Political Roundtable Part X

[payitforward]

I watched about 1/2 the debate. If I read him right, Donald Trump is just going through the motions at this point. Might be wishful thinking on my part (though I don't think there's any chance of him winning anyway). But that's how he came across to me.

I'm sure that there will be lots more ugly stuff come out, btw. Equivalent to, probably even worse than, this week's cesspool. I'm not looking forward to it, but he's deserved everything he's gotten to this point, so I don't think I'll be feeling sorry for him any time soon.

[AFM]

Weird. I thought he destroyed her.

Edit- all you have to do is look at how the peso is trading.

[keynote]

Overall, Trump did better in the second debate than he did in the first. Yeah, he interrupted a lot and whined about the moderators; yeah, he flatly denied a ton of confirmed facts and reasserted a number of statements that have been widely debunked. He even threw Pence under the bus once. But he stuck to his talking points, and I think his narrow base will be encouraged.
As for the rest of the GOP: I don't think returning to the "locker room banter" talking point did him any favors.

I think Clinton still won. But Trump's improvement in message discipline meant that this wasn't a blowout like the first debate was. And, frankly, I think it was wise for Clinton not to engage/provoke him again. I'd guess that she's saving her bait for the third debate, so that a Trump meltdown of some sort will serve as the final impression to the public.

[AFM]

http://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2016/10/09/if-this-report-from-cosmopolitan-is-correct-melania-trump-just-had-the-best-troll-of-all-time/?utm_content=bufferd2618&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

[montestewart]

http://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2016/10/09/if-this-report-from-cosmopolitan-is-correct-melania-trump-just-had-the-best-troll-of-all-time/?utm_content=bufferd2618&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

That cost $1100? She was trolled by the store that sold it to her.

[AFM]

http://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2016/10/09/if-this-report-from-cosmopolitan-is-correct-melania-trump-just-had-the-best-troll-of-all-time/?utm_content=bufferd2618&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

That cost $1100? She was trolled by the store that sold it to her.

Pussy is expensive.

[JWizmentality]

I suppose Trump diehards think he crushed it. He was just as erratic as the first debate but managed to string together a few more coherent sentences than he did the first time. So I guess that's an improvement and bigly win for his camp. Won't win him the election though.

[Ruzious]

I watched about 1/2 the debate. If I read him right, Donald Trump is just going through the motions at this point. Might be wishful thinking on my part (though I don't think there's any chance of him winning anyway). But that's how he came across to me.

I'm sure that there will be lots more ugly stuff come out, btw. Equivalent to, probably even worse than, this week's cesspool. I'm not looking forward to it, but he's deserved everything he's gotten to this point, so I don't think I'll be feeling sorry for him any time soon.

I thought he was a pathetic embarrassment, as usual. When she got tough with him, he goes I never thought I'd say this, but if I win, the first thing I'm going to do is investigate you, and yer gonna be in big doodoo. That's a slight paraphrase, but it's spoken like a 3rd grade 3rd world dictator.

The end of the debate (if anyone was still awake) was actually very civilized and where Hillary really won it. They were asked to say something good about each other. Hillary did the smart thing saying his children turned out great. Donald was out of his element and very generous here saying she's a fighter, never quits, fights hard, never quits, never gives up. And of course, this goes against what he and his surrogates have been chirping on for so long - that she doesn't have the stamina or health to keep fighting. That's one of their staples, and watch them not bring it up anymore.

[Ruzious]

Read on Twitter

Thing is - Why weren't his comments suggesting the Central Park 5 are guilty - more shocking? Him using the n word should pale in comparison to his actions and words regarding them. Seriously, read this article if you have any doubts about Trump's character. http://www.cbsnews.com/news/donald-trump-central-park-five-are-guilty/

[fishercob]

I don't know whether to laugh or cry at the notion of anyone being undecided between Trump and Clinton at this point.

There may well be plenty of undecided's between Trump and Johnson or Trump and staying home. Or similarly between Clinton and Johnson/Stein or Clinton and abstaining. But between the two actual candidates? Come on.

[nate33]

Clinton News Network reporter whispering to the panel to tell them what to say:

Watch on YouTube

[nate33]

[Ruzious]

Nate, Trump's words on Syria are directly opposite of what Pence said - as Michael Tracy alluded to in what you posted. As far as we know, Trump said that only because of what Hillary said. That would be typical of him. He even said he hasn't talked with Pence about it. When he does, it's probably 50/50 he changes his mind and blames it on Hillary. Your guy is a complete joke is the nicest way I can put it.

