What Should the Wizards Should Do with the 5th Pick?

[yungal07]

^^^ I read your post but unless the deal is REALLY good, i think we just take the best player available there which would be Harden.

Here's my point. Fans, Columnists, Message boards, DX, ESPN & NBAdraft.net may believe Harden is the BPA or even worthy of the 2nd or 3rd pick in the draft, but what evidence do we have that the scouts & GMs feel that way? All the rumors seem to heavily involve Curry, Evans and even DeRozan as the players teams are after. Heck, I've seen Flynn & Holiday garner as much interest around the league as Harden.

You just contradicted yourself. You say that the media's perspective on the draft may be different than the perspective of actual GMs, but then you talk about rumors heavily involving x,y, z. Well, you're getting those rumors from DX, ESPN, and nbadraft, etc., so in essence you managed to credit and discredit the media all in one post. So which is it? Obviously they've based their mock drafts off of rumors they've heard in which Harden is probably being taken high...surely that rumor holds as much weight as the other rumors you've mentioned? Right?

[ctorres]

Hey friends, Knicks fan here. I come in peace! One of my best friends is a Wizards fan so I'm cool with you guys. Always enjoyed following the Wizards too ever since they acquired Jamison.

Anyways, what would it take for us to swap picks? I want Stephen Curry real bad.

Would you do any of the following deals?

- Larry Hughes and #8 pick for Mike James, Etan Thomas, and #5 pick
- Larry Hughes, Jared Jeffries, and #8 pick for Mike James, Etan Thomas, #5 pick, and either Darius Songaila or DeShawn Stevenson

If not these deals, there has to be something you guys would be willing to do! Just please work with us.

[Dat2U]

so in essence you managed to credit and discredit the media all in one post.

It takes real talent to do that. Don't hate.

While Harden seemingly remains near the top of many a mock draft, I'm hearing and reading about mnay other names in the rumor mill. Harden almost seems like the default choice for the mock drafts b/c he's been near the top all year long. I have my doubts that his stature is anything more than a collective group think by many and he's not high on alot of team's board as he's made out to be.

I have no real evidence of this, its just my own educated guess. I know he's your favorite at the #5 but I'm just astonished that this guy highly thought of as an NBA prospect by so many. If I'm wrong about Harden and he becomes a star it's really gonna blow up in my face b/c I've railed against him for better part of this year.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Interesting, we worked out Terrence Williams today. He can guard 3 positions. Been a big fan of his since last fall.

Something is up. Ty Lawson, and now Terrence Williams. I think Ernie has a trade in his pocket and I think Mike James is the one being traded with the 5th pick.

Wizards track record would suggest that working out for the team has almost no relation to whether or not we draft a guy. On the other hand, yeah of course Ernie is working the phones (Ginobili rumor, etc). What's interesting to me is thinking about what players might be 'best available' in various trade down situations. We've talked the #5 prospects to death, let's look at plausible options later if GMEG opts to swap.

So far we've heard about:
New York (8th)
Portland (24, 33, 55, 56)
San Antonio (37, 51, 53)

Whose your favorite guy in the range of any of those, provided we drop back and have roster spots open?

Out of that, doc, 24 just seems like a real nice spot in this draft. There's gonna be SOMEBODY that can really step in and play and help a team.

Maynor, McClinton, Terence Williams, James Johnson, Meeks (a really good sleeper if he stays in this draft), Pendergraph (very efficient player alongside Harden, who might be the better player in the short run), Wesley Matthews (available much later, but I have a feeling this guys is what we need at SG), Chase Budweiser (Wiz could use a white baller)....

SOMEBODY GOOD will be available very late this draft. The trade down scenarios are exhaustingly interesting, doc.

[AgentOvechkin08]

Hey friends, Knicks fan here. I come in peace! One of my best friends is a Wizards fan so I'm cool with you guys. Always enjoyed following the Wizards too ever since they acquired Jamison.

Anyways, what would it take for us to swap picks? I want Stephen Curry real bad.

Would you do any of the following deals?

