Arenas Traded for Rashard Lewis

[AceDegenerate]

^ Agreed, Ruz. These guys sound like kids on a playground plotting against a "snitch" who told the teacher on them. I'm sorry, but since when is attempting to cover up multiple felonies ever a good idea? Gilbert did something that was against the law. Apparently that's okay but failing to help him cover it up is the real crime? Are you actually listening to yourselves?

Multiple felonies, you clown. You ignore the fact that the "law" that Gil broke was struck down recently, and it would not have even been illegal in most states. You are beyond pathetic with your Ernie love/Gil Hate.

We all come from different places, despite some of you acting like the only type of Wizards fans allowed here are Upper-Class White Folks. Some of us identify with young athletes because we see more of ourselves in them and relate to them better. Some of us (YOU) identify with overweight former athletes who sit on their ass all day and get fat passing off their mistakes on others, because you see more of yourself in them.

[Ruzious]

This bothers the hell out of me and is clearly the reason all trust was lost between Gilbert and this organization.

But weren't there too many witnesses to cover it up? If it got out, and the Wiz hadn't reported it, wouldn't there have been serious repercussions against the Wiz organization, their GM, and their owner?

This I very much doubt. If it had been any other superstar player, in any other city; it would have been covered up no question about it.

You say that with certainty, but why? Doesn't the fact that it got out to Ernie Grunfeld that quickly make it pretty much a certainty that it would have gotten out to everyone eventually? Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think Ernie Grunfeld hangs out in the locker room.

[Wizards2Lottery]

This I very much doubt. If it had been any other superstar player, in any other city; it would have been covered up no question about it.

You say that with certainty, but why? Doesn't the fact that it got out to Ernie Grunfeld that quickly make it pretty much a certainty that it would have gotten out to everyone eventually? Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think Ernie Grunfeld hangs out in the locker room.

I think Ernie could have supported Gilbert after the incident. Acknowledge the suspension but acknowledge Gilbert as well. Consider it a mistake, acknowledge the suspension but still say words of encouragement towards Gil.

Everything that happened last year, this franchise was convinced they would be able to void his contract. They wouldn't have removed every connection to Gilbert if they didn't believe so.

My main problem is with that. The fact that it got out is unfortunate, but things could have been handled better afterwards.

[AceDegenerate]

Ernie Grunfeld is an internal employee. Generally when things happen within an organization information travels fast INTERNALLY. It is the leadership of said organization who should be held accountable for anything that leaks externally. It was in the hands of the Wizards leadership what to do with the information they had, and we all know how they handled it.

[The Consiglieri]

I think the key thing in the trade that most of us didn't realize until today (at least I didn't) is that only 10 mil of Lewis' 22.7 mil may be guaranteed for 2012/2013 - saving the Wiz up to 12 mil that season compared to what they would have had to pay Gil - not to mention the 22 or so mil in 2013/2014 that Gil is due. That makes this a smart move by the Wiz. It would have been better for the Wiz to trade for Carter, but as some of us said for a long time - Orlando would had to have been nuts to do that.

Most importantly, everyone can finally move forward. Good luck to Arenas. It'll be interesting to see how he fits there - now that he does have a great big man to play with.

As I've been able to let this awful trade brew in my brain the past 24 or so hours, that's what I've come up with as well. I get the sense EG probably went around, sniffing for deals, and this is the only team that was interested and this is the best he could get, so in the end, he moved what was a bad situation and contract, for another bad contract that was slightly worse. Essentially Orlando let us get rid of the gun storyline, and Gil's hurt feelings and issues, and his 4 year contract, and gave us basically a 2.5 year bad contract in exchange (I'm only saying that because I imagine that we'll probably have him on the books remaining years. So the net gain is basically 1 to 1.5 fewer years w/a horrible deal and nothing else. A horrible trade in my view, but a trade that was apparently the best we could do.

[507Mack]

I see EG as the middle man in all this. I don't think he ever wanted to call the cops, because no GM ever wants to de-value his own players. Even he isn't that dumb. I think the whole hyper-sensitivity around the whole gun issue came from the Pollin family. They have a history of making rash and unwise business decisions and PR blunders when the character and integrity of their team comes into question, such as trading Chris Webber and firing MJ. Therefore, I give EG a pass on not taking responsibility, as I think he was just doing what he was told.

I believe Gil when he says that people still don't know what really happened. I serisously doubt that anyone was ever in any real danger in whatever stupid pranks they were pulling in that locker room.

[Ruzious]

Ernie Grunfeld is an internal employee. Generally when things happen within an organization information travels fast INTERNALLY. It is the leadership of said organization who should be held accountable for anything that leaks externally. It was in the hands of the Wizards leadership what to do with the information they had, and we all know how they handled it.

