Official Trade Thread - Part XXXII

[BurtGummer]

I was being sarcastic, the wizards would be the ones laughing at that nonsense.

Jeez, this thread is getting bad

People here sure have a weird unfounded crush on him he's terrible

i mean, have you seen the guy?

Unfortunately I have Although I don't live near DC they're still on tv here
The Stats don't lie he can occasionally play some defense but not often he doesn't even average 1 block, 1 assist or 1 steal a game

[Dat2U]

The two guys I'm afraid of Ernie acquiring are Brandon Knight & Bojan Bogdanovic so I was horrified to learn of the rumor linking the Wizards to Bogdanovic. Leave it to Ernie to find a potential rental that's a downgrade to an already lousy bench. Bojan is a SF that will likely end up stealing minutes from Oubre - not Burke and potentially makes us worse.

[payitforward]

I wouldn't trade for George. Porter is far and away the more effective offensive player at this stage. Porter is proving to be an elite shooter. Outside of Durant he's arguably been the best shooter in the NBA this year. George may be better at creating his own shot but that's less of need with the development of Wall and Beal.

George is a better on ball defender but when looking at age, Porter's consistent improvement and the fact we can lock up Porter for the next 5 years as opposed to having George for 2... I see little reason to risk the chemistry we have now.

I think what makes us so good right now is that we have the best perimeter trio in the league outside of Golden State and Beal & Porter haven't even entered their primes yet. If there is any moves to be made it's to our front court & back court depth.

Agree 100%. Not only wouldn't I trade Porter & a #1 pick for Paul George, I wouldn't trade Otto straight up for him.

Worth mentioning that I thought Paul George was the 3d best player in the 2010 draft, & that he might wind up being the best player altogether over his career. I.e. I'm not a PG hater.

But in every way I can think of, Otto Porter is a more valuable commodity than Paul George. I'd also say that right now (& into the future) he's the better player of the two.

[payitforward]

Porter is getting more recognition this year, as you'd expect, but compare his numbers w/ those from last year -- overall no difference (please don't respond w/ a cherrypicked selection of a few).

Except for a very small downtick in assists, Porter has gotten better at literally everything:

Thanks, nate; you are correct -- my bad.

OTOH, Otto's numbers last year were quite good too! But, yes, he's really a ton better this year.

[Meliorus]

I wouldn't trade for George. Porter is far and away the more effective offensive player at this stage. Porter is proving to be an elite shooter. Outside of Durant he's arguably been the best shooter in the NBA this year. George may be better at creating his own shot but that's less of need with the development of Wall and Beal.

George is a better on ball defender but when looking at age, Porter's consistent improvement and the fact we can lock up Porter for the next 5 years as opposed to having George for 2... I see little reason to risk the chemistry we have now.

I think what makes us so good right now is that we have the best perimeter trio in the league outside of Golden State and Beal & Porter haven't even entered their primes yet. If there is any moves to be made it's to our front court & back court depth.

Agree 100%. Not only wouldn't I trade Porter & a #1 pick for Paul George, I wouldn't trade Otto straight up for him.

Worth mentioning that I thought Paul George was the 3d best player in the 2010 draft, & that he might wind up being the best player altogether over his career. I.e. I'm not a PG hater.

But in every way I can think of, Otto Porter is a more valuable commodity than Paul George. I'd also say that right now (& into the future) he's the better player of the two.

Is Ottto really better or are his stats better because he's a 3rd/4th option?? I'd imagine George's efficiency would skyrocket if he camped the 3 point line and stopped taking isolation pull-ups.

[Meliorus]

People here sure have a weird unfounded crush on him he's terrible

i mean, have you seen the guy?

Unfortunately I have Although I don't live near DC they're still on tv here
The Stats don't lie he can occasionally play some defense but not often he doesn't even average 1 block, 1 assist or 1 steal a game

Are you trolling? Blocks and steals measure defensive impact??

All you need to know is that the Wall-Beal-Otto-Oubre-Gortat lineup has one of the best net ratings in the league.

[payitforward]

I liked Nivek. We totally disagreed on his method of analysis but it was interesting how often our conclusions were the same. I also like nate. We frequently agree in basketball discussions and I appreciate his analysis. But his politics are anathema to me and I don't blame Nivek for bailing. It's a disconcerting situation for an NBA fan board to have a mod who is openly racist in his politics. But I appreciate free speech and pluralism so I believe there should be space for nate's point of view.