- Larry Hughes and #8 pick for Mike James, Etan Thomas, and #5 pick
- Larry Hughes, Jared Jeffries, and #8 pick for Mike James, Etan Thomas, #5 pick, and either Darius Songaila or DeShawn Stevenson

If not these deals, there has to be something you guys would be willing to do! Just please work with us.

Only one i would even consider is the 2nd. because it gets D steve (who i would chose) off our hands. I cant stand watching him on a basketball court.

We could then get a decent player at 8, or package the 8th pick.

Jamison + 8th pick + Blatche for Amare

Arenas/Critt
Hughes/Young
Butler/McGuire
Stoudemire/Songaila
Haywood/McGee

Then maybe get a guy like Meeks in the 2nd. or Jack McClinton.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

That last WIzdynasty post made me put him on ignore once and for all...

Really outdid yourself on that one.

When he said that Hill would immediately be our best post up, better than Jamison <sigh>...
He's been on my ignore for a while but I don't always log in unless I'm going to post.
Then there is always the inevitable quoting.

I don't care what anybody says about Wizdynasty. I've been off meds in the past ...



His and anybody else's posts are just words.

I'd rather have a long arsed, repetitive post than as doc said, a package from the Unibomber. And on the real, I want Wizardynasty to keep right on posting away and feeling empowered to do so because his opinion's are to be as respected as anybody else's.

And besides that, he has some interesting insights that aren't all wrong IMO.

(Okay, I just don't like being the craziest guy in the room! Please stay Wiz, I love you, man.)

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Interesting, we worked out Terrence Williams today. He can guard 3 positions. Been a big fan of his since last fall.

Something is up. Ty Lawson, and now Terrence Williams. I think Ernie has a trade in his pocket and I think Mike James is the one being traded with the 5th pick.

Terrance Williams is IDEAL to step in and START at SG next to Gil becaouse he's a ball-handling, rebounding, great defender.

He's McGuire with better offense.

I'd love to have him and Dominic even if they're similar.

Bravo. TWilliams has kinda fallen off our radar. He'd be a good pickup.
As would Lawson.

Yep, jim. Those guys just are solid players. You know what you're gonna get with both IMO. Floor leaders who'll upgrade the depth at the PG position. With Williams, he's got the size to play SG or SF. Lawson's got the game to be a better Brevin Knight, potentially.

I don't see Crit as anything but a converted SG. Solid worker, but definitely not a PG. Not enough of a scorer to make up for him not being a distributor either. I like Crittenton, but Lawson and Terrance Williams both IMO are better PG prospects.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

That last WIzdynasty post made me put him on ignore once and for all...

Really outdid yourself on that one.

When he said that Hill would immediately be our best post up, better than Jamison <sigh>...
He's been on my ignore for a while but I don't always log in unless I'm going to post.
Then there is always the inevitable quoting.

yeah yeah whatever. The idea that posters on this board think Jamison's post game is better than Hill's is laughable. So lost, and yes please put me ignore so I don't have to see your comments. Any decent basketball mind can see that Hill is an upgrade over Jamison in the post.

I gotta see Hill and will plead ignorance, WD. His stats from college don't impress me FWIW.

What I do agree is that Jamison tends to post up smallish SFs that try and cover him. Antawn's not going to drop step and slam. He's not going Amare Stoudemire on anybody. He's not going to back down and bully like a Boozer. Yet, Antawn can get points in the paint when he wants to.

I think Jamison's post up game is there, but not a real strength of his game.

But I have a hard time seeing Hill be the guy to be that. I WILL give you credit in the future for calling this if your prediction comes to fruition on Hill, WD.

Personally, I can't stand his stats and don't care about Jordan Hill's measurables because he reminds me too much of parts of McGuire, Etan, and Blatche all morphed into one. I can't see him being an upgrade but I think I'm way too opinionated on a guy I've barely seen.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

My only opinion of Hill is that DeJuan Blair, if he doesn't eat his way out of the league and if his knees don't splinter away, is going to be way better than Jordan Hill.

