Hindsight is 20/20

[hands11]

In fairness to Beal. He was the best player of a depleted starting line up last year. Harden got to cut his teeth coming off the bench on a team with KD and Westbrook.

Also, Beal is 20 and is 13 games into his 2nd season.

Beal is better then Harden was at the same stage of their careers.

[payitforward]

harden's ability to create and get to the line would have been perfect in this system. it's especially frustrating to see Beal settle for jumpers because his dribble-drive isn't developed.

beal's a good player, but he's nowhere near harden's level.

?
Harden is four years older than Beal. It's not out of the question by any means that Beal become a player on "Harden's level."

[TGW]

harden's ability to create and get to the line would have been perfect in this system. it's especially frustrating to see Beal settle for jumpers because his dribble-drive isn't developed.

beal's a good player, but he's nowhere near harden's level.

?
Harden is four years older than Beal. It's not out of the question by any means that Beal become a player on "Harden's level."

I never said he couldn't reach Harden's level...I said right now he's nowhere near Harden's level, which is true. beal would have to work very hard on his game to develop the all around game Harden has. We tend to overrate beal here so much, when in reality he really isn't all that great of a player. not yet, at least.

[stevemcqueen1]

Imagine Wall with the drives into the lane and the kick-outs to the Beard for 3.

Beal is shooting 44% from three doing this this season. Harden is shooting 29% from three this season. Beal's shot .399 from three for his career on 1.8 makes per game whereas Harden is a career .364 shooter on 1.7 makes per game. Beal's 3 ball numbers as a rookie were almost as good as Harden's best year.

Beal's a better pure shooter than Harden.

[montestewart]

Well if I could go back I wouldn't make that dumbass Miller/Foye trade and I'd pick Steph Curry. Don't know what that does to every year that follows.

They could have resigned Pech to even things out.

[Ruzious]

There's a lot of BS about Harden in this thread. He's got by far the best +/- on Houston this season - just like he did last season. Opposing 2's have an 11.0 PER against Houston when he's in - with a .42 eFG. I don't watch him on a regular basis, but when I've seen him it's been obvious he's a very talented defensive player. And to imply Houston acquired Howard because of Harden's defensive deficiencies is just absurd - especially when they already had Asik. They got Howard because he's a great player when healthy.

[Illmatic21]

I'm not so sure. Harden is indeed a fabulous offensive player, but his defense is horrendous -- part of the reason they needed Howard. Beal could turn out to be the better all around player.

Also, we would have had to give up Chris Singleton in the deal so....

On second thought, we should have made the deal.

Fish - Agree that Harden's not known for his defensive prowess. However, he is a legit #1 option who does not need the ball to dominate. Imagine Wall with the drives into the lane and the kick-outs to the Beard for 3. IMHO, that would have been a more lethal backcourt that could have done some significant damage deep into the playoffs.

When you have the opportunity to acquire an Olympian and all-around consensus top-20 player, you do it and deal with the aftermath later.

As I mentioned above, Beard would have also helped attract other superstar caliber talent that we crave/need.

Again - Damn you Ted for nixing that deal.

Harden does in fact need the ball, he is a very high usage player. Even in OKC, he rarely played off the ball. He would come in as the primary ballhandler/playmaker of their second unit. He's not a great off the ball player because he isn't an elite shooter, and doesn't really have a developed midrange game.

Obviously he's a better player than Beal right now.

[Illmatic21]

There's a lot of BS about Harden in this thread. He's got by far the best +/- on Houston this season - just like he did last season. Opposing 2's have an 11.0 PER against Houston when he's in - with a .42 eFG. I don't watch him on a regular basis, but when I've seen him it's been obvious he's a very talented defensive player.

Defensive stats are misleading.

Harden is one of the few players who you can tell is a terrible defender just by the eye test. Watch a Houston game this season, he is one of the laziest defensive players I've seen.

http://nba.si.com/2013/11/11/james-hard ... n-rockets/

[relinquishy]

There's a lot of BS about Harden in this thread. He's got by far the best +/- on Houston this season - just like he did last season. Opposing 2's have an 11.0 PER against Houston when he's in - with a .42 eFG. I don't watch him on a regular basis, but when I've seen him it's been obvious he's a very talented defensive player. And to imply Houston acquired Howard because of Harden's defensive deficiencies is just absurd - especially when they already had Asik. They got Howard because he's a great player when healthy.

He's by no means a good defensive player. He sleepwalks on defense so often.

[Kanyewest]

Some of Harden's work defensively. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NIyiEc1741s

He wasn't this bad of defender in OKC though.

