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Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII

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Re: Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII 

Post#1741 » by payitforward » Sat Jul 1, 2017 7:16 pm

CobraCommander wrote:
payitforward wrote:
JWizmentality wrote:
No, I think there will be some friction between Porter and Wall after Wall low key tried to ship him off to Indy. :lol:

Don't think that happened at all....

Uh would there be beef between the early 20s version of you if you thought someone disrespected you publicly? You might not fight him but you sure as hell wouldn't like him anymore...if you ever did. Wall shouldn't have said that publicly...unless the trade went through and Otto was on the Pacers. BUT 20+ million and a lot of time together traveling and playing ball can heal a lot of mental woes. Especially if Otto grows into that big contract and becomes a 18-20pts a night scorer!

I assume we are talking about what was said on that podcast?? Otherwise, maybe I missed something. I don't think John disrespected Otto at all on the podcast. He gave him a lot of love, saying "you can't take nothing away from" what he did. & then, at 17minutes, talking about his improvement, about his shooting, about the "little things" he does that people don't understand, & about his further growth.

& I didn't read his words about needing "somebody who can defend LeBron & go back at him or you have no chance to win" as anti-Otto. He was talking about what would be needed to get past the Cavs in the LBJ era. Sounded pretty accurate to me.

But... maybe it's some other public statement you are talking about?
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Re: Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII 

Post#1742 » by payitforward » Sat Jul 1, 2017 7:25 pm

gambitx777 wrote:How the **** could we not have offered Kelley, tomas and a first and that ofer not be better than what they got for PG? We must not have bee able to fine a way to dump gortat or mahinimi in the deal fast enough.

Sigh... you sure are in a hurry to throw away R1 picks!

Paul George is going to LA next year.
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Re: Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII 

Post#1743 » by gambitx777 » Sat Jul 1, 2017 7:50 pm

Legit do anything and every thing to move mahinmi idc what you need to do and offer nene the full mid level for 2 years or something like that
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Re: Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII 

Post#1744 » by gambitx777 » Sat Jul 1, 2017 8:17 pm

payitforward wrote:
gambitx777 wrote:How the **** could we not have offered Kelley, tomas and a first and that ofer not be better than what they got for PG? We must not have bee able to fine a way to dump gortat or mahinimi in the deal fast enough.

Sigh... you sure are in a hurry to throw away R1 picks!

Paul George is going to LA next year.

You don't know that. If he got here with his friend wall and won a tittle or went to the finals maybe he stays. Maybe he told wall I'm going home don't bother making a serious offer for me. Honestly piff you are over valuing first round picks and not being realistic with your player evaluations. It's not that black and white. Yes first round picks and developing players are important. But that's not really the situation the team is in. How many more prime John wall years do we have left.? 5 -7 maybe less with his knees and the way he plays. We need to go all in on the John wall prime years now. I'm not saying picks are not important, but you want to be golden state or sa and not every team is. They got lucky the 76ers and the magic have gone that route and look where they are minisota too. Like piff your expectations are too high man, like your player evaluations. If a guys isn't perfect you call them trash, just because some one isn't amazing you call them trash melo and Aldridge are not trash. They are not what people make them but they aint trash. Like your views arent wrong I'm not calling you stupid or anything. I just think your going to hard on that side of the fence. No way to a tittle is perfect. Nothing is set in stone. I'm just saying yeah I'm willing to trade pics it's not right it's not wrong its just one way to get there.
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Re: Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII 

Post#1745 » by deneem4 » Sat Jul 1, 2017 8:56 pm

gambitx777 wrote:Legit do anything and every thing to move mahinmi idc what you need to do and offer nene the full mid level for 2 years or something like that


Rather sign Tarik black
Then trade gortat for Monroe
Pay your beals....or its lights out!!!
Bron, Bosh, Wade is like Mike, Hakeem, barkley...3 top 5 picks from same draft
mike, hakeem and Barkley on the same team!!!!
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Re: Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII 

Post#1746 » by gambitx777 » Sat Jul 1, 2017 9:08 pm

deneem4 wrote:
gambitx777 wrote:Legit do anything and every thing to move mahinmi idc what you need to do and offer nene the full mid level for 2 years or something like that


Rather sign Tarik black
Then trade gortat for Monroe

I wouldn't mind having black but gortat for Monroe does not work cap wise and I doubt the bucks do that. Plus I doubt Monroe agrees to an extention. Idk I still feel like mahinmi to sa with Smith for Aldridge makes sense. ! Honestly nene on a mid level deal for a year or two the way he's playing it super fair.
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Re: Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII 

Post#1747 » by payitforward » Sat Jul 1, 2017 9:36 pm

gambitx777 wrote:
payitforward wrote:
gambitx777 wrote:How the **** could we not have offered Kelley, tomas and a first and that ofer not be better than what they got for PG? We must not have bee able to fine a way to dump gortat or mahinimi in the deal fast enough.

