Slather me, Lather me, Blather me - 2011 Draft Thread 5

[Induveca]

Of course, and entire season of development lost would be more of an impact to a young team like the Wiz, but by comparison, older teams like the Celtics, Lakers, and Spurs come back yet another year older, so not sure who's hurt more by that.

Obviously not saying I want it to happen, but the Wiz might be better able to survive and thrive than other franchises.

I think the older teams/players benefit from the lack of a 2011-2012 season. While these players may be a year older, they've also now gotten a full year of rest and recovery for their aging bodies.

After 33/34.........age is age unfortunately. Although I'm sure tons of these guys are already running to "Anti-Aging" clinics (AKA HGH/Test/DHEA distributors).

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

What about young guys built like Kanter? Some of them have possibly been to that type clinic, no?

I was watching ESPN's NFL's greatest games and saw a former player whose head looked bigger in the same manner Barry Bonds' does this days. Juicing makes the noggin bigger indeed.

As for NBA players, I can't blame them if they take this lockout and do whatever they need to do to get ahead. Gasol IMO should go play in Spain. Guys, if they've got good doctors, probably should build up. If Pierre comes back weighing 270 and is ripped, God bless him IMO.

The truth is some people, like Sly Stallone and many of the most famous Olympians, Lance Armstrong, etc. have the resources to get clinically enhanced in ways that are probably not going to hurt them long-term, are definitely going to help them short-term, and with no league paying them they can do what they please.

One thing all the players have to make sure they do is get proper insurance coverage. Heaven forbid they have some sort of traumatic injury right now--the league's not covering them.

[rockymac52]

The truth is some people, like Sly Stallone and many of the most famous Olympians, Lance Armstrong, etc. have the resources to get clinically enhanced in ways that are probably not going to hurt them long-term, are definitely going to help them short-term, and with no league paying them they can do what they please.

Hate to say it, and by no means encouraging it, but if there was ever a time for an NBA player to do steroids, wouldn't it be now?

Don't know how long they stay in your system, so I suppose if the lockout ended sooner than expected you might be caught off guard and fail your first drug test, so probably (definitely) not worth the risk, but hey, Rashard took PEDs even without the lockout, so who knows?

Also for all I know they still drug test during the lockout, but I feel like that wouldn't make much sense...

Last random PED thought/question... If there's no drug testing during lockout, and a player starts using PEDs, then the lockout ends and that player is drug tested and fails the test, would that player still be punished? Couldn't that player just say he took the PEDs during the lockout when he didn't have to follow the rules of the NBA anymore, and since the end of the lockout, he stopped using?

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

I think the older teams/players benefit from the lack of a 2011-2012 season. While these players may be a year older, they've also now gotten a full year of rest and recovery for their aging bodies.

After 33/34.........age is age unfortunately. Although I'm sure tons of these guys are already running to "Anti-Aging" clinics (AKA HGH/Test/DHEA distributors).

As if on cue, I read on Realgm wiretap that Kobe's trying out a new treatment overseas: Cryotherapy.

That's one type of experimental treatment to take advantage of overseas. There are others.

[dobrojim]

While they (PEDs) appear to work and recognizing there is incredible
pressure to use, I would try to stay away from them. Long term
these things can't be good for you. Seriously.

[Zonkerbl]

If you fail a drug test you are in violation. Doesn't matter when you took the drug. You're not failing drug tests during the lockout because they are not being administered.

[hands11]

Super, if the Wizards threw a max deal at Nene, and he accepted it, I'd absolutely positively recant any and all negative comments I've posted about the direction of the team. One low post guy who can score efficiently on the blocks, defend like nobody's business, and who plays unselfishly would make this team super competive. Nene is that guy.

How good would the Wiz be with Nene? Washington could add Nene and really make some noise.

As it is, I think he would complete the Magic next to Dwight Howard. Boston's getting old. Miami doesn't have the cap room, but he could lift them to the title, easily at C. My bet is he rejoins Carmelo in NY.

As this is the draft thread, I wonder if the Wizards could throw player(s) and future picks in a deal to get Nene?