[doclinkin]

Ernie vs doc:

PG Arenas/Blake
SG Hughes/Jarvis?
SF Jarvis/Jeffries
PF Kwame/Jeffries
C Haywood/Etan

O4 Draft
1st-- No Jamison trade. I wanted Iggy. SG/SF
2nd-- I liked Romain Sato but that's another SF/SG so would have gone
C/PF Pape Sow. Sato has had a great Euro career. Sow, neh.

05
1st --traded by MJ for Haywood and Laron Profit
2nd -- SF/PF Ryan Gomes or C Robert Whaley. Whaley had attitude problems, Gomes was a tweener with proven skills in the Big East. Coin flip. At the time I liked attitude problems in a Big, mean spirited, but I also liked Etan Thomas who we had at that spot. Gomes.

06
Hughes free agent was asking too much. Likely to leave.
1st -- I liked PGs Rondo and Kyle Lowry as fast defenders to make up for Arenas' inattention at this end. Would have gone with Rondo probably on the strength of his 100 pt game in HS and success in international play.
2nd -- eh. Cheik Samb maybe?

I would have stolen JJ Barea as an undrafted, I noticed him when we'd picked up PJR and saw the shortest dude on the court was out rebounding everyone else in international play. His numbers held up at Northeastern.

07
Kwame was traded for Caron to replace Hughes. I loved Caron but that was a surprise for me, would never have thought to pull off that heist. Credit Ernie. Anyway I'd have had Iggy so Caron wouldn't be the target.

DRAFT
We needed a PF (no Jamison in my world) or SGs who could shoot to replace Hughes who could not, and to give room for Iggy to dunk.

1st -- I liked Bellinelli, Mo Money, Rudy Fernandez, but had been watching PF/C Tiago Splitter since he was 17 and was a Dirk wannabe shooting and dribbling from the perimeter. And loved Nick Fazekas as a big with range and a nice fit for the Princeton ranged offense.

Wanted Morris Almond most, but was up in the air about who really was best so when in doubt I preferred to trade down and pick up extra picks or future picks if possible and taken whomever was left. Splitter was touted as a lotto pick for years but had a contract issue in Spain. I liked SAS draft and stash method and would have taken him anyway.

Call it Almond/Splitter? Rudy/Fazekas? But I very well could have blown it with an Almond/Fazekas 1st round. I still maintain that Fazekas would have been a great fit in the system and we've seen that Morris Almond's primary deficiency was defense (which never would have bothered EFJ) okay and an unwillingness to pass. But Eddie liked chuckers. So in my fantasy realm I'm still winning that draft.

Though with Iggy on the team I probably would have gone Rudy (as a Hughes clone who could shoot) or Belli (with sweet range and nice passing.

2nd -- I liked SF - Dom McGuire and C -Pau's younger brother. Marc Gasol had the same birthday as EFJ, and we needed a passing Princeton center to facilitate from the top of the key and hit jumpers. Success in international play tips it to the fatter Gasol brother.

08
1st -- Wanted Hibbert so bad. Would have tried to trade up though post draft rumors suggested that Ernie tried to, so no fault here. Since he was gone I wanted nobody, would have traded down. I liked Nico Batum as a draft and stash possibility.

2nd -- Bill Walker, Richard Hendrix, Sasha Kaun, Ramon Sessions. Pick two since I was trading down. Would have stashed Kaun if we did not get Batum. Hendrix has great numbers, Bill Walker did the dirty work that his teammate Mike Beasley would not and made him look good. With Iggy at SF I think Hendrix/Kaun would have been more likely.

09
Well unless injuries played a role we would not have drafted as high as all this but:
1st -- Stef Curry regardless. Even with Rondo/Arenas. One of whom may have been traded already. Was praying Rubio would not fall to #5 since I was nervous that his lack of scoring would prove ugly, but thought he'd be impossible to pass up. I would have taken Stef even if I thought I had to trade up to get him. Then I thought I could trade down and still get Harden if Stef was gone. Would have been wrong about that.

2nd -- DJ Blair falling this far would really be impossible to pass. Loved how he manhandled Hasheem Thabeet.

And the rest is irrelevant. No way we would have selected #1 in the lotto if our team was:

PG Arenas/Rondo
SG Arenas/Stef
SF Iggy/(Almond?)
PF (Fazekas?)/Blair
C Gasol/Haywood

But for what its worth:
2010:
1st round: Middle round pick and needing a PF/SF I'd have gone with one of Booker, Pondexter, Damion James, Craig Brackins. Liked Cole Aldrige and Larry Sanders; knew Greivis would succeed.

2nd" eh. Luke Harangody maybe?

2011:
1st -- Trade up for whichever of Jonas Valanciunas or Enes Kanter was within reach. Unlikely though, so trade down if possible and select two. There were a few I liked this draft. Loved Fareid. Kemba Walker. Would be happy on draft day with either of Klay Thompson or Vucevic, both of whom had professional ballplaying parents. Thompson I knew would fall since he had a pot issues.

