RealGM

Alright, I've decided to go with a traditional 16 team playoff format instead of round robin. Here are the round 1 matchups:

Bracket 1:

Group A:

Snakebites vs. CellarDoor

SabasRevenge! vs. bryant08

Group B:

TMACFORMVP vs. Warspite

BlackIce vs. pancakes3

Bracket 2:

Group C:

SamBone vs. bastillon

All In The Name vs. Baller 24

Group D:

Miller4ever vs. jcldallas24

Myth_Breaker vs. Bruh Man

Player stats and accolades: viewtopic.php?f=340&t=981742

Baller 24 has a great team, and his starting SG is my favorite player. But I believe my team has the overall advantage in this series.

All In The Name

Walt Frazier (40) / Dana Barros (8)
Sidney Mtoncrief (34) / Lou Hudson (14)
Lou Hudson (11) / Dennis Rodman (24) / Peja Stojakovic (13)
Dennis Rodman (12) / Rasheed Wallace (30) / Theo Ratliff (6)
Shaquille O'Neal (40) / Brad Daugherty (4) / Theo Ratliff (4)

vs.

Baller 24

PG: Derek Harper (30) – Mark Price (18)
SG: Dwyane Wade (37) – Doug Christie (11)
SF: Grant Hill (36) – Kevin Durant (12)
PF: Willis Reed (18) – Chris Webber (30)
C: Bill Russell (40) – Willis Reed (8)

Divac (Reserve – Will not play)

Offense

My #1 offensive option is Shaq. He's an absolute beast down low and is a phenomenal passer for a big man. We'll feed him the ball in the paint early and often. Not much needs to be said about the center matchup. Russell is terrific defensively, but he won't be able to stop Shaq. 2000 Shaq will produce against any defender.

Walt Frazier is also a fantastic offensive weapon. He gives us everything we could want from a PG and excels playing both on-ball and off-ball, which is crucial in an ATL. In addition to averaging nearly 21 PPG on almost 52% shooting, Clyde was second in the league in assists. He's the perfect floor general for our team who will do whatever it takes to win, whether it be setting up easy shots for teammates or taking over a game with his scoring (he did both to perfection in Game 7 of the 1970 NBA Finals, leading the Knicks to victory with 36 points, 19 assists, and 5 steals). Derek Harper is a very physical defender, but, again, Frazier is a legend, and he's going to do his thing no matter what. An extremely intelligent player, he will also exploit Harper's physicality at times to draw fouls. Frazier averaged over 7 FTA per game, a figure which, when combined with Shaq's double digit free throw attempts, will get our team into the bonus and our opponents into foul trouble.

Like Frazier, Sidney Moncrief is a great all-around guard who excels at virtually everything offensively and defensively, with the exception of three-point shooting. He too averaged over 20 PPG on over 50% shooting (22.5 on 52.4%). The Moncrief-Wade matchup will be an interesting one. Wade is a very athletic and strong player, but Moncrief is no slouch in these departments either. He'll be our third option and contribute in a variety of ways. If there's one knock on Wade defensively, it's that he gambles too much. I've seen him make some questionable attempts at a steal on a number of occasions, only to leave his teammates scrambling to recover. We expect a guy like Moncrief to take advantage of such situations, due to his great mid-range shot and driving ability (7.9 FTA per game, another guy who will get us into the bonus). Sid the Squid will also post-up Wade and make sure he has to work defensively. Addtionally, Moncrief will cut to the basket to get some easy points when the defense focuses on guys like Shaq and Frazier.

Dennis Rodman has a high basketball IQ and doesn't demand touches. He'll probably score a few garbage points each game and is actually a pretty nice passer, too, so he'll fit just fine within our offensive scheme. Still, we obviously drafted him for his defense and rebounding.

Our bench will add some three-point shooting to the mix. Rasheed Wallace made 1.4 threes per game on 36% shooting and will help spread the floor. He's also got some very nice moves in the post that will help us get some easy buckets. Sheed will present a matchup problem for whoever is guarding him. Reed is a great defender, but he was a center, not a power forward.

“Since that trade, I feel like a new person”, Reed said at the time. “Center is my position.”

He will have a tough time sticking with Wallace on the perimeter, and Webber will have trouble defending him in general, as he was a poor defender.

Dana Barros and Peja Stojakovic had two of the best three-point shooting seasons of all time, plain and simple. In addition to averaging 20.6 PPG and 7.5 APG, Barros knocked down 2.4 threes per game on 46.4%. It's true that the line was shortened this season, but Barros was a fantastic shooter both before (1.1; 44.6% in '92) and after (1.3; 40.7% in '98) the line was moved in. He simply happened to be at his peak at the time this change took place.

Peja averaged 3.0 threes per game on 43.3%, helping him score 24.2 PPG and finish 4th in MVP voting. Only Ray Allen and Jason Richardson have made more threes in a season with the standard line (and only 2 others made more behind the shortened line). Peja is one of the best shooters ever and is also one of the best at knocking down jumpers with a defender in his face.

Lou Hudson will also provide spacing. He was known for his jump shot, averaging 21.9 PPG on 49.2% from the field during his selected season. I obviously cannot provide 3-point numbers for Hudson, but TrueLAfan, an extremely well-respected and credible poster, had the following to say about Sweet Lou:

"Very few older players put up long distance shots with regularity...Lou Hudson did. He'd be a terrific player today...on par with, and maybe better than, Ray Allen."

Now, in spite of the fact that I have a number of 3-point marksmen, I suspect that, in terms of volume, my team is near the bottom of this ATL in 3-point shooting. Still, I don't see this as a major issue in this round, or any round (if I'm fortunate enough to advance), for the following reasons:

1. Shooters need Shaq much more than Shaq needs shooters. In 2000, Shaq's finest season, the Lakers won 67 games and the NBA title, ranking in the top 5 offensively (points per 100 possessions) in the process. Surely Shaq was was surrounded by a plethora of 3-point threats, right? Wrong. Quite the contrary, in fact. That Lakers team had just 1 player average more than 1 three-pointer per game (Glen Rice, and just barely; 84 made threes in 80 games) and no one shot over 36.7% from downtown (unless you count Tyronn Lue and his 8 attempts). Those Lakers ranked in the bottom half of the league in terms of makes and fifth worst percentage-wise.

2. My offense is incredibly efficient. Frazier shot 51.8%, third highest of any guard in the league (his .575 TS% was good for sixth in the league). Moncrief was fourth of all guards in FG% at 52.4%, and his .602 TS% placed him 11th overall. Hudson shot 49.2%, placing him in the top 10 of all non-centers in FG%. Rodman shot 53.9%. Shaq led the league at 57.4% and also was in the top 10 in TS%. Those are my starters. And my bench is filled with efficient scorers as well, with no one shooting lower than 46.9%, Barros (.632) ranking fifth in TS%, and Peja (.624) and Daugherty (.629) both finishing second in TS% in the entire NBA.

3. Finally, my three-point shooting is not all that bad. As I noted before, I have quite a few three-point threats. Granted, my best few players aren't known for their long-range ability, but I'll still almost always have at least one three-point threat on the court. Also, I've crunched the numbers, and, adjusting for minutes (but not for pace, as I don't know exactly what pace to adjust to), my team averages about 3 made threes per game on over 38% shooting. The volume is very poor; the accuracy is very good (it would rank at or near the top of the league nearly any year). Keep in mind though, that this does not take into account Frazier and, especially, Hudson, two guys who would add to this total. Even if I were to make a conservative estimate of 2 made threes per game between them on 33% (remember, Hudson is considered one of those few players who knocked down plenty of threes even without the line, and Frazier was a good enough shooter that he'd probably at least occasionally make a three), this would put my team around 5 threes per game on 36%. That's still below average volume-wise, but it's far from terrible, and the percentage is still above average. And that's about the worst-case scenario.

Defense

Baller 24 has some great offensive pieces, but I have the right defenders to stymie his attack. We'll primarily play man-to-man, starting off the game with Hudson on Harper, Frazier on Wade, Moncrief on Hill, Rodman on Reed, and Shaq on Russell. Hudson is bigger and stronger than most of the guys Harper is used to being defended by. Plus, looking at the perimeter guys next to Harper, we expect he'll be used more to simply bring the ball up the floor, pass it to someone else, and spot-up for a shot, rather than dominating the ball and creating plays (though he may occasionally play that role). And despite Harper's 1.2 made threes per game (good, but not great), he shot less than 36% from downtown, a mediocre-at-best figure for a PG who takes that many threes. Basically, we're not too worried about Harper in an ATL. He's a nice role player, but we're perfectly content if he's the one trying to make plays against us.

Frazier should do a great job on Wade. It's another case of a great offensive player against a great defensive player, but we believe Frazier can take advantage of this matchup. Frazier was arguably the greatest guard defender of all time, and one of the things he's well-known for is his great stealing ability. Unfortunately, steals were not kept track of during his selected season, but he averaged 2.4 SPG during the very tail end of his prime. Frazier was known for tricking the ball-handler into thinking he wasn't playing defense and promptly stealing the ball from the surprised player. For all of Wade's strengths, he is turnover-prone, finishing second in the league in turnovers in 2009. He can sometimes get careless with the ball, and Frazier's style will work well to force some turnovers. Frazier will make it difficult for Wade to penetrate for easy shots. Again, Wade is a great player who is almost impossible to shut down, but we expect Frazier (and Moncrief, who I'll discuss momentarily) to contain him.

As I stated earlier, Moncrief will begin the game defending Hill. Now, this will only be for a few minutes (once the first substitutions are made), but, even so, Moncrief will hold his own even against the taller Hill. Like Frazier, Moncrief is one of the few guys who can make a legitimate case as the best guard defender ever. Now, Moncrief is giving up few inches and some pounds to Hill, but Moncrief has great strength and will not allow Hill to abuse him. Hill is an efficient player, but he's not a good shooter for a wing, shooting barely over 71% from the line, so he won't be able to effectively use his height advantage to simply shoot over Moncrief. Additionally, Moncrief is excellent at staying in front of his man and won't let Hill blow by him to the basket. Hill will probably try to post up Moncrief a couple of times, but Moncrief's strength and defensive ability will prevent him from being abused even in the post.

Rodman is another one of the greatest defenders ever. In my selected season, he was right around that point when he switched from SF to PF, so he can obviously still do a terrific job defending either (in addition to any other position, for that matter). He will harass Reed for the first few minutes and won't let him set up for easy mid-range jumpers.

I mentioned earlier that, as great as Russell was, a guy like Shaq will be effective no matter what. But Russell was not nearly as dominant on the offensive end, so the same does not hold true for him. Shaq can absolutely prevent him from going off. By no means was Russell useless offensively. He was an outstanding passer (though our offensive efficiency, ability to get to the charity stripe, and, as I'll show later, ability to control the boards, will limit Russell's use of his great outlet passing) and ball-handler and had some big scoring outputs. But Russell is far from a top scorer for an ATL, and, although he took quite a few shots from the high post, he's not a guy we're afraid to leave open now and then for a jumpshot. He shot less than 46% (yes, I realize that FG%s were lower then, but that still doesn't make him a knockdown shooter) and below 60% from the free throw line, so Shaq will not be afraid to play off him a bit if needed and help protect the basket.

I'd also like to point out that peak Shaq was actually a great defender. In addition to being their top scorer, Shaq was the defensive anchor of the 2000 Lakers, who ranked first in the league in points allowed per 100 possessions. He also averaged 3.0 BPG and 0.5 SPG, led the NBA in defensive win shares, was second in defensive rating, and was named to the All-Defensive second team. He was very motivated that season and in great shape. He still was not a good pick-and-roll defender but was excellent at defending his man one-on-one and protecting the rim when someone drives to the lane. And we're not too concerned about pick-and-rolls. With other great defenders around Shaq, we're confident that our guys can fight through screens, and we won't have to switch.

Finally, we've got two very good defenders off the bench. Like Shaq, Theo Ratliff was named to the All-Defensive second team and averaged 3.0 BPG.

But our bench player who will play the biggest role defensively (and overall, for that matter) is Rasheed Wallace. He's giving us starter's minutes (30 MPG) off the bench. He is a great post defender and help side defender and will take on the task of defending Chris Webber (who also will be playing 30 MPG off the bench). Webber was a fanatstic player from the high post, but this is a good matchup for us on both ends of the floor. Webber and Wallace were in their primes at around the same time (Baller 24 chose 2001 for Webber; I chose 2002 for Wallace). In these two seasons, the two faced each other 6 times. Here are their stats in those 6 games:

Rasheed Wallace: 22.3 PPG, 10.0 RPG, 1.8 APG, 2.3 TOPG, 54.6 TS%

Chris Webber: 26.2 PPG, 8.7 RPG, 5.3 APG, 3.8 TOPG, 51.4 TS%

So, although Webber is a better offensive player than Wallace, Wallace's superior defense (both one-on-one and help) leads us to believe that Wallace will be the more effective player in this series. We will concede that Webber is a higher volume scorer, but he's also much less efficient. In fact, of all 25 players who averaged 20+ PPG in Webber's selected 2001 season, he had the fourth lowest TS% (.516). It'd be one thing if we were asking them to be #1 options, but, in an ATL, we're not. So since they're being used as role players (albeit very good ones), we believe that Wallace's superior defense, ability to spread the court, and overall efficiency outweighs Webber's passing advantage.