Not yet. They just are not at that point in the rebuild. I doubt you will see anything different then what they have. The time for the deals you are talking about will not happen this year but more likely will happen after they play another season. Whenever that is.

[Induveca]

I won't lie in the UK I'm on HGH TED DHEA and supplements. It's normal here if you have the money,

[fishercob]

Why?

[montestewart]

^
Anything shriveling? Any rage? Accelerated recovery after walking up stairs? Quicker hand speed when reaching for credit card? Gotta know, since I'm considering same. I need to raise my game to the next level.

[gesa2]

I don't know what I would do if I was a professional athlete. The potential advantages of using PEDs in a situation where a slight edge could mean going from a bench to a rotation player, recovering from an injury in time for the playoffs, etc. would be hard to resist. But as a middle aged family doc I believe firmly that my best bet for living long and well involves eating whole foods, getting exercise and not being stupid with alcohol, caffeine, etc.. It doesn't have to be more complicated than that, and anybody that says they know they have better answers is selling something.

We don't know anywhere near enough about how we age and die for me to believe that taking a pill or shot of some chemical is going to help, and history is littered with stories of treatments and drugs that looked good, were sold on rational physiological premises, but caused harm in the long run. Not for me.

[hands11]

I don't know what I would do if I was a professional athlete. The potential advantages of using PEDs in a situation where a slight edge could mean going from a bench to a rotation player, recovering from an injury in time for the playoffs, etc. would be hard to resist. But as a middle aged family doc I believe firmly that my best bet for living long and well involves eating whole foods, getting exercise and not being stupid with alcohol, caffeine, etc.. It doesn't have to be more complicated than that, and anybody that says they know they have better answers is selling something.

We don't know anywhere near enough about how we age and die for me to believe that taking a pill or shot of some chemical is going to help, and history is littered with stories of treatments and drugs that looked good, were sold on rational physiological premises, but caused harm in the long run. Not for me.

I remember watching a great piece on aging and what the body does. Basically it boiling down to some basic genes. People fell into three groups. There was one group that had a regenerating/repairing gene or something. Basically some one like George Burns. People like that can get away with a lot more than others.

[Induveca]

^
Anything shriveling? Any rage? Accelerated recovery after walking up stairs? Quicker hand speed when reaching for credit card? Gotta know, since I'm considering same. I need to raise my game to the next level.

Haha, good comeback. Actually my family has high blood pressure, it's hereditary. Same thing with cholesterol.

I've been in great shape for a guy 35 soon to be 36 for years now. However, my blood pressure remained elevated no matter what I did in terms of diet/cardio/exercise. That's when I started reading some amazing stories on hormone replacement therapy in Europe. It's not all for muscle building or endurance, this therapy has done amazing stuff for me.

My hair is much thicker. Beard much thicker. Of course there are muscle benefits. I went from 14% bodyfat down to 8%, and have gained 10 pounds of lean muscle.

Most importantly? I'm being weaned off of my blood pressure medicine, my BP has dropped so much I've had to reduce the mg 50% in BP pills i've been taking for 8 years because my pressure was too low on them. My cholesterol levels are superb..........in another 4-5 months I will be able to ditch the blood pressure meds.

HGH has been around for 50 years. Testosterone even longer. For what it's worth, I did a 500 dollar blood test in an anti aging clinic, most comprehensive blood test available. A compounding pharmacist formulates all the stuff to address your specific deficiencies based on the blood tests. It's all legal, I have the documents, prescription and even a card to carry around with me in the US and EU for customs.

This stuff, while ridiculously expensive really is a holy grail of medicine. In 10 years it will be the norm in my opinion. I did an immense amount of research, and some of the studies are astounding. Of course, the pharmaceutical industries don't want you to know about the true benefits, as things like blood pressure medicines, cholesterol meds, depression meds would be at serious risk if everyone went on this stuff.

[montestewart]

^
That's pretty interesting Induveca. I'm going to scope around on line and see what I can find. If you know any good site sources, let me know. I don't have high BP, but high cholesterol in my family, and too high body fat. Of course, it could be all those chili, bacon, egg and cheese burgers we eat.