[nate33]

Nate, Trump's words on Syria are directly opposite of what Pence said - as Michael Tracy alluded to in what you posted. As far as we know, Trump said that only because of what Hillary said. That would be typical of him. He even said he hasn't talked with Pence about it. When he does, it's probably 50/50 he changes his mind and blames it on Hillary. Your guy is a complete joke is the nicest way I can put it.

Yes, they conflict with Pence, but Trump is President and Pence is VP. Trump admitted they disagree on the matter.

Trump has been fairly consistent throughout the campaign about working with Russia against ISIS in Syria. I don't think there's any reason to believe that Trump is merely opposing Clinton for the sake of drama in the debate.

The bottom line here is that Clinton is prepared to start WWIII over Syria. How can you maintain a no fly zone unless you're willing to shoot down Russian planes? Maybe that's okay with some of you. It's not okay with me. I don't consider Syria to be THAT important. Let Assad and the Russians secure Syria and take out ISIS. Why do we care so much about supporting the rebels? Have we not learned our lesson about what happens when we arm radical Muslim groups and pit them against other radical Muslim groups? Trump is absolutely right about this. We don't know who these "rebels" are.

[fishercob]

Nate, Trump's words on Syria are directly opposite of what Pence said - as Michael Tracy alluded to in what you posted. As far as we know, Trump said that only because of what Hillary said. That would be typical of him. He even said he hasn't talked with Pence about it. When he does, it's probably 50/50 he changes his mind and blames it on Hillary. Your guy is a complete joke is the nicest way I can put it.

Ruz, what makes you think Trump would change his position in order to serve his own agenda?

Read on Twitter

[FAH1223]

Trump talking about Soros, Buffet, etc and how they benefit from the tax code plus other bankrollers for Hillary's campaign was smart.

Ironically in his rambling on Iraq/Syria he was factually right in that Eastern Aleppo will probably fall to the Assad regime with the Russian/Iranian support. With the Syrian winter approaching, the rebels (that the CIA trained and supplied) plus the defacto Al-Qaeda affliate Jabhat Fatah Al-Sham aka Al-Nusra Front are already short on manpower, foods, weaponry facing a re-galvanized Syrian forces (The Syrian Army is mostly Sunni) along with Iranian/Hezbollah/other Shia militias, nonstop Russian aerial bombing along with secretive Chinese support (China recently sent a naval ship to Tartus where the Russians have their base for the last 50 years). The rebels that we've vetted are embedded with the Al-Qaeda because they're on the same side vs. the regime. They hold more ground in Idlib Province countryside but East Aleppo is their last urban stronghold.

ISIS is in the East. The US Air force recently bombed a Syrian Army position at Deir Ezzor. ISIS then re-took the airport. We say it was an accident. But no one believes us.

Assad also re-took Palmyria from ISIS months ago with the Russian support. So Trump was true in that Assad has fought ISIS with his overstretched army.

Is Trump really wrong in his assessment? Not really if you look at the facts on the ground. The Syrian government will control over 3/4s of the population should they re-take East Aleppo. The media here doesn't mention that Assad controls Western Aleppo which has 1.5 million people. Once the Syrian government has every urban population center, they will go after ISIS.

HRC and the rest of the establishment want us in a conflict in Syria... to light the fire, to put a black eye on Russia and Iran by destroying their only Arab ally in the region. I'm no fan of Bashar Al-Assad... I supported the opposition in 2012 but it would be better to have the Syrian state in tact rather than chaos. His departure could be negotiated if his backers see it'll make the country stable long-term. Russia, Iran, China, and even India have expressed support for non-regime change.

[Ruzious]

Nate, Trump's words on Syria are directly opposite of what Pence said - as Michael Tracy alluded to in what you posted. As far as we know, Trump said that only because of what Hillary said. That would be typical of him. He even said he hasn't talked with Pence about it. When he does, it's probably 50/50 he changes his mind and blames it on Hillary. Your guy is a complete joke is the nicest way I can put it.

Yes, they conflict with Pence, but Trump is President and Pence is VP. Trump admitted they disagree on the matter.