Also, when Wallace comes into the game, this allows us to play our more conventional defensive lineup of Frazier/Moncrief/Rodman/Wallace/Shaq, with each player guarding his respective position.

My opponent's offensive attack is most likely keyed around his perimeter guys in Wade and Hill, but, fortunately, I have a jaw-dropping defensive backcourt and Rodman to make sure Hill doesn't go off.

Rebounding

So, overall, we feel that we have the overall advantage both offensively and defensively, which means the only way Baller 24 could win this matchup is to have a significant rebounding advantage. Now, you might glance at his roster, see Bill Russell's name, and think he might have a major advantage. But I have some great rebounders, too. Not only does Baller 24 not have a significant rebounding advantage; he doesn't have a rebounding advantage at all. I do.

Using TrueLAfan's formula for calculating TRB% for players who played before 1971, I was able to get a good estimate for Frazier, Hudson, Reed, and Russell. Accounting for minutes played, here are the ORB% and the DRB% for each squad:

ORB%:

All In The Name
PG: 2.7
SG: 7.6
SF: 11.3
PF: 9.1
C: 11.1
average: 8.4

Baller 24
PG: 2.1
SG: 3.3
SF: 4.5
PF: 8.8
C: 11.6
average: 6.1

DRB%:

All In The Name
PG: 11.1
SG: 9.7
SF: 23.2
PF: 23.7
C: 26.0
average: 18.7

Baller 24
PG: 7.1
SG: 11.8
SF: 21.4
PF: 22.5
C: 25.7
average: 17.7

So, as you can see, not only do we have the higher overall ORB% and DRB%, we are better across the board, for the most part.

Combined with our efficient offense and lockdown defense, this rebounding edge will be too much to handle for our opponents. It's not going to be an easy series by any means, but we like our chances.

Blackice vs Pancakes3

Dikembe Mutombo (30) / Walt Bellamy (18)
Kevin Garnett (40) / Horace Grant (8)
Dale Ellis(25)/ Andrei Kirilenko (23)
Jerry West(40)/ Manu Ginobili (8)
Dennis Johnson(35)/ Manu Ginobili (13)

*As much as it pains me, Tim Hardaway will be an injury reserve in this series

Vs.

Moses Malone/Mark Eaton
Bob McAdoo/Gus Johnson
Elgin Baylor/Tayshaun Prince
Reggie Miller/Wille Wise
Deron Williams/Penny Hardaway

Roster Info:

viewtopic.php?f=340&t=981742

Writeup

Defense
+ Perimeter defense
+ Shot Blocking
+ Steals
+ Last line of defense


We will play straight man to man most of the time. Their two best players are being guarded by my two of my best defenders. DJ will guard Baylor and we feel that he will do as good a job as anyone, he is only one inch shorter so my PG guarding a SF shouldn’t be a problem (DJ did a damn good job on Magic who is 6’8 I believe).

Malone will be guarded by Mutombo one of the greatest defensive players of all-time, and although Moses is a force, he won’t be able to physically intimidate Mutombo or Walt Bellamy for that matter when he’s in the game. We may throw KG on him when McAdoo is out of the game. Reggie Miller will be guarded by Ellis, with Reggie you don’t need a lockdown defender you need someone who will fight through screens and contest his shoots. We will have him play Reggie for the shot and if Reggie gets past Ellis on a drive our elite help defense will collapse on him and he doesn’t really have elite shooters to kick it out to.

This leaves possibly the greatest “guard” defender on Deron Williams. This will cause a lot of problems for our opponent, Williams will have trouble even bringing up the ball past halfcourt, he has never faced pressure like he will face from West. This will cause problems for our opponents offense which rely’s heavily on the playmaking ability and distribution that Williams brings. Reggie needs a guy to get him the ball, Bayler isn’t a playmaker he is about as pure a scorer as they come, Malone at his chosen peak averaged 1.8 assists which is pretty poor and McAdoo isn’t anything special in the playmaking department. We thought about this a lot and believe that Williams is a key piece to their offense and hence the reason we are putting West on him.

Our post defense is elite, probably the best in the game. KG will lockdown McAdoo who in his own right was a great offensive player, however KG is a top 2 defender at the PF spot (maybe better then Duncan, and certainly the best if you consider Duncan a C) as well as the best “perimeter defender” for a big man that I’ve ever seen. Like pancakes said before McAdoo is a very good shooter. I suspect his role will likely be to space the floor for Moses. We feel that the opponent will have a tough time even getting the ball into Moses but when he does Mutombo is as good as anyone and will limit him as best he can. Moses is a great player and a force on the offensive glass, there will be no stopping him completely but as long as he shoots below his usual FG% and can’t dominant this series we should be fine. Our interior defense should see to that.

We will wreak havoc in the passing lanes, our lockdown defensive line-up of Deke/KG/AK47/West/DJ is just devastating, no pass is safe, every shot is contested (or blocked). AK’s weak side shot blocking and huge wing span allowing him to play the passing lanes at the SF spot, and combined with the tremendous man defense and help defense from the guards and big men we feel that this unit is one of the best defensive units in the game. DJ is a top 3 or 4 defender at his position, and West is arguably the best defensive guard in the history of the league.

Offense
+ Elite Passing
+ Shooting (Mid Range/3 Point)
+ Efficiency
+ Balance
+ Bench (Bellamy/Ginobli)
+ Closer (West)

We will run the offense through West obviously, I don’t know who they can put on him but either way he is going to dominant this series. My opponent has very poor perimeter defenders and my wing offense is a huge part of my offense. West averaged 40ppg (on TS% .581, and %50 FG efficiently in the reg. season) in the playoffs in my chosen season and will average more in this one. There is no one who can stop him and no shot blocking to intimidate him, he will do whatever he wants.

Ellis is a similar player to Reggie actually, both are basically pure scorers. In chosen years, Reggie has a %52 FG while Ellis has a %50 FG, however Reggie shot %41 from 3 on 4.4 3PA while Ellis shot %48 from 3 on 4.1. Reggie scored 24.6 ppg while Ellis scored 27.5. So basically while both are similar Ellis is a better scorer and more efficient from 3, while Reggie has a better %FG, but at 2% it’s pretty negligible. Anyways Ellis is my second creator on the wings and will see a lot off open looks from West and KG, both elite scorers who are maybe the best passers at their positions, ever.

DJ isn’t too shabby either, his role is to penetrate, fill the lanes, and distribute a bit. Most of the playmaking duties will be on West and KG leaving DJ to attack the basket and hit that mid range shot he was so good at.

KG will dominant McAdoo simple as that, pancakes3 tried to argue McAdoo defensively is comparable to KG. Bastillon crushed his argument. Just our luck that we have KG and McAdoo facing off. Here was the argument.

pancakes3 wrote:McAdoo has a reputation for being one of the greatest shooters ever, but his stats show that early in his career, his athleticism allowed him to be a dynamo on the court. At Buffalo his rebounds and blocks though inflated, still adjust to be 13.7/2.8. Those are Garnett-esque numbers would be more fitting. It's not exactly blasphemous to compare young McAdoo with Garnett either. Garnett's twolves peaked at 6th in defense in the magical 04 season, but for the most part they were middling defensive teams at best. McAdoo's talent in Buffalo was abysmal (no real PF/C to pair up with Bob) and they still managed to stick around 9th out of 18 in the league defensively (4th offensively).

bastillon wrote:your points are valid pancakes though comparing McAdoo to Garnett is a ridiculous reach.

KG anchored the best defense ever (or one of the best) when he had competent teammates around him. during the TWolves days his partners were some of the worst defenders in the league - Hudson, Peeler, Szczerbiak... without him they were the worst defensive team in the league by far (statistically proven by on/off). really there wasn't anything that he could do there and actually he had (by FAR) the highest defensive +/- of the 03 on period, way higher than Duncan for example. that's saying a lot. I suppose McAdoo was a fine defender in his own right, but his impact is nowhere close to defensive dominance that Garnett presented during his career.

to support that notion - look at all-defense selections.

Garnett has been an all-defensive first teamer this entire decade with the exception of 06 and 07 where he was 2nd teamer. obviously KG was better defender than 2nd team anyway, but when you're playing with bunch of retards who are widely considered as cancers and are known for their terrible defense, your team D is gonna suffer and thus you won't get much recognition from the media. it's still impressive that he was able to make first teams so many times with such terrible teammates defensively.

DPOTY votings confirm that:

Code: Select all

year     DPOTY rank
 98         11th
 99          7th
 00          7th
 01          2nd
 02          2nd
 03          3rd
 04          6th
 05          9th
 06         13th
 07         13th
 08          1st
 09          8th

you can see that Garnett has always been considered one of the league's premier defenders. I'd still say he was disrespected here because his numbers aren't as flashy as some of the other defenders and he had to play with some terrible teammates, and in the small market as well. no wonder why he didn't get much recognition defensively. once he was traded to Boston, he was widely acknowledged as the best defender in the game (08 DPOTY voting was a total blowout), despite being past prime. people finally could see what KG is capable of when his teammates are competent. not only that he was dominant, he made everyone around him better defensively and all of a sudden guys like Pierce or Rondo became "very good" to borderline "great" instead of "solid/good" and Allen became "good" whereas he had been a liability defensively before (and he was past prime, too).

KG is flat out dominant defender.

now look at McAdoo - in his entire career he didn't manage to make one defensive team either first or second. he wasn't considered as a great defender, period. you can't simply look at extremely inflated boxscore stats and by that false impression assume that he was equal to KG defensively, that's not how it works. essentially nobody considered him as premier defender in the league and his boxscore stats aren't really amazing anyway (after adjusting for pace).

come on now, Garnett was worlds away as a defender.

pancakes3 wrote:i wrote the KG comparison a little tongue in cheek but the idea was that young McAdoo put up silly stats on a crap squad the same as Garnett. HIs board/block numbers PRE-pace adjust are 15.1/3.1, and POST pace adjust it's 12.7/2.8. That's why i said his numbers were comparable to KG's.

I wouldn't say KG was a flat out dominant defender either. Ben Wallace, Mutombo, Russell - they're flat out dominant defenders. KG was merely a VERY GOOD defender. Honestly, as a defender I don't think he's much more imposing than Camby.

I do think KG is a better defender than McAdoo. For sure. Superficially the all-d nods and the DPOY can attest to that. However, I think McAdoo's turbulent career coupled with his career coinciding with Nate Thurmond and KAJ explain the lack of all-d nods.

Anyway, the point is that McAdoo might not have been a transcendently good defensive player but he was certainly an elite player. THere are plenty of PFs in the game who aren't renown for their defense and yet were still able to play rather good D. Currently Gasol comes to mind. Webber is another. Neither are the same caliber of defender that KG is but neither are crippling bad either.

I was just getting a bit overdefensive from warspite's callout. He made it sound like my team was soft. I was just stepping up to bat for my imaginary players.

bastillon wrote:even if we go by his outlier season '74 during which he avged 3.1 BPG (never reached 2.2 after that) and adjust his numbers by per40 and to Wolves 04 pace he posted such a statline (added KG and non-outlier McAdoo for comparison):

Code: Select all

             PPG   RPG   APG   SPG   BPG   TS%
KG     '04  24.6  14.1   5.1   1.5   2.2  54.7
McAdoo '74  22.7  11.2   1.7   0.9   2.5  59.4
McAdoo '75  26.4  10.8   1.7   0.8   1.7  56.9

your pace-adjustments are simply wrong. to ilustrate what pace we're talking about:
Wolves 04 played with 89 poss/game.
D'Antoni's Suns played at about 95-100 poss/game.
McAdoo's Buffalo played at 111.6 poss/game in '74 and 107.7 in '75.

That saved me a lot of time. Luckily I have a dominant defender in Mutombo to cover up the mistakes of the merely "very good" defender in KG (sarcasm, can't be to sure so I should mention that I think KG is on par with Duncan defensively). A shame I didn't draft Camby. Lets move on.

Moses Malone at his peak was a good defender, not great in an ATL context, but very good and certainly enough to contain Mutombo. Mutombo is our Super Perkins so to speak; he will concentrate on keeping Moses off the glass, and will keep his points when he is left open when whoever is guarding needs to help. He is a role player on offense, he will get his points off of put-backs not set plays.

Bench
Ginobli is our 6th man and he will be playing big minutes, his playmaking, and good all-around game will fit nicely beside either DJ or West. As a prerequisite he is of course a good 3 point shooter. Bellamy is our post presence off the bench, he gives us significant low post scoring and rebounding, in a one year peak Bellamy is quite the player, 31.6/19 and a league leading 52% FG which was fantastic back then, consider the quality of centers around in the 60’s. AK is a great defender even in an ATL context; he is the perfect contrast to Ellis. Grant is the perfect role player, he isn’t playing huge minutes behind KG but his effect will be felt when he’s on the floor.

Conclusion
Rebounding is where we’d give an advantage to our opponent, mostly because of Baylor. Other than that though I’m not sure where he has me beat, pace adjusted we have better rebounding in the frontcourt and backcourt, but Baylor owns Ellis in this department. However we have better rebounders off the bench particularly with Bellamy but still a slight advantage to pancakes3. Baylor’s poor FG% (%43 FG), ridicules FGA (29.7 FGA!), poor defense (remember this is an ATL), and poor passing will work in our favour, particularly with the lack of playmaking around him. Reggie Miller isn’t *cough* Jerry West, he isn’t in the same universe as a play-maker and Williams is going to have a hard time not getting stripped with West breathing down his neck everywhere he goes. Simply put we feel that we have too many significant advantages in this series to lose it.

