Deni Avdija

[Eyalley-oop]

I discuss basketball my guy. I don't do this back forth on the he said, I said and now your feelings are hurt nonsense. Please go elsewhere with that because your right, I'm not a nice guy at all. So if you feel I've disrespected you, cool. I don't care. Block me. Go away. Do whatever you want but you don't have to continue to engage me.

You don't discuss baksetball, you make claims and when you're proven wrong you turn to rudeness, that's not a discussion in-spite of what you're telling yourself, keep petting yourself on the back if it helps your feelings.

[closg00]

I wouldn't bet on Deni having along NBA career. Why? Because there will be savy, defensive-minded players in every draft who can "Deni", AND be more than able to carry their share on offensive which Deni cannot do.

The previous Israeli NBA player, Omri Casspi, was also a 6'9" player that resembles Deni but much less talented and had a a much lower potential ceiling, his total career stats are slightly lower than what Deni is averaging this season, Casspi had a 10 year NBA career including time in a Golden State championship team, and that in-spite of having bad luck with a number of injuries, if Deni will stay healthy and will make that choice, there's no reason why he won't stay in the league for a long time, the only question is in what role and for how much money.

Omri Casspi shot the 3 ball at a decent % hence his longevity in the league. I have always said that a Deni with wet jumper would be a player I would keep on the team without hesitation.
https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/c/casspom01.html

[Eyalley-oop]

Omri Casspi shot the 3 ball at a decent % hence his longevity in the league. I have always said that a Deni with wet jumper would be a player I would keep on the team without hesitation.
https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/c/casspom01.html

But he still made 7.9 points per game exactly the same as Deni with 7.9 points in his career and 8.6 this season, and Deni contribute more in other aspects.

Deni will probably improve his 3 pt % during his career, in the previous month after the Rui trade Deni shot close to 40% from 3, his problem is mainly in his mind and I assume eventually he'll solve these issues.

[Dolevi]

The thing is - Omri had a "game" on O, he had his 3 ball. He was CONSISTENCY
Lately i've listened to TikTok videos and I've seen there something interesting Giannis Anntetankompu said in an inteview.
Playing in the NBA and be an NBA player is about consistency. Talking about obsession. If you don't have consistency in what y'all doing- you won't be great.

Watch on YouTube

This is my Alarm every morning. Relevant to everything in life.
Deni can be a skilled player in some things - but he can't find consistency and that hurts him, even if his team is a piece of crap ugly basketball - he still needs to influence.
I clearly understand and support the people against Deni here, as an Israeli. Don't know which team will give him the ball to be an NBA starter. even as a rotation player. Team won't count him as a dribbler and playmaker, because with all due respect - his Ball securtiy is really really bad. He turns-over the ball too much easily. Teams see that as a weakness and try to press him (and get rewarded for that).
So sadly, it's also a lot on Deni himself. The potential is there no one will question that, but with potential only you're not going anywhere, especially when it's 3 seasons of "development".

[doclinkin]

Deni ranks 293 out 512 players in usage. He may be above average for a Wizards player but seems to have the ball less than an average NBA player.

4th on the team in FG attempts at 499 on the year. Which considering he is shooting 42% from the field is something of a flaw not an asset.

That said probably our biggest weakness is that Kuzma is more than double that number and not really shooting much better. (Deni eFG .488. Kuz efg .510).

[Eyalley-oop]

I clearly understand and support the people against Deni here, as an Israeli. Don't know which team will give him the ball to be an NBA starter. even as a rotation player. Team won't count him as a dribbler and playmaker, because with all due respect - his Ball securtiy is really really bad. He turns-over the ball too much easily. Teams see that as a weakness and try to press him (and get rewarded for that).
So sadly, it's also a lot on Deni himself. The potential is there no one will question that, but with potential only you're not going anywhere, especially when it's 3 seasons of "development".

I understand the disappointment but you're talking like his career is over, only a month ago we all talked very differently about him and he looked great, many players have inconsistent first years in their careers, he's only 22 and 2 months, he still has a lot of time to improve and the good news is that he doesn't need to improve a lot of things, if he only improve 1 thing, his 3 pt shot, he'll be a totally different offensive player, if he'll improve 2 things, his 3 pt shot and going left, he'll be a sure starter, so I don't see a reason for this panic, he's in a lot better situation than many other young players, he knows exactly what he needs to do and what to improve and I'm sure he'll work on it.