Blair IMO is going to have a hellaciously effective post up game.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

I don't believe it for a second. Curry will be a starter on a lottery team and a bench player, possibly not even the 6th man, on a contender.

I can't believe how much people are overrating this tweener. Shooting and heart alone can't make up for his size and lack of an ideal position at the next level.

The cherry on top is saying his skillset is comparable to ELITE players like Lebron or Kobe.

Well we just disagree on all aspects of this. IMO he's not a tweener, he does not lack an ideal position. He's legit PG thru and thru. He's got good size for a PG at 6-3 180 and showed decent strength in the athletic testing.

To me his skill level is 2nd in the draft only to Ricky Rubio. Please tell me where you find his skillset lacking.

Dat, I think he's 1st but because he's older.

I don't think Ricky can shoot it.

[MJG]

My only opinion of Hill is that DeJuan Blair, if he doesn't eat his way out of the league and if his knees don't splinter away, is going to be way better than Jordan Hill.

Blair IMO is going to have a hellaciously effective post up game.

Looks like Wages of Wins Journal agrees.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Thanks for posting that, MJG. Just what I needed to see on a sleepless night.

Code: Select all

  Comparing Jordan Hill and DeJuan Blair

Numbers are per 40 minutes

Points-per-shot = [PTS-FTM]/FGA

Adjusted Field Goal Percentage = PPS/2

Win Score = PTS + REB + STL + ½*BLK + ½*AST – FGA – ½*FTA – TO – ½*PF

PAWS48 = Positions Adjusted Win Score per 40 minutes = Win Score per 40 minutes – Average Win Score per 40 minutes at position played

Average PAWS40 = 10.13

All players evaluated at power forward (average WS40 equals 12.5)

Return to The Wages of Wins Journal

 

Statistic
 Jordan Hill
 DeJuan Blair
 
Points per shot
 1.07
 1.19
 
Adjusted Field Goal Percentage
 53.7%
 59.3%
 
Free Throw Percentage
 65.4%
 60.5%
 
Field Goal Attempts
 15.5
 16.0
 
Free Throw Attempts
 5.9
 6.8
 
Points Scored
 20.5
 23.0
 
Rebounds
 12.4
 18.1
 
Steals
 1.0
 2.3
 
Turnovers
 3.2
 1.8
 
Blocked Shots
 1.9
 1.4
 
Assists
 1.6
 1.8
 
Personal Fouls
 3.4
 4.0
 
Win Score
 12.3
 21.8
 
PAWS40
 10.0
 19.5
 



MJG, I'm really not too different from Wizardynasty other than leaning to the other extreme. I'm all about performance over time, as opposed to measureables.

Blair's going to be a freaking beast is what I'd put real good money on, just based on what he's already shown in 20 years of life.


I've seen Jonathan Givony get it twisted and all the mocks be wrong more than a few times.


Blair seems like the poster child for fat guy can play.

[nate33]

Hey friends, Knicks fan here. I come in peace! One of my best friends is a Wizards fan so I'm cool with you guys. Always enjoyed following the Wizards too ever since they acquired Jamison.

Anyways, what would it take for us to swap picks? I want Stephen Curry real bad.

Would you do any of the following deals?

- Larry Hughes and #8 pick for Mike James, Etan Thomas, and #5 pick
- Larry Hughes, Jared Jeffries, and #8 pick for Mike James, Etan Thomas, #5 pick, and either Darius Songaila or DeShawn Stevenson

If not these deals, there has to be something you guys would be willing to do! Just please work with us.

I'd definitely consider the first deal. Though I'd tweak it so that NY gets Pecherov too (expiring in 2010), and NY would also throw in $3M cash. I

[closg00]

Yikes! we've got BJ Mullens coming-in for a workout???????? Resist your urge Ernie to draft another 7ft project ...Actually Mullens has a lot of "upside" and will probably be taken in the top-20.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

BJ Mullens .... upside ....

I'm thinking Ernie's been hit upside the head and can't get past drafting the same player again and again and again if he goes with Mullens.

[closg00]

DX has their Team Needs article on the Wiz up today, here's a snippet.