My 1st round roster:

PG - 6-1, 170 John Stockton
1991/92 season: 15,8 PPG on .482/.407/.782 shooting/3,3 RPG/13,7 APG /3,0 SPG/0,3 BPG.
All-NBA Second Team, All-Defensive Second Team, NBA All-Star.

SG - 6-3, 185 Alvin Robertson
1985/86 season: 17,0 PPG on .514/.276/.795 shooting/6,3 RPG/5,5 APG /3,7 SPG/0,5 BPG.
All-Defensive Second Team, Most Improved Player, Defensive Player of the Year, NBA All-Star.

SF - 6-7, 210 Billy "The Kangaroo Kid" Cunningham
1968/69 season: 24,8 PPG on .426/.737 shooting/12,8 RPG/3,5 APG.
All-NBA First Team, NBA All-Star, 3rd in season MVP voting.

PF - 6-11-7-0, 260 Tim Duncan
2002/03 season: 23,3 PPG on .513/.273/.710 shooting/12,9 RPG/3,9 APG /0,7 SPG/2,9 BPG.
All-NBA First Team, All-Defensive First Team, NBA All-Star, season MVP, Finals MVP, NBA champion.

C - 7-3, 265 Artis Gilmore
1974/75 season: 23,6 PPG on .580/.696 shooting/16,2 RPG/2,5 APG /0,8 SPG/3,1 BPG.
All-ABA First Team, ABA All-Defensive First Team, ABA All-Star, playoffs MVP, ABA champion.


Bench:

PG - 6-2, 180 Tony Parker
2006/07 season: 18,6 PPG on .520/.395/.783 shooting/3,2 RPG/5,5 APG /1,1 SPG/0,1 BPG.
NBA All-Star, Finals MVP, NBA champion.

SG - 6-3, 175 Hal Greer
1967/68 season: 24,1 PPG on .478/.769 shooting/5,4 RPG/4,5 APG.
All-NBA Second Team, NBA All-Star, All-Star Game MVP.

SF - 6-8, 228 Glen Rice
1996/97 season: 26,8 PPG on .477/.470/.867 shooting/4,0 RPG/2,0 APG /0,9 SPG/0,3 BPG.
All-NBA Second Team, NBA All-Star, All-Star Game MVP.

PF - 6-10, 215 Maurice Lucas
1977/78 season: 16,4 PPG on .458/.767 shooting/9,1 RPG/2,5 APG/0,8 SPG/0,9 BPG.
All-NBA Second Team, All-Defensive First Team, NBA All-Star.

C - 6-10, 220 Mel Daniels
1970/71 season: 21,0 PPG on .514/.679 shooting/18,0 RPG/2,2 APG.
All-ABA First Team, season MVP, ABA All-Star, All-Star Game MVP.


First round matchup against Bruh Man:


Rotations

PG – Stockton 25 mpg/Tony Parker 23 mpg vs. O. Robertson/B. Roy
SG – A. Robertson 25 mpg/H. Greer 23 mpg vs. Gervin/Battier
SF – B. Cunningham 25 mpg/G. Rice 23 mpg vs. Nique/Carmelo
PF – T. Duncan 32 mpg/M. Lucas 16 mpg vs. K. Malone/Brand
C – Gilmore 36 mpg/Mel Daniels 12 mpg vs. B. Wallace/Yao



General remarks

I’m very glad to participate in the All-Time League again. My team is based on dominant 2-way bigmen, great defense, unselfish play and winning pedigree – I’m going to show how these advantages shall always triumph misfit collection of offense-oriented chucking jumpshooters.
At first, I would like to wish good luck to my opponent, Bruh Man. He’s gonna need that since – while he gathered an impressive amount of talent, it’s apparent he’s a rookie in all-time competitions and as such committed some typical rookie mistakes.

The first and most serious is collecting too many dominant scorers, which will be fighting each other for shots, struggling to reach 3/4 or even 2/3 of their normal attempts. FOUR about 30-ppg guys in the starting lineup? It’s not gonna cut it, even if we played in the 60s pace – and we won’t, considering we adopted current rules and connected slower, more deliberate and defense-oriented style of play. Counting only 4 starters, in the years adopted by Bruh Oscar averaged 22 FGA, Iceman – 19,6, Nique - 24,3, while Mailman - 19,2, so total 85,1 FGA. Last year the most chucking WHOLE team of 15 players (Knicks) averaged roughly the same - 86,5 FGA! You do the math. Of course I realize in extra-talented all-time leagues there always must be both some cuts in shot attempts and faster pace than in your average squad, but this time the difference is much too large to treat seriously in real game theoretically uber-great firepower of Bruh’s team. While potential for ego clashes of all these alpha scorers is extremely dangerous for team chemistry...
Drafting offensive non-entity in Big Ben improved situation a bit, but not so much, especially considering that Mailman isn’t Shaq as to back-to-basket game; he loved his jumpshot too much. So with him we have 4 30-ppg guys with similar instead of contrasting and complementing styles of getting points – midrange/penetration (of course Gervin and Nique are most similar to each other, near mirror images) - and none of them even has 3-point range to allow at least decent spacing!

While we’re at it, my opponent doesn’t have ANY 3-point threat in his starting lineup (I include potential threats since guys like West or Lou Hudson by all accounts would be great marksmen today – but Big O certainly doesn’t belong to this group). Nilch. Zero. Nada. I don’t think there was any team playing within current rules which managed to win the chip despite such a fatal flaw. There is some help on the bench, with perimeter backups averaging .354-.377 from 3-point line. But none of them is really comparable to my Glen Rice either in accuracy, 3P FGA/FGM numbers or clutchness…

Third flaw of Bruh’s team is not sufficient defense. In this aspect our squads are almost polar opposites of each other. In his starting lineup there is only 1 DPOY-level player in Big Ben (though how many DPOYs he’d win in the 90s? Probably none.) and one All-Defensive level player in Malone (though his defense was always a tad overrated). In mine there are 3 DPOY-level guys in TD, Gilmore and Alvin plus All-Defense Stockton, only Cunningham is below this level, even though by all accounts he was a good forward defender. Bruh’s bench is defensively better than the starting lineup, but still – Roy is better vs. SGs, not PGs, while Battier – SFs, not SGs (see below on them playing out of positions). Melo? Nothing special here. Brand’s forte is shotblocking and rebounding, but not man-to-man defense. With Yao, frankly speaking his best defensive attribute is the sheer size – fortunately, my Two Towers are the least likely combo in this league to be intimidated by this.
Please also bear in mind that unlike dominant scorers, who detract from each other due to limited amount of possible shots, dominant defenders actually enhance each other’s performance. It’s much easier for e.g. Alvin to keep a close assignment on the guy knowing that there’s Stock around ready to cut passing lanes and under the basket there are two 7-footers waiting to block every closer shot (while where’s Bruh’s long-range shooting?) and collect rebound afterwards. Superior help defense, doubling, trapping – I’ve got it all. So the final advantage of my defense over Bruh’s defense should be even more impressive than it would look like from simple comparison of defensive awards: while not only Big Ben, but even Russell wouldn’t suffice alone to lead a team of weak defenders to the ring, especially in All-Time League!

Fourth mistake is playing guys out of positions that they actually played at and at positions they’d be substantially worse. Brandon Roy’s a very good combo guard, but not a real PG. If he were one, Blazers staff – who knows his strengths and weaknesses better than anyone – would simply put him there and start Rudy Fernandez at 2 instead of continuing ongoing quest to find answer at 1, which recently led PTB to overpaying aging Andre Miller. I also question Roy’s ability to cover Parker-like quick guards – in Portland it’s rather Blake’s job, even though Blake isn’t a speed demon himself. Similarly, Battier is classic SF, but if you wanna him switch positions, he’s rather SF/PF than SF/SG. That’s why Rockets started firstly Artest and now Ariza at 2, even though these two are traditional SFs themselves. Will Shane be able to chase effectively small, quick combo guards in Greer and Alvin? It remains doubtful.


Guard matchups

Oscar and Gervin are bigger and superiors scorers/rebounders, no questions asked. As to scoring, I’ve already mentioned it’s less impressive than at first sight due to limited numbers of FGA available and lack of 3P range. One may mention here that Big O wasn’t very kind to players who might threaten him as first scoring option (see: Lucas, Jerry) and it changed only when diminishing skills and lack of winning led him to playing 2nd fiddle to Kareem – remains to be seen how PRIME Oscar would coexist not with one, but three comparable scorers! As to rebounding, bigmen are far more important anyway since they affect more overall team rebounding and I have advantage there. While my combo will not have problems with FGA. It’s a plus of clearly defined roles, with Stockton – obviously in addition to being ultimate unselfish playmaker – being team’s 4th offensive option (though his dagger 3s are always dangerous), while Robertson – dedicated defensive stopper and 5th option and them both not taking away shots from my ultra-efficient bigs. Stock and especially Alvin are obviously better defenders and ballhawks (both led the league in steals in the selected years). As a combo, they are also superior ballhandlers/playmakers: Gervin was a big SG who started his career at SF and never could play the point, lacking both PG skills and willingness to pass, while Alvin was switching between 1 and 2, and as such is fully able to initiate the offense.
In this round I am going to play my perimeter backups for maximum allowed, so 23 mpg, for certain reasons. They do not give up much talent to my starters overall anyway (especially Greer was an unbelievable steal: guy chosen Top-50 player ever whose game would translate well today fell to freakin’ 9th round?!). It would accentuate my advantage in 3P shooting. It would help me with possible foul trouble while my guys are guarding dominant scorers. And also specifically: Tony Parker is more aggressive scorer than Stock, whose unbelievable quickness (though young Stock’s speed is underrated) and penetration skills are going to put his defenders in foul trouble very fast – especially when his rich playoff experience (2 rings, Finals MVP and 100 playoff games under his belt at the tender age of 25!) clashes with Roy’s 0 playoff experience (2009 was his debut). While Greer knows how to play Oscar despite talent and size difference, guarding him many times and in 1962 (so pre-Wilt) leading Nationals to elimination game against comparably or even more talented Royals, while with Wilt it was a slaughter: 3-1 both in 1965 and 1967. You’re telling me Greer had then too much bigman help over his rival to draw any conclusions? Well, he enjoys it again!
Offense/defense overall: I am going to double Oscar often and take the ball off his hands: none other Bruh’s starter can really create for others and the bench is lacking real PG, so this strategy should be very successful. Especially Greer, who knows Big O’s style, will be valuable in help defense against him.
I don’t know Bruh’s assignments on my guys yet, but anyway my defense is certainly going to limit more his offense than the other way around. However, net scoring result should still remain in his favor, but only slightly and for a price of taking clearly higher number of shots, and thus taking them away from the more efficient bigs (well, except Big Ben who’s inefficient anyway ). So at G there’s at most slight advantage of Bruh’s squad.


Forward matchups

See above as to borderline impossible successful coexistence of 2 30-ppg scorers, this time at forward positions. The Mailman was dominant scorer in his personality and style of play (obviously except his final ring-chasing season), so dominant that after him coming to the Jazz their ownership quickly gave up another alpha scorer in Dantley for far less talented-yet-better fit in spot-up shooter Kelly Tripucka, and never tried to pair Karl with another dominant wing again. Put Wilkins in place of Dantley – why result should be different? While in my team Cunningham has experience of playing with dominant big (Wilt) and generally with teammates scoring more than him (he willingly came off the bench for arguably GOAT 1967 Sixers squad), so there won’t be any problem with coexisting with Duncan (who needs fewer shots than Karl anyway).
I admit that Nique trumps Billy in athleticism (though guy with nickname “The Kangaroo Kid” will be no slouch also today!), but since Wilkins is nothing special as a defender, he will not utilize this advantage in full. To put it simply, both guys are gonna get their points and boards (and don’t be surprised if with fewer FGA available than usually and TD/Gilmore/Daniels protecting the basket Nique scores no more than Cunningham!). Yet the most important matchup of the whole series is Duncan – now universally recognized as GOAT PF ever – vs. Malone, who had enjoyed the same reputation before TD dethroned him. The history is on Tim’s side here: career-wise against the Mailman he registered 18 regular-season wins with 25,2 PPG on .528 shooting/11,3 RPG/3 APG/2,7 BPG vs. Malone’s mere 7 wins and 20,7 PPG on .429 shooting/9,9 RPG/4 APG/0,8 BPG. But since it’s unfair to count Karl’s last seasons, let’s mention most comparable periods – when Duncan wasn’t a rookie anymore, while Malone still remained one of 2-4 top PFs and All-NBA Teamer. Since 1998 until 2001 Duncan achieved 7-3 advantage in wins, with the following advantage in numbers:
Duncan – 28,3 PPG on .542 shooting/10,7 RPG/2,3 APG/2,7 BPG
Malone - 22,2 PPG on .428 shooting/10,7 RPG/4 APG/1,3 BPG.
(During this period they didn’t meet in playoffs, but in 1999 Jazz lost to Blazers 2-4 with Rasheed frustrating Karl as hell, while Portland was swept in next round by Duncan’s Spurs). TD is still clearly more productive, despite playing next to D-Rob, who achieved more shots, blocks or rebounds than Ostertags of this world being Malone’s frontcourt partners. Or perhaps someone wanna play this angle that playing next to Admiral, who often took tougher defensive assignment, actually helped Duncan’s production? While it is debatable, we really don’t have to debate this since admitting such argument also works in my favour – from the reason mentioned in paragraph on centers matchup.
As to backups, don’t let the sheer numbers fool you. In 1977/78 Maurice Lucas didn’t register 20/10 production (as opposed to the season before and the season after), but still was the same player who led the 1977 champs Trail Blazers in scoring, minutes played, field goals, free throws, and offensive rebounds. He achieved lesser numbers due to getting fewer MPG in extremely balanced Portland team – and of course due to playing next to Walton in his career/MVP-winning season. But the voters knew better and despite not so outstanding numbers voted Maurice to All-NBA 2nd Team and All-Defensive 1st Team – it is IMHO more impressive than Brand’s 2006 >20/10 season, when he lead weak Clips to 2nd round in his SOLE playoff performance – also not having an occasion to learn how to play next to superior stars (what is a prerequisite in all-time league), completely unlike Maurice.
Carmelo - Glen Rice; between these 2 offense-oriented forwards, the former is a better 1st option, while the latter – a better complementary star (like he was in the 2000 championship Lakers). Guess who’s more perfect fit in their current backup role?
Advantage at F: my team, though Bruh also got great guys.


