LeTravel and the Crab dribble Thread - Wadette Girliman

[sfam]

Wow, the Cleveland GM didn't sound all that positive about his meeting with Lebron. Well, I guess he said, it was a positive and productive meeting, but he certainly didn't have the "We won" face. I'm not really sure Lebron is staying. If Lebron gets assurances he will be universally adored in New Jersey, for instance, I can see him going there.

[sfam]

So Lebron apparently will wait to make an announcement until after his basketball camp in Akron finishes. Does anyone else take this as a really bad sign for Cleveland? If I'm planning on ditching the place, do I want to sit through a camp with lots of crying teens who's heart I've just broken? Or would I rather do my camp, and then ditch the place afterwards?

[hands11]

Just listening to sport radio. Wise. But he isn't on. It's Cush, Mike Hamer and Jackson I think.

They are bringing up some good point and could lead you to believe The Crab stays.

First it's about money
#1 - Where can you make the most. That is always your home team. Chalk one up for CLE unless it's a sign and trade. He can do a short deal. Maybe 2-3 years

#2 - where to do pay state taxes ?
Well for Wade, none in Miami and none in TX.
I don't see him playing with Wade, but I could see him playing with Kidd and Dirke.

#3 Records - where can he win
62-21 in 2010 CLE best in the league
66-16 in 2009 CLE best in the league
Dallas has been a top team for a few years.

#4 Where ever he goes, he needs to be a ball in hand player.
CHI - They have Rose who has to ball
Miami - They have Wade who has the ball
NJ - They have Harris ho has the ball

I don't see him going to any of these teams. Specially Miami.
NY ? - They have nothing.
Dallas - They have Kidd but he is mature enough to share

#5 Owner ship - will they spend or are they cheap.
I don't know a ton about this but I know Chicago was fighting with MJ when he was there.
Anyway, who do they really have left. Rose, Deng, Noah, Gibson and Johnson. Again, I don't see him fitting with a team that has a PG who needs to ball in hand that much.

#6 Coach
http://cleveland.sbnation.com/2010/7/4/ ... tt-was-the

#7 Ties to local area
He is really tied to Cleveland. Aside from that, all I have heard is how close he is to Cuban and Kidd and he like Dallas. I see Chicago and the MJ legacy and statue as a huge negative for Chicago

Stage
So of the places he could go, I'm checking Miami off the list.
Chicago and New Jersey don't seem likely because they have dominate PGs.
NJ - at least they are moving.
Dallas is a pretty big stage. Maybe not NY but you have JJ and the Cowgirls there and Cuban is a marketing person with a presence.

So he could go to NY. Be on the big stage and all but they really have little else to offer him. Curry and Chandler. They could get Bosh or Amare so they could build something. They don't have a ball dominate PG to get in the way but it's all up in the air since they have almost nothing there.

But with Cleveland he can
1- make the most money
2- stay home. To Cleveland he is like MJ was in Chicago
3- stay with a team that was best in the reg season two years in a row where he was injured last year and his teammate was rumor to be messing with his mother late in the year.
4- no ball dominate PG to get in his way

downside
He doesn't have a great number 2 to run with but AJs is at least a pro who can score and plays hard. And if he doesn't work, his contract is a 15M expiring after this next year that could help them get the player he really needs to run with. They dump West.

???
They have B Scott as a clean slate coach. Hickson as a player with upside still.

Conclusion.
So in total, I can easily see him staying or if he wants to do a rebuild, NY is the place that makes the most sense. If he wants to win now, he does a sign and trade with Dallas where he can play with Kidd and Dirke. Sure Kidd is a true PG, but no like a Rose or Harris. Kidd is mature enough and old enough to want to do whatever it takes.

So him going in this order.
Cleveland - most money, home town, MJ was CLE, best record, owner that works with him and $$$
Dallas - most ready to win somewhere else and the SnT (most money) is out of conference
NY - he wants to big stage and willing to do a rebuild. Lots of ?? though.

And if Wade and LB stay, that just makes things better for us down the road if we want to trade Gil.

And of those teams, I see Gil to NY.

[Higga]

LBJ will never be as loved or appreciated anywhere else as he is now in Cleveland. If he had any soul or purpose he would stay home and be Cleveland's legend instead of being "just another big name" in New York or Chicago. In Dallas he'll never be as big as the Cowboys. Miami's not really a sports town.

[nate33]

Just listening to sport radio. Wise. But he isn't on. It's Cush, Mike Hamer and Jackson I think.

They are bringing up some good point and could lead you to believe The Crab stays.

First it's about money
#1 - Where can you make the most. That is always your home team. Chalk one up for CLE unless it's a sign and trade. He can do a short deal. Maybe 2-3 years

#2 - where to do pay state taxes ?
Well for Wade, none in Miami and none in TX.
I don't see him playing with Wade, but I could see him playing with Kidd and Dirke.

