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GT #53: Raptors (28-24) @ Wizards (25-27) 7 PM CSN

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Re: GT #53: Raptors (28-24) @ Wizards (25-27) 7 PM CSN 

Post#241 » by hands11 » Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:04 am

dckingsfan wrote:
hands11 wrote:
popper wrote:We still have an opportunity to tank and keep our first round pick. Trade anyone and everyone except perhaps Wall.... fire the coach and GM. We've been remarkably healthy this year and we're not even a .500 team in the sucky East. Blow this abomination up before we're humiliated again.


And just who is going to do the selling in that model ?

It to late for that.

Best they can do it let EG make some small trade. Ted needs to just override anything other then that.
Fire Randy and put Newman in charge. Something they should have already done.

Then let EG go at the end of the year when his contract expires.

That's more realistic.


EG shouldn't be able to survive another coaching change... if they make a change, make a 2 fer


Just trying to be realistic. I know it feels good to say what you are saying but....

They are shooting for the playoffs. I doubt they fire the EG and the HC. It would be to disruptive.
They aren't selling off everything and tanking. Wouldn't fit that plan and if they did, you are talking about EG doing that in the next 2 days. Not happening. They will add someone.

But what would be reasonable to expect they could do is what I wrote. If you think of something else that is with in reasonable expectations at this stage, then by all means, let me know.

Cuz...

There is what feels good to write.
There is what we would have wanted them to do
There is what we think is realistic that we want them to do now, soon and in the future.
And there is what is realistic that we can project they would do now, soon and in the future.

I was chiming in regarding what I think they would do soon.

I just don't see them going down 4, 5, certainly not 6 games, and Randy surviving that.

And like it or not, they aren't firing EG before the trade deadline. Firing him after doesn't really matter that much so you may as well keep him and keep things looking stable as you go into the playoffs. You can fire him after the season is over.
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Re: GT #53: Raptors (28-24) @ Wizards (25-27) 7 PM CSN 

Post#242 » by jeffsays » Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:13 am

I'd like to blame randy for tonight, but I can't. When you have two bigs in the vicinity of a shooter and neither of them puts up their hands to contest the shot, you're going to have a bad time. I've seen this team play great defense because they decide to put in the effort. Tonight was very lackadaisical. And Wtf was up with ariza not shooting the ball? It was pitiful

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Re: GT #53: Raptors (28-24) @ Wizards (25-27) 7 PM CSN 

Post#243 » by CntOutSmrtCrazy » Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:13 am

I be interested in trading for Amir Johnson just so we never have to play against him again. The dude destroys us.
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Re: GT #53: Raptors (28-24) @ Wizards (25-27) 7 PM CSN 

Post#244 » by dlts20 » Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:15 am

dckingsfan wrote:
CntOutSmrtCrazy wrote:At this point, you just throw your hands up. Right as this team looked like they were about to turn the corner, they fell smack on there face. You look at the past loses (before tonight's game) and you have a double OT lose against SA, a 2 point loss to CLEV, a 3 point loss against MEM, and that 1 point robbery in HOU. Go back even further to the next three loses and you have a 3 point loss to LAC, at 3 point loss to, and a 2 point loss to BOS.
We've lost 6 of the last 7 be less than 3 points and another by 7 in double OT. Than you through in all of those horrible home loses against crappy road teams.

Losing a ton of close games, losing to bad road teams at home, and players going from crap to great games one game to the next is on Wittman. You guys can say what you want about EG, Wittman, Ted. They all suck, I'll give you that, but I know this team is better than our record, we could easily be on pace for 50 wins even with a few of those bad loses still tagged onto us. Not trying to be optimistic here, but I don't think the roster is anywhere near the biggest problem with this team, the head honchos are.


You lost me at 50 win team... this team doesn't know how to close YET - Wall/Beal. This is a young maybe .500 team. Even though they have the vets - Wall/Beal are the drivers - and they just aren't there yet.

but thats the question. Is Witt the reason they dont know how to close? His horrible system and inept coaching. You can clearly see that even the Raps are a better coached team. I cant stand this system. It gives us no advantage on O at any time. None
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Re: GT #53: Raptors (28-24) @ Wizards (25-27) 7 PM CSN 

Post#245 » by gtn130 » Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:30 am

popper wrote:We still have an opportunity to tank and keep our first round pick. Trade anyone and everyone except perhaps Wall.... fire the coach and GM. We've been remarkably healthy this year and we're not even a .500 team in the sucky East. Blow this abomination up before we're humiliated again.


I 100% agree with doing this, whether it's realistic or not, but I'd argue that we haven't been all that healthy considering we lost Okafor from the beginning and Otto Porter lost his offseason.

