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Rui Hachimura

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Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#1541 » by payitforward » Fri Feb 12, 2021 1:19 am

wall_glizzy wrote:This has happened before - pcbothwel is using basketball reference (or some other up-to-date site) and PIF, for whatever reason, is using Box Score Geeks, which updates less frequently. Check the minutes played count for Rui, or presumably any other player that's played in the last few days - 343 on Box Score Geeks, 402 on BBREF. The former has the 35.5 3P%, the latter 37.

Yes, that's right -- my bad.

All the more if I gave the impression that I'd rather have Kuzma than Rui. Certainly not -- & the answer to that question is a definitive judgment of value in a comparison of 2 players.
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Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#1542 » by payitforward » Fri Feb 12, 2021 3:16 am

prime1time wrote:Always king of shocking as too how much hate this guy gets. Like is the average NBA player good? Does the average drafted player work out? If all Rui amounts to is a solid scorer off the bench for a championship team, I'd be pleased. People in this thread talk about Kyle Kuzma like he's chopped liver. I really don't understand. As far as his game goes he continues to develop. It might sound weird but I'm pleased with the 1-5 from 3. Last year he passed up a lot of open 3's. This year he's taking them much quicker. Rui has shown considerable improvement with his shooting. He's both shooting a higher percentage and on more volume. I don't know what Rui will end up being, but all the tools are there for him to end up being a very solid basketball player.

Great point, prime -- if 1/2 of the top 10 picks every year became stars, we'd have 5 new stars every year!

The question has never been "can Rui become a solid NBA player?" Of course he can! The question's only "was picking Rui the best possible use of an asset -- the #9 pick in the 2019 draft?" & that question's not even about Rui!

If that kind of question doesn't interest you, no need to read the rest of this post.
Spoiler:
For comparison, let's go all the way back to the 2011 draft & ask the same 2 questions about the guy picked #9 that year:

If you ask "could Kemba Walker turn out to be a solid NBA player?" obviously the answer is a resounding yes! In fact, he turned out to be much than "solid." He turned out to a terrific player.

But, if you ask "was picking Kemba Walker the best possible use of the asset, of the #9 pick that year?" you get a completely different answer! No, it wasn't. Not close. For starters, it would have been possible to pick Kawhi Leonard -- & good as Walker has been, Leonard has been way better. But, that's not all. One could have traded the #9 pick for the #15 pick & another asset -- say a high R2 pick the following year. Seems perfectly reasonable. That would have gotten you Leonard plus Draymond.

Now, obviously, that's easy to know in retrospect! :) Then again, I had Leonard rated as the guy we should pick at #6, so it's not exactly impossible to know in retrospect. & I also wanted Jimmy Butler, who went #30. You ought to be able to pick up the #15 & #30 pick in a draft using the #9 pick as trade bait.
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Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#1543 » by smoothSeph » Sun Feb 21, 2021 4:54 pm

Read on Twitter
?s=21

Read on Twitter
?s=21

Read on Twitter
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Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#1544 » by prime1time » Sun Feb 21, 2021 5:07 pm

smoothSeph wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=21

Read on Twitter
?s=21

Read on Twitter
?s=21

As is often the case with Rui haters they are silent...

On a side note, the question is with this kind of defensive ability, it's obvious that Rui is more suited to play the 3 and not the 4. Find someone who can provide more defense and post rebounding at the 4 and play Rui at the 3. I think this could work for the foreseeable future and we can develop Deni into a 6th man role. Rui has shown multiple times this season that he can adequately defend on the wing/perimeter. I'm reminded of his matchups against KD. His strength, length and good enough lateral quickness let him do a lot. One thing that has been concerning though is his recent shooting slump. Definitely, something to keep track of.

If you squint you can start to see the making of a solid defensive team. Get a 4 and 5 that can switch 1-5, with a 4 and 5 who can protect the rim.
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Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#1545 » by doclinkin » Sun Feb 21, 2021 5:32 pm

prime1time wrote:As is often the case with Rui haters they are silent...


I don't think Rui had haters so much as skeptics. Maybe doubters. He is easy to like. We have players on this team that were hateable, but Rui isn't one. IF anything the argument comes between his loudest cheerleaders and fans who say: "yeah but..." and point out areas to improve. He's a 2nd year player, with little history in the game, and some areas where he is deficient, with the caveat that he starts out an older rookie than most, but found the game later in his development.

