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Official Wizards Draft Thread: Version 2.0

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Re: Official Wizards Draft Thread: Version 2.0 

Post#121 » by fishercob » Sat Jun 21, 2008 7:01 pm

rook6980 wrote:That Hibbert post was mine... I'm new to this RealGM board. Fish invited me, so I took a look around before signing up. I like the fact that this is a moderated board... and that the folks here seem to be interested in mostly talking about Basketball related issues.


Welcome rook!

I wish we were in position to be somewhat better hosts, but the site has just been "upgraded" so things don't look the same around here as they used to.

They tell us that after the draft that they'll repost all of our archived threads, including "getting to know the members," so definitely formally introduce yourself there.

You get a pretty broad mix of opinions here, but what I like about it is there are some excellent and entertaining writers, as well as a few posters who have a pretty firm grasp of a lot of advanced hoops stats.

There's also a fairly even split (my read at least) between those who think that Eddie Jordan is the worst coach in the history of the NBA and should be fired yesterday, and those who think he's done a decent job with the hand he's been dealt and should be given at least another year.

Everything stays mostly in good fun, and this is by far the best Wiz discussion that I've found online.

Again, welcome aboard!
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Re: Official Wizards Draft Thread: Version 2.0 

Post#122 » by mohammed10 » Sat Jun 21, 2008 9:12 pm

rook6980 wrote:That Hibbert post was mine... I'm new to this RealGM board. Fish invited me, so I took a look around before signing up. I like the fact that this is a moderated board... and that the folks here seem to be interested in mostly talking about Basketball related issues.


Solid post on Ivan's blog.

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Re: Official Wizards Draft Thread: Version 2.0 

Post#123 » by Wiz99 » Sat Jun 21, 2008 11:39 pm

rook6980 wrote:That Hibbert post was mine... I'm new to this RealGM board. Fish invited me, so I took a look around before signing up. I like the fact that this is a moderated board... and that the folks here seem to be interested in mostly talking about Basketball related issues.


Welcome aboard!
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Re: Official Wizards Draft Thread: Version 2.0 

Post#124 » by tkunit » Sun Jun 22, 2008 12:03 am

fishercob wrote:
rook6980 wrote:
There's also a fairly even split (my read at least) between those who think that Eddie Jordan is the worst coach in the history of the NBA and should be fired yesterday, and those who think he's done a decent job with the hand he's been dealt and should be given at least another year.

Everything stays mostly in good fun, and this is by far the best Wiz discussion that I've found online.

Again, welcome aboard!



I thought we all agreed he has stayed 2 years to many
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Re: Official Wizards Draft Thread: Version 2.0 

Post#125 » by Soup's Uncle » Sun Jun 22, 2008 1:05 am

rook6980 wrote:That Hibbert post was mine... I'm new to this RealGM board. Fish invited me, so I took a look around before signing up. I like the fact that this is a moderated board... and that the folks here seem to be interested in mostly talking about Basketball related issues.

Welcome to whay I like to call the Thunder Dome!

Great to have a knowledgeable dude here with us. But we are all knowledgable. I am probably the least.

I too really dug the Hibbert ost. Good job.
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Re: Official Wizards Draft Thread: Version 2.0 

Post#126 » by Kanyewest » Sun Jun 22, 2008 6:41 am

I heard on ESPN that Joe Alexander might go as high as #8 to Milwaukee.
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Re: Official Wizards Draft Thread: Version 2.0 

Post#127 » by Wizardspride » Sun Jun 22, 2008 1:58 pm

Kanyewest wrote:I heard on ESPN that Joe Alexander might go as high as #8 to Milwaukee.

I like Alexander but I think that's a tad bit too high.

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Re: Official Wizards Draft Thread: Version 2.0 

Post#128 » by closg00 » Sun Jun 22, 2008 2:26 pm

SAC is taking Hibbert at 12 if he still there according to the Daily News via the Wiretap. Gonna do a little research and post my final draft prediction....probably one of the PF's.
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Re: Official Wizards Draft Thread: Version 2.0 

Post#129 » by closg00 » Sun Jun 22, 2008 2:30 pm

Kanyewest wrote:I heard on ESPN that Joe Alexander might go as high as #8 to Milwaukee.


