The Washington Redskins Thread

[stevemcqueen1]

I don't think DeShaun Watson makes it to round 2. I also don't love the Ohio State DBs, and don't understand why they've gotten so much hype this offseason. I don't see any separation between them and the likes of Cordrea Tankersley, Jabril Peppers, TreDavious White, Jourdan Lewis, Marlon Humphrey, Desmond King, etc. Don't know how and why we've landed on the OSU guys being early first rounders and all of those other guys being late first or second rounders. But I love Westbrook, Watkins, Qualls, Baker, and Watson.

I like Reddick the pass rusher. I am skeptical of Reddick the stack linebacker. I think he's a phenomenal athlete but doesn't really have an NFL body for his natural position, and thus has no NFL position right now. I think teams that take him in the first round are making a significant gamble.

I'm not worried about Foster's intangibles. I'm worried about the fact he's an undersized ILB who doesn't make plays. I don't understand how a blue chipper playing in Alabama's defense can go his entire college career without forcing a turnover or recovering a fumble. He doesn't read the game particularly well and doesn't have the instinct for coming up with the ball. He just plays 100 miles an hour and tries to blow people up. I like his potential as a leader in the huddle and the locker room, but if I'm taking an undersized ILB halfway through the first round, I want a playmaker. There is too much potential that Foster ends up being just a reliable run stuffing ILB--which is nice to have--but you can always get that in the mid rounds.

I wouldn't hesitate to draft Malik McDowell. McCaffrey and Peppers are the only players I'd consider picking instead of him at 17. People are acting like he's another Nkemdiche and that's just not the case. For one thing he's a lot bigger than Nkemdiche and he actually has a year of film that's utterly dominant. The reason he didn't play as well this season was because he got injured in September and October. He's a top five talent who could be a game changer for our interior defense.

[stevemcqueen1]

One more thing: Barnett sucks. He's slow and he's not big. I really really really hope we don't draft him. I don't understand why he's being so overrated. He's a mid round talent.

[stevemcqueen1]

Actually I do think Malik Hooker is a stud. What I meant before is that I think Peppers is a stud too and I don't get the vast difference in their projections.

But as far as Conley and Lattimore go, I don't see why they are ranked above Tankersley, White, and Humphrey, for example. You can't convince me that those guys aren't just as good, and that they should be second rounders when Lattimore is going top ten and Conley top 20.

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[BearlyBallin]

I don't think DeShaun Watson makes it to round 2. I also don't love the Ohio State DBs, and don't understand why they've gotten so much hype this offseason. I don't see any separation between them and the likes of Cordrea Tankersley, Jabril Peppers, TreDavious White, Jourdan Lewis, Marlon Humphrey, Desmond King, etc. Don't know how and why we've landed on the OSU guys being early first rounders and all of those other guys being late first or second rounders. But I love Westbrook, Watkins, Qualls, Baker, and Watson.

I like Reddick the pass rusher. I am skeptical of Reddick the stack linebacker. I think he's a phenomenal athlete but doesn't really have an NFL body for his natural position, and thus has no NFL position right now. I think teams that take him in the first round are making a significant gamble.
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I wouldn't hesitate to draft Malik McDowell. McCaffrey and Peppers are the only players I'd consider picking instead of him at 17. People are acting like he's another Nkemdiche and that's just not the case. For one thing he's a lot bigger than Nkemdiche and he actually has a year of film that's utterly dominant. The reason he didn't play as well this season was because he got injured in September and October. He's a top five talent who could be a game changer for our interior defense.

If the redskins go Edge & DL in rounds one and two, which CB & FS prospects do you like in round 3 or 4 ?
I'm hoping that teams wait on taking a CB because of the belief that this a draft deep with talent at the position. Therefore allowing the Skins to pickup a good CB in day 3.

[BearlyBallin]

My dream draft scenario for the Skins:

Skins trade QB Kirk Cousins to Cleveland for #12 & #33 picks.
Skins trade #12 to Buccaneers for #19 & #50 picks.