But if most of the board agreed with him, I would probably bail too.

Huh. It's interesting that this came up. I asked AFM for confirmation of this, because he is so often ironic -- the idea of "a traitor to this board," for example, is one I didn't think he'd meant literally the previous times he used the phrase. I hope he'll answer.

It's also -- obviously -- not exactly the right thread for this material. But... it's come up, so I'd better add to it something I've done.

A few days ago, I PM'ed one of the mods (pine) to say that I'd looked at a lot of NBA team boards on RealGM, none of which had anything like the politics thread nate started on this board. No politics, but more importantly no thread full of hate content about Muslims, explicitly racist material (blacks being of inferior intelligence, etc.), and so forth. Not on any NBA team board I found.

I asked that the mods (obviously this would include nate) explicitly discuss whether this one thread (in all its particularity) was appropriate for the Board. I pointed out that there was no shortage of places to talk politics online, & for that matter no shortage of places to spew hatred for particular groups. There's no threat of shutting discussion down, just a question of whether it needs to take place on our front porch.

I don't want to make anybody angry. I don't want to offend nate, whom I get along with just fine in every other thread (even in cases where we disagree). At the same time, if we really did lose Nivek b/c of the thread I certainly do regret that loss. It makes it all the more regrettable that this thread full repulsive material exists here.

Sorry. :(

I posted my answer on the board. Do not hijack the TRADE thread for your own agenda. Consider this your one (very public) warning.

P.S. Since youve gone public let me do the same - I replied to your PM that Nate did not start the politics thread. I told you directly and you recieved my note. Yet you repeat your unfounded allegation above, underlined, yet again. Stop it.

My bad, & I apologize. Somehow I missed the info in your note that nate didn't start the politics thread (which I concluded from his name being on it). That does make a difference -- i.e. it means that my claim that the thread is a platform for nate's politics is inaccurate.

I stand corrected. In fact, I'd say that my request was an example of the overheated rhetoric I was complaining about. nate, you have my apologies as well.

[montestewart]

Huh. It's interesting that this came up. I asked AFM for confirmation of this, because he is so often ironic -- the idea of "a traitor to this board," for example, is one I didn't think he'd meant literally the previous times he used the phrase. I hope he'll answer.

It's also -- obviously -- not exactly the right thread for this material. But... it's come up, so I'd better add to it something I've done.

A few days ago, I PM'ed one of the mods (pine) to say that I'd looked at a lot of NBA team boards on RealGM, none of which had anything like the politics thread nate started on this board. No politics, but more importantly no thread full of hate content about Muslims, explicitly racist material (blacks being of inferior intelligence, etc.), and so forth. Not on any NBA team board I found.

I asked that the mods (obviously this would include nate) explicitly discuss whether this one thread (in all its particularity) was appropriate for the Board. I pointed out that there was no shortage of places to talk politics online, & for that matter no shortage of places to spew hatred for particular groups. There's no threat of shutting discussion down, just a question of whether it needs to take place on our front porch.

I don't want to make anybody angry. I don't want to offend nate, whom I get along with just fine in every other thread (even in cases where we disagree). At the same time, if we really did lose Nivek b/c of the thread I certainly do regret that loss. It makes it all the more regrettable that this thread full repulsive material exists here.

Sorry. :(

I posted my answer on the board. Do not hijack the TRADE thread for your own agenda. Consider this your one (very public) warning.

P.S. Since youve gone public let me do the same - I replied to your PM that Nate did not start the politics thread. I told you directly and you recieved my note. Yet you repeat your unfounded allegation above, underlined, yet again. Stop it.

My bad, & I apologize. Somehow I missed the info in your note that nate didn't start the politics thread (which I concluded from his name being on it). That does make a difference -- i.e. it means that my claim that the thread is a platform for nate's politics is inaccurate.

I stand corrected. In fact, I'd say that my request was an example of the overheated rhetoric I was complaining about. nate, you have my apologies as well.

One of the many many many many many mod tasks is to lock a thread that reaches 100 pages and start a new thread, so each version of the Political thread beyond the first version (started by Lupin?) is probably started by a mod. Nate's starting many Political threads, Trade threads, etc. is one measure of his contribution to the board.

