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I find the hype about Kobe to be extreme. He is a great player but imo he is very overrated.

Remember after Shaq left and before they got Gasol we got to see Kobe lead a team with minimal talent around him. It was mainly him, Odom, and Fisher. During those 3 seasons, Kobe and the Lakers failed to make the playoffs once and lost in the first round twice. One of those first round losses was to the Suns where Amare did not play for the entire seires. That's right- the Lakers lost to the Suns without Amare in a 7 games series yet Kobe got no flack for that. It was only after they got Gasol that they made it past the first round.

Kobe also gets no flack for taking games off like he did in the game 6 loss in the 2008 NBA finals that gave Boston the title. (7 of 22 shooting, 22 points 3 rebounds 1 assist). No one mentioned a word about Kobe quiting in that game.

But anyways here are Kobe's stats in all of the NBA finals he has been in:

2000 NBA Finals

Shaq- 38 PPG, 17 RPG, 2.5 APG, 2.7 BPG, 61% FG 96/157----6 games
Kobe-16 PPG, 5 RPG, 4 APG, 1.4 BPG, 36% FG%, 33/90----5 games

MVP= Shaq. Shaq performs MUCH better than Bryant who shoots a pathetic 36 percent. Also Shaq was doubled covered while Kobe was left with less coverage but even then Shaq did much better.

2001 NBA Finals

Shaq- 33 PPG, 16 RPG, 5 APG, 3.5 BPG, 63/110 57% FG-----5 games
Kobe- 24 PPG, 8 RPG, 6 APG, 1.4 BPG, 44/106 41% FG------5 games

MVP= Shaq. Shaq performs MUCH better than Bryant who shoots 41%.. Also Shaq was doubled covered while Kobe was left with less coverage but even then Shaq did much better.

2002 NBA Finals

Shaq- 37 PPG, 12.25 RPG, 4 APG, 2.75 BPG, 50/84 60% FG----4 games
Kobe-26 PPG, 5.75 RPG, 5 APG, .75 BPG, 36/70 51% FG-------4 games

MVP= Shaq again. Same old story- Shaq gets doubled coverage yet he still out performs Kobe big time.

Total average stats for 3 championships (15 games)=

Shaq=36 PPG, 15.4 RPG, 3.7 APG, 3 BPG, 209/351 60% FG, Double coverage
Kobe=20 PPG, 6 RPG, 4.6 APG, 1 BPG, 113/266 42% FG, Single coverage

Tell me, who was the big player in the finals for the Lakers? Obviously Shaq. To give Kobe credit for these championships like you would give Duncan, Shaq, MJ, Hakeem etc credit for their championships is a JOKE. Shaq was BY FAR the best player on those teams period.

Kobe is one of the most overrated bball players of all time. I would still rank him about #16 all time, which is good but most people are hit by the hype and rank him top 10 which is very untrue.

Now let’s take a look at Kobe’s other 3 championship appearances, 2 of which were losses. In a few weeks from now I predict that Kobe will have another championship appearance and a championship loss to Boston.


2004 NBA finals 5 games loss
Shaq= 27 PPG, 11 RPG, 2 APG, .6 BPG, 53/84 63% FG
Kobe=22 PPG, 3 RPG, 4 APG, .6 BPG, 43/113 38% FG

This was a 5 game loss to Detroit. But Shaq once again clearly outperformed Kobe who severely damaged his team with his terrible shooting percent instead of passing it to Shaq.

2008 NBA finals 6 games loss
Kobe= 25 PPG, 4.5 RPG, 5 APG, .16 BPG, 53/131 40% FG

Yet another terrible shooting NBA finals by Kobe.

2009 NBA finals 5 games win
Kobe= 32 PPG, 5.5 RPG, 7.4 AGP, 58/135, 42% FG

Finally his first great NBA finals performance and it only took him 6 tries to get it! But even then he shot a low 42%.


All in all, Kobe does not perform anywhere as well in the NBA finals as people think (his playoff stats outside of the NBA finals are similar to that as well).

