Discuss Ernie Grunfeld's GM skills here (Part 2)

[gambitx777]

So, let's talk about moving Mahinmi with pick(s) for some sort of cap relief. Sure it's allowed, but is it a realistic possibility?

Is Mahinmi moveable for cap space or useful players right now with any number of picks attached? Say the Wizards' 2018 1st and 2nd and 2020 1st?

Is there a team that could absorb Mahinmi directly into their cap space (Philly needs another injured center)? Is there a team that could send back 2018 expirings (this would not give the Wizards any breathing room this off season)? Is there a team that could/would send useful players back? Or would you have to take back contracts that are just as bad or worse?

Also discussed elsewhere, Gortat is more moveable. But then you'd need a good backup center who will cost almost as much as Gortat unless you think you can depend on Mahinmi for 35+ minutes a night.

I can't see how we discuss moving Mahinmi with a pick without fully acknowledging the disaster of the 2016 FA signings, overpaying for three front court backups and having to surrender 1st round picks to move two of them within a year. That fits neatly on the list with the Miller trade and the 2011 draft, and coupled with the trades for Gortat and Morris, it shows that not only do Terd n Ernie not value 2nd round picks, they don't even seem to recognize the value of 1st round picks.

Right, 2016 was Ernie's epic FA fail, just as Foye/Miller was his epic trade fail and 2011 was his epic draft fail.

The short version of my question is if Ted fired Ernie tomorrow and they wanted to cut their losses on Mahinmi would it even be possible? Would anyone take him even with 2-3 picks attached?

You can't Trump up the value of picks in other posts and then say oh it would take 3-4 firsts for move him for sure. It took one! One first round pick and a close to busting prospect and filler to get boogie. Yes he has person issues but the dudes legit. There are teams out there in needs of pick that would take a first or two for mahinmi. And actually yes the 76ers might be interested in mahinmi and a pick for say Covington or holes or a couple second in this draft. Because they need salary and in actuality there big man situation could use a vet plus mahinmi would be one less year and less money that over paying someone this season to fill salary. As stated they can keep adding all these seconds to the team they need salary on the books. That's one option. Chicago is viable they need a back up center pretty bad and rondon for mahinmi just to cut rondo for cap room I could live with. Probably wouldn't cost us an unprotected pick. Also every one touts the value of GM's getting creative. Well let's see EG do it, no I have no faith in him but hey. Also a disclaimer I said these options were painful. But at what point is leaving the wound open and bleeding till it stops better than just taking a torch to it and sealing the wound. Yes it hurts but some times it's better than living with an open wound. Tossing a first maybe 2019 or 2020 or 2021 loto protected at the kings for kofus and Galloway might be a move worth doing, Save a couple mill and we get a cheaper center and a one year deal out of it. Those deal happen and are out there. maybe we can talk them in to Richardson with his injury and all.

[dckingsfan]

Just checking in to see if EG still sucks

[gambitx777]

Well he definitely still isn't very good at the very least.

[payitforward]

I think that there are ways to get us out of this cap strap and get us younger and a bit better for less money, but i don't think people will like them. There are hard choices to make and IDK if EG has the balls to do the potentially painful things he would have to do to get us out of his messes and make us actually better ( maybe not by much but anything is better).

You keep saying that, & you keep being wrong. Earlier today, or yesterday, you had us getting cap room by renouncing Bogdanovic!

Still, in a sense your are right. There's a way to get us under the cap & younger -- though definitely not better:

1. Let Otto walk for nothing.
2. Pick up Sheldon Mac's option.
3. Buy 4 more R2 picks this year to go w/ our #52.
4. Pick & keep all 5 R2 guys.

There you go, we're under the cap. Not by much, mind you, yet still.... But you might mean something more like:

1. Let Otto walk for nothing.
2. Pick up Sheldon Mac's option.
3. Pick someone @ #52, & sign him.
4. Sign Bogdanovic using Bird rights -- lets say for $5m ??
5. Use the MLE to sign a player.
6. Hmmm. That's it. The MLE guy took us over the cap. We can't add anyone -- & we only have 13 players, which is a problem since the minimum as of the coming season is 14 players. There must be a way to solve this problem: perhaps you are allowed to add a veteran minimum player. Or...?

Ah, no. Whew -- we can pick up Ochefu's option as well. We've made it to 14. But... this path doesn't get us younger, & it sure doesn't get us better either.

But, hey, these are just rules; I'm sure we'll hear how we can do it w/o obeying the rules!