The guy is a stud, man I wish we could get him. The Bucks are going to take him (besides the obvious) because he speaks fluent Mandarin, a little known fact about him.
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Re: Official Wizards Draft Thread: Version 2.0 

Post#130 » by BruceO » Sun Jun 22, 2008 3:46 pm

with all the stories about people being willing to wheel and deal, I mean we hear chicago rumours, Miami rumours, NY rumours, Seattle trying to attain Beasley rumours and teams that are drafting well ahead of where they need to be to get the player they need.

The wizards haven't had much history trying to move up, but theoretically, how far up can we move up considering our assets and what out there would be worth the moving up. Ofcourse I'm a fan of Beasley as far as team needs more so than anyone else, maybe even rose might be a better fit for us than Gil, but If seattle thinks it can offer wilcox plus change to get mark blounts bad contract plus Beasley, what can we offer Miami for Beasley. I truly believe seattle is trying to move up at whatever cost.

Kevin durant knows Beasley. I think the people in seattle know Beasley is just as good if not better than Durant, hence the rush to acquire him. Not alot of no 1 or 2 picks are traded away but if teams were ever considering making that move to give away that player think about the players that have changed franchises, the Tim duncans, lebrons, Dwights, even Kobe even though he was a seven pick (largely due to Kobes orchestration and insistence that he wants to play only for the lakers, something Oj mayo is seeming to say as well NY, LA or Miami)

This post is more so about would the wizards benefit from moving up? who would they give away for that to happen? what would they try to get in return and how would this player change things?
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Re: Official Wizards Draft Thread: Version 2.0 

Post#131 » by Wiz99 » Sun Jun 22, 2008 3:48 pm

NBADraft.net has us taking Hibbert.

I really hope we don't do that.

Roy seems like a nice guy, and he's made a ton of progress in his 4 years. More than any other college player I can think of. But he'll get eaten alive in the NBA.

He's too slow. Any of the old timers round here remember George Muresan running from the defensive end towards our hoop, but the play's over before he gets there, and he can't compete for a rebound with his 7'6" frame. Then the opponent fast breaks the opposite way, scoring before George can get his shotblocking skills into the game either. I literally remember 4 plays in a row where Muresan was trapped between the free throw lines and never got into either post. That'll be Hibbert. Maybe not as egregious, but he can't keep up with the NBA pace. We'll be playing 4 on 5 all day.

He's not athletic. His success in college came from being tall. True you can't teach tall, but what's he gonna do when he's not half a foot taller than everyone else on the court? When he's surrounded by other 7 footers and loads of dudes 6'10 who can jump out of the gym.

He's not strong. He's packed on some muscle at G-town. But he's still thin and will get pushed around. He's not as bad as Shawn Bradley, but I can easily see him getting bumped off lots of rebounds and maybe even posterized on a too-regular-basis.

In the end, the main thing Roy has going for him is height. We'd be lucky for Roy to turn out as a serviceable backup C. Don't we already have one named Etan Thomas? A guy named Blatche who can do some time at C? And a coach that's not exactly know for playing our bigs? Finally, slow tall guys can be found without having to waste a draft pick.

I'd much rather we take someone who may be more raw but have more upside. Someone who could turn into our PF of the future once Jamison and his 32 year old body ages or gets traded away.

JaVale McGee is bursting with potential on a 7' frame. He's got the raw athletic potential to be great. Might take a couple years to see it develop, but the upside is enormous.

I think Darrell Arthur could be a David West type sleeper. Like West, he's supposedly "too small" at 6'9", but he's played like a lottery pick at times and has the quicks to defend 3s as well as enough size to guard most 4s.

I'd take these two guys over Hibbert. If they're not available, I'd go for our 2nd biggest need, which is a younger, gritty, defender and distributor at the point. AD won't last for much longer, and some round here think he's already over the hill. But one thing I think we could all agree to is he'd probably be an excellent mentor to a young guy (I could easily see AD ending up on the sideline someday).