One concern was his ability to swiftly pick up team defensive concepts. Late last season I think he showed that if you give him a single player to guard he has the length and athleticism and focus to shut down that match up. One adjustment that seems to have been made is that coaches taken advantage of this skill and directed him against whomever is the high-usage player on that team. Let everyone else figure out how to adjust in a team scheme behind him. In this respect his rebounding numbers are going to suffer, he is better against face-up players than against bigs in the low post on defense, and if he is 30 feet from the basket defending Dame then yeah he will not be in position to scoop rebounds. part of it has been emphasis as well, in the offseason he was not drilling with a low-post tutor though, he was facing off against hyper talented ballhandlers at Big Guard university. Defending guards is something has seen before. Facing dribble drive players in one-on-one match-ups is well within his skill set. The rest can come later as he experiences it more.

That is the thing to like about Rui. He seems like an avid student. If he sees it he can learn it. His learning curve will be steeper than others since his exposure to the game was late and he had little high level competition. He had no role models for defense or low post play. He learned at first by watching videos of Carmelo in FIBA play. There's no defense in that model.

As he develops he will turn doubters into advocates. Fans even.

as to your EDIT. I'd agree right now he is best on the perimeter. HOWEVER I would not give up on him in the low post. I think if he is taught some basic footwork and rebounding tricks and tips he will develop quickly there too. He just needs an example to model. A go to move. Understanding of basic principles of weak-side adjustments vs ball-side shifts. You saw how happy and proud of himself he was when he took a charge, the other game. We will see how he does against a powerhouse like LeBJ.
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Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#1546 » by prime1time » Sun Feb 21, 2021 5:41 pm

doclinkin wrote:
prime1time wrote:As is often the case with Rui haters they are silent...


I don't think Rui had haters so much as skeptics. Maybe doubters. He is easy to like. We have players on this team that were hateable, but Rui isn't one. IF anything the argument comes between his loudest cheerleaders and fans who say: "yeah but..." and point out areas to improve. He's a 2nd year player, with little history in the game, and some areas where he is deficient, with the caveat that he starts out an older rookie than most, but found the game later in his development.

One concern was his ability to swiftly pick up team defensive concepts. Late last season I think he showed that if you give him a single player to guard he has the length and athleticism and focus to shut down that match up. One adjustment that seems to have been made is that coaches taken advantage of this skill and directed him against whomever is the high-usage player on that team. Let everyone else figure out how to adjust in a team scheme behind him. In this respect his rebounding numbers are going to suffer, he is better against face-up players than against bigs in the low post on defense, and if he is 30 feet from the basket defending Dame then yeah he will not be in position to scoop rebounds. part of it has been emphasis as well, in the offseason he was not drilling with a low-post tutor though, he was facing off against hyper talented ballhandlers at Big Guard university. Defending guards is something has seen before. Facing dribble drive players in one-on-one match-ups is well within his skill set. The rest can come later as he experiences it more.

That is the thing to like about Rui. He seems like an avid student. If he sees it he can learn it. His learning curve will be steeper than others since his exposure to the game was late and he had little high level competition. He had no role models for defense or low post play. He learned at first by watching videos of Carmelo in FIBA play. There's no defense in that model.

As he develops he will turn doubters into advocates. Fans even.

as to your EDIT. I'd agree right now he is best on the perimeter. HOWEVER I would not give up on him in the low post. I think if he is taught some basic footwork and rebounding tricks and tips he will develop quickly there too. You saw how happy and proud of himself he was when he took a charge, the other game. We will see how he does against a powerhouse like LeBJ.

Being skeptical about his growth is one thing. I've seen numerous posts that cleary veer into the unredeemable category. Not just skeptical, but we should cut him loose. These are usually the posters who want to bring up other players in the 2019 NBA Draft and discuss how drafting Rui was an abject disaster. It's fine to be skeptical, but the real question is why can't we be realistic? For far too many posters either Rui ends up being a great player or he's a terrible pick/bust. He makes improvements, but the only aspect of his game that they want to focus on is what he can't do. More so, they trot out the same analysis that existed after he was drafted. I'm fine with skepticism, but reading biased one-sided takes that are meant only to disparage a player isn't skepticism. It's hating. If you want I can quote specific comments I remember them vividly.

Rui has been awful his entire time on the Wizards. Clarke was always the better player. PJ Washington is a better player. Gets no steals, no blocks, has no defensive ability whatsoever. Plays outdated 2000's offense. Literally just plays basketball in a way that it shouldn't be played anymore. This has been a consistent take. Josh Smith but worse.

Comments like this are common place. Does this strike you as skepticism?
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Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#1547 » by queridiculo » Sun Feb 21, 2021 5:51 pm

smoothSeph wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=21

Read on Twitter
?s=21

Read on Twitter
?s=21


Off-topic post here, but just to illustrate how masterfully Beal is playing this season, he carved that kind of coverage up time and time again.