Draft:
1-17 CB Gareon Conley
1-19 ILB Haason Reddick
2-33 QB DeShaun Watson
2-49 FS Budda Baker
2-50 OG Dion Dawkins
3-81 DE Carlos Watkins
4-114 OC Ethan Pocic
4-123 NT Elijah Qualls
5-154 TE Bucky Hodges
6-201 WR Dede Westbrook
6-209 OLB Dylan Cole
7-220 RB Donnel Pumphrey
7-235 DE Patrick Gamble

I would love if McCaffrey fell to us but I doubt it. I'd choose Reddick over Reuben Foster even if Foster is available b/c of Foster's maturity issues. Two guys I would not draft under any circumstances: Malik McDowell & Joe Mixon. McDowell hasn't interviewed well and has questionable love for the game. Too much game film of him going through the motions. No need to go into detail on Mixon. I just get the Lawrence Phillips type of vibe from him. I'm not in love with the DL options where we draft in the 1st round and view Baker/Dawkins as better values than going DL in the 2nd. I think Qualls is the best true NT in the draft anyways. I love DeShaun Watson and would possibly try to trade up from #33 if I got intel a team would select him in the 1st round - I think there's a better chance that Mahomes goes in the 1st tho.

Heck yeah I'd love that draft, but I fear Reddick maybe gone before 1-19

Actually I think Baker, Dawkins & Watkins get taken higher in each of those rounds. Maybe Watkins is there at 3-81...and at DE the concerns of him looking like he's playing in skates, when he's at DT, is removed.

What are your thoughts on Wormley & where do you see him going in the second round ?

I'm liking your thoughts on Quallis, from what I've heard he can anchor that NT spot & if he doesn't get too much heavier he can generate some QB pressure from the inside.

[Dat2U]

I don't think DeShaun Watson makes it to round 2. I also don't love the Ohio State DBs, and don't understand why they've gotten so much hype this offseason. I don't see any separation between them and the likes of Cordrea Tankersley, Jabril Peppers, TreDavious White, Jourdan Lewis, Marlon Humphrey, Desmond King, etc. Don't know how and why we've landed on the OSU guys being early first rounders and all of those other guys being late first or second rounders. But I love Westbrook, Watkins, Qualls, Baker, and Watson.

I like Reddick the pass rusher. I am skeptical of Reddick the stack linebacker. I think he's a phenomenal athlete but doesn't really have an NFL body for his natural position, and thus has no NFL position right now. I think teams that take him in the first round are making a significant gamble.

I'm not worried about Foster's intangibles. I'm worried about the fact he's an undersized ILB who doesn't make plays. I don't understand how a blue chipper playing in Alabama's defense can go his entire college career without forcing a turnover or recovering a fumble. He doesn't read the game particularly well and doesn't have the instinct for coming up with the ball. He just plays 100 miles an hour and tries to blow people up. I like his potential as a leader in the huddle and the locker room, but if I'm taking an undersized ILB halfway through the first round, I want a playmaker. There is too much potential that Foster ends up being just a reliable run stuffing ILB--which is nice to have--but you can always get that in the mid rounds.

I wouldn't hesitate to draft Malik McDowell. McCaffrey and Peppers are the only players I'd consider picking instead of him at 17. People are acting like he's another Nkemdiche and that's just not the case. For one thing he's a lot bigger than Nkemdiche and he actually has a year of film that's utterly dominant. The reason he didn't play as well this season was because he got injured in September and October. He's a top five talent who could be a game changer for our interior defense.

I'd trade up from #33 or down from #17 for Watson. I think he's goes late 1st at best, probably to NYG or HOU.

Peppers looks to be a great RS but I don't know what position he transitions into in the pros. SS? Then what do we do with Cravens?

I do like Desmond King. Not a fan of Humphrey tho. Don't know enough about White & Lewis to give a solid opinion on them.

I think Reddick can play. If he doesn't work inside, he'll be very good on the outside and we definitely need speed on the outside anyways.

I feel you on Foster. Redskins fans seem to be falling all over themselves to draft the kid but I just don't see it on or off the field with him. Instincts are very important to me. Which is a reason why I'm not high on Peppers or Humphrey. I want guys on defense that can make plays.

I just don't trust McDowell. Maybe as a 2nd rounder you could talk me into it but his rep goes far beyond having a few poor games because of injury. I want players that love the game and are passionate about competing every snap. I don't see that from him.

[Dat2U]

My dream draft scenario for the Skins:

Skins trade QB Kirk Cousins to Cleveland for #12 & #33 picks.
Skins trade #12 to Buccaneers for #19 & #50 picks.