#3 Records - where can he win
62-21 in 2010 CLE best in the league
66-16 in 2009 CLE best in the league
Dallas has been a top team for a few years.

#4 Where ever he goes, he needs to be a ball in hand player.
CHI - They have Rose who has to ball
Miami - They have Wade who has the ball
NJ - They have Harris ho has the ball

I don't see him going to any of these teams. Specially Miami.
NY ? - They have nothing.
Dallas - They have Kidd but he is mature enough to share

#5 Owner ship - will they spend or are they cheap.
I don't know a ton about this but I know Chicago was fighting with MJ when he was there.
Anyway, who do they really have left. Rose, Deng, Noah, Gibson and Johnson. Again, I don't see him fitting with a team that has a PG who needs to ball in hand that much.

#6 Coach
http://cleveland.sbnation.com/2010/7/4/ ... tt-was-the

#7 Ties to local area
He is really tied to Cleveland. Aside from that, all I have heard is how close he is to Cuban and Kidd and he like Dallas. I see Chicago and the MJ legacy and statue as a huge negative for Chicago

#1 - The difference in salary in negligible. Cleveland can offer 10.5% raises. Everybody else can offer 8% raises. The difference over 5 years is about $2.5M. Basically, nothing. The only difference is that Cleveland can offer 6 years when everybody else can offer 5. It's not really relevant because Lebron is sure to sign a max deal on his next contract, too. The differences in endorsement opportunities is likely to be bigger than the differences in salary.

#2 - Taxes are largely irrelevant. The Ohio state income tax isn't that much smaller than NY, and it's a lot higher than in Florida. Furthermore, taxes get charged by the game, not by the season. So everyone's tax rate for 41 games a year are pretty similar.

#3 - A ridiculous argument. Cleveland only has a good record because of Lebron. Without him, they're a 30 win team. Lebron isn't going to stay in Cleveland because he seriously believes it's the best place for him to win.

Some of these other arguments have at least some merit, but they're really secondary arguments. The 3 issues above are what matters. And in issues 1 and 2, Cleveland has no serious advantage. They have a huge disadvantage in #3.

[Hoopalotta]

Hey, check this out...

http://www.intrade.com/jsp/intrade/trad ... nID=723353

Looks like we're still in it!

Funny that we didn't even have meeting and we're mentioned by name while the Clippers aren't.

[Kanyewest]

Here is article on the state income taxes. Basically, the difference could be about $1 million a year ($1.5 million in NY and 436 K for Miami with Cleveland at about $1 million). This doesn't include other factors such as real estate tax and endorsement deals.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/sports/o ... 5378.story

Again, while the difference in salary may seem insignificant to you and me, I have to wonder if LeBron's reputation of being a cheap comes into this, but I don't think it is one of the more important factors.

BTW, endorsements could be tied more into whether LeBron can win championships rather than where he signs especially in foreign markets. Where LeBron can win (or thinks he can win) could be his choice. BTW, does LeBron lose out on endorsements if he ends up sharing the spotlight with Wade or is everything all fine and dandy if they are bringing home championships.

[BigA]

Hey, check this out...

http://www.intrade.com/jsp/intrade/trad ... nID=723353

Looks like we're still in it!

Funny that we didn't even have meeting and we're mentioned by name while the Clippers aren't.

I put down all those bets on the Wizards based on Miss Cleo's prediction.

[Kanyewest]

#1 - The difference in salary in negligible. Cleveland can offer 10.5% raises. Everybody else can offer 8% raises. The difference over 5 years is about $2.5M. Basically, nothing. The only difference is that Cleveland can offer 6 years when everybody else can offer 5. It's not really relevant because Lebron is sure to sign a max deal on his next contract, too. The differences in endorsement opportunities is likely to be bigger than the differences in salary.

#2 - Taxes are largely irrelevant. The Ohio state income tax isn't that much smaller than NY, and it's a lot higher than in Florida. Furthermore, taxes get charged by the game, not by the season. So everyone's tax rate for 41 games a year are pretty similar.

Even if the difference seems insignificant to you, LeBron has been noted for being cheap. Weren't there a few posts in this thread indicating that he's a horrible tipper? 1 to 2% is a few million dollars and ultimately gets him that much closer to reaching his billionaire status. Words to LeBron, it won't hurt you that much to give a 15% tip.

[hands11]

Here is article on the state income taxes. Basically, the difference could be about $1 million a year ($1.5 million in NY and 436 K for Miami with Cleveland at about $1 million). This doesn't include other factors such as real estate tax and endorsement deals.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/sports/o ... 5378.story

Again, while the difference in salary may seem insignificant to you and me, I have to wonder if LeBron's reputation of being a cheap comes into this, but I don't think it is one of the more important factors.