During the annual mod convention in Aruba, scofflaws and reprobates take advantage of the attendant light policing and spam post to get threads to 101 pages, like an overflowing shopping cart stall in a grocery store parking lot. Anarchy, chaos, madness, I tell you!

[stevemcqueen1]

I wouldn't trade for George. Porter is far and away the more effective offensive player at this stage. Porter is proving to be an elite shooter. Outside of Durant he's arguably been the best shooter in the NBA this year. George may be better at creating his own shot but that's less of need with the development of Wall and Beal.

George is a better on ball defender but when looking at age, Porter's consistent improvement and the fact we can lock up Porter for the next 5 years as opposed to having George for 2... I see little reason to risk the chemistry we have now.

I think what makes us so good right now is that we have the best perimeter trio in the league outside of Golden State and Beal & Porter haven't even entered their primes yet. If there is any moves to be made it's to our front court & back court depth.

Agree 100%. Not only wouldn't I trade Porter & a #1 pick for Paul George, I wouldn't trade Otto straight up for him.

Worth mentioning that I thought Paul George was the 3d best player in the 2010 draft, & that he might wind up being the best player altogether over his career. I.e. I'm not a PG hater.

But in every way I can think of, Otto Porter is a more valuable commodity than Paul George. I'd also say that right now (& into the future) he's the better player of the two.

Is Ottto really better or are his stats better because he's a 3rd/4th option?? I'd imagine George's efficiency would skyrocket if he camped the 3 point line and stopped taking isolation pull-ups.

PG is a very good shooter, but Otto is better IMO. Otto is obviously a fantastic three point shooter with a lightning fast release, but he's also a really good shooter from mid range. And he's a really good finisher around the rim too.

But another point to consider is that I think PG needs the ball in his hands to do his thing. A big part of what makes him special is the ability to create shots off the dribble for himself and his teammates. Making him a third or fourth option loses that.

If we traded for George, I think he'd become our second option. If we didn't have Beal, I wouldn't hesitate to trade Otto for George. But Beal has been a fantastic second option this season, not sure demoting him to third option for George would make us better net-net than having Otto as a hyper efficient third/fourth option does.

[nate33]

I just don't think Nicholson's contract is bad enough to sacrifice the first round pick to move it.

Agreed. If the luxtax is an issue, Smith can be moved much easier. We could probably just give him away in the offseason in exchange for a top 55 protected 2nd round pick.

[nate33]

Now that Mahinmi's back, he might get the chance. The reason he hasn't played is because we couldn't hide his flaws without a healthy Mahinmi. Jason Smith exceeded expectations too. Nicholson is slow and he's not physical and his release on his set shot jumper takes a century. Jason Smith is physical, he covers ground because he tries so hard, and he is a super shooter off the catch. He's limited, but Brooks went with him over Nicholson because his effort is so much better and he's more athletic and he is a better center. Nicholson isn't a garbage player, he just hasn't gotten a chance here. It's a numbers game and we have too many bigs on our roster.

I'm not so optimistic. I don't buy the notion that Mahinmi can cover up for Nicholson. It doesn't matter that Mahinmi is a good rim protector. That won't help Nicholson execute our switching scheme on defense. It won't improve Nicholson's ability to close out and challenge 3's.

Slow plodders just don't work in today's game anymore. They're massive liabilities everywhere but at center.

[nate33]

Hmm. Would (2) 1st rd picks, Sato, Smith & Nicholson be enough for Bledsoe? He's signed for 2 more yrs @ $29 mil beyond this season. We get at least 3 playoff runs with a top 8 core of Wall, Beal, Porter, Morris, Gortat, Bledsoe, Oubre & Mahinmi.

I just wanted to reiterate how much I love this idea. That's a 60-win team and a championship contender.

[stevemcqueen1]

The two guys I'm afraid of Ernie acquiring are Brandon Knight & Bojan Bogdanovic so I was horrified to learn of the rumor linking the Wizards to Bogdanovic. Leave it to Ernie to find a potential rental that's a downgrade to an already lousy bench. Bojan is a SF that will likely end up stealing minutes from Oubre - not Burke and potentially makes us worse.

We discussed Bojan on a different board and there are a couple of factors that made me like the idea of trading for him more:

1 - He's supposedly a natural SG. A poster that follows him said he's an oversized SG in the vein of Joe Johnson being a SG.

2 - He'd probably play with Oubre. Oubre can guard 1s and 2s so it doesn't really matter where you play him.