Since we've mentioned Casspi, I've followed him since he was about 16 as well and it's not true he was consistent, if you look at his stats you'll see he fluctuated between seasons with 12 pts to seasons with 4 pts a game, he had seasons and teams where he was a starter and seasons where he was a 6th man and seasons where he was deep on the bench, it all depended on the situation and usually also the coach, I'm not wishing for Deni to have the same career, I hope his will be better, but it won't be such a disaster as well.

[Dolevi]

I didn't say Casspi was consistent.
If your point is, that even if a player isn't consistent in what he does - he still has a room to growth - I don't argue with this. Offcourse the potential is there. But while we talking there are new players and new generation, younger players, more hungry, that can fit better and react better to situations than Deni, or let's say - their potential is larger. As long as Deni won't fulfill his potential - his credit will slowly reduce logically. Because he's getting older. The question is - if the organization will decide to invest in Deni.. Or maybe at Wembanyama Try to look at it in Objective eye. The Wizards can't wait eternity for Deni to grow. 3 years it's also a lot of time. Anyway in my opinion - if he won't upgrade his ball control and security, finishing abillities and 3pt shooting (together with shooting overall) - He's gonna struggle and won't reach his potential. But still will get his contract.

[JWizmentality]

Dang, mood in this thread changed real quick huh.

[Kanyewest]

Deni with 15 and 10 on 83% shooting

[Eyalley-oop]

I didn't say Casspi was consistent.

Then maybe I don't understand your English, but that's what I understood from:

The thing is - Omri had a "game" on O, he had his 3 ball. He was CONSISTENCY

Maybe you can explain better what you meant there.

If your point is, that even if a player isn't consistent in what he does - he still has a room to growth - I don't argue with this. .

My point is that when I look at Deni's strengths vs his weaknesses my assumption is that he'll be alright and will have a decent career(as long as he's healthy), people talk like he's a flop but the truth is he doesn't needs to fix too many things in order to become a very good player:

His weaknesses:

1. Mental confidence issues on offense(aka passive).
2. 3 pt shot.
3. Ball handing, only going right.
4. Argue with referees.

And his strengths:

1. Very fast for his height, especially in the open court.
2. Versatile, can defend and play in positions 1-4, sometimes even 5.
3. Good defender, at least before the refs neutered him he has shown he can even be excellent.
4. Good rebounder.
5. Good passer.
6. High basketball IQ on both sides of the court.
7. Unselfish (sometimes too much...).
8. Very good work ethic according to the staff, worked with Drew Hanlen both in the summer and the all-star break although he also played for the national team.
9. Shown he can improve his weaknesses, raised his FT from 64% in the first year and 60% in the Euroleague to 76%, also improved how he finishes at the rim, I think people forgot that missing undefended easy layups used to be a huge issue with him.
10. Only 22 with already 3 years of experience in the league.
11. Seems like a good teammate in the locker room.


If we'll exclude the whole referees thing that is just silly and eventually will go away, he only needs to improve 1 thing out of his 3 big weaknesses in order to become much more effective on offense, it will be great if he'll improve more, but he only needs 1, and if that 1 thing will be his confidence most likely his 3 pt shot and driving to the basket will improve as well and we saw it tonight when he shot 3/4 from 3.

His work ethic and drive to succeed together with knowing he does improve things he's bad at make me assume he'll eventually find the way to fix his issues, maybe I'm just an optimistic, but I follow basketball for almost 30 years, I've seen many youngsters and relatively to other young players his situation isn't that bad as people here make it out to be in the last few weeks.

Offcourse the potential is there. But while we talking there are new players and new generation, younger players, more hungry, that can fit better and react better to situations than Deni, or let's say - their potential is larger. As long as Deni won't fulfill his potential - his credit will slowly reduce logically. Because he's getting older. The question is - if the organization will decide to invest in Deni.. Or maybe at Wembanyama Try to look at it in Objective eye. The Wizards can't wait eternity for Deni to grow. 3 years it's also a lot of time. Anyway in my opinion - if he won't upgrade his ball control and security, finishing abillities and 3pt shooting (together with shooting overall) - He's gonna struggle and won't reach his potential. But still will get his contract.

Obviously if he won't improve his credit will get smaller, as I said I think he'll improve, that's just my assumption, I can't really predict the future, what we know is that Tommy Sheppard likes him and have faith in his potential, so at least for the next season we know Deni will have another chance to show what he's got, if he'll have a disappointing season I assume the Wizards will cut him loose, and then Deni will have to decide where he's going, even then I assume he'll have enough offers from other teams, maybe ones with a playing style that is more suitable for him, but let's hope for now he'll just have a good season here.