Do you seriously believe that in this day and age that wouldn't have gotten out - no matter what Grunfeld did? Do we even know if it had already gotten out before anyone from the Wizards contacted the police?

[AceDegenerate]

Ernie Grunfeld is an internal employee. Generally when things happen within an organization information travels fast INTERNALLY. It is the leadership of said organization who should be held accountable for anything that leaks externally. It was in the hands of the Wizards leadership what to do with the information they had, and we all know how they handled it.

Do you seriously believe that in this day and age that wouldn't have gotten out - no matter what Grunfeld did? Do we even know if it had already gotten out before anyone from the Wizards contacted the police?

I see plenty of evidence (in this day and age) of multi-million dollar corporations covering up all sorts of crimes. I'm sure Mr. Leonsis knows ALL about this. I don't know that anyone has reported exactly how it all got out, but as far as I'm concerned Mr. Grunfeld may as well have called Peter Vecsey himself.

[Ruzious]

This I very much doubt. If it had been any other superstar player, in any other city; it would have been covered up no question about it.

You say that with certainty, but why? Doesn't the fact that it got out to Ernie Grunfeld that quickly make it pretty much a certainty that it would have gotten out to everyone eventually? Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think Ernie Grunfeld hangs out in the locker room.

I think Ernie could have supported Gilbert after the incident. Acknowledge the suspension but acknowledge Gilbert as well. Consider it a mistake, acknowledge the suspension but still say words of encouragement towards Gil.

Everything that happened last year, this franchise was convinced they would be able to void his contract. They wouldn't have removed every connection to Gilbert if they didn't believe so.

My main problem is with that. The fact that it got out is unfortunate, but things could have been handled better afterwards.

I understand that point of view and agree with it to an extent. But part of the problem was the feeling that the situation had to be taken seriously. The view around the country was that Gil wasn't taking the situation seriously enough. That put Grunfeld in a no-win situation.

[Ruzious]

Ernie Grunfeld is an internal employee. Generally when things happen within an organization information travels fast INTERNALLY. It is the leadership of said organization who should be held accountable for anything that leaks externally. It was in the hands of the Wizards leadership what to do with the information they had, and we all know how they handled it.

Do you seriously believe that in this day and age that wouldn't have gotten out - no matter what Grunfeld did? Do we even know if it had already gotten out before anyone from the Wizards contacted the police?

I see plenty of evidence (in this day and age) of multi-million dollar corporations covering up all sorts of crimes. I'm sure Mr. Leonsis knows ALL about this. I don't know that anyone has reported exactly how it all got out, but as far as I'm concerned Mr. Grunfeld may as well have called Peter Vecsey himself.

If you see that evidence, then obviously the coverups didn't work. I think we see over and over and over again with public figures that the coverup is often considered worse than the crime - and often the cover is the crime.

[keynote]

I think we can at least acknowledge that, when our biggest beef with our favorite basketball team is that our front office didn't intentionally cover up a crime committed by our star player, our team is in ruin.

At this point, I'd be fine w/ EG being fired, if only because his tenure has been one of mediocrity at best. But I think it's silly to parse every word of every press release and press conference. If EG is to be fired, it'll be because of his failure to put together a competitive team, not because of his ability or inability to spin a terrible PR situation. I don't think Mr. Wolf could've turned Gilbert's last 2-3 years into a positive.

[AceDegenerate]

Actually it's quite the contrary in today's climate. I've seen a number of reports of cover-ups across all types of corporations/organizations and I've also seen that even when the cover-up is brought to light - nobody is prosecuted for the original wrong-doing because it is so far in the past that it is no longer of primary concern to the public.

It's a moot point and I'm sure we'll agree to disagree as usual but that's how I see it.

[nate33]

That said, I'd be lying if I said I wasn't depressed. Being at the game last night -- and the way it ended -- adds to it no doubt. But I'm burning mad at Ernie for his comments at the end of the press release. Emailed Ted about it in as calm and respectful fashion as possible.

What did EG say?

From the F EG thread:

Ernie with a parting shot to Gilbert in the press release:

“When we re-signed Gilbert prior to the 2008-09 season, we envisioned a level of team success that we unfortunately were not able to achieve due to injuries and other factors beyond our control,” said Grunfeld. “We appreciate the contributions that he made to this franchise and this city and wish him the best of luck.”

No class. No responsibility for past failures.

F U C K YOU ERNIE!!!!

I didn't take that as a shot at Gil. Basically he was saying:

"When we re-signed Arenas, we envisioned that we'd be a perennial playoff team with title aspirations. Unfortunately, due to injuries and other factors we are no longer in that place. We are now a rebuilding team and it doesn't make sense to keep a 29-year-old vet around when we need to tank and acquire talent and he wants to play on a contender."

