Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Who's this history guy? One thing Portis has impressed me on was his running the court. He got a couple of transition buckets last night. He did get a travelling call after he out-ran the Pistons center one time before he dunked, but most times that doesn't get called. He certainly has the length and strength to play PF, and I think those were the main things missing with our players trying to defend Griffin.

I'm referring to what he's done in Chicago. Chicago fans will tell you his best position is clearly C. His numbers and impact were terrible last year until the Bulls made the switch to having him play C over the 2nd half of last season and he had a mini-breakout. 82games shows a stark difference as well. 5 years ago Portis may have clearly been a PF. Now he's exclusively a C --- like Kenneth Faried.

You know a lot about his Chicago playing time. I do know Fred Hoiberg got fired. Thibodeau played Gibson and Noah, and also Lopez.

I think Portis is similar to Kyle Kuzma in that he scores well. Portis is bigger and a better rebounder than KK.

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[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

More on the centers discussion.

To put things into context, here is a list of available free agent centers and PF/C's this offseason:

Will cost big money (more than MLE):
Demarcus Cousins
Marc Gasol (if he opts out)
Nikola Vucevic
Nikola Mirotic
Julius Randle

Should cost MLE type money:
Brook Lopez
Robin Lopez
Nerlens Noel
Willie Cauley-Stein
Bobby Portis

Should cost $3-8M:
Jahill Okafor
Trey Lyles
Thomas Bryant
Dewayne Dedmon
Noah Vonleh
Kevon Looney
Ivica Zubac
Boban Marjanovic
Enes Kanter
DeAndre Jordan
Ed Davis

Sub $3M:
Tyson Chandler
Kenneth Faried
Christian Wood
Mike Muscala
Kyle O'Quinn
Frank Kaminsky
Marcin Gortat
Taj Gibson
Zaza Pachulia
Tyson Chandler
Greg Monroe
Kosta Koufos
Markieff Morris
Javale McGee
Jordan Bell
Joakim Noah


The followings will not be looking to spend much money of centers, either because of salary cap issues, or because they've got the position covered:

Philadelphia
Denver
Detroit
Houston
Minnesota
Utah
Phoenix
Portland
OKC
Indiana
San Antonio
Brooklyn
New York
Orlando
Miami
Golden State
Toronto
Boston
Charlotte
Cleveland
Chicago

That leaves only 9 teams who will be in the center market, and some of them are debatable:

Washington
Dallas
Milwaukee
Sacramento
Atlanta
LA Clippers
LA Lakers
New Orleans
Memphis

The bottom line is there is a lot of supply and not much demand. The Wizards should not spend much money at the center position.

Tyson Chandler is the best minimum salary option IMO.

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[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

One of the worst things the Wizards could do this offseason is throw a ton of money once again at the C position.

It also appears to be a popular idea around here with the suggestions of keeping both Bryant & Portis.

This despite Cs across the league eating the Wizards front line for lunch this season with Andre Drummond being the latest example.

I know they young & developing but as I mentioned a few days back, the C position is a very crowded position as more PFs like Faried are forced to switch to C to stay relevant. Many rosters are filled with one or two traditional bigs on contracts their teams now regret. The FA market will be flooded with capable names. It doesn't make sense to pour a ton of money here.

I think the Wizards should only keep one of the two. I'd lean Bryant because in time you hope he can get stronger and improve his awareness. He also will likely be cheaper because he isn't making 5-6 3s a game.

Portis brings a scoring element but may be capped as a bench player due to defensive limitations. Does it make sense to use limited resources on a backup C with a muted impact because he's a poor defender?

Spending a ton of money here ensures other needs will go unaddressed.

In my observation our frontline is being eaten for lunch BECAUSE of Bryant. He's a lost cause defensively imo.. I've seen enough from him playing against starting bigs. Plays with energy and good finisher in the PnR, but he isn't worth a longterm investment for anything more than a minimum type salary.

Portis isn't great defensively either but he has a clear plus skillset as a screen setter & floor spacing big. His presence unlocks 5-out lineups through which our team can create easier offense. Bigs like Faried are a dime a dozen, but PF/C like Portis who can space the floor and attack closeouts are a worthy investment. I'd offer him something around the Kelly Olynyk contract (4yrs/$40-50M) - given his youth at age 23, he could be a positive or at worst neutral asset on that kind of deal.

Great stuff.

Yep. Kelly Olynyk type deal makes sense.

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[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

In my observation our frontline is being eaten for lunch BECAUSE of Bryant. He's a lost cause defensively imo.. I've seen enough from him playing against starting bigs. Plays with energy and good finisher in the PnR, but he isn't worth a longterm investment for anything more than a minimum type salary.