[gesa2]

HGH has been around for 50 years. Testosterone even longer. For what it's worth, I did a 500 dollar blood test in an anti aging clinic, most comprehensive blood test available. A compounding pharmacist formulates all the stuff to address your specific deficiencies based on the blood tests. It's all legal, I have the documents, prescription and even a card to carry around with me in the US and EU for customs.

This stuff, while ridiculously expensive really is a holy grail of medicine. In 10 years it will be the norm in my opinion. I did an immense amount of research, and some of the studies are astounding. Of course, the pharmaceutical industries don't want you to know about the true benefits, as things like blood pressure medicines, cholesterol meds, depression meds would be at serious risk if everyone went on this stuff.

Believe me, I'm no fan of the pharmaceutical companies. And I hope that you turn out to be right. But I know that the only research that purports to show HGH testosterone etc. has an anti aging effect is flawed. Short term non randomized studies testing secondary markers instead of patient oriented outcomes like death or long term quality of life. Lots of biomarkers and hormone levels in other words, but nothing that proves you won't have any of 1000 complications after using the drug for 10 years. It's a free world, and I don't have any need to tell you how to live your life or what choices to make. But anybody thinking about following your path should do the research themselves and discuss it carefully with someone who understands the issues and isn't selling them anything.

[Induveca]

Gesa,

I appreciate the concern. One of my best friends is a leading research doctor and while he thinks I'm nuts at spending the cash he agrees the stuff works as well, and if I can get off blood pressure meds with hgh/test/dhea he's all for it as well.

Horrible example I know, but a huge portion of actors have been on this stuff for 15 years now. I went to a few clinics in the US and UK. Actors and obvious sports professionals stream in and out of these places like you wouldn't believe. Their clientele is secretive, but quite large. Their arsenal of testing equipment and depth of analysis is expensive but amazing. The well laid diet plans along with the supplements give results which are jaw dropping in 4 weeks.

I know the flawed tests you're speaking about, most likely the 14.8% body fat drop and 8% lean muscle gain with no exercise study done 17 years ago. I've read the refuting reports.

I can say however, from experience that they were indeed quite accurate. Throw some serious exercise into the equation along with watching what you eat and the health benefits are amazing. Find a solid clinic in LA/London/NYC or Miami. Just sit in the waiting rooms for an hour or two. Look at the clientele, then tell me the research is flawed.

Near perfect blood pressure, perfect cholesterol, increased lean muscle mass, dramatically reduced fat, noticeably reduced stress, perfect sleep? I'll take hormones over toxic BP meds and lipitor everyday of the week.

Also for what it's worth I am extremely paranoid with my health.....and these clinics are as well. Full blood tests every 4 weeks. On my own I pay for a full body scan every 4-6 weeks as well.

Anyone who considers this, I suggest the same approach. Extreme skepticism and paranoia lead to tons of research, which eventually gave me the comfort I needed to give it a shot (no pun intended).

[Induveca]

I think the older teams/players benefit from the lack of a 2011-2012 season. While these players may be a year older, they've also now gotten a full year of rest and recovery for their aging bodies.

After 33/34.........age is age unfortunately. Although I'm sure tons of these guys are already running to "Anti-Aging" clinics (AKA HGH/Test/DHEA distributors).

As if on cue, I read on Realgm wiretap that Kobe's trying out a new treatment overseas: Cryotherapy.

That's one type of experimental treatment to take advantage of overseas. There are others.

You can be sure Kobe is getting a cocktail of anti-aging supplements given a different name in the EU. The NBA doesn't test for HGH regardless. It repairs tissue.....it makes no sense for such a progressive clinic to perform that therapy without HGH as part of the regimen.

[gesa2]

Gesa,

I appreciate the concern. One of my best friends is a leading research doctor and while he thinks I'm nuts at spending the cash he agrees the stuff works as well, and if I can get off blood pressure meds with hgh/test/dhea he's all for it as well.

Horrible example I know, but a huge portion of actors have been on this stuff for 15 years now. I went to a few clinics in the US and UK. Actors and obvious sports professionals stream in and out of these places like you wouldn't believe. Their clientele is secretive, but quite large. Their arsenal of testing equipment and depth of analysis is expensive but amazing. The well laid diet plans along with the supplements give results which are jaw dropping in 4 weeks.