Lillard is a lethal shooter, but he's no Beal when it comes to being an effective scorer at all three levels.
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Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#1548 » by nate33 » Sun Feb 21, 2021 5:56 pm

queridiculo wrote:Off-topic post here, but just to illustrate how masterfully Beal is playing this season, he carved that kind of coverage up time and time again.

Lillard is a lethal shooter, but he's no Beal when it comes to being an effective scorer at all three levels.

Beal is so damn good. We all should really try to enjoy this while it lasts and not take it for granted. It's ridiculous how he can make scoring 35 a night look so easy.
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Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#1549 » by doclinkin » Sun Feb 21, 2021 6:06 pm

Scouring rosters of teams Brooks played on for former players who he would respect that he might have as assistants on the bench to drill low post fundamentals.

Scotty played with Barkley, Hakeem, etc. It was a flashback looking at some of the squads he was a bench scrub on. A few names stood out as players who got the most out of their ability with hard work, dirty tricks and effort: Otis Thorpe, Popeye Jones and Rick Mahorn. Jones is now an assistant for Steve Nash in Brooklyn, Mahorn has put his name on a Big Man camp but I don't see videos of him instructing. He last coaches as an assistant to former teammate Bill Laimbeer who has had a solid career coaching the WNBA. Speaking of dirty tricks... he'd be a good guy to be able to turn to on the bench for wisdom and tips.

I still wish the Wiz had the cache to pull a guy like Arvydas Sabonis to coach high level high post big man play. So we could grow our own Nikola Jokic out of whomever they draft.
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Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#1550 » by tontoz » Sun Feb 21, 2021 6:34 pm

nate33 wrote:
queridiculo wrote:Off-topic post here, but just to illustrate how masterfully Beal is playing this season, he carved that kind of coverage up time and time again.

Lillard is a lethal shooter, but he's no Beal when it comes to being an effective scorer at all three levels.

Beal is so damn good. We all should really try to enjoy this while it lasts and not take it for granted. It's ridiculous how he can make scoring 35 a night look so easy.


Beal is under control when he drives so all potential finishing options are available to him. He takes what the defense gives him.

Wall used to bug me because the was so out of control on his drives that it limited his options. Frequently he would just throw up a flailing miss hoping to get bailed out by the refs.
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Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#1551 » by smoothSeph » Sun Feb 21, 2021 6:39 pm

queridiculo wrote:
smoothSeph wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=21

Read on Twitter
?s=21

Read on Twitter
?s=21


Off-topic post here, but just to illustrate how masterfully Beal is playing this season, he carved that kind of coverage up time and time again.

Lillard is a lethal shooter, but he's no Beal when it comes to being an effective scorer at all three levels.

Yea there are a few clips in that thread of Beal absolutely destroying whatever coverage Portland threw at him. It looks so effortless too.
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Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#1552 » by payitforward » Sun Feb 21, 2021 8:42 pm

prime1time wrote:Being skeptical about his growth is one thing. I've seen numerous posts that cleary veer into the unredeemable category. Not just skeptical, but we should cut him loose. These are usually the posters who want to bring up other players in the 2019 NBA Draft and discuss how drafting Rui was an abject disaster. It's fine to be skeptical, but the real question is why can't we be realistic? For far too many posters either Rui ends up being a great player or he's a terrible pick/bust. He makes improvements, but the only aspect of his game that they want to focus on is what he can't do. More so, they trot out the same analysis that existed after he was drafted. I'm fine with skepticism, but reading biased one-sided takes that are meant only to disparage a player isn't skepticism. It's hating. If you want I can quote specific comments I remember them vividly.

Rui has been awful his entire time on the Wizards. Clarke was always the better player. PJ Washington is a better player. Gets no steals, no blocks, has no defensive ability whatsoever. Plays outdated 2000's offense. Literally just plays basketball in a way that it shouldn't be played anymore. This has been a consistent take. Josh Smith but worse.

Comments like this are common place. Does this strike you as skepticism?

No, that's a ridiculous comment. Rui hasn't been "awful," & he certainly hasn't been "Josh Smith but worse." (!) What a thought.... Nor is P.J. Washington a better player so far -- this year & last he's not nearly as good as Rui. Clarke, OTOH, has clearly been better. But... so what?

Clarke seems to have been underrated b/c of concerns that he wasn't big/long enough. Turns out that really isn't a problem. Looks like Keldon Johnson was severely underrated too. Ditto Thybulle. Daniel Gafford has been really good this year -- & he went in R2.

Some guys are picked too low every year! We all know the obvious examples -- Kawhi, Jimmy Butler... it's a pretty long list. But, if someone was picked too low, then someone else had to have been picked "too high." Duh.

I didn't think Rui was a good pick at #9; I'd have traded down. But, that has nothing at all to do with whether he will or won't turn out to be a good NBA player. He hasn't been particularly good so far, but he certainly hasn't been "awful," & he has the potential to be good.

