Political Roundtable Part XXVIII

[dckingsfan]

this long essay on the thought process facing parents of school age kids went viral among
many of my FB friends

(PS- is it politically okay to say went viral anymore?)

warning - it's really long

Long but a good read - sucks to be a parent, teacher or school administrator right now...

[pancakes3]

this long essay on the thought process facing parents of school age kids went viral among
many of my FB friends

(PS- is it politically okay to say went viral anymore?)

warning - it's really long

not addressing the issue of in-person public education as child care is a massive oversight to the point where the entire essay is meaningless.

[dckingsfan]

this long essay on the thought process facing parents of school age kids went viral among
many of my FB friends

(PS- is it politically okay to say went viral anymore?)

warning - it's really long

not addressing the issue of in-person public education as child care is a massive oversight to the point where the entire essay is meaningless.

Adding it as child care is important. But the rest of it stands, no?

His quote would be roughly the same - "we are willing to sacrifice 302 students and lots of teachers and administrators for child care".

Or maybe it should be: "we are willing to sacrifice 302 students and lots of teachers and administrators for child care AND lots of outbreaks..."

[pancakes3]

this long essay on the thought process facing parents of school age kids went viral among
many of my FB friends

(PS- is it politically okay to say went viral anymore?)

warning - it's really long

not addressing the issue of in-person public education as child care is a massive oversight to the point where the entire essay is meaningless.

Adding it as child care is important. But the rest of it stands, no?

His quote would be roughly the same - "we are willing to sacrifice 302 students and lots of teachers and administrators for child care".

Or maybe it should be: "we are willing to sacrifice 302 students and lots of teachers and administrators for child care AND lots of outbreaks..."

it doesn't stand on its own bc child care is the only legitimate countervailing consideration, and it's a significant one. the other targets that he knocks down (i.e. my kid wants to) are complete strawmen. the framing of going through an enumerated and presumably exhaustive list of reasons for reopening and defeating each one, but not addressing the heart of the matter is disingenuous at best.

and it's easy to be cavalier about child care and take the moral high ground of protecting 302 innocent children's lives when you have the flexibility to secure child care in the event of closed schools. what of those who can't - almost exclusively poor people?

i don't really have a strong opinion one way or another, but it's frustrating to see the false dichotomy of full open v full close as the only options presented. are we exploring mitigation methods: outdoor teaching? emergency hiring for smaller student/teacher ratios? satellite remote learning? tax/financial incentives for unemployed people to serve as child care providers?

i don't know the answer but the solution will be complex and convoluted because it's a messy situation. i'd hope that education experts and health care experts are working in collaboration for solutions but it's just trump and devos screaming into the void about "the promise schools made to america" and that schools better reopen OR ELSE...

[dckingsfan]

not addressing the issue of in-person public education as child care is a massive oversight to the point where the entire essay is meaningless.

Adding it as child care is important. But the rest of it stands, no?

His quote would be roughly the same - "we are willing to sacrifice 302 students and lots of teachers and administrators for child care".

Or maybe it should be: "we are willing to sacrifice 302 students and lots of teachers and administrators for child care AND lots of outbreaks..."

it doesn't stand on its own bc child care is the only legitimate countervailing consideration, and it's a significant one. the other targets that he knocks down (i.e. my kid wants to) are complete strawmen. the framing of going through an enumerated and presumably exhaustive list of reasons for reopening and defeating each one, but not addressing the heart of the matter is disingenuous at best.

and it's easy to be cavalier about child care and take the moral high ground of protecting 302 innocent children's lives when you have the flexibility to secure child care in the event of closed schools. what of those who can't - almost exclusively poor people?

i don't really have a strong opinion one way or another, but it's frustrating to see the false dichotomy of full open v full close as the only options presented. are we exploring mitigation methods: outdoor teaching? emergency hiring for smaller student/teacher ratios? satellite remote learning? tax/financial incentives for unemployed people to serve as child care providers?

i don't know the answer but the solution will be complex and convoluted because it's a messy situation. i'd hope that education experts and health care experts are working in collaboration for solutions but it's just trump and devos screaming into the void about "the promise schools made to america" and that schools better reopen OR ELSE...