Portis isn't great defensively either but he has a clear plus skillset as a screen setter & floor spacing big. His presence unlocks 5-out lineups through which our team can create easier offense. Bigs like Faried are a dime a dozen, but PF/C like Portis who can space the floor and attack closeouts are a worthy investment. I'd offer him something around the Kelly Olynyk contract (4yrs/$40-50M) - given his youth at age 23, he could be a positive or at worst neutral asset on that kind of deal.

Neither Bryant nor Portis defend well. Both are energetic and have sufficient length and athleticism, but both seem to lack the instincts to be in the right place at the right time. Center is the most complicated position to defend and it takes time to learn.

The difference between Bryant and Portis is that Bryant is 21 and has played less than 1000 career minutes. Portis is 24 and has played 4200 minutes. I'm more hopeful that Bryant can figure things out. He's also likely to be cheaper. If I had to choose between the two, I'd take Bryant. I'd definitely take Bryant at his $3M QO (or maybe a 2-year/$10M deal), than Portis at 4 years/$50M.

It's also worth noting that Bryant hasn't really been around long enough to properly mold his body for the rigors of the NBA. He could definitely get both stronger and more mobile with the right training.

I just don't have a great feeling about players like Bryant.. it's not only a physical thing, to me he lacks certain basic fundamentals and awareness. Watch him rebound, he doesn't even know how to box out. Bobby Portis could at least rebound from day 1 in the league (career 16% reb rate vs 12% reb rate for Bryant)

TB strikes me as a typical AAU big man who never learned fundamentals. He plays hard, but he's not a freak athlete like a Montrez Harrell who can get away with just playing hard .

I can see where the pro-Bryant crowd is coming from , but I'll take the minority opinion on this one. But hopefully we can find a way to keep both Bryant and Portis on affordable deals, they could be handy trade assets down the line.

Typical AAU...never learns...

Hmmm. I'm in a great mood. I think you are certainly entitled to the belief.

We all learn something new each day. AAU players who get drafted sometimes play G League ball. Wait, I recall seeing Bryant play for Indiana University before his Lakers and G League ball. Too bad he's one of them. You know. Those dumb guys of AAU who don't or can't learn.

Shaquille O'Neal pretty much ruined McGee with ShaqTin a Fool.

Then dumb dumb got two rings!

Illimatic, the other day I saw a very prominent person. He's the best middle school player in his age group. His team coach played professional ball. He also had a personal coach/trainer who his well-to-do parents were no doubt paying to work with this kid.

Great kid! Nice coach. We talked story at a local gym. The kid is NOT black.

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[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Who's this history guy? One thing Portis has impressed me on was his running the court. He got a couple of transition buckets last night. He did get a travelling call after he out-ran the Pistons center one time before he dunked, but most times that doesn't get called. He certainly has the length and strength to play PF, and I think those were the main things missing with our players trying to defend Griffin.

I'm referring to what he's done in Chicago. Chicago fans will tell you his best position is clearly C. His numbers and impact were terrible last year until the Bulls made the switch to having him play C over the 2nd half of last season and he had a mini-breakout. 82games shows a stark difference as well. 5 years ago Portis may have clearly been a PF. Now he's exclusively a C --- like Kenneth Faried.

I stand corrected - assuming the numbers on 82games.com are correct. Looking at the numbers there, it's a shame he punched out Mirotic. Their best lineups were when they played together, and the 2 of them had - by far - the best +/- numbers on the team. The one thing you said that doesn't jibe is Mirotic was there in the first half of the season, and that was when the Portis lineups were most effective, so it's likely he was better in the first half of the season - when it looks he played more C than PF. While PF's had a lower PER against him than centers did, PF's had higher efficiency numbers against him.

They played well together even after the fight.

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[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Bryant and Portis are both essentially centers and I agree that it probably doesn’t make any sense to re-sign both of them. I’d prioritize Bryant because he’s younger and has more upside, imo. And he's almost certain to cost less than Portis.

I’d expect Thomas to get bigger and stronger and, hopefully, become smarter and more aware on both ends of the court with experience. Bryant is growing increasingly comfortable at the 3pt range so, in the long run, I don’t give Portis a real edge over him has a floor stretcher.

Both Bryant and Portis play with great effort and run the floor hard. But Bryant is the superior overall athlete and that’s an important consideration.

One of my real hopes is that Jabari balls out for the rest of the season...and finally gets his act together both mentally and physically. Because his skillset is a much better fit for the modern NBA, at least on the offensive end. If that's the case, I'd tried to keep both Bryant and Parker...at the right price, of course.