Edit: But, I don't think posts like the one you quote above are "commonplace." & I don't think there are -- or ought to be -- a lot of "Rui haters."
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Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#1553 » by NatP4 » Tue Feb 23, 2021 6:56 am

I think tonight was another example of why Rui is a wing, not a big. He did a great job defending on the perimeter against Kuzma&Lebron.

If he could just make it a point to work on his 3pt shot and get more 3s up, he could be a quality SF.
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Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#1554 » by gambitx777 » Tue Feb 23, 2021 7:49 am

Alsoit looks like he has room to play with his frame and he could be a big 3 and D wing given time.
NatP4 wrote:I think tonight was another example of why Rui is a wing, not a big. He did a great job defending on the perimeter against Kuzma&Lebron.

If he could just make it a point to work on his 3pt shot and get more 3s up, he could be a quality SF.


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Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#1555 » by Ruzious » Tue Feb 23, 2021 10:28 am

So Rui does a lot of covering Lillard one game and then Lebron the next. And Kawhi or George is next. This is definitely adding some versatility to his game.
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Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#1556 » by nate33 » Tue Feb 23, 2021 11:05 am

Read on Twitter


I'm loving that Hachimura is embracing his role as a defensive stopper. He really can guard 1 through 5. He still has a long way to go on help defense, but Brooks is making it work by putting him on the opposition's best wing and trying to get him to defend the point of attack.
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Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#1557 » by Chocolate City Jordanaire » Tue Feb 23, 2021 11:57 am

doclinkin wrote:
prime1time wrote:As is often the case with Rui haters they are silent...


I don't think Rui had haters so much as skeptics. Maybe doubters. He is easy to like. We have players on this team that were hateable, but Rui isn't one. IF anything the argument comes between his loudest cheerleaders and fans who say: "yeah but..." and point out areas to improve. He's a 2nd year player, with little history in the game, and some areas where he is deficient, with the caveat that he starts out an older rookie than most, but found the game later in his development.

One concern was his ability to swiftly pick up team defensive concepts. Late last season I think he showed that if you give him a single player to guard he has the length and athleticism and focus to shut down that match up. One adjustment that seems to have been made is that coaches taken advantage of this skill and directed him against whomever is the high-usage player on that team. Let everyone else figure out how to adjust in a team scheme behind him. In this respect his rebounding numbers are going to suffer, he is better against face-up players than against bigs in the low post on defense, and if he is 30 feet from the basket defending Dame then yeah he will not be in position to scoop rebounds. part of it has been emphasis as well, in the offseason he was not drilling with a low-post tutor though, he was facing off against hyper talented ballhandlers at Big Guard university. Defending guards is something has seen before. Facing dribble drive players in one-on-one match-ups is well within his skill set. The rest can come later as he experiences it more.

That is the thing to like about Rui. He seems like an avid student. If he sees it he can learn it. His learning curve will be steeper than others since his exposure to the game was late and he had little high level competition. He had no role models for defense or low post play. He learned at first by watching videos of Carmelo in FIBA play. There's no defense in that model.

As he develops he will turn doubters into advocates. Fans even.

as to your EDIT. I'd agree right now he is best on the perimeter. HOWEVER I would not give up on him in the low post. I think if he is taught some basic footwork and rebounding tricks and tips he will develop quickly there too. He just needs an example to model. A go to move. Understanding of basic principles of weak-side adjustments vs ball-side shifts. You saw how happy and proud of himself he was when he took a charge, the other game. We will see how he does against a powerhouse like LeBJ.


I never should’ve doubted a fellow Aquarian. He is low-key and seemingly detached but he is a competitive dude. He learns. And he is very good at getting even the second or third time around.

Seeing him hit the three pointer and Deni also late in games at their SUPER YOUNG ages just brings me joy!
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Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#1558 » by Chocolate City Jordanaire » Tue Feb 23, 2021 11:58 am

Rui ain’t scared.
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Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#1559 » by Chocolate City Jordanaire » Tue Feb 23, 2021 11:59 am

nate33 wrote:
Read on Twitter


I'm loving that Hachimura is embracing his role as a defensive stopper. He really can guard 1 through 5. He still has a long way to go on help defense, but Brooks is making it work by putting him on the opposition's best wing and trying to get him to defend the point of attack.


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Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#1560 » by Nigel Tufnel » Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:31 pm

I tried to watch Rui closely the last couple of games, and even though he doesn't grab 10 boards a game, he is very aware under the basket about boxing out, which leads to rebounds for others like Westbrook. Lopez is also excellent at boxing out, when he can get into position. The team rebounding has been pretty good.

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