Solid points all... but it still comes down to the " 302" kids, numerous teachers and continuing the pandemic for childcare.

What we aren't seeing, as you point out, is any leadership from the national level to get through this. It's pretty simple, we are going to need federal dollars going to the states to fund the ideas that you mention above. States can't print money. And without money, you can't:

1) get the PPE you need for teachers
2) get the teachers aides you need to reduce class size
3) get the testing kits for teachers, students and administrators
4) install the extra portable classrooms
5) install the air cleaners needed to reduce risk

Without that federal funding it is a binary open/close choice, IMO.

And hence you see post like this going through a parent's perspective. I have seen the same going through both teacher (will I get this and is it worth it) and administrator and school board members (will I get personally sued) perspectives.

[Zonkerbl]

yeah teleworking works great for me. I made a strategic decision to have my kids early and that is paying off a crapton right now. My home is an ideal office. I have wireless headphones, I can get up and pace around while I talk if I need to and no one gets distracted because they can't see me, I can do dishes to keep my hands busy *and* kill two birds with one stone. Teleworking is GREAT. For me.

I have several coworkers with toddlers and elementary school aged children and it is a *nightmare* right now for them.

[Zonkerbl]

Adding it as child care is important. But the rest of it stands, no?

His quote would be roughly the same - "we are willing to sacrifice 302 students and lots of teachers and administrators for child care".

Or maybe it should be: "we are willing to sacrifice 302 students and lots of teachers and administrators for child care AND lots of outbreaks..."

it doesn't stand on its own bc child care is the only legitimate countervailing consideration, and it's a significant one. the other targets that he knocks down (i.e. my kid wants to) are complete strawmen. the framing of going through an enumerated and presumably exhaustive list of reasons for reopening and defeating each one, but not addressing the heart of the matter is disingenuous at best.

and it's easy to be cavalier about child care and take the moral high ground of protecting 302 innocent children's lives when you have the flexibility to secure child care in the event of closed schools. what of those who can't - almost exclusively poor people?

i don't really have a strong opinion one way or another, but it's frustrating to see the false dichotomy of full open v full close as the only options presented. are we exploring mitigation methods: outdoor teaching? emergency hiring for smaller student/teacher ratios? satellite remote learning? tax/financial incentives for unemployed people to serve as child care providers?

i don't know the answer but the solution will be complex and convoluted because it's a messy situation. i'd hope that education experts and health care experts are working in collaboration for solutions but it's just trump and devos screaming into the void about "the promise schools made to america" and that schools better reopen OR ELSE...

Solid points all... but it still comes down to the " 302" kids, numerous teachers and continuing the pandemic for childcare.

What we aren't seeing, as you point out, is any leadership from the national level to get through this. It's pretty simple, we are going to need federal dollars going to the states to fund the ideas that you mention above. States can't print money. And without money, you can't:

1) get the PPE you need for teachers
2) get the teachers aides you need to reduce class size
3) get the testing kits for teachers, students and administrators
4) install the extra portable classrooms
5) install the air cleaners needed to reduce risk

Without that federal funding it is a binary open/close choice, IMO.

And hence you see post like this going through a parent's perspective. I have seen the same going through both teacher (will I get this and is it worth it) and administrator and school board members (will I get personally sued) perspectives.