3 - Sato can play some PG and he can also guard 1s, 2s, and 3s. A Sato/Bogdanovich/Oubre line up is huge and I think it has enough scoring and defense to be balanced.

My only issue with Bogdanovich is the cost. I don't like the idea of giving up a first round pick for an expiring at all. If we could get him for Burke or Jason Smith and a second, then I'd be on board. But losing the first rounder and then having him walk this offseason is way too big a potential price to pay.

[stevemcqueen1]

Hmm. Would (2) 1st rd picks, Sato, Smith & Nicholson be enough for Bledsoe? He's signed for 2 more yrs @ $29 mil beyond this season. We get at least 3 playoff runs with a top 8 core of Wall, Beal, Porter, Morris, Gortat, Bledsoe, Oubre & Mahinmi.

I just wanted to reiterate how much I love this idea. That's a 60-win team and a championship contender.

Yeah, that is a great trade. But unfortunately I don't think it's realistic. I think Phoenix is trying to hold on to Bledsoe and build around him and Booker as their back court. I don't think Bledsoe goes on the table unless they are able to draft Markelle Fultz or Lonzo Ball.

[BurtGummer]

i mean, have you seen the guy?

Unfortunately I have Although I don't live near DC they're still on tv here
The Stats don't lie he can occasionally play some defense but not often he doesn't even average 1 block, 1 assist or 1 steal a game

Are you trolling? Blocks and steals measure defensive impact??

All you need to know is that the Wall-Beal-Otto-Oubre-Gortat lineup has one of the best net ratings in the league.

Not trolling at all,I just don't think he's very good
He doesn't score much gets a couple rebounds no steals no blocks you tell me why he's so good and spare me with your line-up with one of the best net ratings if its true its not because of him its because the Wiz have one of the best starting 5 in the league and the other guys will make up for all his weaknesses

[Dat2U]

The two guys I'm afraid of Ernie acquiring are Brandon Knight & Bojan Bogdanovic so I was horrified to learn of the rumor linking the Wizards to Bogdanovic. Leave it to Ernie to find a potential rental that's a downgrade to an already lousy bench. Bojan is a SF that will likely end up stealing minutes from Oubre - not Burke and potentially makes us worse.

We discussed Bojan on a different board and there are a couple of factors that made me like the idea of trading for him more:

1 - He's supposedly a natural SG. A poster that follows him said he's an oversized SG in the vein of Joe Johnson being a SG.

2 - He'd probably play with Oubre. Oubre can guard 1s and 2s so it doesn't really matter where you play him.

3 - Sato can play some PG and he can also guard 1s, 2s, and 3s. A Sato/Bogdanovich/Oubre line up is huge and I think it has enough scoring and defense to be balanced.

My only issue with Bogdanovich is the cost. I don't like the idea of giving up a first round pick for an expiring at all. If we could get him for Burke or Jason Smith and a second, then I'd be on board. But losing the first rounder and then having him walk this offseason is way too big a potential price to pay.

Looking at 82games.com he's been equally bad at either the 2 or the 3. Considering his height/weight I'm assuming he doesn't have the foot speed to take other 2s off the bounce or defend adequately and that's his real issue. He's a really poor defender. He's not like Lou Will who is such an offensive dynamo that his scoring can offset his weak defense. A horrible team like Nets were better with Bojan OFF the court - on both sides of the ball! I cannot fathom giving up an asset for this guy. Is better than Marcus Thornton? Sure but we need to aim higher than that.

[Dat2U]

Hmm. Would (2) 1st rd picks, Sato, Smith & Nicholson be enough for Bledsoe? He's signed for 2 more yrs @ $29 mil beyond this season. We get at least 3 playoff runs with a top 8 core of Wall, Beal, Porter, Morris, Gortat, Bledsoe, Oubre & Mahinmi.

I just wanted to reiterate how much I love this idea. That's a 60-win team and a championship contender.

Yeah, that is a great trade. But unfortunately I don't think it's realistic. I think Phoenix is trying to hold on to Bledsoe and build around him and Booker as their back court. I don't think Bledsoe goes on the table unless they are able to draft Markelle Fultz or Lonzo Ball.

Not even if we throw in McClellan and send them a really nice floral arrangement?

