary pieces. As such, much or our offense will run through the two of them. This is particularly beneficial give Martins ability to make plays for himself and Gasol's ability to make that second pass. Raja Bell has a defensive reputation that is largely overstated, and Kevin Martin is a bad matchup for him. Bell simply isn't quick enough to cover Martin, who should be able to break down Bell on the first step every time. Martin excels at creating scoring opportunities for himself and Bell is gonna need help containing him. Trouble is, help is going to be very difficult to come by, since he has one of Mo Williams and Allen Iverson, two small, poor defenders, playing with Bell at all times. This will put more strain on Butler and other front court players to either help and risk others getting more opportunities or let Martin do whatever he wants. This means the already free throw prone Martin will get plenty of trips to the line (where he is excellent), and Bell and other guards forced to defend Martin will be in foul trouble early and often. Add to that the fact that Martin will at all times be joined by either Kirk Hinrich or Jason Terry, both definite threats to hit from down town, and KGB simply doesnt have the tools to keep my backcourt from going to town throughout the game. Azurbuke won’t have much luck either, though the disadvantage is somewhat less distinct. Either way, Martin would be stopped without help, and they can’t give it. Martin, Terry, and even Kirk won't have trouble scoring against that backcourt, particularly with Kirk being guarded by either Williams or Iverson throughout, both of whom give up a great deal in terms of size, quickness, or both. Iverson in particular takes way too many chances on defense and those chances don't pay off as often as they used to, so both as a scorer and a playmaker Hinrich will be little impeded. This weakness defensively at point guard is therefor something we can fully take advantage of. He does have some nice help defenders guarding the paint, but luckily, none of my guards are reliant on getting inside to score.

Up front, of course, there is Pau Gasol. Much like Martin (though perhaps not to the same extreme), our opponents will struggle to guard him. As we duly noted earlier, they do have some solid post defenders playing center, but Pau Gasol is a versatile enough to get points regardless, particularly when paired with a vastly superior co-anchor to anything he had in Memphis and a superior supporting cast. In addition to a hook shot which, coupled with his height, makes him extremely difficult to block, he has a solid overall midrange game to go with his lethal low post moves. Given their primarily post based frontcourt defense, Gasol should still be able to perform against this defense. Bynum and Haywood are solid post defenders, but ultimately they aren't the perfect men for this job due to Gasol’s mobility and mid range game. Putting Nocioni at powerforward for a number of minutes also hurts them. I have Tayshaun Prince, who has a balanced game. He is a threat to drive to the basket and can also step out and hit some shots down town and pass the rock as well. The small forwards of our opponents will have to watch him because of his length and overall versatility. He gets 14-15 points per game in spite of the fact that few plays are made for him, making him an effective opportunistic offensive player who, though will never be the focal point of our offense, still demands attention. We also have the up and coming and offensively versatile Michael Beasley coming off our bench. Whether creating difficulty matchup problems while playing at small forward with his size or demanding big man attention away from other players while playing power forward, he is also a valuable asset. We also have a pair of competant offensive rebounders in Gasol and especially Chandler, who should give our already effective offense plenty of second chances. Between Gasol, Martin, Terry, Prince, Beasley, and Hinrich (can be effective with the point guards they have frankly), we have more than enough offensive firepower.

Defense: The defense of this team is quite balanced on all levels, both up front and in the backcourt. The weakest defender on our team luckily plays the same position as their poorest offensive player, Raja Bell. He has a decent 3 point shot, but he's not a guy who's going to destroy a defensive plan. We have Kirk Hinrich who is large and quick enough to be an absolute nightmare for Mo Williams, and, for that matter, Allen Iverson, both of whom will be severely marginalized if not outright eliminated as threats. I will use this opportunity to correct a misperception: Iverson's being a cancer is NOT his only issue at this point. In addition to being bad defensively (already covered), he has lost his offensive step as well. He is no longer nearly as effective at finishing around the basket (read, he misses layups), and can no longer hit those nice difficult running jumpers anymore. Add to that the issues he's always had with passing and a consistent jumper and he can hurt an offense almost as much as a defense, especially while playing point guard, where he will be playing 20 minutes in this lineup. Overall, their backcourt should be more that andequetely covered.

Up front, we have 3 solid defenders starting and some reasonable help off the bench. Tayshaun Prince won't completely lock Butler down, but his length and overall athleticism coupled with his persistence and conditioning mean he is ready and able to give Caron all he can handle. Butler will have to work much harder to score and will still score some, but with less overall effectiveness. We feel Anderson Varejao and Tyson Chandler are competent defenders who will give the opposing centers a hard time as well. Bynum has a nice post game, but given a solid front court defense he’s not going to be a consistent threat to kill an opposing defense. Haywood’s game is largely putbacks, and we have capable rebounders and defenders to help minimalize this as well. The only concern for our solid defense is Dirk Nowitzki. There is no one way to stop him, but we do have a well conditioned and mobile four to counter him. We hope to use this to somewhat limit the space Dirk has to create and force him to the left hand side more often. Dirk will score points, but our balanced defense will keep the rest of the team well in check and Dirk will likely force himself to do too much.

Overall: Our overall offensive balance and defensive tenacity should ultimately carry the day. The backcourt matchup is stark throughout the game such that our guards should be able to generate scoring opportunities regardless of who is on the floor. That and the fact that Gasol is versatile and talented enough to score both in the paint and from midrange mean this team will have no trouble generating offense. Ultimately the balance on both ends of the floor and the striking mismatch in the backcourt will be too much for our opponent to handle. Their strength in defense lies in the interior, but I have too many people who can threaten at range for that to carry the day.