2nd -- Chandler Parsons clutch threes twice to win games at the final buzzer had me looking. Liked Justin Harper, Andrew Goudelock, Keith Benson if I had multiples.

2012
1st -- Beal.
2nd -- Jae Crowder as the SF equivalent to Fareid.

2013
1st. -- Noel. Though I was satisfied with Porter, since Noel fell I doubt I could have passed him. If he hadn't fallen I would have been happy to trade down too for KCP and Dieng or Len.

2nd (we had 2) -- Nate Wolters and Arsalan Kasemi. Hah! ...dang... Though I think Glen Rice will be good. He was off my radar.

So in perfect 20/20 hindsight:

Rondo/Stef
Stef/Batum/Klay
Iggy/Batum/Parsons/Crowder
Faried/DJ Blair/Parsons
Gasol/Splitter/Haywood (who I would have held on to)

Coach: Thom Tippytoe or Dave Joerger.

= Championship!

[Ruzious]

There's a lot of BS about Harden in this thread. He's got by far the best +/- on Houston this season - just like he did last season. Opposing 2's have an 11.0 PER against Houston when he's in - with a .42 eFG. I don't watch him on a regular basis, but when I've seen him it's been obvious he's a very talented defensive player.

Defensive stats are misleading.

Harden is one of the few players who you can tell is a terrible defender just by the eye test. Watch a Houston game this season, he is one of the laziest defensive players I've seen.

http://nba.si.com/2013/11/11/james-hard ... n-rockets/

The stats that you say are misleading presumably include the stats quoted in that article.

Yes, that stats don't tell the whole story by a long-shot - just like the stats quoted in your article don't - as defense is played as a team - but if he was the incredibly bad defender some of you are saying he is - opposing 2's would be torching the Rockets when he's in the game, and they haven't.

[Ruzious]

Some of Harden's work defensively. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NIyiEc1741s

He wasn't this bad of defender in OKC though.

Seriously? That's a video intended to show his defensive short-comings, and yet - at the 22 second mark, it shows how his length bothered the shooter into a miss, and there's at least one more similar play on that short video.

[montestewart]

Some of Harden's work defensively. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NIyiEc1741s

He wasn't this bad of defender in OKC though.

Seriously? That's a video intended to show his defensive short-comings, and yet - at the 22 second mark, it shows how his length bothered the shooter into a miss, and there's at least one more similar play on that short video.

His length, strength, and quickness allow him to harass shooters, but he takes his eye off his man too much. He's not the worst defender, but that vid shows opponents repeatedly getting open looks or lanes due to Harden's inattention to anything but where the ball is.

[stevemcqueen1]

Some of Harden's work defensively. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NIyiEc1741s

He wasn't this bad of defender in OKC though.

Seriously? That's a video intended to show his defensive short-comings, and yet - at the 22 second mark, it shows how his length bothered the shooter into a miss, and there's at least one more similar play on that short video.

Come on Ruz, there is almost nothing positive to take away from that. Awful fundamentals. Poor awareness. Embarrassing effort.

His defense has been horrid since he got to the Rockets. Houston's perimeter defense is backbreaking and he's a huge part of that. Talk to any Houston fan and it's their first complaint. And the worst part is that team does have a foundation for defense. They've got two of the best defensive bigs in the game.

Harden has never been a good defender, but he used to at least play hard on D in OKC.

[hands11]

Some of Harden's work defensively. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NIyiEc1741s

He wasn't this bad of defender in OKC though.

Seriously? That's a video intended to show his defensive short-comings, and yet - at the 22 second mark, it shows how his length bothered the shooter into a miss, and there's at least one more similar play on that short video.

Come on Ruz, there is almost nothing positive to take away from that. Awful fundamentals. Poor awareness. Embarrassing effort.

His defense has been horrid since he got to the Rockets. Houston's perimeter defense is backbreaking and he's a huge part of that. Talk to any Houston fan and it's their first complaint. And the worst part is that team does have a foundation for defense. They've got two of the best defensive bigs in the game.

Harden has never been a good defender, but he used to at least play hard on D in OKC.

For those that miss Gil and need to get their fix, watch Harden. They aren't an exact match, but I see a lot of similarities.

[pancakes3]

So in perfect 20/20 hindsight:

Rondo/Stef
Stef/Batum/Klay
Iggy/Batum/Parsons/Crowder
Faried/DJ Blair/Parsons
Gasol/Splitter/Haywood (who I would have held on to)

Coach: Thom Tippytoe or Dave Joerger.

= Championship!

I'd say so since Klay - a top 5 sg in the league - is buried on the bench as is Parsons, an average/above average starter. Basically it looks like you assembled a souped up Warriors with a better frontcourt. Cap is killer though.