I disagree 100% on what makes sense.

Both dudes bring their hearts. Both are intimidating for their age. I'd keep both because their games compliment one another.

As they score more points referees will allow them leeway. That means less fouls even when they play physical basketball.

Money is the ONLY reason why both maybe shouldn't be kept AS FAR AS I AM CONCERNED.

The two are mofos in a good way.

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[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Whatever offseason decisions the Wizards make they just have to make sure that they consider how that player is going to fit with Zion Williamson.

Q, I truly believe that the Wizards could JUST MISS THE PLAYOFFS AND SOME HOW THEY END UP BEING THE FIRST PICK.

I'm calling it early.

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[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

One of the worst things the Wizards could do this offseason is throw a ton of money once again at the C position.

It also appears to be a popular idea around here with the suggestions of keeping both Bryant & Portis.

This despite Cs across the league eating the Wizards front line for lunch this season with Andre Drummond being the latest example.

I know they young & developing but as I mentioned a few days back, the C position is a very crowded position as more PFs like Faried are forced to switch to C to stay relevant. Many rosters are filled with one or two traditional bigs on contracts their teams now regret. The FA market will be flooded with capable names. It doesn't make sense to pour a ton of money here.

I think the Wizards should only keep one of the two. I'd lean Bryant because in time you hope he can get stronger and improve his awareness. He also will likely be cheaper because he isn't making 5-6 3s a game.

Portis brings a scoring element but may be capped as a bench player due to defensive limitations. Does it make sense to use limited resources on a backup C with a muted impact because he's a poor defender?

Spending a ton of money here ensures other needs will go unaddressed.

Agreed! I do think Bobby Portis can be a good player, but I also think he has to be a 4 to be effective. In any case, we can't afford to give him $15m/yr.

I'm starting to think that it might work best to extend his qualifying offer, then see if we can do a sign-&-trade with his highest bidder. If not, & he goes elsewhere, Ernie can be all "it's not my fault" & overpay Jabari Parker.

I believe in position less basketball.

Parker can play SG, just like Khris Middleton. Switch on defense.

Portis, at SF, can shoot the threes Otto Porter seemed reluctant to take.

Just put three other good defenders on the court.

Beal at PG being one of the three.

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[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

So, I think Bryant could eventually be a difference maker. I don't think Portis ever gets there.

Does that make me nuts? I think he is one of the top 10 young bigs in the L and I think he is going to have a big jump next year.

I do not feel the same way about Portis or Parker.

Portis dropped 30 his first Wizards game.

Dude can EASILY drop 45 to 50. He is that kind of player.

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[FAH1223]

Whatever offseason decisions the Wizards make they just have to make sure that they consider how that player is going to fit with Zion Williamson.

Q, I truly believe that the Wizards could JUST MISS THE PLAYOFFS AND SOME HOW THEY END UP BEING THE FIRST PICK.

I'm calling it early.

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Should Ji make the lottery thread like 2010?

[gambitx777]

Whatever offseason decisions the Wizards make they just have to make sure that they consider how that player is going to fit with Zion Williamson.

Q, I truly believe that the Wizards could JUST MISS THE PLAYOFFS AND SOME HOW THEY END UP BEING THE FIRST PICK.

I'm calling it early.

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The league, has really been kind to us in the lotto at time. It will probably be either the wizards, the pells, the knicks and the cavs, some mix of them in the top 3.

The league has a interest in the knicks getting better and the cavs and the wizards have always been treated well in the lotto when they needed it, they might slide the pells in just to be cute.

[nate33]

Bryant and Portis are both essentially centers and I agree that it probably doesn’t make any sense to re-sign both of them. I’d prioritize Bryant because he’s younger and has more upside, imo. And he's almost certain to cost less than Portis.

I’d expect Thomas to get bigger and stronger and, hopefully, become smarter and more aware on both ends of the court with experience. Bryant is growing increasingly comfortable at the 3pt range so, in the long run, I don’t give Portis a real edge over him has a floor stretcher.

Both Bryant and Portis play with great effort and run the floor hard. But Bryant is the superior overall athlete and that’s an important consideration.

One of my real hopes is that Jabari balls out for the rest of the season...and finally gets his act together both mentally and physically. Because his skillset is a much better fit for the modern NBA, at least on the offensive end. If that's the case, I'd tried to keep both Bryant and Parker...at the right price, of course.

I disagree 100% on what makes sense.

Both dudes bring their hearts. Both are intimidating for their age. I'd keep both because their games compliment one another.