Advantage: Wellsville Fighting Squid

[Teddy KGB]

The Cash 'roo Molesters

Cc: A Bynum [28]/B Haywood [20]
PF: D Nowitzki [34]/A Nocioni [6]/B Haywood [8]
SF: C Butler [30]/A Nocioni [13]/K Azubuike [5]
SG: R Bell [24]/K Azubuike/[24]
PG: M Williams [30]/A Iverson [18]

[approx minutes per game in parenthesis]

Spot minutes: J Thompson

Opponent:

C: Tyson Chandler
PF: Pau Gasol
SF: Tayshaun Prince
SG: Kevin Martin
PG: Kirk Hinrich

Bench: Jason Terry
Bench: Michael Beasley
Bench: Anderson Varejao
Bench: Ronnie Turiaf

Offense:

The main advantage of my offense is that every single player in my starting line-up needs to be man-marked. The weakest offensive player in my starting line-up is Raja Bell and even he is a deadly 3 point shooter who will consistently burn you if you leave him open. With this being the case, the strategy will be to run the offense mainly through Dirk Nowitzki and Caron Butler and thus garner many open shots for the rest of the team because these 2 simply HAVE to be double teamed in quite a few situations. Each player also has a specific role or roles in the offense. Bynum will simply park his huge ass inside the paint every possession that he is on. Bynum is most definitely an offensive threat from the paint and he will be fed the ball a decent amount to post up because he has 50 pounds [at least] on Chandler. Dirk will obviously be the main scorer on the team, and indeed without the forbidden 5 he is probably the best scorer in the game. He is a matchup nightmare from anywhere on the court and I will have him mainly operating from mid range and downtown so as to draw Pau Gasol away from the basket [assuming it's Gasol he puts on Dirk, if not then he'll draw Chandler away]. Dirk will be raining down mid range jumpers and long range bombs all day with single coverage and if he gets doubled it simply means that somebody is open and nobody on my team is an offensive liability. Caron Butler will be the secondary scorer on my team and he will be cutting to the basket quite often and with only 1 big patrolling the paint he should have a huge series, even with Tayshaun on him. Raja Bell will be used as a sharpshooter to spread the floor, sort of in a Bruce Bowen role. He won't have any plays run for him but if he is open then he has the license to shoot. Mo Williams will have a role similar to the one he has filled so successfully in Cleveland. The offense, like in Cleveland, will not run through him but rather through two superior offensive threats in Dirk and Caron, and as a result it should lead to Mo getting a lot of good looks like in Cleveland. What's really good about my team is that from PG through PF all the players can shoot anywhere from the 3 point line in and so the floor should be spaced very well, meaning that when my players do cut to the basket there will be at most 1 big man there to provide help D, and even that big man would have to sag off 'Drew.

Defense:

The defense I will be run is based mainly around Tyson Chandler's absolute lack of utility on the offensive end. What this means is that Bynum can sag off him and patrol the paint. Dirk Nowitzki will be guarding Pau Gasol when Pau is not in the paint and Pau will be double teamed every time he has the ball in the paint. Pau will be played very physically, especially by Bynum/Haywood when he goes into the paint and this should be very successful as it was with Dampier instead of Bynum/Haywood in the '06 DAL-MEM series. Like in that series, Pau does not have Kobe Bryant to draw defensive attention and the constant double teams should throw him off his game like it did in '06. Caron Butler is an adequate defensive player and will mark Tayshaun Prince straight up and Tay simply doesn't have enough of an offensive arsenal to be a major concern. The only other major offensive threat is Kevin Martin and I have good swingmen defenders in Bell/Azubuike to put on Martin. Kirk Hinrich will be played straight up by Mo Williams, I am really not concerned with Hinrich. All in all, they will be playing 4 on 5 on offense because Chandler is useless. This will allow me to clog the lane a lot and not allow easy points in the paint.

Matchups:

Cc: A Bynum/B Haywood vs T Chandler/R Turiaf: Bynum is a better defensive player and offensive player than Chandler, Chandler does have him beat in rebounding though. I have no doubt that Chandler would do a good job D'ing up Bynum but Bynum's presence means that Chandler will not be able to provide much weakside defense. Bynum and Haywood on the other hand have very little to worry about in terms of man defense and so they will be able to provide lots of help defense and thus be very useful defensively. Overall, my Centers have better defensive AND offensive games and while his team's Centers are better rebounders this simply does not make up for the other advantages. Large advantage to me.

PF: D Nowitzki/A Nocioni/B Haywood vs P Gasol/A Varejao: This is another win for me IMO. Dirk is simply a better player than Pau, especially when Pau does not have Kobe Bryant as the first option on offense. Pau is an amazing second option who is being asked in this team to be a first option [either him or Kmart and both suck at it]. The last time that Pau was a first option in the playoffs was back when he was in Memphis, playing against Dirk Nowitzki and the Mavericks. Dirk was absolutely beastly that series [as he is most in most series] whereas Pau was a no show. This highlights how Dirk can thrive as a first option when his teammates show up [as they did that season] and Pau simply cannot handle the load of being a first option. Gasol will have a good series no doubt, but it simply won't be on the MVP level of Dirk's. The backups in this situation hardly matter because Dirk/Gasol will be gobbling up most of the minutes. Advantage: Slight advantage to me.

SF: C Butler/K Azubuike/A Nocioni vs T Prince/M Beasley: I don't see how you can't give this matchup to me easily. Butler is simply a much better player than Prince. Butler simply provides everything every time he steps out onto the court while Prince is still pretty much just a defensive role player. Azubuike is a defensive specialist I will be bringing off the bench. Advantage: Large advantage to me.