Sigh... you sure are in a hurry to throw away R1 picks!

Paul George is going to LA next year.

You don't know that. If he got here with his friend wall and won a tittle or went to the finals maybe he stays. Maybe he told wall I'm going home don't bother making a serious offer for me. Honestly piff you are over valuing first round picks and not being realistic with your player evaluations. It's not that black and white. Yes first round picks and developing players are important. But that's not really the situation the team is in. How many more prime John wall years do we have left.? 5 -7 maybe less with his knees and the way he plays. We need to go all in on the John wall prime years now. I'm not saying picks are not important, but you want to be golden state or sa and not every team is. They got lucky the 76ers and the magic have gone that route and look where they are minisota too. Like piff your expectations are too high man, like your player evaluations. If a guys isn't perfect you call them trash, just because some one isn't amazing you call them trash melo and Aldridge are not trash. They are not what people make them but they aint trash. Like your views arent wrong I'm not calling you stupid or anything. I just think your going to hard on that side of the fence. No way to a tittle is perfect. Nothing is set in stone. I'm just saying yeah I'm willing to trade pics it's not right it's not wrong its just one way to get there.

Hey gambit -- I appreciate being let off the hook for being stupid! :) Although sometimes I am -- everybody is!

Paul George has made it clear that he's going to LA. The only waffle on that came when he said that if he was traded to Cleveland, & if LeBron stayed, that he would re-sign.

Did you notice that he did not say anything of that kind about being traded to the Wizards!

Do you think John Wall is his only friend? :)

I don't think Melo & Aldridge are "trash," gambit -- I just think they're not worth acquiring. They're being thought of as if it was 3-5 years ago.

I certainly agree that you need more than guys on rookie contracts to win a title!! GS built its core through the draft, but they also added guys like Bogut, Iguodala, etc.

Big point: the reason the OKC offer for PG looks so low to you is that it's an offer to rent a guy for a season! That's what you know you are getting.

Of course they'll try to convince him to stay, & it might make sense for him: he's not KD, but he does come in & play the same position. & they are a team with a longer winning tradition than, for example, the Wizards. & a much much much better FO. So I'd say they have a ton better chance of persuading PG to re-sign there than we would have of getting him to stay in DC.
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Re: Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII 

Post#1748 » by 80sballboy » Sat Jul 1, 2017 10:04 pm

BTW, the Celts reportedly offered three draft picks, and two starters on draft night for PG. Obviously they though they could extend him but what were the Pacers thinking? Kevin Pritchard aparently wanted to trade PG out of the Eastern Conference.
http://nba.nbcsports.com/2017/07/01/report-celtics-offered-pacers-three-first-round-picks-two-starters-for-paul-george-on-draft-night/
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Re: Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII 

Post#1749 » by Error Afflalo » Sat Jul 1, 2017 10:06 pm

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Let's dream of a Mahinmi dump.

Hypothetical: suppose we did dump Mahinmi and renounce Bojan. How far would we be from getting in the game for Millsap?
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Re: Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII 

Post#1750 » by gambitx777 » Sat Jul 1, 2017 10:16 pm

payitforward wrote:Hey gambit -- I appreciate being let off the hook for being stupid! :) Although sometimes I am -- everybody is!

Paul George has made it clear that he's going to LA. The only waffle on that came when he said that if he was traded to Cleveland, & if LeBron stayed, that he would re-sign.

Did you notice that he did not say anything of that kind about being traded to the Wizards!

Do you think John Wall is his only friend? :)

I don't think Melo & Aldridge are "trash," gambit -- I just think they're not worth acquiring. They're being thought of as if it was 3-5 years ago.

I certainly agree that you need more than guys on rookie contracts to win a title!! GS built its core through the draft, but they also added guys like Bogut, Iguodala, etc.