So the guy I'd go for as a second choice is Kansas' Mario Chalmers, MOP of the NCAA finals, Big 12 Defensive Player of the Year, good size, and maybe most important in my eyes, although Arthur and Rush were the talent on the team, it was Chalmers who was the heart and soul. He's nothing less than a gritty defensive-minded guard who wants to win bad. Wouldn't be a bad add to the Wiz to groom. We might be able to move down to get him in the 20s - could enable us to swing a trade.
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Re: Official Wizards Draft Thread: Version 2.0 

Post#132 » by tsvqt » Sun Jun 22, 2008 4:00 pm

rook6980 wrote:That Hibbert post was mine... I'm new to this RealGM board. Fish invited me, so I took a look around before signing up. I like the fact that this is a moderated board... and that the folks here seem to be interested in mostly talking about Basketball related issues.


Welcome, Welcome, Welcome!! I'm the REDSKINS #1 fan, and the Wizards #2 fan...behind everyone else who post here. :D
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Re: Official Wizards Draft Thread: Version 2.0 

Post#133 » by Wiz99 » Sun Jun 22, 2008 4:03 pm

BruceO wrote:with all the stories about people being willing to wheel and deal, I mean we hear chicago rumours, Miami rumours, NY rumours, Seattle trying to attain Beasley rumours and teams that are drafting well ahead of where they need to be to get the player they need.

The wizards haven't had much history trying to move up, but theoretically, how far up can we move up considering our assets and what out there would be worth the moving up. Ofcourse I'm a fan of Beasley as far as team needs more so than anyone else, maybe even rose might be a better fit for us than Gil, but If seattle thinks it can offer wilcox plus change to get mark blounts bad contract plus Beasley, what can we offer Miami for Beasley. I truly believe seattle is trying to move up at whatever cost.

Kevin durant knows Beasley. I think the people in seattle know Beasley is just as good if not better than Durant, hence the rush to acquire him. Not alot of no 1 or 2 picks are traded away but if teams were ever considering making that move to give away that player think about the players that have changed franchises, the Tim duncans, lebrons, Dwights, even Kobe even though he was a seven pick (largely due to Kobes orchestration and insistence that he wants to play only for the lakers, something Oj mayo is seeming to say as well NY, LA or Miami)

This post is more so about would the wizards benefit from moving up? who would they give away for that to happen? what would they try to get in return and how would this player change things?


There's only 2 guys worth giving up a major asset for: Beasley and Rose.

Chicago and Miami would require a major proven star back in order to give up the #1 or #2.

I would trade Jamison for the chance to get Beasley, based on the premise that Beasley has got a GREAT shot at being a dominant PF in this league. If you don't believe that, then this makes no sense. But if you do, as much as you might like Jamison, you gotta trade him to get Beasley because:

Beasley's young and will play 15 years of real quality ball. AJ is 32 and maybe has 3-4 years left.

Maybe more importantly, there's just a few people on this board who still think we are a championship contender as currently constructed. Everyone else thinks we need to upgrade to really compete. If you got a chance at a stud PF who could be a star, you gotta roll the dice. Might mean we need to wait for Beasley yo fully blossom, but behind Gil an Caron, Beasley could be ready to rock and roll as early as his sophomore season. Look at what Dwayne Wade did for Miami.

But would Jamison be enough for a #1 or #2 from Chitown or Miami? I doubt it. And I can't imagine us sweetening the deal enough where we weren't giving away the farm.
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Re: Official Wizards Draft Thread: Version 2.0 

Post#134 » by tsvqt » Sun Jun 22, 2008 5:01 pm

Wiz99 wrote:
BruceO wrote:with all the stories about people being willing to wheel and deal, I mean we hear chicago rumours, Miami rumours, NY rumours, Seattle trying to attain Beasley rumours and teams that are drafting well ahead of where they need to be to get the player they need.

The wizards haven't had much history trying to move up, but theoretically, how far up can we move up considering our assets and what out there would be worth the moving up. Ofcourse I'm a fan of Beasley as far as team needs more so than anyone else, maybe even rose might be a better fit for us than Gil, but If seattle thinks it can offer wilcox plus change to get mark blounts bad contract plus Beasley, what can we offer Miami for Beasley. I truly believe seattle is trying to move up at whatever cost.