Well piff if we let otto walk that would give up about what 13 mill in cap room ? yeah bogz would give us 7. No one is suggesting we let otto walk, and we all expect to keel McCellan all ready and yes we should buy some seconds. But the last time I checked it was perfectly allowed to tie a pick to mahinmi to move him? Painful yes does it get us cap relief absolutely (depending on the deal). Last time I checked it was allowed to trade gortat? Last time I checked it wa allowed to denounce bogz, last time I checked it wa allowed to trade smith? yeah all that is in the rules Yes it hurts to do those things but don'e right would get us out of the cap situation you say is hopeless. All with in the confines of the rules.

Gambit, here's what you said:

...there are ways to get us out of this cap strap and get us younger and a bit better for less money.

But i really can't see any such ways.

If we let Porter walk, then with McClellan we have 10 guys & are $8m under the cap. If we also let Bogdanovic walk, we have exactly the same: 10 guys & $8m under the cap. You have to have 14 guys, no fewer.

But as you say, "no one is suggesting we let Otto walk" -- so, lets add him: now we have 11 players & are way over the cap -- at least $12m over. Renouncing Bogdanovic has no effect on this either.

In that case, if we traded Mahinmi & took no salary back at all, just a future pick (not that this is likely), then we'd be at 10 players & @ $3m under the cap. We'd have to add at least 4 players to get to the league minimum. Could we add 4 players & remain under the cap? No. But we could at least still get the guys! For example, we could sign our #52 pick, sign someone w/ the MLE, & add 2-3 veteran minimum guys.

At that point, we'd be at 14 or 15; we'd be over the cap, & depending on who that MLE player was we might not be all that bad. But, going forward we'd be in a lot worse shape, having wasted asset after asset with not much to show.

[payitforward]

...Chicago is viable they need a back up center pretty bad and rondon for mahinmi just to cut rondo for cap room I could live with....

Did you really write that? Ok, I'm beginning to get it. You just don't have any idea of how the league structures this stuff.

[gambitx777]

...Chicago is viable they need a back up center pretty bad and rondon for mahinmi just to cut rondo for cap room I could live with....

Did you really write that? Ok, I'm beginning to get it. You just don't have any idea of how the league structures this stuff.

Rondos deal worth 14 is only guaranteed 3 million $ if cut before or on june 31st. So yes, I have a very good idea how this stuff works, if you make that deal before june 31st, you can cut rondo and only have him count as 3 million in dead cap, therefore creating 12 million in cap relief.

Bogz has a cap hold of 7 and you have jennings and burke coming off the books to the tune of about 7 million.
we were over the cap by about 8 million at the end of the season, 94.1 mill was the cap. we sat around 102.2 take ottos 4.8 and bogz 3.7 off along with jennings 5 and burkes 3.3. that reduces to 16.8. that puts us at 85.4 add in ottos cap hold of 14 and bogz of 7 puts us at about 106 ish with raises a bit more, and the cap is going to be around 107-110 by projections. remove bogz is you renounce him puts us at 100. then do that mahinmi deal, puts us at 90 ish. So that could leave us with any where from 14-20 mill in cap. which would be used up by otto unless you sign guys first then sign otto. or as you said sign otto and then use your exceptions, vet min deals and UDFA to fill out the team and be under the cap and we would still be a good team with a better cap future going forward. But yes I agree it hurts and it sucks to do it.

[diaboliQ_Mo]

Anybody, heard about David Griffin, just let go by the Cavs?
I know that his asking price would be more than the Wiz can afford and there's no reason why he ever wants to come here. But getting somebody like him and letting him execute sign and trade deal somehow between Otto and Paul George (I know it does not work like that) would be a quantum leap we need to take out of this midiocrity! I'm out!

[closg00]

Anybody, heard about David Griffin, just let go by the Cavs?
I know that his asking price would be more than the Wiz can afford and there's no reason why he ever wants to come here. But getting somebody like him and letting him execute sign and trade deal somehow between Otto and Paul George (I know it does not work like that) would be a quantum leap we need to take out of this midiocrity! I'm out!

Read the Wire Tap article and fan comments, Gilbert is a giant prick who never re-ups a GM. Of-course I would welcome anyone new here at GM.

[FAH1223]

Read on Twitter

[closg00]

Read on Twitter

The fact that Ernie's contract extensions are done quietly and out of the media spotlight, tells you everything you need to know about Ted & Ernie, such a disgrace, Ernie will be a lifer like Wes.

[payitforward]

It's a good answer -- give him that.

