The 2024-25 Rookies

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Needless to say, I really don't care what any of these guys did in the NCAA tournament. Tell me what they did throughout the sample size of the season, and if you got high school data, give me that too. I don't give a rat's --- what Queen did over the week, its irrelevant, what Queen did over the breadth of the season is what matters, which is interesting, but alas, not what I want inside the top 5 (if we pick there). He becomes a consideration if we do not.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/derik-queen-1.html

There's a tab that reads:
Show Leaderboards, Awards, and Honors

He was B1G Freshman of the Year
He destroyed Rutgers (Harper and Bailey?)
Queen made 1st Team All B1G

[FAH1223]

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[penbeast0]

Don't get me wrong, I don't think Carrington is completely useless. He will stick in the NBA for awhile and has some NBA skills. My issue with Bub is mainly that I don't see much growth in his game. I think he's an average prospect with a low ceiling. I like guards that attack the paint and draw fouls, and are bulldogs defensively (think prime Kyle Lowry). Bub is a game manager that shoots the ball well off the dribble. His archtype is available in the 20's/second round every year IMO. Again, he'll stick because he has a useful nba skillset, but he's not a guy you build around.

Where would you rank him compared to our other youngsters (Sarr, Coulibaly, George, AJ)?

[payitforward]

This thread is intended for discussion of the '24-25 class of NBA rookies -- all of them on all teams. I.e. not especially for discussion of our players.

That said, in my judgment TGW's description of Bub Carrington is ludicrous. Just talk. Not analysis of any kind.

Of course, he might be right & I might be wrong. We'll see.

[TheBlackCzar]

My read is that it is way too early to make a call on any rookie in this draft class.

I kind of disagree with you here and kind of agree.

I think there are two different things:

Will they be/can they be a #1 or #2.

Will they improve to be a solid rotational player.

Are they going to be a bust.

I think our group has shown they aren't going to be a #1 or #2 on a really good team. I don't think it is too early to make that read.

I think that all 4 look like they have the potential to be solid rotational guys.

I don't think any of them look like they are going to be Johnny Davis level busts.

I think I first got the notion of being relentless from you. That is why if they package any of the four to move up, I am going to be fine with it. I am trying not to get attached to this group because I "feel" that if the FO follows its own strategy, they should move these players if they have the opportunity for additional draft assets.

Now back to badinage's original post and the point. If they can take one of the 4 and move up materially in this years' strong draft class - you don't hesitate.

If there are no opportunities to do so, just let the kids develop. But time is a tick'n as they will soon be off their rookie contracts (especially give our timeframe if we don't get lucky).

\


Problem with your logic... There is no guy like Sarr in this draft.... You can downplay all the reasons why he was considered for #1 last year, but the main reason why is because he's a 7ft with exceptional coordination, foot speed and agility.... No amount of complaining about what scoring option he might become when he's a raw 19yr old, will change that Sarr's physical traits are elite and rare....

While this draft is considered stronger than last year, Sarr still has more perceived potential than most of the other Big options in this draft....... So you want Winger to follow Philly's "Process" strategy which didn't work.... Why when it didn't work.... Not only didn't it work, but that team had so many cracks at the apple and kept picking the worst choices for whatever reason (injury, psychological issues, poor player evals etc).... We haven't displayed that level of ineptitude in player analysis and evaluation thus far..... And honestly if we pick our 1 and 2 this year and next, or if one of our own develops + this years pick, we're gravy, while we still have a bunch of picks going forward, ie. 2 frp this year and next, so how many rookies do you want to keep adding to the team.... is 3 a year not enough??

The strategy that we've employed since these dudes came into the franchise has turned very barren assets into plentiful assets.... Why don't you think this can continue while we continue developing existing players for either trade in yr 3 or 4 or for being resigned? They didn't trade your master Deni until he'd displayed 3.75 irrelevant years, and one breakout quarter of a season.... I mean shouldn't everybody else receive the same leniency as your savior?

[dckingsfan]

My read is that it is way too early to make a call on any rookie in this draft class.

I kind of disagree with you here and kind of agree.

I think there are two different things:

Will they be/can they be a #1 or #2.

Will they improve to be a solid rotational player.

Are they going to be a bust.

I think our group has shown they aren't going to be a #1 or #2 on a really good team. I don't think it is too early to make that read.

I think that all 4 look like they have the potential to be solid rotational guys.

I don't think any of them look like they are going to be Johnny Davis level busts.

I think I first got the notion of being relentless from you. That is why if they package any of the four to move up, I am going to be fine with it. I am trying not to get attached to this group because I "feel" that if the FO follows its own strategy, they should move these players if they have the opportunity for additional draft assets.

Now back to badinage's original post and the point. If they can take one of the 4 and move up materially in this years' strong draft class - you don't hesitate.

If there are no opportunities to do so, just let the kids develop. But time is a tick'n as they will soon be off their rookie contracts (especially give our timeframe if we don't get lucky).

Problem with your logic... There is no guy like Sarr in this draft.... You can downplay all the reasons why he was considered for #1 last year, but the main reason why is because he's a 7ft with exceptional coordination, foot speed and agility.... No amount of complaining about what scoring option he might become when he's a raw 19yr old, will change that Sarr's physical traits are elite and rare....