Kevin durant knows Beasley. I think the people in seattle know Beasley is just as good if not better than Durant, hence the rush to acquire him. Not alot of no 1 or 2 picks are traded away but if teams were ever considering making that move to give away that player think about the players that have changed franchises, the Tim duncans, lebrons, Dwights, even Kobe even though he was a seven pick (largely due to Kobes orchestration and insistence that he wants to play only for the lakers, something Oj mayo is seeming to say as well NY, LA or Miami)

This post is more so about would the wizards benefit from moving up? who would they give away for that to happen? what would they try to get in return and how would this player change things?


There's only 2 guys worth giving up a major asset for: Beasley and Rose.

Chicago and Miami would require a major proven star back in order to give up the #1 or #2.

I would trade Jamison for the chance to get Beasley, based on the premise that Beasley has got a GREAT shot at being a dominant PF in this league. If you don't believe that, then this makes no sense. But if you do, as much as you might like Jamison, you gotta trade him to get Beasley because:

Beasley's young and will play 15 years of real quality ball. AJ is 32 and maybe has 3-4 years left.

Maybe more importantly, there's just a few people on this board who still think we are a championship contender as currently constructed. Everyone else thinks we need to upgrade to really compete. If you got a chance at a stud PF who could be a star, you gotta roll the dice. Might mean we need to wait for Beasley yo fully blossom, but behind Gil an Caron, Beasley could be ready to rock and roll as early as his sophomore season. Look at what Dwayne Wade did for Miami.

But would Jamison be enough for a #1 or #2 from Chitown or Miami? I doubt it. And I can't imagine us sweetening the deal enough where we weren't giving away the farm.


I would not blink twice in giving up Jamison, Blatche, #18 (selecting for Miami), and 2009 1st.

PG - ARENAS, Daniels, #47 (Mike Taylor)
SG - STEVENSON, Young
SF - BUTLER, McGuire
PF - BEASLEY, Songaila, VV
C - HAYWOOD, Thomas, Pech
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Re: Official Wizards Draft Thread: Version 2.0 

Post#135 » by closg00 » Sun Jun 22, 2008 5:39 pm

I wonder why we didn't work out Nathan Jawai? Anyone know when we will hold our last workout?
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Re: Official Wizards Draft Thread: Version 2.0 

Post#136 » by go'stags » Sun Jun 22, 2008 6:16 pm

Wiz99, I don't get it. You knock Hibbert for not being strong, but you want Darrell Arthur? He's probably the weakest PF in the draft. He wasnt a good rebounder in college despsite his athleticsim, so how will he be a better rebounder than Hibbert? You have to take into account the pace of the teams. kansas played at break neck speed. Georgetown played painfully slow. And Hibbert will be a much better low post defender than Authur, beacuse hes 7'2 270 as opposed to 6'9 220. And please, Arthur cannot cover any 3 in this league.

As for Mcgee, yes he may be bursting with potential, but hes eerily similiar to Blatche, on and off the court. He has a lot of skills, but not the best attitude or work ethic. You really think either is going to thrive when they see the other being lazy? How do you choose whom to play?

I like Chalmers as well, but I'm starting to think I'd go in a different direction. I think there are going to be starting caliber players available when we pick, not right away, but down the line.

And I wouldn't take Alexander if he fell to us, let alone 8 overall.
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Re: Official Wizards Draft Thread: Version 2.0 

Post#137 » by dobrojim » Mon Jun 23, 2008 1:18 am

nate33 wrote:I LIKE Pecherov + #18 for Lowry + #28. I don't like the AD for Kapono part.

Trade AD for cap relief. Then we'd have cap room for Mason.


You gotta really like what Mason gave us this year. That said, I think one
should expect that N1 will be taking that role away from him. One of those
2 guys could be redundant. Given that N1 is on a rookie contract and RMjr
is a UFA after a breakout season, add in N1's youth and the scales clearly
tilt in that direction. JMO.