SG: R Bell/K Azubuike vs K Martin/J Terry?: This is where he makes up a lot of the gap. Kevin Martin is clearly a much better player than either of my SGs, but the thing is that both of my SGs are defensive specialists who will be expending 90% of their energy on the court simply chasing Kevin Martin around and defending him as tight as possible. With not just one but two defensive specialist to put on Martin, it means that whoever is on Martin will be able to give 100% while they're on him and then they will be benched and the other guy will mark him. Terry off the bench is also a very potent threat but the same applies for him except that he is less of a threat. Advantage: Large advantage to him.

PG: M Williams/A Iverson vs K Hinrich/J Terry: This is where I had made the risky pick of Allen Iverson and I'm sure I will get crucified by some for it. However, let me elaborate as to why I picked Mo Williams and Allen Iverson as my PGs. On my team, the PG is not going to be used in the traditional role of a floor general as the offense will be running mainly through my forwards. The PG's role will be to provide a tertiary offensive threat and you have to admit that both Williams and Iverson would be extremely effective in a tertiary threat role. This means that at least 1 of my PGs and one of Butler/Nowitzki will be on the court at all times and as a result I will always have at least 2 dangerous offensive players on at all times. My PGs' main issue is defense and while they may get burned by Terry they will burn him back even more, and while Hinrich will D them up well they will still score and Hinrich cannot burn them back. Advantage: Small advantage to me.

Note: If Allen Iverson becomes a locker room cancer in this series he will be sent home and Raja Bell will be played at backup PG which won't be an issue because I'm not using a conventional PG anyways.

Overall I think that Snakebites' team simply lacks the offensive firepower to be a real threat to my team. With Gasol and Martin D'd up hard, who else will score? Terry can do it to an extent but he has his limits. His team simply cannot score enough to make this a real contest. KGB in 5 or 6.

[dockingsched]

make sure you post up your roster and a team strategy. failure to at least do that will disqualify you.

voting will be pretty straight forward. each participant will vote for all other matchups (7 out of 8) by simply stating who they think wins the head to head matchup based on roster and strategy. voting begins friday at 9am eastern and 6am pacific.

before that you can argue for your team or ask questions of any other team.

[john2jer]

Line-up:

C - Duncan(36)/Gasol(12)
PF - Odom(36)/Bonner(12)
SF - Wallace(33)/Randolph(15)
SG - Redd(30)/Evans(18)
PG - Nelson(30)/Calderon(18)

Pretty straight forward on minutes distribution. This is a 16 team tournament, so 4 games played, thus minutes on my aging players won't be a concern. With that being said, one of my goals while building my team was versatile players. I wanted guys who could play multiple positions in many different systems. Outside of Gasol, Bonner, Redd, and Nelson/Calderon. If Duncan is in foul trouble or tiring, Gasol steps in, and then Odom, Randolph, Wallace, or Bonner can play PF. We can also play small ball with Odom, Wallace, and Randolph as the front court, or go big moving Odom to the SF with Gasol and Duncan as my posts, and Redd/Evans as my backcourt. Odom's ability to handle the ball and play point forward takes pressure off of Evans as a non-traditional young PG. The match-up I most look forward to is Gerald Wallace completely abusing Kevin Durant's spagheti frame. Our ability to spread the floor opens up the court for Duncan, and reduces the effectiveness of Smoove being able to roam for block shots. Odom might not be a world class outside shooter, but he shoots for a good clip elsewhere, and has learned not to force shots. He'll play within an offense.

We also have guys who know how to win and have played on championship clubs in Duncan, Bonner, and Odom. Along with guys who I'd consider fighters who will do whatever it takes to win games in Nelson, Bonner, and Wallace. Duncan provides an Obi Wan type of leadership and a will to win.

On offense: The versatility this team has, along with four great shooters in Redd, Nelson, Calderon, and Bonner, plus post options, almost screams for a triangle style team. We're also able to run a lot of pick and rolls with Nelson and Calderon's ability to knock down shots from the point, especially mid-range, or distribute to Duncan, Gasol, and Odom as they roll to the basket, or kick out to Redd and Bonner for the dagger three. Duncan's ability to step out and hit a jump shot opens up space in the paint for Gasol, Odom, and Wallace. When Bargs is in the game attemping to play defense, he's going to get pounded by Duncan, Gasol, and Odom down low. I feel everyone on the team contributes offensively, be it through shooting, distributing, or attacking the basket. Everyone's a threat. I definitely look forward to a high-low game with Duncan/Odom surrounded by Nelson, Redd, and Bonner. If they zone that we're killing them from outside the arc, and if they man up, Duncan's either eating someone alive one on one, or Odom's slashing to the basket. The passing is WAY too good.

On defense: We have two weak links on defense that I think are greatly made up for by our length in the front court. Michael Redd brings size to be able to body up with bigger guards, but let's be honest; Duncan, Odom, and Wallace will be playing help defense when Redd's in there. Which is why I limited his minutes slightly because I fully trust the strength, quickness, and ability of Tyreke "The Freak" Evans to use his MASSIVE wingspan to shut down passing lanes, along with Gerald Wallace, and initiating the break going the other way. It's this perimeter defense, along with the shot blocking of Anthony Randolph(who will be 7'4" by time this tourney starts), Tim Duncan, and Marc Gasol, that will lead to easy baskets on the other end of the floor, saving Duncan, Odom, and Gasol having to make too many trips down the floor. Evans also will be used against Rose when he's in the game to slow down the ultra quick guard. As far as matching up against my opponent, I'm quite excited. Kendrick Perkins is a non-factor on offense, leaving Duncan and Gasol able to help protect the basket. Josh Smith isn't going to create offense on his own, or stretch the floor, but is dangerous in the pick and roll, and athletic enough to allow for oops, but again, help side defense is made easier with Perkins getting major minutes. Smoove is also known to be a knucklehead, which definitely works in my favor. Rose is one of the quickest PGs in the league, but Nelson matches up well with him due to Jameer's strength, and knowing that he has help behind him. Kevin Durant's going to get his points, but I have probably one of the best defensive SFs in the league to help contain him with strong/physical defense. Since Durant will be their primary scorer, we can almost just guard Durant 94 feet and make sure he never gets the ball in his hands, forcing the game to become a 4 on 3 when Perkins is in.