[Meliorus]

Unfortunately I have Although I don't live near DC they're still on tv here
The Stats don't lie he can occasionally play some defense but not often he doesn't even average 1 block, 1 assist or 1 steal a game

Are you trolling? Blocks and steals measure defensive impact??

All you need to know is that the Wall-Beal-Otto-Oubre-Gortat lineup has one of the best net ratings in the league.

Not trolling at all,I just don't think he's very good
He doesn't score much gets a couple rebounds no steals no blocks you tell me why he's so good and spare me with your line-up with one of the best net ratings if its true its not because of him its because the Wiz have one of the best starting 5 in the league and the other guys will make up for all his weaknesses

Then why does the net rating soar when Oubre REPLACES one of the starting five (Gortat or Morris)?? The dude is our most versatile defender. He'll guard the point guard if Wall is tired, he'll guard the other team's star player, he'll guard power forwards when called upon. A guy who can switch 1-4 is valuable in today's league. When he's in the lineup, all our guards/wings can switch with ease.

You tell me why we should trade for the bad players on your bad team. I can make the argument that every single player on your roster aside from Zubac, Ingram and D'Angelo is bad and will stay bad.

[nate33]

The two guys I'm afraid of Ernie acquiring are Brandon Knight & Bojan Bogdanovic so I was horrified to learn of the rumor linking the Wizards to Bogdanovic. Leave it to Ernie to find a potential rental that's a downgrade to an already lousy bench. Bojan is a SF that will likely end up stealing minutes from Oubre - not Burke and potentially makes us worse.

We discussed Bojan on a different board and there are a couple of factors that made me like the idea of trading for him more:

1 - He's supposedly a natural SG. A poster that follows him said he's an oversized SG in the vein of Joe Johnson being a SG.

2 - He'd probably play with Oubre. Oubre can guard 1s and 2s so it doesn't really matter where you play him.

3 - Sato can play some PG and he can also guard 1s, 2s, and 3s. A Sato/Bogdanovich/Oubre line up is huge and I think it has enough scoring and defense to be balanced.

My only issue with Bogdanovich is the cost. I don't like the idea of giving up a first round pick for an expiring at all. If we could get him for Burke or Jason Smith and a second, then I'd be on board. But losing the first rounder and then having him walk this offseason is way too big a potential price to pay.

Looking at 82games.com he's been equally bad at either the 2 or the 3. Considering his height/weight I'm assuming he doesn't have the foot speed to take other 2s off the bounce or defend adequately and that's his real issue. He's a really poor defender. He's not like Lou Will who is such an offensive dynamo that his scoring can offset his weak defense. A horrible team like Nets were better with Bojan OFF the court - on both sides of the ball! I cannot fathom giving up an asset for this guy. Is better than Marcus Thornton? Sure but we need to aim higher than that.

I'm just hoping (against all evidence) that EG is at least patient. If we're going to give up a 1st round pick for bench depth, so be it; but at least let it be a decent trade than can be justified in a vacuum. We have no need whatsoever to make a panic trade. We have maybe a 1% chance at a championship this year, and Bogdonavich gets us up to maybe 1.05% It's not worth it.

On the other hand, Lou Williams can win us a playoff game by himself. I'm not in love with the idea of trading a pick for him, but at least there is a potential "reward" in the risk/reward equation.

[sfam]

Now that Mahinmi's back, he might get the chance. The reason he hasn't played is because we couldn't hide his flaws without a healthy Mahinmi. Jason Smith exceeded expectations too. Nicholson is slow and he's not physical and his release on his set shot jumper takes a century. Jason Smith is physical, he covers ground because he tries so hard, and he is a super shooter off the catch. He's limited, but Brooks went with him over Nicholson because his effort is so much better and he's more athletic and he is a better center. Nicholson isn't a garbage player, he just hasn't gotten a chance here. It's a numbers game and we have too many bigs on our roster.

I'm not so optimistic. I don't buy the notion that Mahinmi can cover up for Nicholson. It doesn't matter that Mahinmi is a good rim protector. That won't help Nicholson execute our switching scheme on defense. It won't improve Nicholson's ability to close out and challenge 3's.

Slow plodders just don't work in today's game anymore. They're massive liabilities everywhere but at center.

Smith is going to get the chance at the 4 well before Nicholson. He clearly isn't ideal there (lets hope the new second unit improves with more play) but compared to Nicholson, Smith should be in NOLA this weekend.