[Dolevi]

I didn't say Casspi was consistent.

Then maybe I don't understand your English, but that's what I understood from:

The thing is - Omri had a "game" on O, he had his 3 ball. He was CONSISTENCY

Maybe you can explain better what you meant there.

If your point is, that even if a player isn't consistent in what he does - he still has a room to growth - I don't argue with this. .

My point is that when I look at Deni's strengths vs his weaknesses my assumption is that he'll be alright and will have a decent career(as long as he's healthy), people talk like he's a flop but the truth is he doesn't needs to fix too many things in order to become a very good player:

His weaknesses:

1. Mental confidence issues on offense(aka passive).
2. 3 pt shot.
3. Ball handing, only going right.
4. Argue with referees.

And his strengths:

1. Very fast for his height, especially in the open court.
2. Versatile, can defend and play in positions 1-4, sometimes even 5.
3. Good defender, at least before the refs neutered him he has shown he can even be excellent.
4. Good rebounder.
5. Good passer.
6. High basketball IQ on both sides of the court.
7. Unselfish (sometimes too much...).
8. Very good work ethic according to the staff, worked with Drew Hanlen both in the summer and the all-star break although he also played for the national team.
9. Shown he can improve his weaknesses, raised his FT from 64% in the first year and 60% in the Euroleague to 76%, also improved how he finishes at the rim, I think people forgot that missing undefended easy layups used to be a huge issue with him.
10. Only 22 with already 3 years of experience in the league.
11. Seems like a good teammate in the locker room.


If we'll exclude the whole referees thing that is just silly and eventually will go away, he only needs to improve 1 thing out of his 3 big weaknesses in order to become much more effective on offense, it will be great if he'll improve more, but he only needs 1, and if that 1 thing will be his confidence most likely his 3 pt shot and driving to the basket will improve as well and we saw it tonight when he shot 3/4 from 3.

His work ethic and drive to succeed together with knowing he does improve things he's bad at make me assume he'll eventually find the way to fix his issues, maybe I'm just an optimistic, but I follow basketball for almost 30 years, I've seen many youngsters and relatively to other young players his situation isn't that bad as people here make it out to be in the last few weeks.

Offcourse the potential is there. But while we talking there are new players and new generation, younger players, more hungry, that can fit better and react better to situations than Deni, or let's say - their potential is larger. As long as Deni won't fulfill his potential - his credit will slowly reduce logically. Because he's getting older. The question is - if the organization will decide to invest in Deni.. Or maybe at Wembanyama Try to look at it in Objective eye. The Wizards can't wait eternity for Deni to grow. 3 years it's also a lot of time. Anyway in my opinion - if he won't upgrade his ball control and security, finishing abillities and 3pt shooting (together with shooting overall) - He's gonna struggle and won't reach his potential. But still will get his contract.

Obviously if he won't improve his credit will get smaller, as I said I think he'll improve, that's just my assumption, I can't really predict the future, what we know is that Tommy Sheppard likes him and have faith in his potential, so at least for the next season we know Deni will have another chance to show what he's got, if he'll have a disappointing season I assume the Wizards will cut him loose, and then Deni will have to decide where he's going, even then I assume he'll have enough offers from other teams, maybe ones with a playing style that is more suitable for him, but let's hope for now he'll just have a good season here.

You're right about what you said and I wasn't clear with what I wrote. I meant that Casspi had a game (something that makes him productive in offense), you could count on him to make the 3 when needed. Deni got the D, but even that slowly got reduced and weaker lately. The consistency I've talked about it the consistency to make the same plays by long time period and actually contribute the team. So Deni can contribute in defense we all know that, but he hasn't proved yet that he's capable of doing it also on O someway with this team at least. Casspi you could count on him to make the 3 because overall over time, especially in Sacramento and GSW, you could count on him and he has shoot pretty well in pretty good % by time. He was stable in that. Deni still hasn't found stabilization, and it's ok he's young and still can improve, but he's not that young as he was in his first day here. It's 3 years already.
Agreed about the weaknesses and strenghts.

[Eyalley-oop]

You're right about what you said and I wasn't clear with what I wrote. I meant that Casspi had a game (something that makes him productive in offense), you could count on him to make the 3 when needed. Deni got the D, but even that slowly got reduced and weaker lately. The consistency I've talked about it the consistency to make the same plays by long time period and actually contribute the team. So Deni can contribute in defense we all know that, but he hasn't proved yet that he's capable of doing it also on O someway with this team at least. Casspi you could count on him to make the 3 because overall over time, especially in Sacramento and GSW, you could count on him and he has shoot pretty well in pretty good % by time. He was stable in that. Deni still hasn't found stabilization, and it's ok he's young and still can improve, but he's not that young as he was in his first day here. It's 3 years already.
Agreed about the weaknesses and strenghts.