N1 in a backcourt with a healthy Agent Zero is a scary prospect for defenses
(and possibly an enticing prospect for offenses, opp that is....but 0 and 1 will
have to work to live that down).
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Re: Official Wizards Draft Thread: Version 2.0 

Post#138 » by dobrojim » Mon Jun 23, 2008 1:38 am

I fear that Hibbs will be gone when we pick. I really like him for us partly because
even if The Poet returns, in some semblance of where he was when he left, he has
what, 2 more years? A big like Hibbs on a rookie contract could be a very valuable asset.

I agree a lot more with Rook (welcome guy) than Wiz99. A G'town 7-2/280 4 year player
is got to be at least a servicable role player and probably better. If he's there, we should
take him with a huge smile on our collective faces. I think Hibbs is already ready to come
into the league and defend the likes of Z and SideShow Bob. And he should set some
GREAT screens for our jump shooters.
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Re: Official Wizards Draft Thread: Version 2.0 

Post#139 » by fishercob » Mon Jun 23, 2008 1:38 am

dobrojim wrote:
nate33 wrote:I LIKE Pecherov + #18 for Lowry + #28. I don't like the AD for Kapono part.

Trade AD for cap relief. Then we'd have cap room for Mason.


You gotta really like what Mason gave us this year. That said, I think one
should expect that N1 will be taking that role away from him. One of those
2 guys could be redundant. Given that N1 is on a rookie contract and RMjr
is a UFA after a breakout season, add in N1's youth and the scales clearly
tilt in that direction. JMO.

N1 in a backcourt with a healthy Agent Zero is a scary prospect for defenses
(and possibly an enticing prospect for offenses, opp that is....but 0 and 1 will
have to work to live that down).



Oh wow. We need to start referring to the Arenas-Young backcourt as "The General Lee."

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Re: Official Wizards Draft Thread: Version 2.0 

Post#140 » by tsvqt » Mon Jun 23, 2008 1:41 am

dobrojim wrote:
nate33 wrote:I LIKE Pecherov + #18 for Lowry + #28. I don't like the AD for Kapono part.

Trade AD for cap relief. Then we'd have cap room for Mason.


You gotta really like what Mason gave us this year. That said, I think one
should expect that N1 will be taking that role away from him. One of those
2 guys could be redundant. Given that N1 is on a rookie contract and RMjr
is a UFA after a breakout season, add in N1's youth and the scales clearly
tilt in that direction. JMO.

N1 in a backcourt with a healthy Agent Zero is a scary prospect for defenses
(and possibly an enticing prospect for offenses, opp that is....but 0 and 1 will
have to work to live that down).


Although I'm more on the side of trading Arenas than keeping him, I'll admit that I saw some things from him when he did return from that injury that really impressed the heck outta me!! I saw him making passes that I have not sen him make in his whole duration here prior to the injury. If THAT Agent Zero is running the show, then we may be clearly one of the best the East has to offer. I can live with a pass happy, ball in his hands at the end of the qrt/game type of player. What I saw from him when he played after the injury was a man who could make plays as far as passes in traffic....no look....Magic Johnson-type plays. He and Blatche connected well on a few, which leads me to believe Gil CAN make players around him better.
My honest opinion though on Gil and Caron..........Caron raised his game to a level where he feels he can be looked at as a primary man. When Gil came back, Caron took a step back and that's not at all what we needed. He got lost trying to be 2nd fiddle. Had he continued to think of himself as 1st fiddle, maybe........well, Shaq and Kobe had a problem with what I'm proposing didn't they? When you have two players vying for King Of the Hill, it makes for an uneasy situation. Looking at it though, can we compare Gil and Caron to Kobe and Shaq? Not as far as talent, but as far as having two dominate players? Can they both play to their strengths and humble themselves during a game when one is truely proving to be the man on that night? I think Gil and Caron are hungry enough to defer on any given night to the other. Shaq and Kobe were in a battle for supremeacy. They had been to the mountain top. Gil and Caron are hungry, so deferring should not be a problem .
After all is said and done, I could take another year of a HEALTHY Wizards roster. Go Wiz!!
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