Game Thread #9 Wiz vs Cavs Nov 16th 7PM

[hands11]

Wall
Beal ( rotate Temple between PG and SG with Wall and Beal and use Maynor here and there if needed )
Trevor A/Webster ( or the other way around )
Ves/Booker
Gortat/Nene

I still like:
Wall
Beal
Ariza
Nene
Gortat
line-up. Nene would be a tickin' bomb as 2nd unit. And Jan was ok yesterday, but they were only Cavs. You don't put a dude from DNPs to 1st squad at once. Besides Vesely is good rebounder, so it would be better for Wizards to not share the same time with Marcin in my opinion.

They did this with great success when Nene first got here. They actually started Ves and Kevin and brought Nene off the bench with the older players. Mo Evans, etc. Nene also came off the bench last year and they won with more balance line ups. They also ( mostly because of injury ) mixed it up last year with success.

They won their first 3 games last year like this.
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400277929 AJ with Kevin starting center, Nene bench
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400277972 AJ with Singleton as SF w/ Webster, Nene bench
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278027 Crawford PG with BB, CS, Web, Oak w/Nene bench

Here they beat OKC with out Wall and no Nene
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278224 Temple PG, BB, Web, KS, Oak w/ Ves huge off the bench

Won the next 2 game with Wall coming off the bench
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278262 AJ PG w/ Wall, KS, Trevor bench
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278276 AJ PG w/ Wall, KS, Trevor, Ves, Kevin bench
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278297 lost by 1 doing the same thing
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278311 then bet Denver the same way.
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278333 Lost one then beat Portland the same way

http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278381 Wall, BB, Web, Oak, Nene... Nene played bad
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278429 Wall with Temple
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278442 Wall with Temple
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278455 Wall with Temple
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278487 Wall with Temple

http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278532 Wall, Beal, Webster, Nene, Okafor 3 wins
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278602 some losing, then won with it again

http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278649 some more losing then Wall with Temple
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278677 Wall with Temple
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278690 Wall with Temple
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278699 Wall with Temple
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278768 Wall with Temple and no Nene or Webster 47 pts
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278815 Wall with Temple and no Nene
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278828 Wall with Temple
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278858 Wall with Temple

Wow, I didn't expect that to be so clear when I first started posted the lines. But this is what I was getting at. In this cause, the one move they could do it is bring Beal off the bench and play Temple at SG like DS for Gil. Since I don't think Randy has the balls to do that, rotation Beal out early. The other move that works is bring Nene off the bench and let Gortat be Okafor. I would do both moves. Nene off the bench and Beal rotated out really. That give you a 2nd quarter line up with Beal, Trevor A/Webster and Nene.

They won most of their games last year with something other then the starting 5 we think of as
Wall, Beal, Webster, Nene and Okafor because in most cases one of Wall, Beal or Nene was recovering from injury so they were available to build a super bench. And with then there, you could play a Kevin S or a Booker or a Single and be ok.

According to the data from the games they won last year, it looks like its all in the line ups. We have the players to get it done. And Randy should have this data just as easy as I did.

[nate33]

They won their first 3 games last year like this.
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400277929 AJ with Kevin starting center, Nene bench
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400277972 AJ with Singleton as SF w/ Webster, Nene bench
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278027 Crawford PG with BB, CS, Web, Oak w/Nene bench

You fail to mention that they also lost 10 games with that same basic lineup (no Wall, Nene coming off the bench).

Here they beat OKC with out Wall and no Nene
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278224 Temple PG, BB, Web, KS, Oak w/ Ves huge off the bench

Their record without both Wall and Nene was 1-12. This is literally the ONLY game they won without them.

The one thing you pointed out that is noteworthy is that they seemed to fare pretty well with Temple in the lineup. I don't think that means we should make any kind of concerted effort to play Temple in place of Beal or Wall or anything like that, but it probably means Temple is a better option than Price, which is something I've advocated for a little while now. Neither Temple nor Price can give us much on offense, but at least Temple is a good and versatile defender who can take the pressure off Wall and Beal by guarding the opposing team's best guard.

[hands11]

They won their first 3 games last year like this.
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400277929 AJ with Kevin starting center, Nene bench
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400277972 AJ with Singleton as SF w/ Webster, Nene bench
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278027 Crawford PG with BB, CS, Web, Oak w/Nene bench

You fail to mention that they also lost 10 games with that same basic lineup (no Wall, Nene coming off the bench).

Here they beat OKC with out Wall and no Nene
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278224 Temple PG, BB, Web, KS, Oak w/ Ves huge off the bench

Their record without both Wall and Nene was 1-12. This is literally the ONLY game they won without them.

The one thing you pointed out that is noteworthy is that they seemed to fare pretty well with Temple in the lineup. I don't think that means we should make any kind of concerted effort to play Temple in place of Beal or Wall or anything like that, but it probably means Temple is a better option than Price, which is something I've advocated for a little while now. Neither Temple nor Price can give us much on offense, but at least Temple is a good and versatile defender who can take the pressure off Wall and Beal by guarding the opposing team's best guard.

I didn't fail to mention that Nate, I was just going through the Ws and seeing who was in and who wasn't. I wasn't advocating them being better without Wall or Nene on the roster, I was looking to see in what games they played with Nene coming off the bench. What I found was that they played lots of games with either Wall, Beal or Nene coming off the bench. Actually, it looks like most their wins came that way. Lots with Beal off the bench. Now that wasn't by choice so much as it was a result of them phasing them back in as they recovered from injury, but the results are pretty clear. Wall, Beal and Nene had big games coming off the bench and the team won more.

What I have been advocating is using the talent they have better to create line up that create mismatches, a better bench and more balance line up that creates more scoring opportunities and better defense. Create a better bench with what you have. I have suggested one way to do that is to start Ves with Nene off the bench. Another idea I had was the pair Temple with Wall more in the beginning of the game ala Gil/DS. They can do with by starting a player and removing them early or changing the starting line up. One way to get there is this.

Wall/Temple - with Temple coming in early in the first for Beal, then Temple/Beal back to Wall/Beal
Beal
Webster/Trevor
Ves/Nene/Booker
Gortat/Kevin

In a Wall, Temple, Webster/Trevor A, Ves, Gortat line up, thats when Wall would be set on scoring more. If you need more scoring, you bring in Nene. But it gives you a much better 2nd unit as well with Beal, Trevor A, Nene on it to anchor it.

Miami does this with Wade if you check game flow. Wade comes out early so he is ready to run the start of the 2nd quarter. Randy has been playing Beal all of the first and only some into the 2nd. What I want to see them do is remove one of the scorers and use Temple and Ves as glue guys that are long defensive players that don't need to shoot. This makes them more athletic, better defensively, and it frees the scoring up for the remaining scorer. It also creates a much better 2nd unit to chew up on other teams weaker 2nd units and it matchs up better with teams that create strong 2nd units by doing this very same thing ala Miami and what CLE did to us.

Try to maximize having only 4 scorers and one of Ves/Booker or Temple as the glue. That's what I think they need to do.