Kobe overall NBA finals stats from 6 series averaged=

23 PPG, 5 RPG, 5 APG, 41% FG (267/645).

He gets hyped a lot because he is from the huge market of LA. I was shocked when I saw voters vote that Kobe was a better Laker than Shaq. It was no comparison!

I could understand if he was the only one on the team but he has played for extremely talented teams. Shaq took up double coverage in the first 4 NBA finals where Kobe still struggled and in the past 2 NBA finals, while Kobe was the best on his team he had good teammates that prevented opposing teams from locking down on Kobe.

Look, this wont end well.

Even though I dislike Kobe to say I would not want him on my team in the finals would be an outright lie.

And...IBTL.

The Legynd wrote:Even though I dislike Kobe to say I would not want him on my team in the finals would be an outright lie.

And...IBTL.

Why would this be locked? It is a perfectly legit thread that is similar to quite a few threads on this board right now. Many threads are analyzing players so why can't I analyze Kobe?

hopefully his stats this season will not improve go suns

its a legit point and well made

nbhadja wrote:

The Legynd wrote:Even though I dislike Kobe to say I would not want him on my team in the finals would be an outright lie.

And...IBTL.

Why would this be locked? It is a perfectly legit thread that is similar to quite a few threads on this board right now. Many threads are analyzing players so why can't I analyze Kobe?

Kobe's stats are not the reason why fans love him. His will to win is what separates himself from lebron, dwight, etc. You can analyze his stats all you want, but at the end of the day Kobe's focus and determination will be his legacy.

drtomaslight wrote:

nbhadja wrote:

The Legynd wrote:Even though I dislike Kobe to say I would not want him on my team in the finals would be an outright lie.

And...IBTL.

Why would this be locked? It is a perfectly legit thread that is similar to quite a few threads on this board right now. Many threads are analyzing players so why can't I analyze Kobe?

Kobe's stats are not the reason why fans love him. His will to win is what separates himself from lebron, dwight, etc. You can analyze his stats all you want, but at the end of the day Kobe's focus and determination will be his legacy.

so whats makes him a better player than Isiah Thomas then?

drtomaslight wrote:

nbhadja wrote:

The Legynd wrote:Even though I dislike Kobe to say I would not want him on my team in the finals would be an outright lie.

And...IBTL.

Why would this be locked? It is a perfectly legit thread that is similar to quite a few threads on this board right now. Many threads are analyzing players so why can't I analyze Kobe?

Kobe's stats are not the reason why fans love him. His will to win is what separates himself from lebron, dwight, etc. You can analyze his stats all you want, but at the end of the day Kobe's focus and determination will be his legacy.

But in the 3 seasons where Kobe did not have Shaq and Gasol, he failed to make it past the first round and he even once failed to lead a team to the playoffs. To me that was the opposite of will to win. He should have been able to lead that team past the first round at least once in 3 seasons. There is no excuse for Kobe and the Lakers to lose a 7 game series against the Suns minus Amare and go 0 for 3 in chances to advance past the 1st round.

Not only that, but for these 3 seasons Kobe was in his prime, not some young player far away from his prime.

Jimmy76 wrote:

drtomaslight wrote:
Kobe's stats are not the reason why fans love him. His will to win is what separates himself from lebron, dwight, etc. You can analyze his stats all you want, but at the end of the day Kobe's focus and determination will be his legacy.

so whats makes him a better player than Isiah Thomas then?

I never said he was better then Isiah Thomas. But if i did, i would compare 4>2.

you talk like anyone playing in the finales are not determined or focused.

i'm not convinced.


to be honest, Kobe has lots of weapons and can score in almost all ways, but that doesn't mean he is a dominant player.

drtomaslight wrote:

Jimmy76 wrote:

drtomaslight wrote:
Kobe's stats are not the reason why fans love him. His will to win is what separates himself from lebron, dwight, etc. You can analyze his stats all you want, but at the end of the day Kobe's focus and determination will be his legacy.

so whats makes him a better player than Isiah Thomas then?