They announced on the fb group of my home town in Ohio that they were going to open the swimming pool and I wrote a comment to the effect of "If you idiots murder my elderly parents I am going to sue you bankrupt"

[dckingsfan]

it doesn't stand on its own bc child care is the only legitimate countervailing consideration, and it's a significant one. the other targets that he knocks down (i.e. my kid wants to) are complete strawmen. the framing of going through an enumerated and presumably exhaustive list of reasons for reopening and defeating each one, but not addressing the heart of the matter is disingenuous at best.

and it's easy to be cavalier about child care and take the moral high ground of protecting 302 innocent children's lives when you have the flexibility to secure child care in the event of closed schools. what of those who can't - almost exclusively poor people?

i don't really have a strong opinion one way or another, but it's frustrating to see the false dichotomy of full open v full close as the only options presented. are we exploring mitigation methods: outdoor teaching? emergency hiring for smaller student/teacher ratios? satellite remote learning? tax/financial incentives for unemployed people to serve as child care providers?

i don't know the answer but the solution will be complex and convoluted because it's a messy situation. i'd hope that education experts and health care experts are working in collaboration for solutions but it's just trump and devos screaming into the void about "the promise schools made to america" and that schools better reopen OR ELSE...

Solid points all... but it still comes down to the " 302" kids, numerous teachers and continuing the pandemic for childcare.

What we aren't seeing, as you point out, is any leadership from the national level to get through this. It's pretty simple, we are going to need federal dollars going to the states to fund the ideas that you mention above. States can't print money. And without money, you can't:

1) get the PPE you need for teachers
2) get the teachers aides you need to reduce class size
3) get the testing kits for teachers, students and administrators
4) install the extra portable classrooms
5) install the air cleaners needed to reduce risk

Without that federal funding it is a binary open/close choice, IMO.

And hence you see post like this going through a parent's perspective. I have seen the same going through both teacher (will I get this and is it worth it) and administrator and school board members (will I get personally sued) perspectives.

They announced on the fb group of my home town in Ohio that they were going to open the swimming pool and I wrote a comment to the effect of "If you idiots murder my elderly parents I am going to sue you bankrupt"

This - I hope Pelosi holds the line on immunity.

[Wizardspride]

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[Ruzious]

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His comments have had zero positive effects. It's as if he's trying to divide and exacerbate the problems. Imagine him doing that - shocking.

[Zonkerbl]

Here are some desegregational education policies that we've tried that don't work and why they don't work:
1. Magnet schools located in poor school districts - just creates a separate school inside a school. Kids in the magnet program at Blair do not associate with the poors.

2. Bussing - No one wants to invest $300k extra in a house to get access to good schools only to have that yanked away. So no one wants to bus from a wealthy school district to a poor school district. Having a large number of poor kids bussed in from poor districts is going to create a ton of problems. Also to avoid rush hour everyone has to be on the bus at 6 am, which is insane.

Here's a desegregation policy for education - fund public schools on a per capita basis from state coffers. Stop funding schools from property taxes. Will prevent rich people from creating clusters of high quality education that excludes poor people, will prevent poor neighborhoods from getting the shaft. Will also make affordable housing policies much more feasible, because the quality of public schools will be decoupled from real estate prices. Will lower housing prices and rent costs for everybody.

[DCZards]

Here are some desegregational education policies that we've tried that don't work and why they don't work:
1. Magnet schools located in poor school districts - just creates a separate school inside a school. Kids in the magnet program at Blair do not associate with the poors.

2. Bussing - No one wants to invest $300k extra in a house to get access to good schools only to have that yanked away. So no one wants to bus from a wealthy school district to a poor school district. Having a large number of poor kids bussed in from poor districts is going to create a ton of problems. Also to avoid rush hour everyone has to be on the bus at 6 am, which is insane.

Here's a desegregation policy for education - fund public schools on a per capita basis from state coffers. Stop funding schools from property taxes. Will prevent rich people from creating clusters of high quality education that excludes poor people, will prevent poor neighborhoods from getting the shaft. Will also make affordable housing policies much more feasible, because the quality of public schools will be decoupled from real estate prices. Will lower housing prices and rent costs for everybody.