My larger point:

We lost Okafor early on
Porter, who was supposed to be the most NBA-ready player in the draft is looking like a bust
Eric Maynor has been a joke
The Vesely, Singleton, Booker, Seraphin bunch hasn't made very much collective progress.

Despite these things, Ted and EG are still pushing their chips forward in win-now mode because we have a realistic opportunity to have a top-five seed in the EC while being a really bad team that shouldn't win more than 33 games in a normal season. Our end goal is to get swept in the playoffs in either the 1st or 2nd round and then claim this season was a success while throwing away our 1st round pick and eviscerating every last bit of draft equity.

This season is a scam.
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Re: GT #53: Raptors (28-24) @ Wizards (25-27) 7 PM CSN 

Post#246 » by MoonwalkJenkins » Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:36 am

gtn130 wrote:
popper wrote:We still have an opportunity to tank and keep our first round pick. Trade anyone and everyone except perhaps Wall.... fire the coach and GM. We've been remarkably healthy this year and we're not even a .500 team in the sucky East. Blow this abomination up before we're humiliated again.


I 100% agree with doing this, whether it's realistic or not, but I'd argue that we haven't been all that healthy considering we lost Okafor from the beginning and Otto Porter lost his offseason.

My larger point:

We lost Okafor early on
Porter, who was supposed to be the most NBA-ready player in the draft is looking like a bust
Eric Maynor has been a joke
The Vesely, Singleton, Booker, Seraphin bunch hasn't made very much collective progress.

Despite these things, Ted and EG are still pushing their chips forward in win-now mode because we have a realistic opportunity to have a top-five seed in the EC while being a really bad team that shouldn't win more than 33 games in a normal season. Our end goal is to get swept in the playoffs in either the 1st or 2nd round and then claim this season was a success while throwing away our 1st round pick and eviscerating every last bit of draft equity.

This season is a scam.



There's no reason to go back into the lottery. The entire league knows we have a very solid core in Wall and Beal, and we can clear the decks and have a little cash to play with this summer. The 7th pick in the draft (and the quality of player that comes with) probably isn't going to change anything with this roster that a smart gm can't do without it.
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Re: GT #53: Raptors (28-24) @ Wizards (25-27) 7 PM CSN 

Post#247 » by gtn130 » Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:36 am

dlts20 wrote:but thats the question. Is Witt the reason they dont know how to close? His horrible system and inept coaching. You can clearly see that even the Raps are a better coached team. I cant stand this system. It gives us no advantage on O at any time. None


We would would win more games with a better coach, there's no question there, but does it really matter? This team isn't very good on paper or otherwise -- Wittman just makes them even worse.
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Re: GT #53: Raptors (28-24) @ Wizards (25-27) 7 PM CSN 

Post#248 » by jivelikenice » Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:40 am

Randy is awful. Beal running in circles around Nene waiting for a handoff is not an offense.

Nene is terrible. Ppl point to the New Orleans deal but in reality the Nene deal is the one that's holding us back. He is TERRIBLE from the free throw line and a TERRIBLE rebounder yet Randy refuses to ever hold him accountable. He has a free pass to do whatever he wants out there. The staff is afraid of him.

Gortat is not as good defensively as Okafor but why does he get picked on by this staff? He was the only player capable of rebounding tonight but he's on the bench while Nene's inefficient a$$ gets featured...

They really need to re-evaluate how they're using Beal. He is doing too much on the floor. I don't understand why they're trying to force the issues with him as a ball handler. He can't handle the rock and he becomes a ball stopper all to often. Right now he needs to focus on running the floor and setting up for 3. He really has done nothing to deserve a starting role.

Webster stinks as a bench player. He can't create offense so as a bench scorer he doesn't fit the bill.
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Re: GT #53: Raptors (28-24) @ Wizards (25-27) 7 PM CSN 

Post#249 » by gtn130 » Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:43 am

MoonwalkJenkins wrote:There's no reason to go back into the lottery. The entire league knows we have a very solid core in Wall and Beal, and we can clear the decks and have a little cash to play with this summer. The 7th pick in the draft (and the quality of player that comes with) probably isn't going to change anything with this roster that a smart gm can't do without it.


Yeah, I don't agree.

We have a great young player in Wall, I agree there -- I think Beal has some work to do, but the potential is there.

As for cash to play with...I guess if we don't resign Ariza and Gortat, which leaves us doing what? Highly unlikely that we can substantially upgrade our roster through FA this year.

7th overall pick is worth so, so much -- especially this year. We could realistically draft an all-star caliber player in the 7th slot, even with EG manning the ship.