Big point: the reason the OKC offer for PG looks so low to you is that it's an offer to rent a guy for a season! That's what you know you are getting.

Of course they'll try to convince him to stay, & it might make sense for him: he's not KD, but he does come in & play the same position. & they are a team with a longer winning tradition than, for example, the Wizards. & a much much much better FO. So I'd say they have a ton better chance of persuading PG to re-sign there than we would have of getting him to stay in DC.

I was just trying to put my points across in a respectful Manor cuz sometimes people take things personally around here. Oh could have decided to stay here and even for a rental we could have made a better offer. But like I said I'm assuming maybe pg told John to tell eg not to bother.

In the melo Aldridge thing. I'm not thinking of them as 3-5 years ago. I'm looking at what we currently have. Making an assessment of what would be fair and reasonable to move for them and how much them at their current levels can help. I'm not talking about giving them fresh 5 year max deals here, just bringing them in for an appropriate loss to gain ratio. If your moving anyone not named John Brad Otto Morris Kelley those trades make you better. And if you swing Mello signing with you after he gets bought out, even better ( probably won't happen)
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Re: Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII 

Post#1751 » by The Consiglieri » Sat Jul 1, 2017 10:29 pm

Dark Faze wrote:Another day another terrible package traded for a superstar while we do nothing. Cool.


We've got to remind ourselves that we have a completely incompetent F.O. that sucked it's way into a generational talent in Wall and a damn good player in Beal and a potential damn good player in Porter. All 3 were consensus picks at slot more or less, not genius finds by Ernie. Any time he had to think out of the box he blew it, with literally every single pick made in 2010, 2011, 2012, and 2013, and his franchise killing horror show trade in 2009 remains a testament to his complete incompetence. Having grown up and lived in the Bay Area till I was 30 back in '04 and moved to Lake Tahoe/Reno, I've followed closely as first the local Warriors had their umpteenth rebuild over a 20 year period just as we were, and watched the warriors repeatedly nail decisions while we whiffed, and whiffed badly, indeed the only horror show mistakes the Warriors seemed to make were with late draft picks, and the selection of Harrison Barnes which many, but not all of us, recognized was a talent that would NEVER live up to his billing at the next level. Meanwhile the Wizards blew virtually every asset they had to work with: Vet contracts to deal, available salary cap space to take on vets for picks, trades, later draftees, everything, we blew literally every single move we made for more than half a decade of our rebuild other than three rubber stamp draft picks (I wanted Noel at 1.03 in 2012, but Porter was the consensus 1.03 going into the draft, 1.04 if Noel had gone as expected) was blown.

Then as if a cherry on top, in 2016, when anyone with even half a functioning brain cell knew Durant was not going to DC (why do you move from a perenial contender to a dumpster fire F.O. and franchise that's been known as Clippers East throughout the nineties and most of the 21st century, and that appears to have one franchise piece, and an injury prone solid one, when you could play with LeBron, the Warriors, the Rockets, or sign a 1 year, and then go in '18 to someone else? It was a pipe dream the second it was thought up and the team blew it's entire cupboard of draft picks other than 1.01 in '10, and 1.03 in '12 and '13 leading to its suspect situation in the summer of '16), the next move was to look for bargain bin depth deals, hold your nose and select them, but above all else, ABOVE ALL ELSE, do not sign anyone to long term mega contracts just because you have money burning a hole in your pocket, your drunk, and hey, that chick over at the roulette table thinks your HOT! For gods sake, I play freaking Dynasty Salary Cap Contract League Fantasy on RSO and other sites, and Dynasty 101 is NEVER sign long term mega deals to RB's (injury prone, short careers), and all 4 year+ deals should go to proven talents under 30, w/o a history of injury and playing at positions where production is predictable (top end WR's and QB's heading into or into their prime). I'm a 42 year old nobody's ever heard of that will never pull a check within 1/20th of what Ernie pulls. And I KNEW THAT FROM PLAYING FANTASY. How is he so insanely stupid that not only did he not know it, but he behaved like a drunk, 55 year old balding divorce in Vegas w/some lottery winnings in his pocket with beer goggles, that those 40+ers at the C grade strip club really did love him, and another lap dance wasn't going to hurt his bottom line any.