Agree with your closing statement. How we fund schools is the main culprit when it comes to the quality of education provided rich and middle-class kids as compared to poor and low-income kids. If we reopen schools without giving ALL of them the Covid-19 related funding they need, poor and low-income black and brown families will get screwed again because their kids will be the ones getting sick and bringing the virus home.

[dckingsfan]

Here are some desegregational education policies that we've tried that don't work and why they don't work:
1. Magnet schools located in poor school districts - just creates a separate school inside a school. Kids in the magnet program at Blair do not associate with the poors.

2. Bussing - No one wants to invest $300k extra in a house to get access to good schools only to have that yanked away. So no one wants to bus from a wealthy school district to a poor school district. Having a large number of poor kids bussed in from poor districts is going to create a ton of problems. Also to avoid rush hour everyone has to be on the bus at 6 am, which is insane.

Here's a desegregation policy for education - fund public schools on a per capita basis from state coffers. Stop funding schools from property taxes. Will prevent rich people from creating clusters of high quality education that excludes poor people, will prevent poor neighborhoods from getting the shaft. Will also make affordable housing policies much more feasible, because the quality of public schools will be decoupled from real estate prices. Will lower housing prices and rent costs for everybody.

Agree with your closing statement. How we fund schools is the main culprit when it comes to the quality of education provided rich and middle-class kids as compared to poor and low-income kids. If we reopen schools without giving ALL of them the Covid-19 related funding they need, poor and low-income black and brown families will get screwed again because their kids will be the ones getting sick and bringing the virus home.

So, one thing. Each state funds its schools differently and often more money goes to poorer schools (California (revenue limits)). In other cases (states) this isn't the case (Maryland). And where the states drive revenue and then run into funding issues (competing priorities) you can lose funding quickly.

Then there is the PTA - in rich school districts they raise a lot of money.

My worry. If you dictate this from a federal level you will just increase the unfunded mandates that are already burdening schools.

I don't have the answers - just worries.

I think that we need to reimagine our schools in general and give cover to defund those that are underperforming.

[Wizardspride]

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[dobrojim]

Good for the house. There is no reason for this litigation to take that long.
There is every reason why this should be decided promptly.

[Wizardspride]

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[Wizardspride]

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[pancakes3]

just an evil, stupid man.

even if we take it at face value that flying the confederate flag is free speech*, just go an inch further and realize what message that speech is trying to convey. that message is abhorrent.

*first amendment free speech means that the government can't censor you** and specifically lists press (mainstream media) as protected. society at large is absolutely free to censor itself.

**the government censors speech all the time. libel/slander is a restriction on what you can or can't say. obscenity censorship. food/ingredient labels are regulated. threatening speech is restricted.

[queridiculo]

Here are some desegregational education policies that we've tried that don't work and why they don't work:
1. Magnet schools located in poor school districts - just creates a separate school inside a school. Kids in the magnet program at Blair do not associate with the poors.

2. Bussing - No one wants to invest $300k extra in a house to get access to good schools only to have that yanked away. So no one wants to bus from a wealthy school district to a poor school district. Having a large number of poor kids bussed in from poor districts is going to create a ton of problems. Also to avoid rush hour everyone has to be on the bus at 6 am, which is insane.

Here's a desegregation policy for education - fund public schools on a per capita basis from state coffers. Stop funding schools from property taxes. Will prevent rich people from creating clusters of high quality education that excludes poor people, will prevent poor neighborhoods from getting the shaft. Will also make affordable housing policies much more feasible, because the quality of public schools will be decoupled from real estate prices. Will lower housing prices and rent costs for everybody.

You're leaving one out, stop federal funding of charter schools.

[Ruzious]

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I would never have imagined having such a moron as President. W was no genius, but he was Abraham Lincoln compared to Trump.

I think Trump clinging so fiercely to the confederate flag really hurts him. It just doesn't resonate with the vast majority of people any more. The fact that Nascar even got rid of it says it all. It's just hard-core rednecks and out-there racists that still see it as something worth protecting.