If they do decide to improve through the draft, the most glaring holes on the roster likely lie on the perimeter, where they could an elite young point guard or shooting guard, a player capable of playing with Gilbert Arenas, on or off of the ball, and capable of hitting shots. With the fifth pick, there are a lot of options, ranging from point guards like Stephen Curry, a wing player like James Harden, or a hybrid like Tyreke Evans, all of whom could fulfill this role. Another significant concern is the frontcourt. Though Andray Blatche and JaVale McGee were solid contributors, neither player was consistent enough to consider the frontcourt rotation set. Jordan Hill will likely be on the board here, if that is the direction that they choose to pursue.

http://www.draftexpress.com/blog/NBA-Te ... ision-3253

[dobrojim]

apologies for OT but AJ's post up game is top notch even if
it's not shaq-style based on brute strength and athletic
dominence. When Hill comes into the league and has
half as many 20-10 games as Jamison, I'll think about
taking certain people off ignore. Measureables are
all well and good but you gotta look at what happens
in actual games. By measureables, Javale McGee
would/should have been ROY. Now if you want
to argue that down the road potential is what
ROY should be based on, McGee /might/ be
better than Rose or Beasley. But I doubt MIA
or CHI would trade them straight up. It's silly.

[WizarDynasty]

apologies for OT but AJ's post up game is top notch even if
it's not shaq-style based on brute strength and athletic
dominence. When Hill comes into the league and has
half as many 20-10 games as Jamison, I'll think about
taking certain people off ignore. Measureables are
all well and good but you gotta look at what happens
in actual games. By measureables, Javale McGee
would/should have been ROY. Now if you want
to argue that down the road potential is what
ROY should be based on, McGee /might/ be
better than Rose or Beasley. But I doubt MIA
or CHI would trade them straight up. It's silly.

Top Notch. Wow. A powerforward who's shooting percentage hovers around point guard territory of .44 percent. What part of assisted on close to .70 percent of his shots do you not understand. A post player normally isn't assisted since he executes a POST MOVE. Grabbing rebounds when no one else on the team rebound is not an accomplishment. If jamison is averaging ten rebounds next to dwight howard..or another dominant rebounder, then that's when you praise Jamison rebounds. you don't brag about ten rebounds a game when you are the only big logging consistent heavy minutes. He plays 35 minutes. Every 3 minutes and thirty seconds and a team has to shoot the ball every twenty four seconds. So with no one else rebounding next to Jamison, all Jamison can manage to rebound is one every three minutes and 30 seconds..and we are including offensive rebounds as well. A powerforward who shooting percentage is lower than alot of guards...and he average ten rebounds a game with no other big man rebounding next to him and you got the nerve to call him "top notch". That's HOFer material right there. And if he is being assisted close to .70 percent, that means he is taking easy wide open shots 70% of time after someone does all the work to suck in teh defense. Pau Gasol and D. Howard in the playoffs are executing post moves....Jamison is basically playing like Rashard Lewis except Jamison is a way worse three point shooter. Hate to shoot your Top Notch post game. And even then, Jamison isn't shooting shots with a hand in his face, he only shoots when he is wide open and normally misses. Top Notch..lmao. Jamison get 20-10 because he gets to stand in one spot and wait for teh defense to collapse and get rewarded for doing nothing but hitting a wide open shot. Even in this role, he shoots way below .50 percent. Hopefully the concept of being assisted on .70 percent of your shots and we don't even have a passing point guard shows just how pathetic Jamison really is in terms of taking over a game on offense when we need to score badly.

[DaRealHibachi]

Are you really that dense...??? most PF's get most of their shots assisted...

btw 70% isnt an average for AJ...

last year 70
07-08 53
06-07 53
05-06 51

KG gets 74% assisted this year, so KG post game sucks...

Why do I even bother, really...???

[Kanyewest]

DeRozan is rising higher in my book. Sure he doesn't have a 3 point shot but he has a solid mid range game and it looks like he can play solid defense. If I had to make a decision today, I would take him over James Harden; not sure if I would take him over Curry.