I never said he was better then Isiah Thomas. But if i did, i would compare 4>2.

so we measure purely by accolades and percieved will to win then?

nbhadja wrote:

drtomaslight wrote:
Kobe's stats are not the reason why fans love him. His will to win is what separates himself from lebron, dwight, etc. You can analyze his stats all you want, but at the end of the day Kobe's focus and determination will be his legacy.

But in the 3 seasons where Kobe did not have Shaq and Gasol, he failed to make it past the first round and he even once failed to lead a team to the playoffs. To me that was the opposite of will to win. He should have been able to lead that team past the first round at least once in 3 seasons. There is no excuse for Kobe and the Lakers to lose a 7 game series against the Suns minus Amare and go 0 for 3 in chances to advance pasted the 1st round.

Not only that, but for these 3 seasons Kobe was in his prime, not some young player far away from his prime.

Thats fair to say but you have to remember who was on that team. Starting Lineup- Smuch Parker, Kobe, Lamar, Kwame Brown and Chris Mihm.

Parker, Brown and Mihm were not legit. Even MJ would have trouble with that team. Lamar now is on the bench. Kobe was basically playing with a 6th man and 3 really bad players.

Kobe owns your soul & will take it from your girl whether she likes it or not.


End of story.

Jimmy76 wrote:

drtomaslight wrote:
I never said he was better then Isiah Thomas. But if i did, i would compare 4>2.

so we measure purely by accolades and percieved will to win then?

no, we don't. its just not a coincidence why players that show that most heart and passion keep on succeeding in this league. look at the leaders of the finals champs over the last 2 decades. kobe= serious competitor, duncan=serious competitor, kg=serious competitor, hakeem = serious competitor. mj=serious competitor.

You must not know who was on that Lakers team. They was the definition of a start leading his team to the playoffs. The year he didn't make the playoffs wasn't he injured anyways. Btw that sun team finished 2nd in the NBA without Stoudemaire they weren't a sorry team.

drtomaslight wrote:

nbhadja wrote:

drtomaslight wrote:
Kobe's stats are not the reason why fans love him. His will to win is what separates himself from lebron, dwight, etc. You can analyze his stats all you want, but at the end of the day Kobe's focus and determination will be his legacy.

But in the 3 seasons where Kobe did not have Shaq and Gasol, he failed to make it past the first round and he even once failed to lead a team to the playoffs. To me that was the opposite of will to win. He should have been able to lead that team past the first round at least once in 3 seasons. There is no excuse for Kobe and the Lakers to lose a 7 game series against the Suns minus Amare and go 0 for 3 in chances to advance pasted the 1st round.

Not only that, but for these 3 seasons Kobe was in his prime, not some young player far away from his prime.

Thats fair to say but you have to remember who was on that team. Starting Lineup- Smuch Parker, Kobe, Lamar, Kwame Brown and Chris Mihm.

Parker, Brown and Mihm were not legit. Even MJ would have trouble with that team. Lamar now is on the bench. Kobe was basically playing with a 6th man and 3 really bad players.

Odom being on the bench now has no relation to back then. Odom was a 15-10-5 player. He was pretty decent. He did not have much talent around him asides from Odom but still that should be enough to advanced past the first round at least once in three tries. That certainly is more talent than the Suns without Amare. MJ and even Lebron would have taken that team past the first round. Prime Shaq/Hakeem etc would have as well.

But even more telling is Kobe's struggles in the finals with good teammates like Shaq, Gasol/Odom/Bynum. WHen you have a legendary center taking up double teams and dominating those double teams there is no reason to shoot 40% and below 40%.

it's too bad that you can't afford a TV so you watch basketball on your calculator. Maybe you should try to watch it once, it's not that bad.

nbhadja wrote:He did not have much talent around him asides from Odom but still that should be enough to advanced past the first round at least once in three tries. That certainly is more talent than the Suns without Amare.

LAL: http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2006.html
PHX: http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/PHO/2006.html

VinnyTheMick wrote:Kobe owns your soul & will take it from your girl whether she likes it or not.


End of story.

Ain't that the truth.