And it's this way with every DC team save the Nets. The Caps ruined by the Forsberg trade, the Redskins lead by a megalomaniacal owner, and yet another incompetent GM, and the wizards rapidly approaching 15 years under the same horrific F.O. that has been lapped by both the Warriors in the West and the Celtics in the East despite having more initial assets of high value to rebuild with than either team, but having squandered virtually all of them while the Warriors parlayed their lesser assets into vastly superior talent via draft picks, trades and smart FA decision making, and the Celtics, for gods sake they were making runs at the NBA title when we hit rock bottom, hit rock bottom several years later, and have already long since passed us largely due to being about 1,000,000x smarter when it comes to asset management and trades.

Nothing is worse than having a message board consistently smarter about rebuilding beloved franchises than management, and yet that's what we have with the Wizards, with the Caps and with the Redskins. What an awful situation. We are in the worst possible region for a salary cap based league: Too good (and too stupid to land a steal) to land picks high enough to draft elite talent, too bad to actually contend for titles or lure elite free agents. I appreciate for the first time in my lifetime the wizards actually have some legit talent, but the horrible mistakes that were made in 2009-2015 in the draft, and in 2016 in free agency destroyed any possibility that the good fortune of landing 3 top 3 picks in 2010-2013 would actually matter and that is a truly bittersweet reality to deal with. It's also why I begrudge the Warriors nothing while everyone hates on them. I find it odd, and maybe very East Coast (being a west coaster I'm a bit more attuned to it). Nobody complained about the NBA being boring when it was all Celtics and lakers in the eighties, or Bulls in the nineties, or lakers in the early aughts. The NBA has always been ruled by dynasties in huge major cities. Now that LeBron opened up the horrors of AAU ball infecting the NBA w/super teams when he moved to Miami it's far too late to complain about the warriors and strikes me as a bit much. The Warriors other than the RUN TMC days late eighties early nineties, and Webber's rookie year were a mirror image of the incompetence of the Wizards, it even coalesced into an epic trade that would do neither team any good with Chris Webber, both teams were essentially horrible from 1994-2012 or 2013, w/a few blips for both teams of playoff relevance but 85% of those 20 seasons were miserable affairs, and the Warriors were horrible in the eighties too, even worse than the mediocre Bullets. Now after suffering as a franchise for 40 years JUST LIKE THE WIZARDS, brilliant asset management, draft day decisions, trades and signings have built a power house. GOOD FOR THEM.

Unlike the Lakers, who seemingly never have to suffer because of the allure of LA, and the history, and unlike the Celtics who seemingly always fall ar$e over tea kettle into a pot of gold (and who feels for Boston really, a billion titles in every major sport since 2001-what do they have a claim on in regards to suffering?), the Warriors, exactly like the Wizards, have suffered, and suffered and suffered, both cities even dealt with devastating crime and homicide and drug issues in these decades, now the Warriors are finally enjoying what we've always hoped for and might have achieved if we and not the incompetent EG were in charge, and media pundits and fans are hating on them? It just strikes me as absurd. Few fanbases as die hard have been as snakebite as the warriors fans have, and now they finally have success to celebrate, and it's success built on brains and great decision making, rather than allure (LA, NYC), or Luck or whatever the hell Boston has going for it, or Miami for that matter (the freaking Marlins won two titles, still can't believe that in addition to the Heat), genuine success built on smarts, and people are hating left and right (haven't seen it here, just seen it and heard it a ton of the radio, media, podcasts etc. It just pisses me off. I hope the warriors win another ten titles and the Lakers, Bulls, NYC and Miami continue to be totally irrelevant (well, Im screwed on the Celtics, but the rest still could suck for a while), and hopefully the Celtics never figure it out. If the Wizards couldn't do it, and they can't, at least our sister city in failure and miserable incompetence in the Warriors of the 1990's and aughts can, and they've done it by earning it through smarts, and that means something.

Sorry, felt like ranting.
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Re: Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII 

Post#1752 » by NatP4 » Sat Jul 1, 2017 10:37 pm

Error Afflalo wrote:
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Let's dream of a Mahinmi dump.

Hypothetical: suppose we did dump Mahinmi and renounce Bojan. How far would we be from getting in the game for Millsap?


Pretty far. We would have to create max room under the cap unless we completed a sign and trade to acquire his bird rights I believe.