Tangibles: My first round match-up is against a team that's counting on a rookie/2nd year PG and a young SF who hasn't been able to lead his team to victory, just yet. When the game is on the line, who are they going to turn to? Who takes charge in the huddle or on the court and provides the back for the rest of them to climb on? This is where Duncan(mostly), and to an extent Odom come in. Don't underestimate the heart of a champion. We're rolling with 2 and a half(Bonner) guys who have won it all.

Why we win: Cellar's Dwellars are going to have to get into an offense/defense sub situation because Perkins doesn't provide offense and Bargs doesn't provide defense. This hurts the team's rythym, while I can just ride my horses and don't have to count too much on my bench.

(Wanted to get this typed up, but I know there's a tad bit of randomness to the order of my points. Not sure what tonight's going to hold.)

[CellarDoor]

Line-up:

Pretty straight forward on minutes distribution. This is a 16 team tournament, so 4 games played, thus minutes on my aging players won't be a concern. With that being said, one of my goals while building my team was versatile players. I wanted guys who could play multiple positions in many different systems. Outside of Gasol, Bonner, Redd, and Nelson/Calderon. If Duncan is in foul trouble or tiring, Gasol steps in, and then Odom, Randolph, Wallace, or Bonner can play PF. We can also play small ball with Odom, Wallace, and Randolph as the front court, or go big moving Odom to the SF with Gasol and Duncan as my posts, and Redd/Evans as my backcourt. Odom's ability to handle the ball and play point forward takes pressure off of Evans as a non-traditional young PG. The match-up I most look forward to is Gerald Wallace completely abusing Kevin Durant's spagheti frame. Our ability to spread the floor opens up the court for Duncan, and reduces the effectiveness of Smoove being able to roam for block shots. Odom might not be a world class outside shooter, but he shoots for a good clip elsewhere, and has learned not to force shots. He'll play within an offense.

Duncan wasn't double teams nearly as often last year as in the past and he still wasn't a highly efficient player only managing around 50% from the field. He maintained his points average but actually lost a bit more efficiency against the Celtics where he saw a lot of Perkins (KG on Bonner due to his range if anyone recalls). Tim's not a player that's going to beat you on his own anymore, and if you think Lamar Odom's jumpshot is going to beat anyone you're going to be in trouble too. Again, by and large, I'm going to let TD get his twenty and stay at home on D anyways.

On offense: The versatility this team has, along with four great shooters in Redd, Nelson, Calderon, and Bonner, plus post options, almost screams for a triangle style team. We're also able to run a lot of pick and rolls with Nelson and Calderon's ability to knock down shots from the point, especially mid-range, or distribute to Duncan, Gasol, and Odom as they roll to the basket, or kick out to Redd and Bonner for the dagger three.

The funny thing about PnR is you need to have guys who can ROLL. Bonner, Odom and Duncan play for two teams that NEVER run the PnR and rarely set picks at all.

Duncan's ability to step out and hit a jump shot opens up space in the paint for Gasol, Odom, and Wallace. When Bargs is in the game attemping to play defense, he's going to get pounded by Duncan, Gasol, and Odom down low.

By all means, pull Duncan out as a distraction for Gasol Odom and Wallace to work the post. Wallace has no post game to speak of, Odom has very little and is being guarded by Smoove a large portion of the time, and Gasol isn't a big scorer. If you want to move Duncan out of the paint in favor of Gasol posting, I'll celebrate.

I feel everyone on the team contributes offensively, be it through shooting, distributing, or attacking the basket. Everyone's a threat. I definitely look forward to a high-low game with Duncan/Odom surrounded by Nelson, Redd, and Bonner. If they zone that we're killing them from outside the arc, and if they man up, Duncan's either eating someone alive one on one, or Odom's slashing to the basket. The passing is WAY too good.

As I mentioned in my write-up and earlier, i'm not running a zone at you. No one on your team is explosive enough to warrant a double very often. If Duncan "eats Perkins alive" for 19 a game, i'm cool with that.

On defense: We have two weak links on defense that I think are greatly made up for by our length in the front court. Michael Redd brings size to be able to body up with bigger guards, but let's be honest; Duncan, Odom, and Wallace will be playing help defense when Redd's in there. Which is why I limited his minutes slightly because I fully trust the strength, quickness, and ability of Tyreke "The Freak" Evans to use his MASSIVE wingspan to shut down passing lanes, along with Gerald Wallace, and initiating the break going the other way. It's this perimeter defense, along with the shot blocking of Anthony Randolph(who will be 7'4" by time this tourney starts), Tim Duncan, and Marc Gasol, that will lead to easy baskets on the other end of the floor, saving Duncan, Odom, and Gasol having to make too many trips down the floor. Evans also will be used against Rose when he's in the game to slow down the ultra quick guard. As far as matching up against my opponent, I'm quite excited. Kendrick Perkins is a non-factor on offense, leaving Duncan and Gasol able to help protect the basket. Josh Smith isn't going to create offense on his own, or stretch the floor, but is dangerous in the pick and roll, and athletic enough to allow for oops, but again, help side defense is made easier with Perkins getting major minutes. Smoove is also known to be a knucklehead, which definitely works in my favor. Rose is one of the quickest PGs in the league, but Nelson matches up well with him due to Jameer's strength, and knowing that he has help behind him. Kevin Durant's going to get his points, but I have probably one of the best defensive SFs in the league to help contain him with strong/physical defense. Since Durant will be their primary scorer, we can almost just guard Durant 94 feet and make sure he never gets the ball in his hands, forcing the game to become a 4 on 3 when Perkins is in.