BTW, endorsements could be tied more into whether LeBron can win championships rather than where he signs especially in foreign markets. Where LeBron can win (or thinks he can win) could be his choice. BTW, does LeBron lose out on endorsements if he ends up sharing the spotlight with Wade or is everything all fine and dandy if they are bringing home championships.

Exactly what I was talking about. State taxes play a role. Florida and TX are zero I believe.

As for money from enforcements, LB is already a huge star and has large enforcements.

Hey, were does Tiger live. Who cares? He is a mega star. His image, his play and winning brought the enforcements and they will be gone when that changes as it took a hit with his last actions.

Only thing that will keep the enforcements coming for him is winning, stats and personality. As the song goes... 2 out of 3 ain't bad.

This is just "ridiculous" ay Nate ?

[Severn Hoos]

In order of best case scenarios to the LeBonBon saga, I would rank them accordingly:

1. LA Clippers - out of the conference, probably never sees the Finals again without buying a ticket. Too bad it'll never happen.

2. Knicks - even better with an overrated, overpaid, and potentially fragile Amare. I didn't think this one was likely, but some writers swear it's a real possibility. Even better if he buys the line that the Knicks will have cap space next year, Melo signs his extension, and the new CBA slices the cap so that the Knicks lose their flexibility. Amare, LeBron, and...... Danilo!

3. Nets - maybe they'll come around eventually, I just don't see it. They're still the Nets.

4. Cavaliers - capped out, marginal role players. Could they really get Bosh? I'm not much of a Bosh fan, but he would definitely help that team. This one would be higher, but there's already a good hatred built up for the Cavs, plus if he did go back home and win a title eventually, the slobbering will be worse than ever.

5. Heat - Would hate to see him & Wade (& Bosh?) team up, for so many reasons. Shows he's a punk and just chasing a title. Shows what's wrong about the NBA, don't like the just-add-water approach. Silver lining(s): Talk shifts to "He couldn't win one on his own", and no matter how many titles they do win together, Wade will always have one more than LeBron.

6. Bulls - this is the really scary one. Rose, Noah, LeBron, Boozer, and maybe a Deng trade for a SG and depth? Again, win a title, and it's his team (unlike Miami, which will always be Wade's team). Plus, the slobbering over him winning in the shadow of Jordan's legacy, blah, blah, blah. Makes me sick even thinking about it.

Yep, definitely rooting for the Knicks. It's the trifecta - marginal talent around him, extreme hype further distracts him from actually playing basketball, and breaks the hearts of Clevelanders everywhere. Sounds good to me!

[sfam]

Its beginning to look like LeBonBon isn't going back to Cleveland unless he can take his Bosh security blanky with him. Bosh has had his fill of small market teams - I just don't see him going there. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see him in Chicago or NY now.

[Hoopalotta]

I don't know if I'm seeing the Nets as being a good scenario for parity's sake. I had thought that Prokhorov was going to be something of a "big-splash" buffoon, but he's starting to sound pretty savvy.

I was impressed by this article im particular:

http://sports.espn.go.com/new-york/nba/ ... id=5357254

So he's either going to get Bron and Lee/Boozer or he's going to sit it out? That's pretty smart if you ask me.

I'd be wary; might have to put the Nets towards the top of the 'do not want' pile for Le Bon Bon.

[closg00]

Bron is such a mama's boy, it was predictable that he would re-up with the Cavs. Safe bet.

[pancakes3]

psch. his twitter name is @kingjames? another drop in the bucket of reasons lebron irks me. +1 with Hoos, i hope he goes out and languishes in clipperland, but don't count out the nyets. that new owner's got a bold yet simple straightforwardness to his thinking that "nets" results.

[sashae]

Does anyone find Lebron's "announcing his decision" on Thursday on ESPN kinda... insufferable? Criminy, we KNOW you're going back to Cleveland...

[BigA]

^this will make up for him being deprived of the the experience of announcing his college decision on ESPN.

[long suffrin' boulez fan]

I heard a rumor that le ego was about to announce his choice between hush puppies and fries at long John silvers on the deuce.

Seriously, does anyone really care anymore?

[sfam]

Does anyone find Lebron's "announcing his decision" on Thursday on ESPN kinda... insufferable? Criminy, we KNOW you're going back to Cleveland...

Gee, I'm kinda wonderin why Lebron settled for just ESPN. I heard he asked his management team if a state of the union style event before congress was possible. Only after he found out Congress was out of session, and he'd be announcing it to an empty chamber, did he back down to just going on ESPN prime time. Too bad the NBA finals are over, or I'm sure he'd schedule it for that time slot.

[Joe_Wiz]

I'm not saying I actually want him, but if he signs a 2-year deal, one could imagine him coming here in the summer of 2012 . . .