Centers matchup

Big Ben is a great defensive star, but in this matchup’s bigmen pecking order it goes like Duncan>Malone/Gilmore>Daniels>Big Ben, so my guys are clearly dominating. Wallace couldn’t cover effectively bigger and better TD during 2005 Finals nor would be able to contain even bigger and stronger Gilmore. Anyway, he is much better help defender than man-to-man defender; that’s why even aging, razor-thin Cliff Robinson used to take tougher bigmen defensive assignment instead of Ben; when Cliff was replaced by soft Okur, Pistons’ play suffered – they reached championship level only after midseason trade when Rasheed took a role of primary man-to-man defender. In Bruh’s team Ben must try to be do-it-all defensive anchor against bigger and better guys (not to mention stopping Parker’s or Cunningham’s penetrations) – so it’s safe to say it’s too demanding of a task even for this ultimate hustle player. While his offense leaves so much to be desired (hey, even Rodman was clearly better scorer, despite chasing boards instead of anything else in 2nd stage of his career), also as to FTs, that he can be left alone in favour of doubling the Mailman. Malone doubled by 2 superior defenders bigger than him, even better than his real nemesis in TD-Admiral duo – isn’t it a recipe for disaster for my opponents?
As to reserves, who’s better to back up the best all-time ABA center than the second-best one? Yao is larger, while Mel Daniels – simply greater. Penbeast, who saw both guys live, likened Mel to Mourning – both were a tad undersized, but strong, unselfish, great defensive centers. And I bet majority of RealGMers would prefer building around Zo instead of Yao. Daniels co-led Pacers to ABA championship (Roger Brown became playoffs MVP, but just like with KG-Pierce, it can be argued that big guy was more important in the whole playoff run) and has 3 championship rings combined. Ming never played even in conference finals, let alone league finals. In addition to being injury-prone, he’s also prone to intimidation from stronger and tougher players (that’s why Rockets always wanted to put bruiser PF next to Yao to protect him). Now he’s got BOTH ultra-tough/better Gilmore and Daniels as opponents. I reckon it’s completely certain that they’re gonna hurt him more than the other way around...
Advantage at C: my team, no questions asked. Hey, even unguarded Ben Wallace is gonna get fewer points than GUARDED Gilmore!


Intangibles and conclusion

My team has clear advantages in man-to-man defense, shotblocking, stealing the ball, 3P-shooting, rebounding (e.g. Gilmore – the best ABA rebounder ever) and ball movement. Also intangibles go in my favour: starting from much superior playoff/championship experience (for instance, Bruh doesn’t have even 1 Finals MVP, even if we count non-selected years) through team chemistry/cohesiveness to extremely efficient, leading by example Duncan’s leadership as opposed to Oscar’s me-first leadership, stifling other stars around him. As a result, it’s safe to say: Myth’s team in 5!

Dallas vs Miller4ever

Lineups:
Robinson 1991-1992(35)/Robinson 1992-1993(13)
Nowitzki 2006-2007(35)/Haywood1969-1970(13)
Dandridge 1978-1979(30)/Debusschere 1973-74(18)
Drexler 1988-1989(35)/Dantley1983-1984(13)
Cousy 1959-1960(30)/Maravich 1976-1977(18)

VS

Jason Kidd('98-'99)/Don Buse('75-'76)
Tracy McGrady('02-'03)/Dan Majerle('92-'93)
Paul Pressey('84-'85)/Alex English('81-'82)
Nate Thurmond('67-'68)/Dan Roundfield('80-'81)
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar('75-'76)/Sam Lacey('74-'75)

Roster Info: viewtopic.php?f=340&t=981742

Writeup

Offense:
+ Scoring
+ Passing
+ Versatility
+ Slashers(Dantley, Drexler, Dandridge)
+ Athleticism(Drexler, DRob)

We will run the offense through Drexler and Nowitzki both of whom are pretty good offensive players. One of the two should have an awesome game against the opponent. Both can create their own offense no matter who's put on them. Especially Nowitzki who is one of the top offensive talents to ever play basketball. His versatility is what leads me to believe he can come out on top in a matchup against either Thurmond or Roundfield. He can take them outside for a jumper which is one of the reasons that i believe will make it hard for Thurmond to stop him, take them to the rack, or just post them up. While Drexler's jumper may not have been that well from long range who was still able to knock it down at most times and be effective. His athleticism is really what made him great then he had to change his game a bit and start working on his post game but early in his career his athleticism is what allowed him to do so many great things.

Cousy is who will run this great offense his playmaking, and scoring ability are what will help this team the most. You can't just abandon him you need to stick on him and hope he doesn't get you at some point during the possesion with a good pass or scoring a bucket.

Robinson will most likely get his touches in the paint and whenver he gets doubled team Nowitzki will just stroke that jumper. Which is one facet of our offense that will make it hard to stop.

Dandridge while not known that much offensively is no slacker himself he can help spread the floor for Dirk, and give the rest of the players somebody who can knockdown a mid range shot or take it to the basket and score it over the big man.

Defense:

+ Length (Robinson, Haywood, Drexler)
+ Versatility(Drexler, Drob, Dandridge, Dantley)
+ Debusschere(6 Time all Defense 1st team)
+ Robinson (1991-1992 DPOY)
+ Haywood as an energy big off the bench(30ppg, 19.5 rpg his rookie season)

We will play Man to Man then run a 2-3 zone at times when necessary. I have people on my team who can stop McGrady and his offensive prowess. Debusschere a six time 1st all NBA Defensive player is one of the few who can hold him down. Cousy and Maravich will likely have trouble on Kidd but they stand a chance if they play it right and don't make any mistakes and go around the picks, to let him take a jumper rather then let him take it to the basket and create stuff for his team mates.

Paul Pressey is someone Dandridge is capable of stopping. Nowitzki might have hard time holding down Thurmond but Haywood can help him out and hold it down while Nowitzki rests or as well as Robinson who was a better than average defender.

Our center David Robinson is known as one of the best defensive centers of all time. He'd have a pretty good chance in a matchup against Kareem. His length and athleticism can help make one of the most unstoppable shots of all time be pretty hard to make.

Bench
Our bench should be one of the tops in the division. I have three Hall of Famers coming off the bench in Maravich, Debusschere, and Dantley. Maravich provides some scoring punch, and creating for other players. Debusschere provides great defense to our bench he is one of the ebst defenders to ever play he played tough, and hard any time he touched the floor. Dantley is one of my favorite players of all time i loved his aggressiveness he had every game always willing to take it to the rack. Which was partly the reason to him averaging nearly 12 Free Throws per game. Robinson and Haywood are gonna be my bigs off the bench. Robinson was a sixth man of the year award winner he could stretch the floor and play good defense on other players. Haywood was a beast, he went after the ball like there was no tomorrow. He got most of his points off of offensive rebounds, and working hard to get the ball in the post.

Team Cellardoor:
Just getting my tentative rotations out here for Snake. The years I selected are on my roster page found here:
Aguirre might be changed, but otherwise the years should remain consistent.

Payton(38)/Kirk(10)
Carter(32)/Bowen(16)
Bird(38)/Hawkins(10)
Hawkins(15)/Williams(33)
Lanier(36)/Sabonis(12)

Aguirre is, at the moment, a situational player.

My opponent:
Wilkins/KJ
Kobe/Jones
Mullin/E. Jones
McHale/Willis
Walton/Laimbeer

Good luck to my opponent, Snakebites.
Backcourt: With Payton and VC I possess two guys with extreme physical advantages at their position. For Payton, it’s his size. For VC, it’s his size and alien athleticism. Unfortunately, my opponent has another big, hyperathletic SG to combat him with in Kobe Bryant. We feel like Payton holds a HUGE edge over Wilkens and KJ though. Neither have the size to even slow him down. VC is every bit the scorer this flavor of Kobe is with all the range too, so Kobe’s going to have a tough time helping off him and a tough time stopping him as well. Defensively we’re going to see my guards switch their assignments. Payton will take Kobe and VC will be on Wilkens. Payton guarded MJ and the 72 win Bulls and did a very nice job, not allowing Jordan to shoot over 50% in any game. This version of Kobe also doesn’t have a post game nearly as refined as what we’ve seen in recent years. I feel like Kobe will be held below his season averages: something like 25 points on 43% from the field. Wilkens and KJ are both non-factors from range, so VC will be playing a lot of help D and recovering to use his size to bother their shots/drives to the basket.

Frontcourt: Our frontcourts hold the two best players in the series: Bird and Walton. Both of them Finals MVPs with marvelous Playoffs and MVPs in the regular season. The problem is, Bird is being guarded by tissue paper in Chris Mullin while Walton, a lesser scorer to begin with is being guarded by Lanier. Sandwiched in between is a match-up of the technically sound, hyper efficient McHale and the motivated athletic monster Connie Hawkins. Offensively we expect Bird to have little problem scoring on Mullin (or Kobe). The focus of our offense is going to be Bird and Payton posting, so we’ll be inverting our offense with Lanier hitting his spots for jumpers, Hawkins cutting, and VC spotting up or cutting. Lanier will get a fair amount of touches working against Walton with Bird spotting up and VC cutting. Lanier is regarded as one of the better passing bigs in the NBA, so there’s no doubt he can find VC. Hawkins will primarily be a finisher, but when McHale is out of the game he’ll use his speed to get around Willis and finish strong. Defensively we’ll again see switches. McHale will be checked by Bird while Hawkins covers Mullin. We’re confident that Larry, who was selected to the All Defensive team, has both the knowledge of McHale’s game and the discipline to stay with his terrific footwork and upfakes. Frankly I’d rather McHale beat me than Kobe and Walton as I’m not impressed with the competition Kevin faced while putting up those numbers. There were no other PFs selected to defensive teams that year and no PF defenders of note in the NBA other than Sampson. Mullin’s mid/long range game will be bothered by Hawkins length, and I don’t expect him to get many ISO opportunities. This leaves Lanier on Walton. These two must have faced each other so much, I wish we had game logs. I will point out that Walton never once scored 20 a game in a season. We’ll be playing him straight up with a terrific defensive C and force him to beat us.

Keys to victory: Not letting Kobe beat us, have too many offensive options to stop, take advantage of defensive mismatches (Mullin, Wilkens), rebound the ball (advantages at PG, SF, PF with close battles at SG and a close losing battle at C)

SamBone vs. bastillon

The Boned Samuels

PG- 2006 Steve Nash
18.6 ppg, 11.6 asst, 3.5 reb, .532 FG%, .455 3pt%, .921 FT%
MVP, 1st team All NBA, All Star

SG- 1996 Michael Jordan
30.4 ppg, 6.6 reb, 4.3 asst, 2.2 steals, .495 FG%, .427 3pt%, .834 FT%
MVP, Finals MVP, All Star MVP, 1st team All Defensive, 1st team All NBA, All Star, Scoring Leader

SF- 1988 James Worthy
19.7 ppg, 5 reb, 3.9 asst, 1 steal, .531 FG%, .796 FT%
Finals MVP, All Star

PF- 1962 Bob Pettit (even though he won a few MVP's I thought this was his best season)
31.1 ppg, 18.7 reb, 3.7 asst, .45 FG%, .771 FT%
1st team All-NBA, All Star, All Star MVP

C- 1979 Robert Parish
17.2 ppg, 12.1 reb, 1.3 steals, 2.9 blocks, .499 FG%

BENCH
F- 2006 Shawn Marion
21.8 ppg, 11.8 reb, 1.8 asst, 1.7 blocks, 2 steals, .525 FG%, .331 3pt%, .809 FT%
All Star, All NBA (3rd team)

PF/C - 1994 Charles Oakley
11.8 ppg, 11.8 reb, 2.7 asst, 1.3 steals, .478 FG%, .776 FT%
1st team All Defensive, All Star

C/PF - 2007 Marcus Camby
11.2 ppg, 11.7 reb, 3.3 blocks 3.2 asst, 1.2 steals, .473 FG%, .729 FT%
Defensive Player of the Year, 1st team All Defensive, league leader in blocks

PG - 1974 Norm Van Lier
14.3 ppg, 6.9 assts, 4.7 reb, 2 steals, .406 FG%, .778 FT%
1st team All Defensive, 2nd team All NBA, All Star

SG - 1982 Andrew Toney
(dispite having 2 straight AS seasons after this year, this year he was a bench guy and I think it fits what I will need from him the best)
16.5 ppg, 1.7 reb, 3.7 assts, .8 steals, .522 FG%, .424 3pt%, .842 FT%
was ranked 2nd in the NBA in 3pt%, ranked 9th in NBA in 3 pointers made[/quote]

ROTATION
PG – NASH ( 33 ), VAN LIER ( 15 )
SG - JORDAN ( 38 ), TONEY ( 10)
SF - WORTHY ( 30 ), MARION ( 18 )
PF - PETTIT ( 30 ), OAKLEY ( 18 )
C - PARISH ( 30 ), CAMBY ( 18 )
vs.

bastillon wrote:PG - Magic (38), Baron Davis (10)
SG - Jerry Sloan (36), David Thompson (12)
SF - Pippen (40), Chet Walker (8)
PF - Cowens (20), Kemp (28)
C - Dwight (35), Sampson (13)

my opponent wants to run which is no problem from me. That playes into my advandge and exactly what my team was ment to do

Defensively
basically we will have ttle on D to eliminate mismatches
-MJ will be on Magic and should do a nice job limiting Magic’s offense and playmaking. MJ was a unbelievable defender his entire career (including DPOY). This is a fun battle of 2 great players and winner. But I believe MJ’s man on man defense will really cause Magic to struggle.