Frankly i'm getting tired of snipping quotes, so hopefully I don't miss anything here.
First, I forgot about Randolph...J2J in 4. I forfeit
Second, Perkins isn't a huge factor, but as I found out last year, it turns out he's a competent player near the basket that can't be left. He finished dishes with authority and actally scored 3-4 times in ISO when he wasn't screening Rondo and trying to break Rose in 2. If you leave him he's going to score. Neither of us have the luxury of leaving someone on either team. My worst offensive guy (Perkins) can hurt you, and J2J's worst guy (Odom) can hurt you. For the reserves, Randolph still isn't scoring at a terribly impressive clip. On the warriors. In the pre-season.

Alright, now there's two things I REALLY want to hammer home here: Evans and Wallace.
Evans...the "freak" who couldn't athletically hold Rose's jock? That one? He's going to terrorize the passing lanes while guarding Rose? Good luck with that. He's going to terrorize the passing lanes at all? He's averaging 1 steal in 33 minutes. In the pre-season where everyone else is playing sloppy. With the way refs call games in this league, if an unpolished rookie is playing Rose he's going to be shooting 8-10 fts a game. It's going to be a terrible mis-step to play Evans in a 16 team league. Even his scoring which looks nice at 15 a game in 33 minutes is marred by 4TOs and horrible efficiency.

With Wallace, like I mentioned, I relish the opportunity to have him guarding one of my primary scorers. Wallace is a great, great help defender. Absolutely insane. But he's an average man defender. He doesn't have the footwork for it or the desire to do it. If he didn't have to guard Durant I'd be concerned about his weakside defense on Rose. As it stands, he shouldn't worry me or affect anyone's votes terrible much. The list of on-ball SF defenders who are better is long.

Tangibles: My first round match-up is against a team that's counting on a rookie/2nd year PG and a young SF who hasn't been able to lead his team to victory, just yet. When the game is on the line, who are they going to turn to? Who takes charge in the huddle or on the court and provides the back for the rest of them to climb on? This is where Duncan(mostly), and to an extent Odom come in. Don't underestimate the heart of a champion. We're rolling with 2 and a half(Bonner) guys who have won it all.

A 2nd year PG who dismantled a top defense in the league and top defensive guard and helped take a team to 7 games we had no business hanging with with or without Garnett. Durant has had his team on his back and done the best he can and he's the best offensive player in this series, bar none. He can hit the three at a high clip contested and otherwise, manufacture his own shot, and is incredibly efficient. And again, you're severely overrating Odom. He's a nice, inconsistent player, but there isn't an ounce of leadership in his body.

Cellar's Dwellars are going to have to get into an offense/defense sub situation because Perkins doesn't provide offense and Bargs doesn't provide defense. This hurts the team's rythym, while I can just ride my horses and don't have to count too much on my bench.

First, the word you're looking for is "Dwellers". Second, I'm again confused by the overrating of roleplayers. You think this game is going to be won by Marc Gasol being played by an average man defender instead of a top 3 man defender? Am I supposed to think Bargniani can't hang with Bonner or Odom? Really?
The only guy Bargniani doesn't have the skill to contain or doesn't have to worry about containing is Tim Duncan who will be guarded almost exclusively by Perkins who I've already outlined on offense and defense.(Wanted to get this typed up, but I know there's a tad bit of randomness to the order of my points. Not sure what tonight's going to hold.)[/quote]

[VintaGe36]

Our MO is to make the other team put the ball on the ground because we won't let them beat us with the 3. Marion will be guarding Battier who is a smart player, and a tremendous defender but on offense he is a spot up shooter, a corner 3 guy who depends on a Mcgrady or a Yao to draw his man off him. He can't create his own shoot. The lack of wing scorers allows us to put the onus on West and Billups. Brand (a great defender) will be guarding West and we believe that the lack of dribble-drive penetration on the other team will really hurt the ability of West to get those open shots that he gets in New Orleans. Billups (like Williams) is a guy that sets up the offense and looks for scoring chances. Paul is a guy that creates them off of dribble-drive penetration.

With three guys, setting high screens for billups, and only one guy(Marion) with the size and speed to keep up with them, Billups will get openings through the PnR and PnP. This will cause your team to scramble, and Battier, will get a few open looks. However this will open up the lane, and with the screens, Billups will get into the teeth of your D, at which point I'm not terrified of any of your big men.

Brand is a good defensive anchor and Thabeet is a guy that will blocks shots and deter players from getting to the paint.

In what realm, is the 6'9 Brand, who is a natural PF, and not even a physical one at that, and a rookie C, with next to no NBA experience an anchor for a team? West, Scola, Oden and McDyess will eat that frontcourt alive.

Offense

Spacing. We feel that we have spaced the floor perfectly, Okur will give Brand plenty of room to work in the post, and open up the floor for Williams/Carter/Marion to drive.

Brand isn't even a post player, he shoots mid range jumpshots....

also Carter shot a huge 75% of shots in the form of jumpers last season.
Marion shot 44% of shots through jumpers, I don't really see the slashers you seem to think the are.

We will have Okur pull either West or Oden (probably West) away from the basket, with the 3 point range of Williams/Carter/Okur you can't pack the paint or you'll get killed from the outside. Brand is a very savvy post player and although Oden is a great post defender, he has had a history of foul trouble. With Williams and Carter going to the basket we will try to put the pressure on Oden to make quick decisions and hopefully get into foul trouble early.

