The Next Coach (SCOTT BROOKS HIRED pg.13)

Post #181 » by **TheSecretWeapon** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 9:12 pm

Can't say I'd be thrilled with Brooks or Jeff Van Gundy, although either would be an upgrade on Wittman. That said, Van Gundy is pretty unlikely, I think. He won a power struggle with Grunfeld in New York. I don't think he'd come to Washington to work for Grunfeld again. And, I don't think Grunfeld would hire him.

gtn130 · Post #182 » by **gtn130** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 9:13 pm

JWizmentality wrote:The more I read the more I don't want Brooks. Seems like a Randy Wittman clone. Would much rather have JVG.

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Definitely. I would take Wittman over Brooks tbh if KD is completely out of the picture.

Post #183 » by **Ruzious** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 9:23 pm

I'd be fine with Brooks, but it is pretty pathetic that apparently the Wiz are trying to hire him without interviewing him. To me, Kevin Ollie makes more sense than Brooks if the whole idea is to attract Durant. Ollie is the one that Durant said created the professional atmosphere for OKC. And it doesn't hurt that he won an NCAA Championship in 2014.

Kanyewest · Post #184 » by **Kanyewest** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 9:40 pm

TheSecretWeapon wrote:
Kanyewest wrote:
TheSecretWeapon wrote:Robinson was better than Ewing by quite a large margin. Don't have time to delve into it today, but Robinson is one of the more underrated players in basketball history.

Statistically, Robinson is more efficient but then you also have to look at the fact that Robinson did play a large portion of his career with superior teammates than Ewing. I'm not sure Robinson finds himself with a ring either with Ewing.

This is coming from a HUGE Ewing fan. I loved watching him at Georgetown. Loved watching him throughout his NBA career. He played hard and worked hard. I admired his game, his work ethic, and the person. I got to know him a little when he was an assistant with the Wizards and found him to be a really good guy.

So, that said: More efficient is better. Robinson's worst pre-injury offensive efficiency was about the same as Ewing's BEST. Even post-injury, Robinson was almost as efficient as Ewing's career best efficiency.

The supporting cast issue is one I can look at in a couple weeks when I have more time. I'd be surprised if there was much difference between the two -- until Robinson got Duncan, of course.

But, the difference is quite large.

Career PPA -- Robinson 231; Ewing 155.

Ewing's peak PPA was 198. Robinson: 263. Not counting the season where he hurt his back, Robinson had 10 seasons that rated better than Ewing's best, and two more seasons that rated better than Ewing's second best. In all, Ewing had 13 seasons that rated as less productive per 100 team possessions than Robinson's worst season.

Much as I respect and admire Ewing, there was a significant distance between Robinson and him. I haven't done any analysis on top 50 all-time type stuff. Robinson surely belongs. Not sure on Ewing. He was a very good player before age-related decline.

EDIT to move the first two paragraphs of my response out of my quoting of kanyewest's post.

Dennis Rodman comes to mind for a few seasons (him getting 17 rebounds a game I suspect helped Robinson's PPA significantly). Sean Elliott was his only teammate before to make an all star team before Robinson had Tim Duncan but I think he was significantly better than any (edit:perimeter) player Ewing played with in his prime.

Wizardspride · Post #185 » by **Wizardspride** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 9:51 pm

[tweet]https://twitter.com/WojVerticalNBA/status/722893109193875456[/tweet]

Kanyewest · Post #186 » by **Kanyewest** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 9:57 pm

Generally most center rankings have Robinson and Ewing in the top 10 of all time with Robinson being 7th and Ewing being 8th. I haven't seen Robinson crack the high teens recently although that may have been the case when he retired. Either way being in the early 20s is still impressive.

Here is Slam's top 500 (2011) - (Robinson 25, Ewing 37) http://www.basketball-reference.com/awards/slam_500_greatest.html

Simmons' pyramid (2010) (Robinson 29, Ewing 40) http://www.basketball-reference.com/awards/simmons_pyramid.html

Espn's top 10 Centers of all time (Robinson 7, Ewing 8) http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/page/nbarankCs/ranking-greatest-centers-nba-history

As an off topic to original point of the argument though, Ewing is generally considered the better player than Jason Kidd.

Wizardspride · Post #187 » by **Wizardspride** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 9:57 pm

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/sources--wizards-offer-head-coaching-job-to-scott-brooks-213807080.html

Sources: Wizards offer head-coaching job to Scott Brooks

Washington Wizards general manager Ernie Grunfeld met with Scott Brooks on Wednesday in Southern California, offering him the franchise’s head-coaching job, league sources told The Vertical.

Brooks has been enthusiastic about reaching an agreement with the Wizards and could complete negotiations on a contract that will pay him in the range of $7 million a season, league sources told The Vertical.

Kanyewest · Post #188 » by **Kanyewest** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 9:59 pm

Wizardspride wrote:[tweet]https://twitter.com/WojVerticalNBA/status/722893109193875456[/tweet]

Uh oh...

keynote · Post #189 » by **keynote** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 10:19 pm

Kanyewest wrote:
Wizardspride wrote:[tweet]https://twitter.com/WojVerticalNBA/status/722893109193875456[/tweet]

Uh oh...

[tweet]https://twitter.com/zparker1030/status/722893951162667009[/tweet]

Ouch.

keynote · Post #190 » by **keynote** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 10:24 pm

keynote wrote:I wonder what we'll offer to Brooks -- especially with the Rockets looming as a potential suitor. I'm guessing that EG will offer (and Brooks will accept) a $6M/year deal.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/sources--wizards-offer-head-coaching-job-to-scott-brooks-213807080.html

Washington Wizards general manager Ernie Grunfeld met with Scott Brooks on Wednesday in Southern California, offering him the franchise’s head-coaching job, league sources told The Vertical.