As they score more points referees will allow them leeway. That means less fouls even when they play physical basketball.

Money is the ONLY reason why both maybe shouldn't be kept AS FAR AS I AM CONCERNED.

The two are mofos in a good way.

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Yes. But it's a very big reason. Money is what constrains all decisions on free agency, and the Wizards are constrained more than anyone else because of Wall's albatross contract. Making these decisions without factoring money is just pure fantasy.

I laid it out in my original post on this thread. Assuming Sato is resigned, our cap number is already at $102M with a lineup of only Sato, Beal, Brown, Howard, Mahinmi and our draft pick. That leaves just $30M to find our starting SF, our starting PF, our starting center for the future, a backup guard, and whatever other depth we need.

I don't see how we can spend a combined $15-18M on Portis and Bryant and still field a decent team. It would leave just $12-15M for our starting SF and starting PF.

[dckingsfan]

So, I think Bryant could eventually be a difference maker. I don't think Portis ever gets there.

Does that make me nuts? I think he is one of the top 10 young bigs in the L and I think he is going to have a big jump next year.

I do not feel the same way about Portis or Parker.

Portis dropped 30 his first Wizards game.
Dude can EASILY drop 45 to 50. He is that kind of player.

Offensively, I wouldn't have a problem with either player. That said - I think that Bryant will end up a better 3 point shooter, consistently have the better TS% and be more consistent at the FT line.

On the defensive end, I think that Bryant will end up being better. I think he is already a slightly better defensive rebounder and shot blocker. We are watching the game slow down for him. I think next year he will be much better on the defensive end.

That isn't saying I wouldn't want both players. But that comes back to EG. We may end up with Howard/Mahimni to go along with either Bryant and/or Portis.

My two cents...

[Ruzious]

I think saying centers are a dime a dozen is too simplistic. Old school centers who don't expand their scoring ability are a dime a dozen - with the possible exception of a guy like Drummond - who's a physical freak. The game is going toward positionaless front court players. Look at Milwaukee. Offensively, why call Brook Lopez - who typically plays 30 feet from the basket the center while Giannis does most of his scoring near the basket? There really is no center in that offense.

[payitforward]

...... & there is a perfect guy -- Richaun Holmes. He'll be unrestricted & cheap. He's posting a 68.4% TS% -- on top of which, for every 15 shots he takes the guy gets more than 5 offensive rebounds! 2.75 blocks per 40 minutes.
Edit: let me make that last point more graphic. Holmes makes 9.825 out of every 15 shots he takes. Which means that of those 15 shots he misses only 5.175. In that same time period, he gets 5.14 offensive boards. Wow.

I think he is an above average player, and was quite surprised that Sixers let him go last year, before being picked up by Phoenix. I would want him here for a different reason though. I think he is a very good defensive presence. He blocks shots, gets rebounds, contests shots in the middle, and at his best can create havoc for opponents. Most of his points come on drives to the basket and dunks, so dont get too carried away with the "9.825 out of every 15 shots". His FT shooting needs improvement. That said, he does drive to the basket, which is something we don't have right now in a center.

I wasn't touting him as a scorer, & I'm not interested in anyone's "skills" independent of the impact of their numbers on the outcomes of basketball games. Also not interested in adding "something we don't have right now."

If your team puts up better numbers, you win more games -- period. No exceptions. The better a team's numbers the more games the team wins.

A team's numbers are nothing more than the numbers of their individual players added up in a column & adjusted for playing time. That's it. Period.

If you replace the playing time of a player with worse numbers with playing time of a player with better numbers, you win more games. Period. No exceptions. It's impossible for it to be otherwise.

Ergo -- adding Richaun Holmes is better than adding Mike Muscala. His numbers are better (much better!) than Mike's.

[dckingsfan]

I think saying centers are a dime a dozen is too simplistic. Old school centers who don't expand their scoring ability are a dime a dozen - with the possible exception of a guy like Drummond - who's a physical freak. The game is going toward positionaless front court players. Look at Milwaukee. Offensively, why call Brook Lopez - who typically plays 30 feet from the basket the center while Giannis does most of his scoring near the basket? There really is no center in that offense.

And on D, they need to be rim protectors while also being able to defend at the 3 point line.

[payitforward]

I just don't have a great feeling about players like Bryant. it's not only a physical thing, to me he lacks certain basic fundamentals and awareness. Watch him rebound, he doesn't even know how to box out. Bobby Portis could at least rebound from day 1 in the league (career 16% reb rate vs 12% reb rate for Bryant)

TB strikes me as a typical AAU big man who never learned fundamentals. He plays hard, but he's not a freak athlete like a Montrez Harrell who can get away with just playing hard .