Again, Brand shoots mid range jumpers, foul trouble, won't be an issue, and Carter was a jumpshooter last year too, Oden won't even be challenged by your seemingly soft, perimeter based team.

If I need a game winner, a clutch shot I have Williams/Gordon/Carter to choose from. Outside of Billups (who we will guard heavily in those situations) who is gonna do it for the other team?

This is such a bogus claim "clutchness" is such an overrated stat, stars take the shot, when they need to. If you double Billups, someone will be open, and if not, i'll run screens, double screens heck triple screens, with rollers to the basket, to open things up, In crunch time, my team will operate like they normally do, and will find success.

We have the better bench, Thabeet/Haslem/Barnes are defensive guys that know their role, and Haslem in particular brings a lot of toughness to the team. Gordon is my 6th man and he will be playing 30+ minutes. The best bench player on the other team, Scola, is playing behind David West and can't play C or SF so how many minutes can he get? With Gordon coming off the bench he is gonna shred Blake and Foye.

Thabeet? the rookie Thabeet? he's gonna get punished by veteran savvy frontcourt.

To conclude, I'd reiterate that Williams has never had this many weapons to work with. With Carter/Gordon in the back-court with him you can't key in on his or your going to get killed by the off-guard, and with his size he can guard SG's while Gordon guards PG's (which he does quite well).

Weapons? you mean a two SGs that are notorious for creating for themselves,
and a PF playing at SF, with next to no offensive game to speak of, and two jumpshoot big men?

You act like this is some kind of super team.


On the other hand, Billups has had a defensive juggernaut of a supporting cast before, and he won a championship running the show, i don't expect it to be any different.

In short we have a much, much better offense, a balanced one were everyone has a role and a PG that can run the show like no other

Much better? debatable, especially with my much superior team defense and man defenders

and with guys like Marion/Brand who are elite defenders

Elite? no no no. Elite defenders, are guys who impose their will on another team, a guy who can take a player out of the game (Battier, Garnett, Duncan) Marion is versatile, you know who else is versatile? Jared Jeffries, neither Marion or Brand are bad on D, but don't talk them up to be elite either.

Williams/Carter who are good ones, and a defensive bench, we have a comparable defense.

a rookie C, who didn't even dominate college, despite being massive, a trigger happy SG, who thrived with a PG big enough to guard Shooting Guards(something Deron has NEVER done btw) is a defensive bench? I see a rookie, two scorers, and a decent PF.

My defense, from top to bottom is much better, you don't have a defender of Battier's caliber, or a big man with the skills and strength of Oden(don't you dare bring up Thabeet) McDyess won't get pushed around, and neither will West or Scola.

[BlackIce]

VINTAGE36 vs. BLACKICE

Rotation:
Chauncey Billups(38)/JR Smith(10)
Shane Battier(30)/JR Smith(18)
David West(15)/Grant Hill(33)
Luis Scola(28)/David West(20)
Greg Oden(30)/Antonio McDyess(18)

Outlook: As you can see, I'm running a less than conventional line up. I'm featuring David West out of position at the 3, which to some, may seem odd, but for my current match up, plays to my favor.

Offense: On Offense, Chauncey Billups, will be running the show, Deron is hardly a stopper on defense, and though he is bigger, so Billups won't be able to post him up, but that isn't the only part of Billups game, I really don't see Billups being completely nullified this round, and vice versa for Billups guarding Deron.

My Offense will obviously run through Billups/Blake I'm gonna run the pick and roll with Scola and Oden all day. Brand is a solid defender, but hardly the anchor BlackIce is making him out to be, if hes content following Scola or Oden, or West, to the perimeter, ill burn him, since nobody is apt to strong post defense in his frontcourt. I'll also be using David West, and the pick and pop. Billups isn't the quickest guard, but with three guys capable of setting good hard screens, he'll find openings in the defense. West has the range, and versatility, to make my PnR and PnP work to my advantage, and Oden and Scolare physical enough to make the PnR doable. If they don't switch, or react, Billups and Blake have the range to make them pay. Battier, will perch on the outside, waiting for openings to hit 3's. He isn't the greatest offensive player, but if my PnR starts clicking, and Ice starts to pack the lane, Battier, will keep them honest.

Defense: This, is where I have a clear advantage IMO. My team, is tailor made, to be an elite squad defensively. Marion, at the 3, allows me to play West at the 3 as well. Marion has never used his quickness to his advantage. Marion, really doesn't have much of an offensive game to speak of, and so sticking West on him, wont be such a huge liability. Battier, will shut Carter down, and take him out of the game. Billups pretty much cancels out Deron, for the most part anyways. Brand and Okur aren't post players at all, so Oden won't get into foul trouble, and Scola and Oden aren't so athletically challenged, that they can't deal with them. Grant Hill off the bench, is a solid veteran, who can score, defend, and do the little things on the court, and McDyess is a beastly rebounder and defender, and since Ice has no bruising big man period(nothing but jump shooters by my counts) can enforce his will on the game along with Oden. I can clearly out match my opponent with brute force, and the rebounding edge I'll have here, goes without saying. My rebounding edge, should give me a significant edge in this series.

In the end, my team is built better defensively, and has better rebounders, though my team may not have the individual offensive talent to the tune of a premier swingman, we do have a strong cohesive unit, with solid defense from top to bottom, the ability to shut his team down, and a capable offensive scheme that will allow my best ball handler(Billups) to thrive.