[nate33]

I can't believe we've gotten to the point where we are bashing EG because he failed to cover up a felony.

[nate33]

And let's not forget Arenas' role in this. Covering things up and smoothing them over is a two-way street. At first, the organization was quiet on the incident, preferring to let legal authorities have their say before weighing in. Then Arenas had to do the classless "finger gun incident" on national TV. At that point, EG had no way to salvage the situation. Arenas left EG and Stern no other choice but to come down hard on him.

You people need to come to grips with the fact that Arenas played an active role in all of this. He isn't a victim here.

[AceDegenerate]

You can keep sticking up for the management and I'll keep sticking up for the players.

For some reason you think it makes you more right than me though.

I can't believe fans who are so ungrateful that they can't even appreciate the one player who decided to sign with this team in the last 30 years, of his own volition - think that they are somehow entitled to be great?

As if championships should just happen for this city based on the fact that it has sucked for so long? Magical things like Dwight Howard signing here in 2012 are just going to happen to the Wizards.

Teams that take chances on players, time and time again in this league win championships. Teams that give up on players, time and time again in this league are the doormats and are sitting in Secaucus come May.

Karma goes a long way, and nobody who ever plays here leaves on a good note; yet somehow it's always those players at fault and somehow it's going to magically change with the next player.

I was here for the entirety of Arenas' tenure, and I'll be here when it all comes back around for John Wall too, it really won't be long before everyone turns on him.

[TGW]

I can't believe we've gotten to the point where we are bashing EG because he failed to cover up a felony.

I agree. This is beyond ridiculous. And that's from an "EG basher."

BTW Ace -- Gilbert didn't choose to play for the Wizards. His two-face coin did.

[Induveca]

Just to help go back on topic, Arenas obviously isn't a victim.........we the FANS are the victim.

Again, it goes back to Grunfeld/Pollins not squashing the problem right away. Call the two guys into your office, shut them the hell up, explain you could call the cops etc but end of the day this goes away now. It never happened.

Do it again, you have no choice......police need to be involved. "I can save your ass this time.....next time definitely not" This type of stuff happens all the time at companies with talented employees.

You don't do it to help the employee, you do it to help your own job and salvage what you can out of the situation. It's doubly idiotic NOT to do this when the employee has value beyond what he brings to the office. In the NBA you can actually TRADE these guys for close to equivalent talent!

And before we get the holier than thou stuff, I'm not a gun advocate, but considering that in the majority of NBA cities there wouldn't have even been a crime committed, I think it was fine to squash the problem to save some value for the franchise. It's a business, not a place of worship.

That law was not intended to throw multi-millionaires with no threat to the public into jail. It was created to curb gun violence in a murder/drug/gun infested city during a completely different era. Yes, I am justifying this from an outside perspective as a businessman attempting to save value for my company and my clients/customers.

They wanted to void the contract. That's all. It backfired, now we had no choice but to trade our most valuable asset for nothing. Blame the Pollins, I agree with that......but Grunfeld was on board too. He needs to go.

At some point he was involved in a conversation that went something like "If we just play this right we may be able to void this contract".

[AceDegenerate]

Also, I'm only mentioning this because I don't think anyone has said anything about it - and we like to overanalyze here.

Arenas wore Jordans for nearly every game this season, and I think there was some significance to that in that I think in his eyes he saw himself treated the same way Jordan was treated by the organization. It's things like this that we as fans can easily forget and pass off as business as usual, but the fraternity of players in this league don't forget.

I think LeBron is almost universally respected around the league by his peers, while he is almost universally hated around the league by fans. I think the players respect the fact that he did what was in his own best interest rather than place the organization first; when time and time again the organizations are the ones who turn their backs on players.

[verbal8]

I like the trade for Arenas. One interesting thing about Arenas' contract is that his ETO coincides with Dwight Howard's player option. Usually I could never see an NBA star walking away from $44 million. However Arenas is definitely not typical.

I hate the trade for the Wizards. If they were going to trade him for the worst contract in the NBA, why not try harder to void his contract?

Maybe there are follow-up moves that makes this deal seem to fit in a bigger picture. I see the financial motivation for the deal. It must mean the WIzards are fairly certain of a lockout. Given that assumption, a guy with a huge but 1/2 guaranteed deal could be a big trade chip. However I think it takes a more creative GM than EG to utilize it effectively.

However I am really concerned that EG really thinks Shart the player has some value. He is basically Yi with 3 point range.

The one basketball positive is it gives them a compliment to putting Serpahin or Booker at one of the forward spots. However the talent hit from Arenas to Shart, does not justify this.