Lather me with blather -- DRAFT thread 4

[tontoz]

http://www.eurobasket.com/player.asp?Cntry=SRB&PlayerID=78508

24/54. That is just sad.

http://www.euroleague.net/competition/p ... ode=000925

use: http://www.eurobasket.com/player.asp?Cn ... erID=78508
you see other 45 games he played this season (not that it changes his bad FT this season, last season was better).

So adding all three leagues together he was 120/256 for 47% this season. Ugh

Thanks for the link. He was better last year but even that isn't good. A wing player should certainly be over 70%.

[TGW]

Ten points, eight rebounds, two goaltending calls, multiple missed defensive rotations, multiple open looks surrendered at the basket after falling for pump fakes, and leading the league in blocks and alley oop dunks does not make for an irreplaceable player. We're talking about a 10 point, 8 rebound headcase.

yea...that still led the team in +/-, rpg per 36, and blocks.

I wouldn't mind McGee for Williams, but let's not act like McGee doesn't have an impact on this team. They play MUCH better with him than without.

Yeah...so much better that they still only won 23 games. Not sure that's actually an argument in favor of McGee.

Fine...if that's the criteria for judging the players on our roster, then we should trade John Wall for Steve Nash. Nash was a former MVP and had more wins than John last season.

[sfam]

You can absolutely minimize risk. You can do it by picking someone who already has developed skills instead of picking someone that doesn't.

There is an age limit for draft. You can't wait till players are 30 years old and then draft them
You are funny guys.

If you are going to make an attempt at humor you should at least do a better job. Vesely can't shoot, create his own shot, rebound or even hold onto the ball very well.

The "logic" being used here to promote drafting Vesely is the exact same reasoning that led to Yi being picked at 6.

Help me understand something - Yi was picked based on his terrific workout against standing chairs. Vesely, on the other hand, plays - no, starts - in the top Euroleague.

[jivelikenice]

From Pro Basketball talk not sure how legit it is:

As it stands expect the @WashWizards to trade up w/ the @Utah_Jazz or @Cavs to take Enes Kanter. Per a source Wiz have him #2 on their board

I assume Williams is #1 on their board. I would hate to trade the 18th pick of the Morris Twins, Faried and Singleton are all still there.

unless we can buy a pick but Faried and Vesley for Kanter? wow

I understand the sentiment but in the NBA it makes more sense to consolidate and get a potential complete player over two players that have strengths, but also don't project to being more than good role players. There's also no way of knowing for show that Faried will be there @ 18 and we'd have a logjam up front with Vesely, Faried, Blatche, Booker, McGee, Seraphin, and Lewis....

[WizarDynasty]

his significant improvement in 3 pt % clearly shows that his focus in practice has been to improve his 3 point percentage, not his ft% which he successfully did. Spending all your time practicing threes is going to alter your shot mechanics for your free throw shooting. A stronger MCgee is a once in a generation bigman and he's gotten far far stronger and it's EG's biggest accomplishment of his career i believe. I would be worried had i not seen that he dramatically increased his 3 point shooting which is what opens an offense and driving lanes, not free throw shooting. He is best fit for John Wall is all EG's thinking needs to be.
Finally the reason we grab Tyler is because of our secret weapon, and yes i am glad i am eating crow..my G. Banks. Elite Fluid Post Footwork bigman coach, he proved with the results toward teh end of last season.

[sfam]

I don't think the list (or really any list going back a real long time) tells you anything other than by landing the best big man of his generation (Lakers with Shaq, Heat with Shaq, Spurs with Duncan, Celtics with the last year of Garnett's prime), or the modern day best Jordan equivalent (game+will to win competitiveness) in Kobe win it all. The only excpeptions have been Detroit, and Dallas over the past well, forever. If you want to win it all, you either need a once in a generation big man (Shaq, Garnett, and Duncan are 3 of the best 5 big men of the past 30 years (Ewing, and Olajuwon also are in there, howard will join the list after he leaves the Magic and starts gifting a team in LA, or NY titles. I think IQ, basketball smarts, coached well, whatever, doesn't mean squat. I think having these guys is step 1, then coaching and surrounding them with talent is step 2. We aren't winning squat without landing one of these guys, we have the partner in Wall, but we do not have the other piece. Adding smart players, smart role players, a genius GM and coach is irrelevant. The only time teams like Dallas or Detroit steal titles are in down years between elite player based dynasties, this was a down year, LA cycled down, Miami was a year early, Chicago isn't quite there (may just miss, as Seattle, and Indy and NY just missed in the 90's). We can definitely contend with all those strategies, but in the end, the only way to win squat w/o a massive pile of luck, is to get that other player, without the other player, we're just one elite guy and some nice (and admittedly valuable) window dressing that's irrelevant without the other guy filling the room and the role of elite unstoppable difference maker. San Antoio's genius was a product of flukish luck, having only two major down years in a nearly 25 year stretch, and winning the lottery in those years that featured only 2 of the 5 drafts in the past 25 years housing transcendent once in a generation big men. They fell arse over feet into a leprechauns pot of gold. That's not genius, that's luck, what they did do, getting a great coach, and finding some gem's in the draft is nice, but totally freaking irrelevant, Saunders has found just as many mid to late round gems as the Spurs FO's have, he just never got himself a Duncan or Roboinson at #1 overall, which is in the end, the only thing that actually matters (and to irritate me some more, just like the Magic, they barely ever sucked, sunddenly did, sucked in the perfect year, and stole the #1 slot in a lottery they weren't anywhere near the worst team in to begin with).