I know the flawed tests you're speaking about, most likely the 14.8% body fat drop and 8% lean muscle gain with no exercise study done 17 years ago. I've read the refuting reports.

I can say however, from experience that they were indeed quite accurate. Throw some serious exercise into the equation along with watching what you eat and the health benefits are amazing. Find a solid clinic in LA/London/NYC or Miami. Just sit in the waiting rooms for an hour or two. Look at the clientele, then tell me the research is flawed.

Near perfect blood pressure, perfect cholesterol, increased lean muscle mass, dramatically reduced fat, noticeably reduced stress, perfect sleep? I'll take hormones over toxic BP meds and lipitor everyday of the week.

Also for what it's worth I am extremely paranoid with my health.....and these clinics are as well. Full blood tests every 4 weeks. On my own I pay for a full body scan every 4-6 weeks as well.

Anyone who considers this, I suggest the same approach. Extreme skepticism and paranoia lead to tons of research, which eventually gave me the comfort I needed to give it a shot (no pun intended).

If I study placebo and "Throw some serious exercise into the equation along with watching what you eat", I'm going to see a serious difference.That's the basis behind the claims of every diet ad you see. And saying that I can see a group of people who have both won the genetic lottery and have every incentive to trade long term risk to maximize their appearance and physical abilities in the short term in the waiting room is almost the opposite of evidence for me.

The best example I can give from more conventional medicine is estrogen replacement therapy for post menopausal women. I graduated from medical school in 1991. Before then and for the first 8 years after, doctors KNEW that estrogen after menopause improved women's health. There were large association studies that showed that women who took hormones had a lower total cholesterol, higher HDL cholesterol, lower risk for heart attacks and strokes, and better bone mineral density. In 1999 the Women's Health Initiative came out, a randomized blinded placebo controlled study. What it showed was that MORE women had heart attacks and strokes on estrogen than the women on placebo. It did help with osteoporosis, and actually decreased colon cancer risk slightly, but overall a few more women died on estrogen than off. It turned out that the earlier studies compared women who chose to take estrogen against women who didn't, and the women who chose to take estrogen as a group also ate better and exercised more, making it look like estrogen was helpful.

The human body is far more complicated than we understand. Unanticipated consequences abound in medical literature. Every new treatment is thought to be and is marketed as the new breakthrough that will make our lives easier. But the reality is that if there is a medical breakthrough that will push the average life expectancy to more than 80, it hasn't been developed yet. I'm not risking my one turn around this planet on unproven therapies.

[Black Eyed Sooz]

Footnote to the draft- with the Grizzlies making the playoffs, I believe this officially closes the book on the JC Navarro deal - or what WOULD HAVE been the deal had we not then dealt that conditional pick back to Memphis for Crittenton.

The Grizzlies pick this year would've been #20, which turned out to be Donatas Motiejunas- and he actually ended up in the hands of the Houston Rockets, after being traded from the T-Wolves.

So take your pick there: a) JC Navarro, b) Javaris Crittenton, c) Motiejunas, d) any number of guys that were available at #20 including Nolan Smith (who went at 21), and Kenneth Faried (who went at 22).

I suppose you could add in possibility e) which is that maybe if we'd held on to the pick, and had #6, #18, and #20, we might've actually been able to move up in the draft.

So for everyone that likes to talk about roads not taken, or never will be, there it is...

[theboomking]

Net year's draft may be problematic for us. We aren't likely to have a shot at a better center than JaVale. PG isn't an area of need. We have Singleton and Vesely at SF.

Unfortunately, a lot of the talent in next year's draft looks to be at SF. If the BPA was Quincy Miller or Harrison Barnes, do you take them? Life would be easiest if we are looking at the BPA being a PF to replace Blatche, or a SG to replace Young, but even then, we'd probably have to be choosing pretty high.

The top PF available will almost certainly be Sullinger. At SG, would you guys prefer Bradley Beal, who has that smooth Ray Allen-esque stroke, or Jeremy Lamb, who just won the national championship, and is even longer than NY?