Draft:
1-17 CB Gareon Conley
1-19 ILB Haason Reddick
2-33 QB DeShaun Watson
2-49 FS Budda Baker
2-50 OG Dion Dawkins
3-81 DE Carlos Watkins
4-114 OC Ethan Pocic
4-123 NT Elijah Qualls
5-154 TE Bucky Hodges
6-201 WR Dede Westbrook
6-209 OLB Dylan Cole
7-220 RB Donnel Pumphrey
7-235 DE Patrick Gamble

I would love if McCaffrey fell to us but I doubt it. I'd choose Reddick over Reuben Foster even if Foster is available b/c of Foster's maturity issues. Two guys I would not draft under any circumstances: Malik McDowell & Joe Mixon. McDowell hasn't interviewed well and has questionable love for the game. Too much game film of him going through the motions. No need to go into detail on Mixon. I just get the Lawrence Phillips type of vibe from him. I'm not in love with the DL options where we draft in the 1st round and view Baker/Dawkins as better values than going DL in the 2nd. I think Qualls is the best true NT in the draft anyways. I love DeShaun Watson and would possibly try to trade up from #33 if I got intel a team would select him in the 1st round - I think there's a better chance that Mahomes goes in the 1st tho.

Heck yeah I'd love that draft, but I fear Reddick maybe gone before 1-19

Actually I think Baker, Dawkins & Watkins get taken higher in each of those rounds. Maybe Watkins is there at 3-81...and at DE the concerns of him looking like he's playing in skates, when he's at DT, is removed.

What are your thoughts on Wormley & where do you see him going in the second round ?

I'm liking your thoughts on Quallis, from what I've heard he can anchor that NT spot & if he doesn't get too much heavier he can generate some QB pressure from the inside.

I feel Wormley may be solid. I just think there are better prospects available in the 2nd round. I actually love the 2nd round of this draft. There's 12-15 guys that I would love to have on our football team.

Another guy I love that I didn't mention is Obi Melinfonwu. I just worry that drafting him at #17 is too high and he may not be available in the mid-2nd round. Adoree' Jackson is another guy I really like.

If Reddick is gone I'd be open to drafting Forrest Lamp in the 1st, easily the best G prospect in the draft. I think he or Dawkins would make our offensive line whole.

I'd also stay away from the RB Cook. I worry that guys who don't feel it's important enough to prepare for the combine are not going to prepare when it's really time to play.

[stevemcqueen1]

I'd trade up from #33 or down from #17 for Watson. I think he's goes late 1st at best, probably to NYG or HOU.

Peppers looks to be a great RS but I don't know what position he transitions into in the pros. SS? Then what do we do with Cravens?

I do like Desmond King. Not a fan of Humphrey tho. Don't know enough about White & Lewis to give a solid opinion on them.

I think Reddick can play. If he doesn't work inside, he'll be very good on the outside and we definitely need speed on the outside anyways.

I feel you on Foster. Redskins fans seem to be falling all over themselves to draft the kid but I just don't see it on or off the field with him. Instincts are very important to me. Which is a reason why I'm not high on Peppers or Humphrey. I want guys on defense that can make plays.

I just don't trust McDowell. Maybe as a 2nd rounder you could talk me into it but his rep goes far beyond having a few poor games because of injury. I want players that love the game and are passionate about competing every snap. I don't see that from him.

I'd take Watson at 17 if we make the decision to deal Kirk or let him walk. And I wouldn't look back. But I think we're going to get a long term deal done with Kirk, in which case, I'd pass on the QBs. That's one of the few positions where you ignore BPA.

Peppers is a safety and slot corner. Harbaugh didn't do Peppers a ton of favors by playing him at LBer so much, it made it harder for Peppers to audition for NFL teams. But the flip side to that is he was highly effective in the role and Michigan's defense was dominant. I mean, I guess you could continue to have him play WILL in certain sub packages, but he's a natural DB. What I like best about him is his run defense. A guy with his speed and playmaking ability could get away with half-assing run downs, but Peppers relishes playing the run. I also like his collegiate resume. He was the best player on Michigan the past two seasons, and he led a truly great defense. I don't know if you closely follow their program, but he was basically the guy who personified the Harbaugh turnaround. Things had gotten pretty low for them. Jabrill was the first blue chipper who thrived under Harbaugh and his natural talent and personality redefined the team and elevated them. Some guys are just special football players, like RGIII and Sean Taylor were. I think Jabrill is kind of like that too.

As far as what to do with Cravens, I would play them both. Cravens is a little bigger. Less explosive. But he can still cover and thus you can move them around your defensive backfield. Either could play a ton of snaps in the box. Peppers is a bigger talent, so Cravens probably isn't keeping him off the field, but Cravens is still good enough that I think he'd find his way into a variety of packages. It'd be nice to have two young high end talents at DB, especially at safety, where we are very weak.