Pretty sure even after using assets to dump Mahinmi for 16 mil and renouncing Bojans cap hold it would still only get us a few million below the cap. If they could dump Mahinmi on Atlanta in a sign and trade Millsap deal, then we're talking. But why the hell would they do that?

And Keef was an idiot to Millsap in that series, he ain't coming here.
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Re: Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII 

Post#1753 » by Dark Faze » Sat Jul 1, 2017 10:38 pm

Man--lots of team out on Millsap. Move Gortat + Kieff + pick. Then grab Nene + Dedmon with MLE?
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Re: Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII 

Post#1754 » by gambitx777 » Sat Jul 1, 2017 11:03 pm

NatP4 wrote:
Error Afflalo wrote:
Read on Twitter


Let's dream of a Mahinmi dump.

Hypothetical: suppose we did dump Mahinmi and renounce Bojan. How far would we be from getting in the game for Millsap?


Pretty far. We would have to create max room under the cap unless we completed a sign and trade to acquire his bird rights I believe.

Pretty sure even after using assets to dump Mahinmi for 16 mil and renouncing Bojans cap hold it would still only get us a few million below the cap. If they could dump Mahinmi on Atlanta in a sign and trade Millsap deal, then we're talking. But why the hell would they do that?

And Keef was an idiot to Millsap in that series, he ain't coming here.

No if we dump mahinmi and renounce bojan that's 23 mill in cap room. Because Otto is restricted and does not count for more than his cap hold let's say he signs for 23 a year we would have 14 mill if we dumped mahinmi and renounced bojan, but before Otto sings we would have 23 mill in cap room give or take a mill or two
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Re: Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII 

Post#1755 » by Error Afflalo » Sun Jul 2, 2017 12:03 am

80sballboy wrote:BTW, the Celts reportedly offered three draft picks, and two starters on draft night for PG. Obviously they though they could extend him but what were the Pacers thinking? Kevin Pritchard aparently wanted to trade PG out of the Eastern Conference.
http://nba.nbcsports.com/2017/07/01/report-celtics-offered-pacers-three-first-round-picks-two-starters-for-paul-george-on-draft-night/


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Re: Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII 

Post#1756 » by gambitx777 » Sun Jul 2, 2017 12:24 am

Why are we not doing anything wall pretty much gave you an ultimatum.
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Re: Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII 

Post#1757 » by dckingsfan » Sun Jul 2, 2017 1:00 am

Question on Millsap (since his main suitors have gone away). If Atlanta gets into a sign and trade "mode", is there a deal to be done there - especially since they are interested in Bogdanovic?

Would Gortat or Mahimni be of interest? I would think we would need to include Morris in the mix as well? Or will Millsap demand such a contract that we just can't get it done?

Wall, Beal, Porter, Millsap, (Gortat or Mahimni)
Sato, Mac, Oubre, Smith
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Re: Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII 

Post#1758 » by ozthegap » Sun Jul 2, 2017 1:02 am

gambitx777 wrote:Why are we not doing anything wall pretty much gave you an ultimatum.


They don't care. Ted won't pay lux tax even if it means losing Wall.
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Re: Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII 

Post#1759 » by 80sballboy » Sun Jul 2, 2017 1:16 am

ozthegap wrote:
gambitx777 wrote:Why are we not doing anything wall pretty much gave you an ultimatum.


They don't care. Ted won't pay lux tax even if it means losing Wall.


What do you want them to do? Rush like last season when they signed Mahinmi, Nicholson, Smith, Thornton and traded for Burke? I'll take patience and going for bench scraps. I'm resigned to the fact that they'll basically be the same, save for at least 2 new bench additions. The only guy I'd like to see gone is Gortat, not Mahinmi. We need Mahinmi's defense against the PNR. But neither appears to be tradeable right now, but you never know when you get to the trade deadline.
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Re: Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII 

Post#1760 » by payitforward » Sun Jul 2, 2017 3:14 am

gambitx777 wrote:No if we dump mahinmi and renounce bojan that's 23 mill in cap room. Because Otto is restricted and does not count for more than his cap hold let's say he signs for 23 a year we would have 14 mill if we dumped mahinmi and renounced bojan, but before Otto sings we would have 23 mill in cap room give or take a mill or two

1. We have already extended Bojan a qualifying offer. Can you please not keep talking about "renouncing" him?

2. How many times do you have to add up the guaranteed salaries & so forth before you understand that we have NO ROOM.

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