OK I'm not sure how many times you can change your lineup but this is the last edit I'll be able to do.
First of all Vintage says that his team will run through Billups/Blake pick and roll, but Blake isn't even playing. So not sure what thats about. JR Smith is his backup PG, and we will welcome that he has no secondary ball handler and Smith is a pure SG that has no PG skills at all, and a no B-Ball IQ so he will attack him quite a bit during those 10 minutes. With this 3 big lineup Marion's versatility really comes in handy. I can put Marion on West, Brand on Scola (who isn't the periemer player that Vintage is making him out to be), and saying that Brand or Marion aren't good post defenders is just plain untrue. Okur stays on Oden. If it wasn't for Marion this lineup could cause me some problems, but I like it because I can guard it and I can kill them on the other end. BTW Brand isn't a defensive anchor? Not much I can say except that isn't true. West a pretty medicore defender and doesn't have Chandler behind to clean his mess (though Oden is a great defender, if foul prone). Is West going to guard Marion on back-doors, on fast breaks? I hope so. Anyways this doesn't change much West is only playing 15 minutes at SF with the 26 year old Hill playing 33. It's an attempt to mask his lack of ball hander's, and secondary scoring but it comes at a price. Smith can't handle PG duties quite simply and he doesn't have a Roy/JJ/Carter beside him to relieve the play-making/ball-handling duties. He has Battier beside him.

Ultimately playing West out of position for 15 minutes a game will hurt him quite a bit of defense, and Scola (who still isn't playing 30+ minutes) is going to struggle guarding Okur or Brand.

Marion has never used his quickness to his advantage.

What? Marions game is based on his quickness for his size, and he can kill West, especially with Williams finding him everytime he burns West. Vintage is being quite liberal in his favour, Battier is going to shut down Carter? He is going to give him a hard time but come on now. Billups is the clear 2nd best PG in this game, and I have a slight advantage at his best position, PG. Also playing West at SF, leaves Battier as the only guy that Bilups can swing the ball to that can hit the 3.

Brand and Okur aren't post players at all, so Oden won't get into foul trouble, and Scola and Oden aren't so athletically challenged, that they can't deal with them. Grant Hill off the bench, is a solid veteran, who can score, defend, and do the little things on the court, and McDyess is a beastly rebounder and defender, and since Ice has no bruising big man period(nothing but jump shooters by my counts) can enforce his will on the game along with Oden. I can clearly out match my opponent with brute force, and the rebounding edge I'll have here, goes without saying.

Er Haslem can play the post, so can Thabeet and Brand. Williams and Carter both put up around 5 RPG, and Marion is one of the best rebounding 3's in the game. Brand and Okur are also good rebounders, so again just not true.

In the end, my team is built better defensively, and has better rebounders, though my team may not have the individual offensive talent to the tune of a premier swingman, we do have a strong cohesive unit, with solid defense from top to bottom, the ability to shut his team down, and a capable offensive scheme that will allow my best ball handler(Billups) to thrive.

Thats the thing, Billups is best with a clear 2nd guy to create, like Melo. He isn't in the best position to thrive. You've glossed over my defence but whatever, I've made my case.

[Teddy KGB]

Am I correct in thinking that judging should start?

[CellarDoor]

Am I correct in thinking that judging should start?

It can, I'd probably wait a bit longer to see some responses. I want to see if Vintage calls BI on something on his own, and I want to see if a few of the other match-ups get rebuttals, etc. If you're not sure on your availability or you think any match-ups have run their course or are obviously in someone's favor, feel free to vote.

[knicksfan3232]

So when does this voting begin?

[Teddy KGB]

You can start voting already I believe

[VintaGe36]

OK I'm not sure how many times you can change your lineup but this is the last edit I'll be able to do.
First of all Vintage says that his team will run through Billups/Blake pick and roll, but Blake isn't even playing. So not sure what thats about. JR Smith is his backup PG, and we will welcome that he has no secondary ball handler and Smith is a pure SG that has no PG skills at all, and a no B-Ball IQ so he will attack him quite a bit during those 10 minutes.

That was a typo, Blake is my back-up PG.

With this 3 big lineup Marion's versatility really comes in handy. I can put Marion on West, Brand on Scola (who isn't the periemer player that Vintage is making him out to be)[/quite]

Where did I state Scola had a perimeter game? I simply said i'd use high screens and the PnR to get Billups open...

and saying that Brand or Marion aren't good post defenders is just plain untrue.

Saying they are elite, is just plain untrue. i've talked to a fan who follows the Clippers, and though Brand is a solid post defender and has a nice wing span, for the occasional block, he is absolutely NOT an anchor to any team's defense.

Also, Marion isn't an elite defender, I don't know why people toss that around
In his last 4 games against Marion, West has scored 17,21,19, and 20 ppg.
Those are right around his average, what makes you think Marion(who has undoubtedly lost a step, and is playing SF, when he's been playing PF all these years) is gonna shut West down?
He had a negative Net PER at SF last year, basically giving up more than he produced, and i understand how skewed of a stat PER is, but surely that's better than just going off of reputation, which my opponent is doing here. Brand, coming of two injury plagued seasons, is an anchor? All 6'9 of him? Far fetched at best.

Ultimately playing West out of position for 15 minutes a game will hurt him quite a bit of defense, and Scola (who still isn't playing 30+ minutes) is going to struggle guarding Okur or Brand.

What makes you think this? Scola isn't completely immobile, and Brand and Okur are jumpshooters, Scola is a smart defender, will position, and pester your lack of post play "post players".

What? Marions game is based on his quickness for his size, and he can kill West, especially with Williams finding him everytime he burns West. Vintage is being quite liberal in his favour, Battier is going to shut down Carter? He is going to give him a hard time but come on now.