The word you're looking for is reliable, with Casspi you knew what you're getting and not getting, like Kispert for example, with Deni it's not the case yet for better or worse, I believe it won't stay this way but again, it's only my assumption.

It's true that 3 years have passed, but it's misleading, remember Deni came here when he was barely 19, a lot of players have their rookie season when they are 22-23, Kispert for example was 22 as a rookie, in an alternate universe Deni could have stayed in Europe and have his rookie season only now or next year, the fact that at 22 he already have 3 years of experience in the league is a plus, not a minus, at 22 he doesn't need to adjust to the different game style, the amount of games, the road trips, the media, etc... and the most important, as I've said a number of times, it means he's already in a point where he knows exactly what his weaknesses are and what specific issues he needs to solve in order to become a good player, if he'll be able to do it or not we'll have to wait and see but I don't agree his situation is that bad, I think it's actually rather good relative to other players his age.

[Eyalley-oop]

Read on Twitter

[Frichuela]

Read on Twitter

Well I sincerely hope so. As some of us wrote in the game thread, Deni has a tendency to be “overly generous” when approaching the rim. Instead of going for a lay up/floater he frequently looks for a pass, which often leads to either a turnover, a worse shot for a team mate or a broken play. That has to stop!

[pcbothwel]

I have learned my lesson on counting out underperforming young players in this league assuming two things.
1) They have at least an average BBIQ & work ethic
2) They have shown glimpses and were highly touted/drafted

Beal - Underwhelming in his first 4 years (19-22), before exploding in year 5 at age 23
Otto, Embiid, Lavine, Randle, Smart, DLO, Porzingis, Booker, Rozier, Ingram, Jaylen Brown, Sabonis, Ball, Markkanen, Sexton, Garland, Coby White, etc.

This doesn't mean Deni WILL make a huge leap, but the precedent is there.

[CntOutSmrtCrazy]

After two good games (kind of, TOs have been an issue), Deni's March splits don't really look bad compared to other months. His defense has fallen off though effort wise, but what is even the point given this season? You could see his frustration boiling over with his teammates lackadaisical approach to defense, but I'd still like him to compete.

Teams still avoid him on that end though, constantly trying to get screens and switches to get him off their best scores. Where he has been noticeable drop-off is when he is in man-to-man he hasn't been getting as many stops. Not to worried about it as he still usually makes it tough, but as Nate mentioned, needs to get back to getting guys out of their spots more often.

His biggest problem seems to be successful quarters, then he clams up and doesn't look to be a threat. I'm all for being a team player and moving the ball, but if you do it to the point that it is detrimental to team you have to tweak your strategy.

[arusinov]

Deni's last 5 games averages: 32.4 min, 14.0 / 9.8 / 5.6 on 63.2 ts%
Generally when Deni plays over 30 min he averages 14.4 / 8.9 / 3.9 on 62.3 ts%

Sure it doesn't mean that if Deni was playing 30 min every game he would have those averages and splits... Naturally he played more when he played better.

But he also played less minutes not really when he played worse... but actually when he started games worse. For example last game against Toronto Deni started with 1/ 6 FG, and 3 tov with 1 ast. If Kuzma was available after this start Deni would almost certainly end up with less than 20 minutes playing time and "horrible game".

He's not Corey which can shoot and cut in any situation... to succeed Deni needs some tolerance for inevitable mistakes and ball in his hand

[dckingsfan]

What is Deni's +/- in March? Just curious if we are thinking that this month is an indicator and how he is carrying his team.

[Kanyewest]

What is Deni's +/- in March? Just curious if we are thinking that this month is an indicator and how he is carrying his team.

-70 in March. If we ignore the last 3 games, - 50. Plus 33 in February

Also seems like everyone has a negative plus minus in March. Beal is minus 23, Kuzma was - 51.

[CntOutSmrtCrazy]

What is Deni's +/- in March? Just curious if we are thinking that this month is an indicator and how he is carrying his team.

-70 in March. If we ignore the last 3 games, - 50. Plus 33 in February

Also seems like everyone has a negative plus minus in March. Beal is minus 23, Kuzma was - 51.

Yeah he has like 3/4 horrific games in the +/- department in March, those two ATL games are ones that I recall off the top of my head and what started the pitchforks to come out.