I agree that getting a top 10 player of all time helps in winning championships. As an aside, any chance we could get some paragraph breaks, even if you're not quite sure where to put them? It sounds like you might be writing cool stuff but its really hard to pay attention for large blocks of text like that.

[spaceman_E]

Swing for the fences.

Step 1) Mcgee, 2013 1st for #2.
Step 2) Kanter falls to 6.
Step 3) We use 18, 34, Booker/Seraphin to get Singleton.
Step 4) ?
Step 5) Profit.

G: Wall Young Craw
F: Singleton Williams Shard
C: Kanter Blatche

That rotation wins you a lot of games.

[Cramer]

Just tossing something out for thought.....just how damn athletic and good would Vesley be considered if he was....I don't know, a black kid finishing his freshman year at Syracuse (just to pick a school).

He'd be getting picked apart.....

[sfam]

Forget his hands or lack of rebounding. If the guy is hitting only 44% of his free throws (and he's not Shaq or Wilt Chamberlin) then I don't want him.

I mean where do you start with this guy? A ton of people want him because he'd look great on the wing with Wall on the break. What else does this guy bring to the table? Nothing.

I'd take Leonard in a heart beat over this guy. I just hope he's gone when we pick. I'd rather roll the dice with Donatas at 18.

Vesely haters keep repeating this, and it keeps getting knocked down. The dude is a terrific defender on the wing. He also has a post-up game and is a good slasher. More importantly, he clearly has basketball smarts, and shows a good understanding of the game. He does more than the fast break. You might still hate him, but jeeze, the dude has enough talent to be in this draft.

[sfam]

Just tossing something out for thought.....just how damn athletic and good would Vesley be considered if he was....I don't know, a black kid finishing his freshman year at Syracuse (just to pick a school).

He'd be getting picked apart.....

How many of your strawmen, I don't know - "black kids finishing his freshmen year at Syracuse" would be winning the best young Euro player of the year award and would be starting on a top quality Euroleague team?

[sfam]

I see us getting kanter with one of those trades, utah probably, and also dealing blatche to get another 1st rounder to pick up another player.

+1
I LOVE this plan.

[Cramer]

Forget his hands or lack of rebounding. If the guy is hitting only 44% of his free throws (and he's not Shaq or Wilt Chamberlin) then I don't want him.

I mean where do you start with this guy? A ton of people want him because he'd look great on the wing with Wall on the break. What else does this guy bring to the table? Nothing.

I'd take Leonard in a heart beat over this guy. I just hope he's gone when we pick. I'd rather roll the dice with Donatas at 18.

Vesely haters keep repeating this, and it keeps getting knocked down. The dude is a terrific defender on the wing. He also has a post-up game and is a good slasher. More importantly, he clearly has basketball smarts, and shows a good understanding of the game. He does more than the fast break. You might still hate him, but jeeze, the dude has enough talent to be in this draft.

I don't hate him. Don't hate him at all. I just get the feeling that a lot of people are enamored by the crazy athletic European (read white guy) and because of that are overlooking a lot of holes in his game. A LOT of holes. Having said that, being as there is a reasonable chance we end up with him I hope you thoughts on him are spot on and mine are way off.

[tontoz]

Help me understand something - Yi was picked based on his terrific workout against standing chairs. Vesely, on the other hand, plays - no, starts - in the top Euroleague.

What workouts has Vesely done? Word is he was avoiding workouts altogether until the teams started complaining. I think he is doing his first workout this week.

What does Vesely do in these games? Not much. He doesn't shoot well or create his own shot. He struggles to hold onto the ball and doesn't rebound. Obviously he is not creating for others and he can't even shoot foul shots. He shot 47% from the line this season combining the 3 leagues.

Other than dunk what can he do?

[Zonkerbl]

Well, to me that says that despite his youth he is playing good defense, playing within the offense, and providing hustle. It's tough for young players to break rotations in European ball, he must be doing something right. All the measurables (FT%, etc.) are on the offensive side. So he must be good at defense. Which would be great.

[Zonkerbl]

I vote for "Lather me with Dan Rather" for the next draft blather thread.

[Ruzious]

I've asked that same question - what basketball skill other than dunking does Vesely do well? And all I hear after asking are crickets chirping.

[Rafael122]

I vote for "Lather me with Dan Rather" for the next draft blather thread.

[Ruzious]

Well, to me that says that despite his youth he is playing good defense, playing within the offense, and providing hustle. It's tough for young players to break rotations in European ball, he must be doing something right. All the measurables (FT%, etc.) are on the offensive side. So he must be good at defense. Which would be great.

From the scouting reports, he's not a good defender. Opposing teams single him out to go after.

So... no actual skills other than dunking?

Other people seem to think that because he looks something like AK47, that makes him a good defender. It boggles the mind.

[keynote]

I don't care if Vorld Vide Ves is the best defender and dunker ever. Every F of note that I can think of has either been able to shoot or rebound (or both). There's no minutes on a legit NBA squad for a forward that can do neither.

[doc.end]

I've asked that same question - what basketball skill other than dunking does Vesely do well? And all I hear after asking are crickets chirping.

High basketball IQ, is coachable, doesn't need ball, moves off the ball, plays within system (well I hope that wouldn't be a void with Saunders), quickness, leaping ability (you said dunking right ), passing, first step, physical attributes - he is basically a big man capable of playing on wing.

Well why am I typing this anyway...