Trump has been fairly consistent throughout the campaign about working with Russia against ISIS in Syria. I don't think there's any reason to believe that Trump is merely opposing Clinton for the sake of drama in the debate.

The bottom line here is that Clinton is prepared to start WWIII over Syria. How can you maintain a no fly zone unless you're willing to shoot down Russian planes? Maybe that's okay with some of you. It's not okay with me. I don't consider Syria to be THAT important. Let Assad and the Russians secure Syria and take out ISIS. Why do we care so much about supporting the rebels? Have we not learned our lesson about what happens when we arm radical Muslim groups and pit them against other radical Muslim groups? Trump is absolutely right about this. We don't know who these "rebels" are.

Yeah, he admitted it AFTER HE WAS TOLD THEY DISAGREED. How do you give points for him for that? Again, he said they hadn't even talked about it. How do you not talk to your VP candidate about something like that?

And again, he only admits things after he's caught. With his income tax - even if he was doing the right thing with his taxes - he never said he didn't pay taxes until the truth came out - which might not have happened except for Hillary basically tricking him into admitting it in the first debate.

Speaking of which, I still haven't heard a reason why he didn't pay alt min tax. For AMT purposes, net operating loss carryforwards can only be used to offset up to 90% of taxable income - so while it could cut 90% of his taxable income, 10% of Trump's income should have still been quite substantial. He'd have to have reported losses every single year to keep avoiding taxes.

[AFM]

I wish Trump brought up the fact that Hillary used the exact same deduction on her tax return, instead of just saying her donors.

[FAH1223]

Nate, Trump's words on Syria are directly opposite of what Pence said - as Michael Tracy alluded to in what you posted. As far as we know, Trump said that only because of what Hillary said. That would be typical of him. He even said he hasn't talked with Pence about it. When he does, it's probably 50/50 he changes his mind and blames it on Hillary. Your guy is a complete joke is the nicest way I can put it.

Yes, they conflict with Pence, but Trump is President and Pence is VP. Trump admitted they disagree on the matter.

Trump has been fairly consistent throughout the campaign about working with Russia against ISIS in Syria. I don't think there's any reason to believe that Trump is merely opposing Clinton for the sake of drama in the debate.

The bottom line here is that Clinton is prepared to start WWIII over Syria. How can you maintain a no fly zone unless you're willing to shoot down Russian planes? Maybe that's okay with some of you. It's not okay with me. I don't consider Syria to be THAT important. Let Assad and the Russians secure Syria and take out ISIS. Why do we care so much about supporting the rebels? Have we not learned our lesson about what happens when we arm radical Muslim groups and pit them against other radical Muslim groups? Trump is absolutely right about this. We don't know who these "rebels" are.

The only place a No Fly Zone can be done is in the north at the Turkish border with Turkish troops enforcing it.

Turkey doesn't want the Kurds i.e. YPG and PKK to have a Kurdistan in Northern Syria although the Kurds have taken out ISIS and received support from the US.

You can't do a No Fly Zone in the urban centers. The Syrian government and the Russians have put in the S-300 and S-400 systems at Tartus and Latakia... they've effectively put in their own No Fly Zone over all of Western and Central Syria. Israel was warned not to fly in Syrian airspace anymore last year.

Russia has also warned the US to not launch attacks on Syrian air force positions or runways. A lot of people inside the Beltway in ThinkTank Land want to prevent Syrian planes from flying. But Russia has vowed to shoot down any US cruise missiles.

According to international law, we aren't even supposed to be in Syria to begin with. Russia is there because they were invited. Same with the Iranian militias and commanders. Same with China's naval ship that recently arrived and it's trainers in Damascus.

But since 2010, the CIA has poured over $1 billion to arm and train rebels from the provinces. The Turkish border has been open and porous. Jordan also helped with the regime change operation.

The White Helmets, the volunteer rescue team, operate in rebel areas and they've received $23M from USAID and about $50M from the UK, Germany, Holland, Japan, etc... and they've been a great tool for making the message about the humaniatrian crisis and advocating for intervention.

But in Syria, we don't hear in our media the story of those living in government held areas and the rebels attacking those civilians. Or of the humanitarian organizations who can't get supplies because of sanctions (Red Crescent, Red Cross, WHO, UN, etc).

[AFM]

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-10-10/summarizing-second-presidential-debate-dummies