I could very well be wrong. Maybe he will become an elite scorer and elite defender/defensive rebounder or maybe he will be able to become a really good PF.

I don't see it but... somethings have to be believed to be seen.

[gambitx777]

We ended up with 3 top 15 rookies easy!

Sent from my SM-S926U1 using RealGM mobile app

[dobrojim]

Read on Twitter

Interesting but it's really an indication of 2 things:

1. Everyone (all teams) shoots a lot of 3s

2. How unusual it is for 3 rookies on the same team
to get as much playing time as our kids have gotten.

[DCZards]

Read on Twitter

Interesting but it's really an indication of 2 things:

1. Everyone (all teams) shoots a lot of 3s

2. How unusual it is for 3 rookies on the same team
to get as much playing time as our kids have gotten.

In today’s NBA you can’t have enough good 3pt shooting. The best team in the NBA (Boston) is proving that the 3 ball is an awesome weapon. So it’s encouraging to know that we have 3 rooks who, hopefully, will be at least average 3pt shooters.

I’m expecting Kyshawn to turn out to be the best of the three when it comes to 3pt shooting.

[dobrojim]

Agreed. But I’d say being average will lead to an average team,
all other things being roughly equal.

[The Consiglieri]

Needless to say, I really don't care what any of these guys did in the NCAA tournament. Tell me what they did throughout the sample size of the season, and if you got high school data, give me that too. I don't give a rat's --- what Queen did over the week, its irrelevant, what Queen did over the breadth of the season is what matters, which is interesting, but alas, not what I want inside the top 5 (if we pick there). He becomes a consideration if we do not.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/derik-queen-1.html

There's a tab that reads:
Show Leaderboards, Awards, and Honors

He was B1G Freshman of the Year
He destroyed Rutgers (Harper and Bailey?)
Queen made 1st Team All B1G

I do not care, even a little about any of that.

Let me give you 1, of innumerable examples of why:

Johnny Davis had this awards haul in 2022, that beloved, local favorite on our board, clearly most popular and most celebrated Draft Pick of the century:

Lute Olson Player of the year '22
Jerry West Shooting Guard of the year '22
First Team All American
Big Ten Player of the year
1st team All Big 10
Maui Invitational Player of the Tournament
Naismith Finalist
Wooden Finalist

And another 3 Wisconsin specific awards.

love ya man, but I don't think any award for a college player is in and of itself, meaningful in the evaluation process, it's just something for their college cv, and beating a horrible Rutgers team isn't really persuasive either. It's not that it doesn't matter, its just not proven sticky, to me, as any kind of trait of historical superstars and stars. There's a great big bucket of NBA stars who not surprisingly won all sorts of plaudits in college, but man, neither of us are young and I'm sure you can recall, I certainly can, an innumerable supply of players in college that collected all manner of hardware and were average Joe's at best, or far worse in the NBA like Johnny Davis. Hell Cal Cheaney was just a Michigan murderer while at Indiana, but as an NBA player, the best of those Michigan stars were 10x as good as he was.

Its just not meaningful. I want to know what his profile is on offense and defense, how it projects to the NBA, what scouts see in terms of difference making traits, how projectable, and go from there. I don't care about individual games, nor awards, at all, I care what the analytical #'s tell us, and what the scouts tell us in terms of projecting out his strengths and weaknesses when he tries to leap the giant chasm between the Big 10 and the NBA, the one that swallowed Johnny Davis whole, and spit him out like so much cud, just 3 years ago.

[DCZards]

Agreed. But I’d say being average will lead to an average team,
all other things being roughly equal.

That’s why I said “at least average.” I expect Sarr to be above average for a big and for George to be above average…like he was in college.

[dobrojim]

Maybe in 3-5 years.

BTW - what's our win rate for just MAR-APR? And give
that win percentage an slight incremental bump

[closg00]

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[closg00]

Congrats to Alex.

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[Tyrone Messby]

Is Castle really that good or is just because he's getting heavy usage?

[AFM]

He’s getting glazed like crazy because he’s on the spurs

[gambitx777]

He’s getting glazed like crazy because he’s on the spurs

I am not a castle guy. Is he good. Yes. Is he as good as advertised no.

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[closg00]

Only his 2nd start, he has a chance to be Curry-like, or light.

Watch on YouTube

[dckingsfan]

ESPN - Rookie of the Year rankings:

https://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/44601305/2024-2025-nba-rookie-rankings-top-20-players-season-stephon-castle-zaccharie-risacher

Top 5:
1 - Risacher

Risacher is delivering on his top-pick status, and the Hawks should feel good about their decision (then and now).

2 - Castle

I debated making him No. 1 on this list, but Castle's struggles with efficiency and turnovers (2.1 turnovers per game) gave Risacher a tiny edge. However, Castle certainly has the talent to end up the best player in this class over time, particularly if he polishes those areas of his game.

3 - Edey

Edey's rookie season has fallen in line with my expectations: He is highly efficient and productive on a per-minute basis, but has averaged 20 minutes per game because of his defensive limitations, keeping him in more of a platoon role.

4 - Clingan

Clingan looks like a legitimate defensive centerpiece for Portland, particularly if he can stay on the floor for longer stretches.

5 - Buzelis

Improved consistency and confidence have made him more impactful all-around than some scouts had expected. The next step will be expanding his offense and creating his own shot more effectively.