Also the minutes Marion is on the court he will most likly be defending Magic

-Nash will need to guard Sloan which I do not see as an issue at all. Sloan was never really an offensive threat and while shooting 41% in this “peak year” we do not fear this matchup at all. This matchup will allow us to play our weakest defender max minutes because he can not be exploited here.

-Worthy on pippen will be a great matchup. Both players got their superstar name playing next to GOAT players. This “peak” season was played without MJ when Scottie was the teams #1 option and he only scored 22 ppg and shot 49% from the field (on 18 shots per game (66% from the line ouch). Worthy could hold his own on defense and this matchup should be a non issue as well. Both players in my matchup matchup well and equal eachother out.

- Pettit on Cowens would matchup perfect (with Pettit scoring more) so this matchup will again be a non issue . With Kemp getting the bulk of the minutes in this matchup(against the rules of the game!) we adjusted our roation to get BIG OAK a few more minutes. Without knwing the “peak” year for kemp we are not sure if this was pre or post his “Pillsbury Dough Boy” run, but we assume pre! Kemp was a beast but against Oakley he will not be able to push people around.

- Parish/Camby will have the fun of guarding D12. My opponent seems to think this is a pushover battle and I strongley disagree. Dwight as physically stronge and impressive as he is, still has never built an offensive game. Parish has battled BEAST centers his entire life and this matchup will be no different. And considering Dwight is a WOLT free throw shooter (59% at his peak) If we are incorrect and our BIGS struggle, we will simply hack a Dwight.


Offensively

- Nash will be guarded by Sloan. As good as a career defender as Sloan was, he has NEVER been forced to guard a, to quote my opponent “devastating weapon”. And if they truly plan on switching a lot, this only will help Nash’s teammates.

-so MJ will be guarded by Robin. No surprise here again, but nobody has been able to guard MJ one on one and it defiantly will not happen here. I really do not need to go on about what this truly GREATEST OF ALL TIME player can do and will do in this matchup. I really look forward to my opponent switching to guard Nash’s shooting and leave Sloan to matchup against MJ.

-Worthy will be guarded by Magic which should be interesting. We knew magic often guarded bigger player but were shocked at this matchup. James is one of the most clutch players of all time and his numbers only got better the bigger the games got. He was an extremely effective offensive player .

-Pettit will be matched up with Cowens which should be a pretty even matchup. I would say Pettit’s shooting would be effective in this matchup. When Oakley is in the game against Kemp he will basically be used setting devastating screens and crashing the offensive boards (ranked 3rd in NBA in this season)

-Parish/Camby will be guarding by D12. Dwight should limit both of these guys, but neither will really be looked at to do much other then running the floor which both do well (as does Dwight) and crashing the offensive glass

Tall Firs

Starters:
G/F: Michael Cooper (1986-87)
10.5/3.1/4.5, .438/.385/.851, DPOY

G/F: John Havlicek (1971-72)
27.5/8.2/7.5, .458/.834, All-NBA 1st, All-Defense 1st

F: Lebron James (2008-09)
28.4/7.9/7.2/1.7/1.1, .489/.344/.780, MVP, All-Defense 1st

F/C: Wes Unseld (1968-69)
13.8/18.2/2.6, .476/.605, MVP

C: Alonzo Mourning (1998-99)
20.1/11.0/1.6/3.9, .511/.652, DPOY, 2nd in MVP, All-NBA 1st (over prime Shaq)

Bench:
F/C: Elvin Hayes (1976-77)
23.7/12.5/1.9/2.7/1.1, .501/.687, All-NBA 1st

G: Terry Porter (1990-91)
17.0/3.5/8.0/2.0, .515/.415/.823

F: Detlef Schrempf (1994-95)
19.2/6.2/3.8/1.1, .523/.514/.839, All-NBA 3rd

C: Jeff Ruland (1983-84)
22.2/12.3/3.9/1.0/0.9, .579/.733

G: Jeff Hornacek (1991-92)
20.1/5.0/5.1/2.0, .512/.439/.886

Minute Distribution Range:
PG: Cooper (24-28) - Porter (20-24)
SG: Havlicek (40-44) - Cooper (4-8) - Hornacek**
SF: James (38-40) - (Schrempf 10-12)
PF: Unseld*/Hayes (48)
C: Mourning (36-38) - Hayes/Unseld (10-12) - Ruland**
*will play over 25 minutes
**situational

vs.

Patrick Ewing (35) - Pau Gasol (13)
Charles Barkley (35) - Pau Gasol (13)
Julius Erving (35) - Paul Pierce (13)
Sam Jones (25) - Paul Pierce (13) - Joe Johnson (10)
Chauncey Billups (33) - Mo Cheeks (15)
extra: Elmore Smith

The Really Serious Serious Guys:

Kidd(36)/Buse(12)
McGrady(36)/Majerle(12)
Pressey(24)/English(24)
Thurmond(28)/Roundfield(20)
Abdul-Jabbar(40)/Thurmond(8)

Key Points:

-My team has insane passing. The lowest assist average per game in my starting lineup goes to Thurmond at 4.2.
-My team can finish on that passing. With 5 players who all do great things off the ball (moving, setting screens, cutting, finding good positions). This does not mean that these player cannot isolate. The go-to guys with the clock winding down are McGrady, English, and Kareem, so there will always be a ball-dominant option if need be.
-My team is built on defense all up and down. All of my players can defend multiple positions. In addition to great man-to-man defense, these players are also excellent in help defense. I also have incredible shotblockers. My post defense is immaculate with Nate, Kareem, and Roundfield sharing the rotation. Sam Lacey can make plays and will come in if a big gets in foul trouble.

Roster:

Minutes:
PG: Derek Harper (30) – Mark Price (28)
SG: Dwyane Wade (37) – Doug Christie (11)
SF: Grant Hill (36) – Kevin Durant (12)
PF: Willis Reed (18) – Chris Webber (30)
C: Bill Russell (40) – Willis Reed (8)

Divac (Reserve – Will not play)

bryant08 vs. SabasRevenge!

Rotations:

bryant08
Patrick Ewing (35) - Pau Gasol (13)
Charles Barkley (35) - Pau Gasol (13)
Julius Erving (35) - Paul Pierce (13)
Sam Jones (25) - Paul Pierce (13) - Joe Johnson (10)
Chauncey Billups (33) - Mo Cheeks (15)
situational: Elmore Smith

SabasRevenge!
PG: Cooper (24-28) - Porter (20-24)
SG: Havlicek (40-44) - Cooper (4-8) - Hornacek**
SF: James (32-40) - (Schrempf 8-12)
PF: Unseld*/Hayes (40-48) - James (0-8)
C: Mourning (36-38) - Hayes/Unseld (10-12) - Ruland**
*will play over 25 minutes
**situational

Stats:
C Patrick Ewing (89-90)
28.6 points, 10.9 rebounds, 4.0 blocks, 2.2 assists, 1.0 steals, 55% FG, 78% FT

PF Charles Barkley (86-87)
23.0 points, 14.6 rebounds, 4.9 assists, 1.8 steals, 1.5 blocks, 59% FG, 76% FT

SF Julius Erving (75-76)
29.3 points, 11.0 rebounds, 5.0 assists, 2.5 steals, 1.9 blocks, 51% FG, 80% FT

SG Sam Jones (65-66)
23.5 points, 5.2 rebounds, 3.2 assists, 47% FG

PG Chauncey Billups (05-06)
18.5 points, 8.6 assists, 3.1 rebounds, 1 steal, 42% FG, 43% 3PT, 2.3 3PTM

C Elmore Smith (73-74)
12.5 points, 11.2 rebounds, 4.9 blocks, 1.9 assists, 1 steal, 46% FG

PF/C Pau Gasol (08-09)
18.9 points, 9.6 rebounds, 3.5 assists, 1 block, 57% FG, 78% FT

SG/SF Paul Pierce (01-02)
26.1 points, 6.9 rebounds, 3.2 assists, 1.9 steals, 1 block, 44% FG, 40% 3PT, 2.6 3PTM

SG Joe Johnson (06-07)
25.0 points, 4.4 assists, 4.2 rebounds, 47% FG, 38% 3PT, 2.1 3PTM

PG Mo Cheeks (85-86)
15.4 points, 9.2 assists, 2.5 steals, 54% FG, 84% FT

I'd like to start of by saying how much of a drool-worthy matchup this really is. Two dominant frontcourts and plenty of incredible talent on both sides, including the LBJ vs. Dr. J matchup. I believe SabasRevenge! has done a good job building a well-rounded team, but I strongly believe my squad has what it takes to win this series.

Advantages

1. Offense
I built this frontcourt to dominate offensively, and this is no exception. My major advantage lies at Barkley-Unseld. Whereas my opponent claims due to their similar body types, Unseld can stop Barkley from backing down (which is true), Barkley has exceptional quickness at the position and will continually abuse Unseld. One of the major advatnages here is the fact that Wes Unseld is just 6-7, so unlike most 80s/90s PFs, Barkley can shoot over him without a problem. Unseld is also not a shotblocking threat. Up top, Ewing against Mourning is an advantage for me, without a doubt. Ewing has outplayed Mourning head-to-head throughout their careers, holding Mourning to just 46% shooting as well as 3.7 turnovers. This even includes later years, in which Ewing was barely playing in these matchups (around 10 minutes a game). Here are the stats head to head:

Ewing: 24 points, 10.8 rebounds, 2.4 blocks, 2.5 turnovers, 50% FG (11 wins)
Mourning: 21 points, 10.5 rebounds, 3.1 blocks, 3.7 turnovers, 46% FG (11 wins)

The bottom line is you can't win the game without putting up more points than your opponent. My opponent claims his defense is incredible, but frankly, my team is full of some of the best offensive players to ever play the game and this isn't a sport where you can totally shut guys down. The matchups are extremely favourable for me offensively and I believe my efficiency is a huge positive. My opponent claims that my team is full of too many "first options", but Ewing/Erving are guys that can adjust well, and if we're back to this argument again, every team in the league has too much talent.

My opponent repeatedly mentions Cooper, Havlicek as great perimeter defenders, which are very useful and I do agree with that, but it's not my backcourt that will be doing the major damage anyways. My backcourt is more for ball movement and shooting the open shot. Billups is a very tough competitor and a great distributor, but if Cooper gives him any sort of problem, I'm very lucky to have Dr. J who is just a terrific creator overall.

2. My opponent's offense
Yeah, my defense doesn't have as many awards as my opponent's, but I've got a major advantage here for quite a few reasons. Michael Cooper and Wes Unseld are two major ones. I'm sick and tired of the ridiculous overrating of Cooper's game offensively, if anything, he's hardly a factor at all. This allows me to put whoever my weakest defender is on the floor on Cooper without a problem, which is a major advantage. Looking at Unseld, he can make the good pass and clean up inside, but he's up against one of the greatest rebounders to ever play the game in Barkley and there's another non-factor. Ewing has already proven to severely limit the effectiveness of Mourning, so that's another positive matchup for me.

My opponent's offense comes almost entirely from his wings, John Havlicek and LeBron James. Sam Jones and Havlicek know each other extremely well, which is why I plan to stay conventional and use Jones on Hondo. Let's not forget, Jones was the reason Havlicek was a sixth man for those great Celtics teams rather than a starter. LeBron is a tough one, a man with his size and speed. But Julius Erving is a fantastic defender, which excellent length and quickness. There are very few guys in history with LeBron's size at the SF position, so saying he has a size advantage is applicable to everyone. As mentioned, Erving's length will definitely give LeBron a problem and the quickness ensures no easy blow-by opportunities, which LeBron is so reliant on. The best thing to do with LeBron is force him to take jumpers, which I'm very confident Erving will be able to do. My opponent has Havlicek and Cooper in the backcourt, neither of which were adept outside shooters (Havlicek was much better from mid-range), and his best shooter is LeBron James. I'll let you chew on that one, but it's quite obvious with the amount of havoc LeBron usually wreaks in the paint, shooters are an important part of an offense revolved around him.