Brooks has been enthusiastic about reaching an agreement with the Wizards and could complete negotiations on a contract that will pay him in the range of $7 million a season, league sources told The Vertical.

Huh. I though we could've gotten it done for $6M per. :-?

Wizardspride · Post #191 » by **Wizardspride** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 10:28 pm

[tweet]https://twitter.com/ChrisMannixYS/status/722913419246985217[/tweet]

dckingsfan · Post #192 » by **dckingsfan** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 10:34 pm

Yeesh - not a Brooks fan - oh well.

JWizmentality · Post #193 » by **JWizmentality** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 10:43 pm

Sigh...welcome to Washington Scott. Would like to say we're happy to have you but we're all just hanging on to a pipe dream that KD has an uber man crush on you.

80sballboy · Post #194 » by **80sballboy** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 10:53 pm

It's a safe pick though I can't believe they are shelling out $7M a year for a head coach who has a good record, but hasn't won anything. They are really fishing for K7-fo-33-D

Post #195 » by **TheSecretWeapon** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 10:59 pm

Kanyewest wrote:Generally most center rankings have Robinson and Ewing in the top 10 of all time with Robinson being 7th and Ewing being 8th. I haven't seen Robinson crack the high teens recently although that may have been the case when he retired. Either way being in the early 20s is still impressive.

Here is Slam's top 500 (2011) - (Robinson 25, Ewing 37) http://www.basketball-reference.com/awards/slam_500_greatest.html

Simmons' pyramid (2010) (Robinson 29, Ewing 40) http://www.basketball-reference.com/awards/simmons_pyramid.html

Espn's top 10 Centers of all time (Robinson 7, Ewing 8) http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/page/nbarankCs/ranking-greatest-centers-nba-history

As an off topic to original point of the argument though, Ewing is generally considered the better player than Jason Kidd.

I have Kidd rated better than Ewing -- career PPA: 167 to Ewing's 155. I have Kidd's peak at 208 to Ewing's 198. I have Kidd with 3 seasons as good or better than Ewing's best, then a couple more better than Ewing's second best. Kidd didn't really seem to have the steep decline at the tail end of his career -- at least not to the extent that Ewing did.

80sballboy · Post #196 » by **80sballboy** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 11:05 pm

http://www.csnmidatlantic.com/basketball-washington-wizards/talk/so-many-capable-coaches-market-why-scott-brooks

Kanyewest · Post #197 » by **Kanyewest** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 11:15 pm

TheSecretWeapon wrote:
Kanyewest wrote:Generally most center rankings have Robinson and Ewing in the top 10 of all time with Robinson being 7th and Ewing being 8th. I haven't seen Robinson crack the high teens recently although that may have been the case when he retired. Either way being in the early 20s is still impressive.

Here is Slam's top 500 (2011) - (Robinson 25, Ewing 37) http://www.basketball-reference.com/awards/slam_500_greatest.html

Simmons' pyramid (2010) (Robinson 29, Ewing 40) http://www.basketball-reference.com/awards/simmons_pyramid.html

Espn's top 10 Centers of all time (Robinson 7, Ewing 8) http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/page/nbarankCs/ranking-greatest-centers-nba-history

As an off topic to original point of the argument though, Ewing is generally considered the better player than Jason Kidd.

I have Kidd rated better than Ewing -- career PPA: 167 to Ewing's 155. I have Kidd's peak at 208 to Ewing's 198. I have Kidd with 3 seasons as good or better than Ewing's best, then a couple more better than Ewing's second best. Kidd didn't really seem to have the steep decline at the tail end of his career -- at least not to the extent that Ewing did.

True, Kidd final years may have put him on top considering most of those lists were made in 2010 and the Mavs went on to win the title in 2011.

Either way, Ewing is still a great player- I'm not discounting him as a head coaching candidate because of his playing career, although I wouldn't be surprised if there were other reasons, (like not really coaching Kwame Brown up).

sashae · Post #198 » by **sashae** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 11:21 pm

I will say it now: I am not on board with Scott Brooks.. This is a guy notorious for several things:
- Excellent defensive coach
- Poor at end-game planning
- Poor at plays out of timeouts
- Extremely rigid about rotations (doesn't play match ups well - shades of Etan over Haywood with Perk.)

While has shown some measure of ability to coach up his players, the flip to that are guys like Reggie Jackson (developed in Detroit), and the litany of 4th guys (like Jeremy Lamb and Perry Jones) that went nowhere.

I think it's a bad hire, even if I will root for him to succeed.

keynote · Post #199 » by **keynote** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 11:27 pm

http://www.csnmidatlantic.com/basketball-washington-wizards/talk/so-many-capable-coaches-market-why-scott-brooks

In fact, CSN was told earlier in the day, agents who have tried to get their clients face-to-face meetings with the Wizards have been unsuccessful -- and some frustrated -- because they've locked in on Brooks from the outset.

I'm always of the opinion that it doesn't hurt to flirt. But I guess EG felt that his unwavering focus is part of his pitch to Brooks. That, and the $7M per, of course.

80sballboy · Post #200 » by **80sballboy** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 11:56 pm

gtn130 wrote:
JWizmentality wrote:The more I read the more I don't want Brooks. Seems like a Randy Wittman clone. Would much rather have JVG.

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Definitely. I would take Wittman over Brooks tbh if KD is completely out of the picture.

His relationship with the players or ability to work the locker room is the edge he has over Wittman. That and his record. Not sure his x's and o's are any better.