I can see where the pro-Bryant crowd is coming from , but I'll take the minority opinion on this one. But hopefully we can find a way to keep both Bryant and Portis on affordable deals, they could be handy trade assets down the line.

Well, I guess you're entitled to any "feeling" you like; & if something strikes you one way or another, well... I guess it just does, huh? But neither of those has any bearing whatever on whether Thomas Bryant is good, bad or indifferent.

I've watched Bryant pretty closely. He doesn't look to me like he lacks fundamentals & *certainly not* like he lacks "awareness," which I take as a polite way of saying he's dumb (at least basketball dumb -- & maybe more). He doesn't look or act dumb to me. Not in any way. I see him calling out stuff on the court all the time. I also see him box out all the time. Otherwise, feel free to explain how he managed 8 rebounds in 16 minutes, most of which was played w/ Drummond on the floor.

Btw, Bryant is averaging the same number of rebounds per 40 minutes this year as Bobby is averaging for us so far. Actually, illmatic, that's a lie. Bryant is averaging more rebounds than Bobby as a Wizard. Also more than Bobby did for the Bulls back in 2016-17 when he was Bryant's age. That's "Bobby Portis (who) could at least rebound from day 1 in the league."

But, hey, you get to be wrong about some things! It just seems like you might not want to put quite so much effort into it. For example, Montrezl Harrell doesn't just "play hard." You might note for example that he's improved significantly every year for the 4 years of his career -- what? do you think he just plays harder & harder? Is that the secret to his success? Nor, btw, do his combine numbers support the idea that he's, as you call him, "a freak athlete."

In case you wondered, btw, when CCJ wrote

Typical AAU...never learns...

I'm pretty sure it was you he was talking about. So I'm at least glad you're now saying you do want to keep Bryant.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

I just don't have a great feeling about players like Bryant. it's not only a physical thing, to me he lacks certain basic fundamentals and awareness. Watch him rebound, he doesn't even know how to box out. Bobby Portis could at least rebound from day 1 in the league (career 16% reb rate vs 12% reb rate for Bryant)

TB strikes me as a typical AAU big man who never learned fundamentals. He plays hard, but he's not a freak athlete like a Montrez Harrell who can get away with just playing hard .

I can see where the pro-Bryant crowd is coming from , but I'll take the minority opinion on this one. But hopefully we can find a way to keep both Bryant and Portis on affordable deals, they could be handy trade assets down the line.

Well, I guess you're entitled to any "feeling" you like; & if something strikes you one way or another, well... I guess it just does, huh? But neither of those has any bearing whatever on whether Thomas Bryant is good, bad or indifferent.

I've watched Bryant pretty closely. He doesn't look to me like he lacks fundamentals & *certainly not* like he lacks "awareness," which I take as a polite way of saying he's dumb (at least basketball dumb -- & maybe more). He doesn't look or act dumb to me. Not in any way. I see him calling out stuff on the court all the time. I also see him box out all the time. Otherwise, feel free to explain how he managed 8 rebounds in 16 minutes, most of which was played w/ Drummond on the floor.

Btw, Bryant is averaging the same number of rebounds per 40 minutes this year as Bobby is averaging for us so far. Actually, illmatic, that's a lie. Bryant is averaging more rebounds than Bobby as a Wizard. Also more than Bobby did for the Bulls back in 2016-17 when he was Bryant's age. That's "Bobby Portis (who) could at least rebound from day 1 in the league."

But, hey, you get to be wrong about some things! It just seems like you might not want to put quite so much effort into it. For example, Montrezl Harrell doesn't just "play hard." You might note for example that he's improved significantly every year for the 4 years of his career -- what? do you think he just plays harder & harder? Is that the secret to his success? Nor, btw, do his combine numbers support the idea that he's, as you call him, "a freak athlete."

In case you wondered, btw, when CCJ wrote

Typical AAU...never learns...

I'm pretty sure it was you he was talking about. So I'm at least glad you're now saying you do want to keep Bryant.

I was taking issue to stereotype and prejudice.

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[ANTETOKOUNBROS]

Do you think you will decline team option on Jabari? I still hold out hope my Bucks will get him back.

[gambitx777]

Do you think you will decline team option on Jabari? I still hold out hope my Bucks will get him back.

The wizards will absolutely decline that option, and I imagine they will do so in good faith with him and offer him a 4 for 20 or 3 for 20 type deal where he makes 5-7 mill a year or something like that. I don't see EG trading otto for two young guys with out him wholeheartedly trying to keep them both.