[BigA]

via Imgflip Meme Generator

[FAH1223]

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[closg00]

Read on Twitter

The comments are hilarious, Ted is a trollish-looking dumb man.


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[BigA]

So, do we know how many people work in college scouting for the Wizards? If they aren't going to be drafting anyone for the foreseeable future, couldn't they reduce the headcount there? They'll still need to evaluate undrafted FAs.

[keynote]

I'll say this: unlike last year, EG is getting decent value for each guy. Frazier is likely worth a low second rounder. Meeks-if-healthy is worth the money. Scott is too.

But the overall vision still isn't there. Frazier and Meeks-if-healthy on cheap deals would be terrific if they played alongside a Rudy Gay-type super sub at the 4. Scott on a cheap deal would be a smart pickup if he played with the next Dion Waiters our Lou Williams (or a freshly bought-out Ellis). But you can't expect to contend with a bench with zero dynamic players. Not a single guy on our bench can get hot and carry the offense for a quarter.

Barring a trade, it's clear that the FO is content to lick their wounds and play it safe after last year's offseason debacle. They've looked at their hand. They're betting that the noise we made in the playoffs plus re-signing Porter will be enough to satisfy the fan base. They're betting that Wall will blink first and take the extension. They're betting that just enough is just enough.

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[closg00]

Once, just once, I'd like to see Ernie wait until later in the summer to make final moves. Ernie prefers to grab players like Scott and Meeks rather than see if you can score on overlooked talent playing in Summer League.

[Kanyewest]

Once, just once, I'd like to see Ernie wait until later in the summer to make final moves. Ernie prefers to grab players like Scott and Meeks rather than see if you can score on overlooked talent playing in Summer League.

IIRC, EG did add DeShawn Stevenson and Martell Webster pretty late.

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[pcbothwel]

I'll say this: unlike last year, EG is getting decent value for each guy. Frazier is likely worth a low second rounder. Meeks-if-healthy is worth the money. Scott is too.

But the overall vision still isn't there. Frazier and Meeks-if-healthy on cheap deals would be terrific if they played alongside a Rudy Gay-type super sub at the 4. Scott on a cheap deal would be a smart pickup if he played with the next Dion Waiters our Lou Williams (or a freshly bought-out Ellis). But you can't expect to contend with a bench with zero dynamic players. Not a single guy on our bench can get hot and carry the offense for a quarter.

Barring a trade, it's clear that the FO is content to lick their wounds and play it safe after last year's offseason debacle. They've looked at their hand. They're betting that the noise we made in the playoffs plus re-signing Porter will be enough to satisfy the fan base. They're betting that Wall will blink first and take the extension. They're betting that just enough is just enough.

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I have a feeling that EG is going to do a really solid (B+) job this offseason.
I think most everyone here thinks the depth deals have been great so far (Frazier, Meeks, Scott), assuming they are just that...

But I think EG is cooking up something having to do with a Bogs SnT to get us a massive trade exception. He might be combining Bogs with someone like Smith to get us a 20M exception and I think I know why.

Look at the West fellas. The Pelicans are not going to make the playoffs. Even if Cousins/AD fit well, I see them chasing the 8th seed. But if they dont, it could get bad:
1) GSW: Nuff said
2) SAS: Nuff Said
3) Rockets: Added CP3
4) LAC: Lost CP3, but added Beverly and Gallo
5) Thunder: Added PG13
6) Jazz: Might keep Hayward
7) T-Wolves: Added Teague and Butler
8) Nuggets: Front court as good as Pels with everything else better

Someone tell me who the Pelicans finish in front of???
And if in February it doesnt look good, what team could/would offer: pure cap space, young player (Oubre), and multiple 1st..

[Rafael122]

The problem I have with Ernie is this: dude wants to end his offseason early so he can spend the rest of the time on vacation.

Case in point: he signed Jodie Meeks. He's probably a tier 5 free agent, i.e. the last guys to sign because everyone else is so busy trying to make trades or add the big free agents to their team. In other words, Meeks was going to be on the market 3 weeks from now.

The reason I have an issue with it is that Jamal Crawford got traded to Atlanta, and there's rumors of a buyout. Instead of Ernie waiting for the market to settle for situations like this, he signs Meeks for the BAE and calls it a day. IDK how much Crawford is going to get, he might get the minimum from some team but for the sake of argument, he gets paid out $12 million of his $14 million due, we sign him for the BAE and he comes out ahead almost a couple million bucks. What's the rush?