And we don't have a smart GM, so I don't understand your point there.
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Re: GT #53: Raptors (28-24) @ Wizards (25-27) 7 PM CSN 

Post#250 » by jivelikenice » Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:48 am

Has Gortat played at all with Seraphin? At this point I'd try it. Gortat/Booker doesn't work. Nene is playing like crap and needs to play less minutes. I'd really like to see Gortat/Seraphin. I think you'll get a bit better spacing and less plodding on the floor.
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Re: GT #53: Raptors (28-24) @ Wizards (25-27) 7 PM CSN 

Post#251 » by jivelikenice » Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:50 am

hands11 wrote:Gortat said Nene was sick


Which explains why he played soo many minutes and got 16 fg attempts :roll:
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Re: GT #53: Raptors (28-24) @ Wizards (25-27) 7 PM CSN 

Post#252 » by truwizfan4evr » Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:50 am

Is Nene allergic to rebounding? He had only 5 rebounds....
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Re: GT #53: Raptors (28-24) @ Wizards (25-27) 7 PM CSN 

Post#253 » by jivelikenice » Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:51 am

nuposse04 wrote:
JWallConnect wrote:How did Wall only score 3 points since half


Toronto's D almost looked memphis good against him in the 2nd half. Wall should be knocked for not penetrating more but he was getting NO love from the refs. Didn't help he expends all his energy since we don't have any other decent ball handlers.


He actually drove a lot more today but the refs were giving him nothing and Toronto really clamped down....
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Re: GT #53: Raptors (28-24) @ Wizards (25-27) 7 PM CSN 

Post#254 » by dlts20 » Wed Feb 19, 2014 5:06 am

didnt get to see it but it sounded like he tried to drive more. Hopefully he doesnt get discouraged but I still say that all drives arent the same. I just dont think anyone is capable of being a great driver in this system. Its almost like it helps the D to setup and stop drives but as long as we can shoot more jumpers its great........smh
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Re: GT #53: Raptors (28-24) @ Wizards (25-27) 7 PM CSN 

Post#255 » by jivelikenice » Wed Feb 19, 2014 5:29 am

truwizfan4evr wrote:Is Nene allergic to rebounding? He had only 5 rebounds....


At that size to rebound so poorly has to be about effort. He has to be my least favorite Wizard
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Re: GT #53: Raptors (28-24) @ Wizards (25-27) 7 PM CSN 

Post#256 » by GhostsOfGil » Wed Feb 19, 2014 5:47 am

jivelikenice wrote:
truwizfan4evr wrote:Is Nene allergic to rebounding? He had only 5 rebounds....


At that size to rebound so poorly has to be about effort. He has to be my least favorite Wizard


Can't say I agree with any of your Nene posts. IMO Nene is the opposite of Gortat. Nene's a far more impactful player even if he doesnt fill the stat sheet. Gortat on the other hand will give you better numbers but is a ball stopper in the post, is consistently slow to rotate and is soft as butter on both ends of the floor.

My observation is that this team relies too heavily on Nene and John to create offense since they have no one else who can create for themselves. Maybe part of it is the scheme, but since Beal's funk, Wall and Nene seem to be pressing. Then there's the interior defense which is such an obvious problem, it's not even worth talking about.
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Re: GT #53: Raptors (28-24) @ Wizards (25-27) 7 PM CSN 

Post#257 » by crackhed » Wed Feb 19, 2014 5:58 am

^ agree with you on the nene / gortat comparison. despite his physique, can't help but get the feeling that gortat fancies himself as a mostly finesse player
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Re: GT #53: Raptors (28-24) @ Wizards (25-27) 7 PM CSN 

Post#258 » by jivelikenice » Wed Feb 19, 2014 6:05 am

We'll disagree then because Néne has been bad. He's been near Shaq bad at the FT line and is horrible on the boards. He's not good enough offensively to compensate for how poor he is in those areas. Tonight he was scared to go against the Raptor bigs and started settling for Js. I don't love Gortat but he's much better rolling to the basket and he's much better on the boards. He's definitely soft at times but we underutilize him when he has favorable matchups. And I'd hardly call him a ball stopper. Néne on the other hand is a good passer, but holds the ball for a good 5-10 seconds pump faking in place. His fg% is way down from his Denver days....
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Re: GT #53: Raptors (28-24) @ Wizards (25-27) 7 PM CSN 

Post#259 » by crackhed » Wed Feb 19, 2014 6:10 am

both guys have plenty room 4 improvement imo, though in diff areas
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Re: GT #53: Raptors (28-24) @ Wizards (25-27) 7 PM CSN 

Post#260 » by jivelikenice » Wed Feb 19, 2014 6:19 am

Agree there. Gortat could do more if they used him in more pick & roll AND if he finished stronger. Nene though is also soft. I mean how else do you avg less than six boards a game in 30 minutes at 6'11 270? His minutes are up but his rebounding numbers are way down. He's a vet playing out his deal.

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