3. Efficiency
It's quite simple, my players are just ridiculously more efficient than those of my opponent per the number of shots they take. A guy like Michael Cooper honestly shouldn't even be a starter in this league with his lack of ability at the offensive end. A quick TS% comparison for myself and my opponent for starters:



Putting together a team that takes a low number of shots in a league like this to try and make it "realistic" doesn't work when the team is full of low-efficiency guys that are not up to par offensively and will have their work cut out on defense anyways.

4. Talent
In a league this competitive, you need talent to pull out wins, and I believe that's something my team has a great amount of in comparison to my opponent. I really want to stress how Michael Cooper is not in any shape or form a starter in this league, seeing as how he 94 career games in the NBA and only 2 in the selected season. My frontcourt is the best in this competition and is going to be a handful to stop. I don't believe my opponent's team is as talented as mine and this will shine through in a playoff series where sometimes you simply need a player to takeover.

more to come

Lenny Wilkens (25)/ Kevin Johnson (23)
Kobe Bryant (38)/ Eddie Jones (10)
Chris Mullin (34)/ Eddie Jones (14)
Kevin Mchale (36)/ Kevin Willis (12)
Bill Walton (36)/ Bill Laimbeer (12)

Lenny Wilkens 1968-1969
Kobe Bryant 2002-2003
Chris Mullin 1989-1990
Kevin Mchale 1986-1987
Bill Walton 1976-1977

Kevin Johnson 1989-1990
Drazen Petrovic 1992-1993
Eddie Jones 1999-2000
Kevin Willis 1991-1992
Bill Laimbeer (1985-1986)

Petrovic for the time being is a situational shooter with no regular rotation minutes, but could be brought in in situations where a quick score is needed.

Team Summary: My team is a well balanced and relentless machine built around the incredibly mobile and relentless Bill Walton and Kobe Bryant, one of the best guards ever to play the game, who in selected years was at his physical and athletic peak in which he boasted an incredible all round two way game. My team can post up, defend, run, grind it out, and shoot the lights out. Our flexability, spacing, and versatility enable us to match up against a variety of opponents and styles.

Offensively: We feel that the options we have offensively give us a major advantage in this matchup. There are no easy covers in our starting lineup and with Walton, Kobe, and Wilkens/KJ there is no shortage of passing ability to exploit our offensive options. Walton has a case to make as the best passing big man in the history of the game, making him a critical hub to our offense down low. He can find cutters, take it himself, or kick it out to one of our shooters. Lanier, while an effective defender, will not be able to prevent a player of Walton's mobility and impressive skill from working effectively.

Our second primary offensive weapon, of course, is Kobe Bryant. He was a great shooter in selected years, but our effective spacing should also give him ample room to operate. Given the level of strength and athleticism, coupled with his well developed overall game at this stage of his career, we feel he will be able to score and be a first option offensively even with an effective defender like Payton hounding him. This also, of course, leaves Vince Carter guarding the likes of our point guards. Though he did have some tools for defense, he has never been noted as a consistent defender at any stage of his career, and without Payton to provide any help here, our point guards, KJ in particular, should be able to deal with Carter.

There are other sacrifices entailed by my opponent's defensive switches as well. McHale should still be able score with relative efficiency (26/10 on 60% in selected years) even with Bird guarding him, who I am unsure can be any more effective than Buck Williams at this task. Perhaps worse, this puts the interior Buck out of his element on the perimeter guarding the likes of Mullin and Eddie Jones. Not only is his defensive ability not best used here, but he will be out of range of rebounding opportunities.

Defensively: We would agree that Mullin/Bird is a mismatch, but Mullin's time guarding Bird will be limited. Instead, we will match Bird with his former teammate, Kevin Mchale. McHale often guarded the small forwards that Bird struggled with in his playing days. His size and defensive ability should give Bird trouble, mostly in the post. That, coupled with the interior presence of Walton, should be able to limit Bird's opportunities inside. Bird was also a great shooter, and we still expect him to score, but we will be able to limit certain aspects of his game. This leaves Mullin on Hawkins/Buck, who aren't being used as primary offensive options in this matchup and should not be huge issues here. Most of all, Bird now, on both ends of the floor, loses any size advantage he would normally have in such matchups.

Though Lanier had a reliable mid range shot, it wasn't his entire offensive game, and using him purely as a mid range shooter does limit him somewhat. We believe that Walton has the mobility and defensive skill to recover enough to remain very relavent in the paint. If he has to give up a jumpshot here or there to Lanier, so be it. Walton is also the best defensive rebounder in this series, leading the league in rebounds in spite of playing fewer minutes than most of the other great big men during the regular season. Overall, we still feel Walton presents more issues for Lanier on both ends than vice versa. We can also on occasion switch McHale onto Lanier and allow Walton to roam inside, though, as we've said, this will be a secondary option to keeping McHale on the primary threat, Bird.

In the backcourt, we will have Kobe on Carter most of the time, though he could on occasion see time on Payton depending on how matchups fair. Carter is extremely athletic, but Kobe can easily match him in that department and is physical enough to really bother a player like Carter, who isn't known for his own physicality. Payton does have the size advantage over our point guards, but he also prefers to post up and play beneath the free throw line on offense, and this will often be a zone in which he is not as free to operate with the defenders we have down low. He will have to either go into the teeth of the interior or settle for jumpshots at times. He will not be rendered ineffective, but we believe we have the tools needed to alleviate the defensive matchup there.

Overall: Our team has enough flexibility on both ends of the floor to match up effectively against this opponent and emerge victorious. Walton and Bryant lead a balanced and unrelenting attack on both ends of the floor, and are complemented by an effective combination of other role players. Our team's overall skill level and versatility is overbearing, and we have a 5 pronged offensive attack coupled with an effective defense. We have clear advantages in 3 out of 5 matchups overall, and the tools needed to minimize the effects of the two matchups our opponents have.

pg: Deron Williams (2008) 28 mins
sg: Reggie Miller (1990) 38 mins
sf: Elgin Baylor (1961) 38 mins
pf: Bob McAdoo (1974) 38 mins
c: Moses Malone (1983) 42 mins

Bench:
Penny Hardaway (1995) 20 mins
Mark Eaton (1985) 5 mins
Willie Wise (1974) 10 mins
Gus Johnson (1971) 10 mins
Tayshaun Prince (2007) 10 mins

Offensive Strategy:
-Draw Fouls
-Force Mutombo out early
-Abuse DJ
-Work the pip/pop/kick out
-Go for O-boards

Our best offensive players are in Baylor and McAdoo so naturally that’s where the points are going to come from. With Reggie spacing the floor, there will be a lot of room in the middle of the court for Baylor and McAdoo to work a 2 man game. With McAdoo’s shooting and Baylor’s dribble penetration, the pick and pop should be our bread and butter. Malone working the weak side will clean up whatever mistakes he can get his hands on.

However, early in the game, it’s vital that we force the ball inside to Moses and let him go 1-on-1 with Mutumbo. Mutumbo is a fantastic shotblocker, but I’m not impressed by his man defense. In 1995, Mutombo faced the spurs and fouled out of game 2 in 30 mins of play. Chances are that Moses could draw a few quick fouls early on and force the rookie Bellamy to step into a high pressure situation.

After testing the Mutombo waters, I would probably give Baylor the green light to work Dennis Johnson into the ground. DJ may have been only 2-3 inches shorter than Baylor but he’s giving up 40 lbs to one of the greatest midrange scorers to ever play the game. I’ll probably work that matchup until either the buckets or fouls force Kirilenko to come into the game.

Once the defensive unit of West/Ellis/AK/KG/Bellamy is in, I would go to the aforementioned 2man game between Baylor and McAdoo. Mac keeps KG out of the paint if he doesn’t switch. If he does switch, the 6’11 McAdoo will have no problem shooting over AK47. If both are locked up, I have no problems letting Reggie take the kickout. 1990 Reggie wasn’t just a jumpshooter. He shot 7 foul shots a game and is quite capable of getting to the line. If Ellis plays Reggie too close, foul shots could be coming. If he doesn’t, Reggie shot .571 in the playoffs against the bad boy pistons.


Defensive Strategy:
-harass Jerry West
-cut off his teammates
-double KG whenever possible
-shut down the rebounding game

Deron will probably used sparingly this series because Jerry West plays bigger than the average guard. The first chance I get I would yank Deron and put in Penny. Penny’s speed and length will help temper West’s impact on the game. Letting Deron play the first 7 minutes of each quarter should allow us to deliver the ball into Malone and eat up some clock without letting West run absolutely bonkers.

The opponent’s biggest offensive threat is in West. There’s no use in doubling West since he’s such a keen passer. Putting Penny in the game is a start, but stopping his teammates will also stymie Jerry’s effectiveness. The two major guys to worry about on this roster outside of West are Dale Ellis and Kevin Garnett.

Luckily, both guys are notorious for shrinking in a playoff atmosphere. Ellis’s scoring dropped from an impressive 27.5 to a merely good 24.5 in postseason play. His 3p% also dropped precipitously from .478 to .405. This is because Ellis poses a limited dribble threat. As long as a defender is dedicated in shadowing him, his shooting is tempered.

KG’s play didn’t drop as much. In fact, his rebounding increased by 0.7 boards. However his shooting did drop from .500 down to .452 and he fouled out of 2 WCF games while playing a very washed up Karl Malone. I think McAdoo’s size will serve him well in guarding KG, as well as the fact that Malone can double down whenever Mutombo is in the game since he’s an utter non-factor on offense.

Our biggest defensive stops will come when the 2nd unit comes into the game. Gus Johnson, Willie Wise, Tayshaun Prince, and Mark Eaton are all phenomenal defenders. I plan on having all 4 guys + Penny to close out the final 5 minutes of the 1st half and the 3rd quarter. Willie Wise has guarded some of the best SF ever and will get real handsy with west. Gus Johnson is the kind of country-strong defender that is a thorn in wiry KG’s side. Prince can hound anyone into a bad shooting night. Eaton is just the bow that ties everyone together. He cleans up mistakes, chats it up, and runs the defense from the baseline. Since these guys are only playing for 10 minutes (albeit crucial 10 minutes) this defensive unit is capable of playing 5 minute stretches without letting anyone score which will be vital to build on leads and hold onto existing leads.

The rebounding disparity is probably the most obvious defensive advantage. Recent NBA champs - Lakers, Celtics, Pistons, have demonstrated how powerful team rebounding can be. I've got stud rebounders at all 3 frontcourt positions which makes for a perfect boxout situation. I just don't see a team being able to overcome such a large rebounding deficit.

A note on offensive rebounding: he pulls down 7.7 orb/game. McAdoo pulled down 3.8 orb/game. There are no numbers kept but in approximating that a modest 5/20 of baylor's boards were offensive. Normalizing the pace to 100 poss/game (and estimating that Baylor would have had 10 rpg, working out to be 2.5 oboards/game) that's works out to be slightly under 13.5 extra possessions a game. Getting 12-15 extra possessions a game is like gaining an extra half quarter's worth of offensive possessions. That is an enormous advantage especially when considering the conversion percentages of o-boards to buckets.

compound this "gain" of possessions with the defensive rebounding, the advantage becomes that much wider. the gross gain of 12-15 possessions turns into a net gain of 7-10 possessions. That's like starting the game and getting spotted 10-15 points.

Conclusion:
We’ll work the matchups. We’ve got better answers for their questions than they do ours. West? We’ll stick a very long penny hardaway and willie wise on him and cut off his outlets. Ellis? We’ll smother him with Reggie Miller who doesn’t get tired and accept a coinflip for the outcome. KG? We’ll double on him with Malone.

As for my questions, I ask who is going to guard Elgin Baylor? You laugh at his efficiency, but he still scores 35 a game and gets to the foul line a dozen times a game. Are you just going to play the percentages and let that happen? Do you think sticking Dennis Johnson on him is going to help that situation? Who is going to win the matchup between McAdoo and Garnett? Garnett is a better defender, fine. That doesn’t change the fact that my PF is going to score at least half a dozen more points than your PF even if your PF is a better defender. The most interesting question is what about the center matchup? My center rolled through the 1983 playoffs 16-1 and swept a magic/KAJ led Lakers and your defensive plan is to play man coverage? With the same center that let Shaq roll through the playoffs 16-1 eighteen years later?


a note on box-out rebounding:
Box out is just a rebounding philosophy. It works best when the entire frontcourt buys into it, and boxes out all 3 sides of the exposed lane. If even just 1 player doesn't "box out" then someone can just cruise down the middle of the lane, and grab a offensive rebound. To counter this, many players have abandoned "boxing out" and just follow the ball. this "chase down the ball" philosophy of rebounding is what guys like Rodman and Ben Wallace subscribe to. They are athletic and intuitive enough to get to where the ball is.

In today's game, the NBA SF has become much more of a perimeter player that the box out isn't really how it was originally designed. Guys kind of just "line out" and protect their side of the basket, hoping to corall the ball if it bounces to them. If the ball doesn't bounce their way, then hopefully a guard can chase it down. However, with a guy like Baylor, the box out will be revitalized and team rebounding will truly shine again.

Rebuttal to jcdallas24.