Marion never exploited that size playing PF, he has NEVER carried a team offensively, what makes

Er Haslem can play the post, so can Thabeet and Brand. Williams and Carter both put up around 5 RPG, and Marion is one of the best rebounding 3's in the game. Brand and Okur are also good rebounders, so again just not true.

Being big, doesn't mean you can play in the post. A rookie Thabeet? who everyone knows, is raw as can be on the offensive side of the ball? Brand, like I said, is a midrange jump-shooter, and Haslem gets his points off of jumpers around the elbow/FT line, if those are the guys you're going to be relying on, for post play, my team's defense will eat you alive.

% of jumpshots taken last year:

Haslem - 68%
Okur - 71%
Brand - 71%
Scola - 47%

So by my estimations, you're going to rely on a raw young center, in his FIRST season in the NBA, to carry your team, in the post? Good luck with that, he had trouble scoring against Dejaun Blair...

Thats the thing, Billups is best with a clear 2nd guy to create, like Melo. He isn't in the best position to thrive.

Surely, than Richard Hamilton is more of a clear 2nd option than David West, is that what you're implying?

[Miller4ever]

We will sub at the PG position very often to make sure there are fresh legs ready to lead our team at all times.

This could also very well ensure that neither get into a rhythm of any kind.

The big men, David Lee, Samuel Dalembert, Blake Griffin and Charlie Villanueva, will be setting plenty of off the ball screens to free up our wingmen. After setting these screens, David Lee and Charlie Villanueva will utilize their mid range jumper capabilities and spread the floor to create easy scoring opportunities. Blake Griffin and Samuel Dalembert will roll to the basket, looking for a dish off for an easy lay in. Other than Dalembert, the rest of the big men are great at running the floor and will succeed in this run and gun offensive style. All of these big men are exceptional offensive rebounders and will crash the glass on every jumper.

All of this is nullified with the 3-2 zone with no switching. Millsap and Brooks stop any rolling, and the midrange is defended.

Whenever possible, our PG or SG will try and leave their man to set up a quick double team to force a turnover.

And this will allow open men way too often. We like this strategy.

David Lee is very capable of handling Milsap in the post.

Lee's post defense is not that good.

Overall I feel that this team just won’t be much of a threat when they are on offense. I know Danny Granger is a great scorer, but he will be out muscled for almost the entire game by Andre Iguodala and has never had success vs. him in the past either. In Danny Granger’s 4 year career he has played the 76ers 15 times and has only scored over 20 points once.

Igoudala plays SG when playing against the Pacers and Granger also averaged 8, 13, and 19 ppg in his first three years respectively, so it's better to look at percentages. Vs. Indiana Iggy scores at a 43% clip. Against Philly Granger scores at a 42%. Thing is, Iggy is being guarded by Jarrett Jack.

We will run all game on this team and it will lead us to an easy victory.

Did I mention that our team is younger? More hustle up and down?

I think it's a grave mistake to underestimate my offense. My team is more capable offensively than the numbers show, with the exception of Ariza and Granger. My team also has better perimeter D and better interior D.

[BlackIce]

Ok don't have much time. Glad you brought up the 2004 pistons team though i will get to that.

West isn't as good as Sheed was in 2004 on that Piston team, patiuclarly on defense but thats besides the point, if West plays the Sheed/2nd/3rd option role who plays the Hamilton role? Grant Hill? Battier can play the Prince role but he isn't as good as Prince is offensivly and Ben Wallace was a DPY, while Oden is a 3rd year player that just played his 1st fullish season. That Pistons team didn't have a clear cut go to guy but it had a lot of guys (paticularly Sheed and Rip) who were verrry dangerous offense players.

Also they were a much better defensive team, you are acting like your team is this defensive monster, but Blake/Smith/West/Scola and even Hill are playing major roles on your team and they go from horrible in Blake to average in Hill.

Also I'm not asking Maron to break down the defense and hit 3's his role is the same one he had in PHO, he can play PF on offense because Okur isn't a tradional center. All this talk of jump-shooting, does that make Okur any less dangerous? Which one of your bigs can guard the Williams/Okur pick and pop?

Also those numbers are very misleading, Marion was on bad teams and your numbers don't account for switchs and team defense...and Chris Paul.

Brand isn't a jumpshooter the reason that number is high is because with Dally clogging the paint in PHI and all the horrid shooters around Brand he had very little choice. He had no room to operate in the post and had to settle for the jumper, not the case here.



Marion never exploited that size playing PF, he has NEVER carried a team offensively, what makes
When did I ask Marion to "carry my team offensively? If he can get 15ppg on good D and good rebounding I'm fine. I have more than enough offense.

a rookie C, who didn't even dominate college, despite being massive, a trigger happy SG, who thrived with a PG big enough to guard Shooting Guards(something Deron has NEVER done btw) is a defensive bench? I see a rookie, two scorers, and a decent PF.

Oh my. All I want Thabeet to do is play defense and block shots. Not carry my team. Ben Gordon is just a trigger happy SG? Really? I mean come on we're facing each other but thats ridicules, he is one of the most efficient scorers at his position, your making him out to be jamal crawford. Deron DID guard SG's on the Olympic team when he played along side Paul. Two scorers? So Matt Barnes is a scorer? I thought he was a damn good defensive role player. He is a similar player to Hill except he isn't 36 and is only playing 8 minutes not 33.

Also why do you keep attacking Thabeet he isn't starting, he' isn't even my 6th man and I have big z in case of any problems, your acting like he is playing a major role on my team, and just how proven is your starting center?

I don't have to to rebute your first rebuttal but calling Carter a "soft jump-shooter", or my team a soft jump shooting team, if I recall correctly...whatever. I don't have time, but I'll let the judges decide for themselves.