Humphrey is raw, but he's a big time talent. Off coverage and cover 2 and cover 3 shell needs a good deal of work. Route recognition skills are underdeveloped and his footwork out of his break isn't fluid and he takes a lot of false steps. He needs work on his craft in coverage. But his single press coverage is already there and that's rare to find in young college corners. This kid can reroute receivers and turn and run with just about anyone. His run contain is outstanding. And the tools are definitely there for him to become a very good cover 2 corner because he's got top notch click and close speed and he's very physical. He's also really big for a speedy outside corner.

Bottom line for me with Humphrey is that he's a RS sophomore who has two very good seasons starting for truly great defenses and he's got elite measurables. There are holes in his game, but if we can look past those to see the elite potential in another RS sophomore in Solomon Thomas, then I don't see why Humphrey isn't given the same benefit of the doubt. Marshon Lattimore doesn't have two good years on his resume and most places have him going top five to ten? We're heavily projecting these guys, so I don't get it.

Jourdan Lewis received misdemeanor domestic violence charges back in March which I think torpedoed his draft stock. But there is some doubt about whether an assault even took place, so he could actually end up being cleared of all charges. The problem for him is that there isn't time for the legal process to play out before the draft, so unfortunately, he could really plummet. But I think a team could get the equivalent of a first or early second round talent much later in the draft with him. The other big knock on him is his size. He's very small. But he's surprisingly good in run contain and quite good in press coverage and he played gunner for Michigan. It's a testament to his competitiveness and toughness that he was so effective in those roles at his size. And the thing that makes him special is the ball skills. He makes an absurd amount of plays on the ball. He broke up like 20 passes as a junior and something ridiculous like 40 on his career. He is hyper aggressive and he pretty much always stays dialed in. If his legal issues clear up, then the size is really the only complaint that teams could have about him.

White has a reputation for lacking physicality and I don't love that about him. He's got a slender base and doesn't show a lot of functional power. But he can still make open field tackles because he's a pretty good technician. And he is a legit outside corner and I can live with a lack of physicality at that position. The other big knock against him is that he didn't have a good sophomore season. But given his excellent freshman and junior seasons, he's got a lot of really good tape. His press man coverage is absolutely fantastic. I honestly think he's the best at mirroring speed downfield in the class. Fluid hips, great feet, and he's disciplined. Guys like him who can play on an island and cover opposing #1s are pretty much the most valuable DBs in the NFL. I don't understand why he's not thought of as a first rounder. He's the type of player I could see being the top corner on a really good pass defense and really outperform his draft slot.

As far as McDowell goes, I'll just say this: nobody was questioning his heart when he was kicking ass his sophomore year. All of this innuendo about him didn't start springing up until after this season ended and it feels to me like he's being scapegoated for getting hurt and Michigan State having a bad season. He didn't forget how to play football this year, or suddenly lose his passion for the sport. He was playing with broken ribs and serious shoulder and ankle injuries. The fact that he played through them for most of the season should be evidence of his toughness and commitment.

Trent Williams had a rough senior season after putting up a dominant junior season, to the point where people we talking about him as maybe a late first rounder when that season ended. Come to find out, he played the entire season with serious injuries. Then he showed up at the combine and everyone saw what a freak of nature athlete he was. It's a similar situation with Malik McDowell, except I don't think he's getting the benefit of the doubt that Trent got. And I think that's a big mistake. When you're picking 17 and you have a defensive line that's completely devoid of any sort of plus talent, you don't look a gift horse in the mouth when the Football Gods drop a legit blue chip talent like Malik McDowell in your lap. He could transform our defensive front.

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Regarding the draft

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[stevemcqueen1]

Gareon Conley has been accused of rape. http://www.tmz.com/2017/04/25/nfl-prospect-gareon-conley-accused-of-rape-denies-allegations/

He hasn't been charged with anything yet.

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[BearlyBallin]

This has got to be a first.

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[BearlyBallin]

Welcome to DC, Mr. Jonathan Allen.

"...defensive end earned the Chuck Bednarik and Bronco Nagurski Award as the nation's top defender on the nation's top defense in 2016 after compiling 69 tackles, 16 for a loss, and leading the team with 10.5 sacks."

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[long suffrin' boulez fan]

Wow. Jonathan Allen. Need and BPA.

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