Firstly, I wanted to make a correction. I am using Kareem's 78-79 season, and that's the season I've chosen him for the entire time, I just gave him the wrong year on my roster page.

jcldallas24 wrote:Offense:
+ Scoring

Calling this team's scoring an advantage is based purely on PPG all added up together. In terms of efficiency, the starting lineup (with adjusted numbers for the minutes played, but not pace) shoot 48.4 from the field on 81.9 attempts. With offense running through Dirk, who has a more athletic defensive powerhouse in Nate Thurmond to match up against, he cannot perform. Dirk excels against smaller forwards by taking them inside and takes out bigs by forcing them outside their range. Against Thurmond, who is both big and fast, both advantages are negated, and Dirk's #1 reason for efficient shooting (his height) is taken away. As for Drexler, he will be guarded by a lengthier T-Mac. His TS% is not a concern. Bob Cousy is a sub-.400 shooter. Even if he were to take less shots, that would only give Kidd the opportunity to play more help defense.

+ Passing

Absolute hogwash. My starting lineup adds up to 32.7 assists per game in the same minutes as 26.1 assists per game in my opponent's starting lineup. Furthermore, the assist/turnover ratio favors me, 2.15 to 2.04

+ Versatility

Looking at it position by position (and only offensive versatility), we can safely say that:

J-Kidd vs. Cousy: Kidd is a better scorer (better than 6-17 night in and night out) and has a 3-point shot. Both were triple-double threats, but Kidd is much more efficient, and is less ball-dominant than Cousy.

T-Mac vs. Clyde: Both are great slashers, both move great off the ball. In other words, it comes down to pure production and efficiency, where McGrady takes an edge with a higher TS% (mainly because of better 3-point shooting) and at a higher PPG average in a slower league.

Pressey vs. Dandridge: Pressey was the first point-forward, and scoring was just one of the things he did on offense. Dandridge has some good moves, but he was a typical small forward on offense, and had Hayes and Unseld in the frontcourt with him to take some of the load off.

Thurmond vs. Nowitzki: Thurmond did not have the one-on-one ability Nowitzki has, but could throw a mean pick and create opportunities for his teammates. Still, Nowitzki has the edge here.

Kareem vs. the Admiral: This is almost. Both players could've gone off for triple-doubles, scored with a plethora of moves, and passed it well, except with 5.4 assists per game to Robinson's 2.7, Kareem has an extra dimension on Robinson here.

+ Athleticism(Drexler, DRob)

T-Mac can AT LEAST match Drexler and I think Kareem will be alright against D-Rob. Kidd has an edge on Cousy and Thurmond has an edge on Dirk.

Robinson will most likely get his touches in the paint and whenver he gets doubled team Nowitzki will just stroke that jumper. Which is one facet of our offense that will make it hard to stop.

Nobody will be doubled. Thurmond and Kareem can more than hold their own. Even if you don't think Pressey is a good man defender, if someone were to get double-teamed he will rotate to the open Dirk.

Defense:

+ Length (Robinson, Haywood, Drexler)

Kidd has 2 inches on Cousy
T-Mac has 2 inches on Drexler
Pressey is down 1 inch on Dandridge
Thurmond is the same as Dirk
Kareem has 1 inch on Robinson
Buse is down 1 inch on Maravich
Majerle has 1 inch on Dantley
English is the same as Debusschere
Roundfield is the same as Haywood
Lacey is the same as the other Robinson

Lengthwise, I hold a 4-inch total advantage. It's very advantageous in the backcourt duo of Kidd and T-Mac, where it'll be easier to shoot over their respective defenders.

+ Versatility(Drexler, Drob, Dandridge, Dantley)

Don't know exactly what this demonstrates, besides an abundance of D's in the names of the players (instead of on the court. Snap.)

+ Debusschere(6 Time all Defense 1st team)

While we're counting, I think my team holds more total defensive 1st team selections across more years. Kidd has 3, Pressey has 2, Thurmond has 2, Kareem has 5, Buse has 4, and Roundfield has 3. There's a few 2nd team selections between them, also, and Dan Majerle.

.

Pistons vs. Rockets

Isiah Thomas/Tiny Archibald
Joe Dumars/Mitch Richmond
Bobby Jones/ Bernard King
Antonio McDysee/Jack Sikma
Wilt Chamberlain/ George Mikan
VS
Chris Paul
Micheal Ray Richardson/Ray Allen
Rick Barry/ Ron Artest
Jerry Lucas/Larry Nance
Hakeem Olajuwon/ Jermaine O Neal

Pistons Overview

My team is built around the GOAT bigman and the GOAT backcourt. This team consists of 3 great def players (Wilt/Jones/Dumars) that will work together and oppose players in the post, on the wing and at the top of the key. Our 3 level defense allows us to mount a game plan vs. any team in this league.
The Pistons on offense use a conventional inside-out offense based on Wilts low post play and wing shooters such as Bobby Jones/Dumars/Mitch Richmond. The Pistons however like to use Bernard King down low and make him the 6th man offensive sparkplug that gets us points and allows Wilt to concentrate on defense. Wilt moves to the high post and allows King to post up in the low block and frees up space for shooters. Of course Isiah will play some pick and roll with Wilt and attack the basket looking for lay ups or assists. The Pistons don’t have a huge scorer so rely on all players and play a team game. The Pistons also are a very low Turnover team with no starter averaging 3TOs a game.

Match up
Center
The Pistons will use a 2 man rotation of Wilt & Sikma covering the C spot. Mikan is not a rotation player unless there is massive foul trouble or at the end of halves. I believe the defense of these 2 will be more than able to reduce the effectiveness of the Rockets Cs and hold them below there projected numbers. I believe Wilt can hold Hakeem to under 18ppg and 45% shooting. Furthermore Wilt only avgs 1.7 fouls per game so Hakeems trips to the FT line will be drastically cut and so his eff and production will follow. Sikma is vastly superior defender than either O Neal and will have a much greater effect on Hakeem than on Wilt. Wilt of course is not trying to score 30ppg and will be somewhere around 18ppg in this offense. I do believe Hakeems defense will slow down Wilt and force him to drop from 70%FG to around 60%. What it does mean is that Wilt will still be able to score as much on fewer FGA.

PF
Dysee will be guarding the long bomber Lucas and for the most part wont have to leave to double team him. His quickness and physical abilites (pre knee injury) will be a nightmare for the slower of foot and positional rebounding style of Lucas. Lucas is a great shooter but putting the on the floor is not his specialty. Im also suspicious of his ability to def rebound with a leaper like Dysee who can nearly jump over him. I expect Dysee to score primarily from run outs/ fast breaks and by facing up Lucas and going by him. Im pretty content that Dysee will get enough dunks to offset whatever shooting adv Lucas has. Lucas is relying on kickouts from Hakeem or dribble penetration from Barry. I however am one of the very few teams that don’t have to double and leave Lucas wide open. Sikma is a vastly superior player to Nance and will be able to dominate the boards whenever Lucas in not on the floor. Furthermore when Nance is in the game we will change up our defense and put more pressure on Hakeem or slashers with the twin towers setup.

SF
Bobby Jones will be on Rick Barry from tip off and will be guarding for 66% of the time that hes on the floor. Hes done very well on Barry and should be able to hold him under his 46% to somewhere around 42%. This drop off in production for the #2 option of the Rockets adds to there woes and forces other players to step up. Ron Artest may have to carry a larger role with his 3pt shooting. Being the teams 3pt sharpshooter it exposes a weakness of the Rockets. The pressure of a lead tends to make Artest crack and his desire to take over the game can turn into a disaster. Having a super scorer like Bernard King go off on Artest and bully him in the post can only add to his frustrations and light a fuse to the Artest time bomb.
King will play the 6th man role and come in to provide instant offense in post up and down screens. King will score on Barry easily and force Artest into the game. If Barry is having a great game on Jones. King will come in to tire him and try to draw fouls on him. He can single handedly swing momentum and force a hot Barry to the bench and thus act as a def stopper. I believe my def stopper is superior and my scoring SF is actually more efficient

SG
I believe I have maybe the best 3 guard rotation in this league and the Rockets have maybe the worst starting SG in this league. MMR is a PG who uses his size and long arms to harass other Pgs . However hes facing Sgs now and he loses a lot his length and size adv that he uses so well. MRR also lacks range outside 16ft and will be useless as a spot up 3pt shooter. I also believe that MRR wont be as effective guarding a spot up shooter like Dumars nor will he be able to cope with the physical play of Mitch Richmond. MRR also allows Dumars/Richmond to double off of him to give help if need be because of his lack of range. MRR is a great slasher and can pull an dshoot over small Pgs but again now hes doing this against Dumars and having to shoot over the bigger Richmond and that’s not counting the weak side defenders of my team that can alter a lot of shots. Ray Allen on the other hand is a great shooter and but again will have to contend with Dumars and Mitch.

PG

Oh yeah the master vs. the student. They have almost identical stats with CP3 better from 3pt range. I however contend that the era difference gives Isiah Thomas the nod. I cant imagine anyone being able to deal with Isiah under the current rules. Isiah is quicker than a prime AI and is a master at the dribble change of pace and speeds. IMHO the only deference
that realy matters is what Isiah can do in crunch time and how he can single handedly beat teams by himself. His heroics are the stuff of legend and although CP3 might be great someday he is yet to do it. If for some factor Isiah is having trouble I feel confident in bringing in Tiny. I don’t plan on using him but he is the ultimate spark plug who can produce and should be a starting PG in this league.

I believe my team is superior in the following factors
1. FG%
2. Rebounding
3. Turnovers
4. Clutch play
5. Chemistry
6. Depth

ROTATION
PG – NASH ( 33 ), VAN LIER ( 15)
SG - JORDAN ( 38 ), TONEY ( 10)
SF - WORTHY ( 30 ), MARION ( 18 )
PF - PETTIT ( 25 ), OAKLEY ( 15 ), MARION ( 8 )
C - PARISH ( 28 ), CAMBY ( 20 )

PG - Magic (38), Baron Davis (10)
SG - Jerry Sloan (36), David Thompson (12)
SF - Pippen (40), Chet Walker (8)
PF - Cowens (25), Kemp (23) (edited, happy now ? )
C - Dwight (35), Sampson (13)

first off all, my main assumptions for this series are:
-switch pick and rolls with Nash, can't let him shoot jumpshots, especially 3s
-put Pippen on MJ to completely take away his post up and live with the results
-absolutely dominate the boards
-attack the paint offensively
-make them rotate the ball and shoot midrange jumpshots defensively
-by offensive rebounds from bigs (Dwight and Kemp) and insane inside scoring from many players combined with extremely poor interior defense from opponents, score at will vastly limiting opponents' transition opportunities

Defensively

-switch any pick and roll with Nash, that's by far the best way how to defend his devastating weapon (Nash fan here). fortunately I've assembled a team that is perfectly capable of doing it. with all that insane athleticism and pretty good lateral quickness they can do a good job on him. furthermore, I have small players who are very capable of switching onto bigs without any problems whatsoever. I'm making him drive the ball and kick it out, I'm not gonna let Nash shoot jumpshots. there are gonna be a lot of mismatches so it's really hard to determine one matchup, but based on what I would like, I'm guarding him with Jerry Sloan. all-defensive teams have been established in '69, the year I've chosen for him, and he was ahead of Jerry West and John Havlicek on first all-defensive team. since then, he has been all defensive player to the rest of his career (barring 22 games in his last season), mostly on first teams. Jerry Sloan was a great defender, very comparable with Jerry West, if not better. with his length and quickness I feel like I can bother Nash's jumpshot and then again I'm switching on every pick and roll not to give him space to shoot.

-MJ is extremely hard, obviously. fortunately I'm in possession of the GOAT perimeter defender in Pippen. although Michael is a tremendous scorer and can't be stopped by anybody, ever, he can be contained reasonably well. actually MJ has never faced anything somewhat like Pippen against him. most of the players who were guarding him were undersized SGs who weren't even recognized as great defenders anyway. SG defense was certainly poor in the 90s. with Pippen guarding MJ it's taking away his post-up right away and his driving will be limited too. in case of any pick and roll or switch I'll try to take away ball from MJ. this team has some great defenders and I feel like they can rotate fast enough. I think Pippen will do as good job as anyone.

-Worthy is tricky. obviously without Magic he won't be as good as usually, but then you have Nash making up for that disadvantage. Worthy can be a very dangerous iso scorer against Magic but I can live with him using possessions instead of Nash or MJ. Worthy is mainly working on mid post where you can contain him with half-zone/double-teams. I'm not concerned with that matchup. although Magic would be a good enough defender not to be abused by him, it's mainly because Worthy is limited iso scorer and isn't a good go-to option in the ATL competition. his advantages come from being a great catch-and-finish player but I don't think he'll make a great living in transition (more on that later).

-I'm not sure what I should think about Pettit. he's certainly a dangerous player but PF quality in the 60s was ridiculous and his pace-adjusted stats are not even remotely close to what they are now. this matchup is confusing. Dave Cowens and Shawn Kemp were good man defenders (Kemp great). Pettit has never faced a defense like that. 60s Celtics had Russell as more of a team-defender who wasn't his matchup and they weren't even half of this defensive team anyway. this is where my across-era dislikes can affect my judgement. I don't consider Pettit as one of the TOP5 PFs ever in terms of ability. anyway, if he gives me any trouble defensively I can always use double team but I don't think it's gonna be that necessary.

-Parish is not a factor offensively. Dwight is capable of making him look like a lost child. Parish had very limited skills in terms of iso scoring and he wasn't really a great finisher either. Dwight has way more than enough athleticism to bother his turnaround jumpshots and without really variety of moves he won't be able to make up for that. I think Howard will dominate in this matchup.

-bench is poor offensively. nobody is gonna make any impact. they wouldn't be great offensive players in normal league and this is ATL.

Offensively

this is r'n'g team. with Magic + great finishers I have modified Showtime only with worlds better rebounding and defense, allowing me to run all the time after defensive stops. I don't think you can stop this team when it's in transition. Magic to Dwight. dunk. Magic to Pippen. lay-up switching hands in the air. Magic to Kemp. poster. really, if Showtime was basically unstoppable team in transition, you best believe you can't stop this team either.

I'm not gonna focus as much on matchups here. I feel like I can run all game long because I matchup with my opponent pretty well. obviously he has assembled a great offensive team, with all the shooting and two of the best offensive anchors ever. he's gonna get his either in the HC or in transition, but there are gonna be a lot of stops too.

what my opponent absolutely fails to do is defend the paint. you can't put Parish and Pettit together and count on them to stop a team like mine from scoring in the paint. I mean seriously who can block a shot there ? who can play a lick of post defense ? who won't be abused by Dwight, Kemp or Sampson ? (that's why I'm going with Kemp here - he's a great interior scorer and I don't need anyone to space the floor here, because there's no intimidation in the paint) I can dunk on this poorous defenders all game long and even assuming that somehow they could force a miss, you can compete with my team on the boards (Magic, Sloan, Pippen at ~11-12% TRB, Kemp ~20% in the playoffs, Dwight ~23-24%) and there are gonna be A LOT of 2nd chance opportunities. without being able to make stops defensively, you can't run. without running you don't have easy points. you're forced to play half-court basketball. then, again, I think this team can't be absolutely stopped, it's a great offensive team, but I can contain them reasonably well. without a doubt better than they can contain me considering their ridiculous interior defense. this ATL competition. let's be serious. by far the most important aspect of the game is interior defense. having that crucial advantage, I can't lose this matchup.

-MJ will be on Magic and should do a nice job limiting Magic’s offense and playmaking. MJ was a unbelievable defender his entire career (including DPOY). This is a fun battle of 2 great players and winner. But I believe MJ’s man on man defense will really cause Magic to struggle.

we've seen it in '91 finals and Magic abused MJ in the post, essentially he did whatever he wanted to do with him. it's not really a surprise considering huge weight disparity. Magic is like 250 and 6'9, you can't guard him with SG in the post and assume he will do a good job.

just look what happened when MJ tried to guard him in the post (found this links)
http://video.google.pl/videoplay?docid= ... 7121&hl=pl
http://video.google.pl/videoplay?docid= ... 8326&hl=pl

you're being quite optimistic if you think that MJ will stop Magic and Pippen won't do the same with MJ. I wonder also how will MJ keep up endurance-wise if he has to push Magic out of the paint while giving like 30 pounds and at the same time try to score on Pippen. good luck with that.

now the real fun begins!

REBUTTALS

bastillon wrote: Worthy is limited iso scorer and isn't a good go-to option in the ATL competition. his advantages come from being a great catch-and-finish player but I don't think he'll make a great living in transition.

bastillon wrote: this is r'n'g team. with Magic + great finishers I have modified Showtime only with worlds better rebounding and defense, allowing me to run all the time after defensive stops. I don't think you can stop this team when it's in transition. Magic to Dwight. dunk. Magic to Pippen. lay-up switching hands in the air. Magic to Kemp. poster. really, if Showtime was basically unstoppable team in transition, you best believe you can't stop this team either.

This confuses me, who was Magic running the floor with in the Showtime days? Worthy ws the finishing wing that ran up and down the court like you hope Pippen will be able to do. The transition game and running the floor is exactly were Wothy made his name and what made him one of the top SF’s to ever play in the NBA
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1304 ... ime#page/6

bastillon wrote:Dave Cowens and Shawn Kemp were good man defenders (Kemp great). Pettit has never faced a defense like that. 60s Celtics had Russell as more of a team-defender who wasn't his matchup and they weren't even half of this defensive team anyway. this is where my across-era dislikes can affect my judgement. I don't consider Pettit as one of the TOP5 PFs ever in terms of ability.

Well I have to argue this statement also. Pettit was a Top 5 PF in the history of the game

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1352 ... ime#page/8

And Pettit constantly went against GOAT Bigs like 2 of the BEST in Wilt and Russell. Including when he beat Russell’s Celtics in the Finals. He made the PF position what it is today.

bastillon wrote: what my opponent absolutely fails to do is defend the paint. you can't put Parish and Pettit together and count on them to stop a team like mine from scoring in the paint. I mean seriously who can block a shot there?

1979 Robert Parish 2.9 blocks per (4th in NBA)
2007 Marcus Camby 3.3 blocks per (led NBA) and DPOY
add to that
Marion blocking 1.7 blocks per

That seems like plenty of blocks for me!

bastillon wrote: who won't be abused by Dwight, Kemp or Sampson ? (that's why I'm going with Kemp here - he's a great interior scorer and I don't need anyone to space the floor here, because there's no intimidation in the paint)

again, please learn the rules of the game! Cowens must play at least 25 minutes. And when did Kemp become this GOAT player. I know we are only using 1 year peak (no idea what year it is for Kemp) but he is no were near the GOAT you are making him out to be. He got his numbers because he was a black hole. Who was always one of the league leaders in turnovers (and was a PF, how does that happen). And you claim that he was a great defender when he really was a hack artist usually leading the league in fouls.

I also what to know how Sampson will be such a factor while logging only 13 minutes?

bastillon wrote: I can dunk on this poorous defenders all game long and even assuming that somehow they could force a miss, you can compete with my team on the boards (Magic, Sloan, Pippen at ~11-12% TRB, Kemp ~20% in the playoffs, Dwight ~23-24%) and there are gonna be A LOT of 2nd chance opportunities.

not sure what your stats here mean, but rebounding is not an issue for me at all

‘62 Pettit -18.7 reb vs. ’76 Cowens 16 reb per
’79 Parish -12.1 reb vs. ‘09 Howard 13.8 reb
bench rebounding (all of my guys will be getting minutes to contribute)
’07 Camby 11.7 reb vs ? season Kemp but basically 11 per
’94 Oakley 11.8 reb per vs 13 minutes of Sampson ?

plaus you can add in Marion who pulled in 11.8 reb per in my 2006 season
So were is this HUGE advantage?

And my favorite quote of them all

bastillon wrote: I can't lose this matchup.

WOW! Not only have you made incorrect judgements on the players, and used an illegal line-up, but you are also delusional!

My team is much more well rounded and built around the GREATEST OFFENSIVE PLAYER to ever play the game. Who also was a 1st team All Defensive player his entire career. I have spacing, playmaking, and role players all around him. My bench is filled with great defenders and a deadly shooter. Plus I have CLUTCH players all over the court. I have a few questions for you to answer

Who is your go to guy?
Who will carry the load offensively for your team that you think will run up and down the floor?
How well will your team shoot from the line?
Who will be able to shoot a 3?

I edited my last post but I think you might not notice it.

-MJ will be on Magic and should do a nice job limiting Magic’s offense and playmaking. MJ was a unbelievable defender his entire career (including DPOY). This is a fun battle of 2 great players and winner. But I believe MJ’s man on man defense will really cause Magic to struggle.

we've seen it in '91 finals and Magic abused MJ in the post, essentially he did whatever he wanted to do with him. it's not really a surprise considering huge weight disparity. Magic is like 250 and 6'9, you can't guard him with SG in the post and assume he will do a good job.

just look what happened when MJ tried to guard him in the post (found this links)
http://video.google.pl/videoplay?docid= ... 7121&hl=pl
http://video.google.pl/videoplay?docid= ... 326&hl=pl#

you're being quite optimistic if you think that MJ will stop Magic and Pippen won't do the same with MJ. I wonder also how will MJ keep up endurance-wise if he has to push Magic out of the paint while giving like 30 pounds and at the same time try to score on Pippen. good luck with that.

This confuses me, who was Magic running the floor with in the Showtime days? Worthy ws the finishing wing that ran up and down the court like you hope Pippen will be able to do. The transition game and running the floor is exactly were Wothy made his name and what made him one of the top SF’s to ever play in the NBA

exactly, Worthy's greatness was based on the ability to run the floor on the break and finish. how the hell is he gonna run when you have such a bad defenders in the paint and thus can't get stops defensively ?

And Pettit constantly went against GOAT Bigs like 2 of the BEST in Wilt and Russell. Including when he beat Russell’s Celtics in the Finals. He made the PF position what it is today.

they were centers and never matched up with him. the best Pettit faced at his position was Neil Johnston and Tommy Heinsohn. not really impressive competition if you ask me.

1979 Robert Parish 2.9 blocks per (4th in NBA)
2007 Marcus Camby 3.3 blocks per (led NBA) and DPOY
add to that
Marion blocking 1.7 blocks per

wow you're using DPOTY argument with Camby, give me a break. he was as much of a DPOTY as MJ is capable of "causing Magic to struggle". Marion is sure gonna block a hell lot of shots and provide interior defense. we've all seen how dominant 06 Suns were defensively and obviously Lakers' tandem of Kwame Brown and Lamar Odom didn't abuse them inside. the same goes for Elton Brand and Kaman, they didn't completely dominate the boards and paint. good luck with Marion as your PF. Parish was barely a very good shotblocker and never established himself as one of the best defenders in the league. he has never made all-defensive 2nd team. I'm sure he'll protect the paint just fine.

I'll answer later to the points about rebounding.

round 2 of rebuttals

bastillon wrote:
we've seen it in '91 finals and Magic abused MJ in the post, essentially he did whatever he wanted to do with him. it's not really a surprise considering huge weight disparity. Magic is like 250 and 6'9, you can't guard him with SG in the post and assume he will do a good job.
you're being quite optimistic if you think that MJ will stop Magic and Pippen won't do the same with MJ. I wonder also how will MJ keep up endurance-wise if he has to push Magic out of the paint while giving like 30 pounds and at the same time try to score on Pippen. good luck with that.

Sure Magic on the block will have a huge weight advantage over MJ, but what shooters do you have around Magic that will prevent him from getting doubled? And I am perfectly content allowing one of the greatest playmakers in the history of the game try to play one on one in the paint. Magic has never been an #1 offensive option, and would love to see him try to dominate the scoring in this matchup.

Magic did so well against MJ in the 1991 Finals that his more talented team lost in 5 games. It did not work in 91 and it will not work here with less talent around him then he did in 91.

Nobody was ever able to stop MJ, and Pippen falls into that category. And when was MJ ever too tired (or sick) to be able to score at will?

bastillon wrote: Worthy is limited iso scorer and isn't a good go-to option in the ATL competition. his advantages come from being a great catch-and-finish player but I don't think he'll make a great living in transition.

This confuses me, who was Magic running the floor with in the Showtime days? Worthy ws the finishing wing that ran up and down the court like you hope Pippen will be able to do. The transition game and running the floor is exactly were Wothy made his name and what made him one of the top SF’s to ever play in the NBA

exactly, Worthy's greatness was based on the ability to run the floor on the break and finish. how the hell is he gonna run when you have such a bad defenders in the paint and thus can't get stops defensively ?

again I am confused You don’t think he would make a great living in transition, but agree that his greatness was his ability to run the floor? What argument are you gonna stick with?

Defensive stops are really not a big problem considering your team “peak shooting %” of your starters is only .494%, I highly doubt you will be scoring everytime down. And add rto that that you may have the worst SG to ever start in a ATL game who shoots .417% in his peak.

bastillon wrote:they were centers and never matched up with him. the best Pettit faced at his position was Neil Johnston and Tommy Heinsohn. not really impressive competition if you ask me.

1st of all Wilt usually matchup up against PF’s when he played because Nate Thurmond usually guarded the C’s (and check most all decade teams from the 60’s the listed Wilt at PF.) And that still does not mean that he was one of the Top 5 PF’s in NBA history or that he played great against Russell in the 58 Finals. And again was much better of a player then the guy he is matched up against in dave Cowens who is not on any all time lists at the position just like his backup Kemp

bastillon wrote: I mean seriously who can block a shot there?

1979 Robert Parish 2.9 blocks per (4th in NBA)
2007 Marcus Camby 3.3 blocks per (led NBA) and DPOY
add to that
Marion blocking 1.7 blocks per

wow you're using DPOTY argument with Camby, give me a break. he was as much of a DPOTY as MJ is capable of "causing Magic to struggle". Marion is sure gonna block a hell lot of shots and provide interior defense. we've all seen how dominant 06 Suns were defensively and obviously Lakers' tandem of Kwame Brown and Lamar Odom didn't abuse them inside. the same goes for Elton Brand and Kaman, they didn't completely dominate the boards and paint. good luck with Marion as your PF. Parish was barely a very good shotblocker and never established himself as one of the best defenders in the league. he has never made all-defensive 2nd team. I'm sure he'll protect the paint just fine.

Again what are you argueing? Your question was Who will block shots? And my simple answer was the facts! (something you seem to not use)

I did not say I was using Marion at PF in this matchup, I was just answering your question about who can block a shot. You claim that Parish was barely a good shot blocker, but the FACTS are that in the season I am using he was ranked 4th in the NBA.

I am also not sure how much defense is needed to defend Dwight considering he has no offensive moves at all, and if he was making an impact alls we would need to do is foul him and hope the back board can withstand the beating