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Chocolate City Jordanaire · Post #261 » by **Chocolate City Jordanaire** » Tue Apr 19, 2011 2:59 pm

DCZ and nate, Flip at one point last season showed more loyalty to KG than his own players and in fact reprimanded his own players through the media in a game they lost to Boston after some jaw-jacking with KG.

I think KG is a dirty player. I think he is a bully on small guys, young guys, Euros that he thinks he can punk. I think the guy has obviously been a great player, but he's not a guy I consider nice or worth emulating in all aspects.

Flip's love for KG is irritating to me.

Kanyewest · Post #262 » by **Kanyewest** » Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:02 pm

Induveca wrote:The quotes Saunders keeps floating about Wall being similar to Garnett irk me a bit. I swear it seems like this bum just uses KG's name to remind people he once coached a *decent* team led by one of the most talented power forwards during his prime to ever play the game.

He made it out of the first round once, never won a damn thing.........and KG has openly said he was a fool to stay in Minnesota so long and waste his prime.

I, for one, am sick of the guy.

I wouldn't blame Flip though for KG not getting out of the first round as they often played championship caliber teams in the Spurs and Lakers. If LeBron was in the West, it it is entirely possible that he would have not made it out of the first round either considering when the Cavs made it to the finals, they were swept by the Spurs.

I would blame McHale for not putting around enough talent around him consistently. When KG had Sam Cassell as his 2nd best player, the T-Wolves made it to the conference finals and may have made it to the finals had Cassell not gotten injured against the Lakers in the Western Conference Finals. McHale also didn't retain Chauncey Billups in free agency either.

pancakes3 · Post #263 » by **pancakes3** » Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:10 pm

back to jimmy wall. watching all these Rose highlights gives me mixed feelings. i don't think wall has it in him to be like derrick rose, which is a shame. the muscle mass just isn't there. wall is a skinny little thing. he doesn't have that butt that wade/rose has, much less the super stocky bottoms that williams and paul have. i think that will really hinder his dribble penetration ability, and his "and+1" ability. plus it looks like wall is a "one-footed-leaper" instead of a "two-footed-leaper" which means he has to gather steam before taking off...

OR maybe he can. who knows.

Post #264 » by **Ruzious** » Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:13 pm

Chocolate City Jordanaire wrote:DCZ and nate, Flip at one point last season showed more loyalty to KG than his own players and in fact reprimanded his own players through the media in a game they lost to Boston after some jaw-jacking with KG.

I think KG is a dirty player. I think he is a bully on small guys, young guys, Euros that he thinks he can punk. I think the guy has obviously been a great player, but he's not a guy I consider nice or worth emulating in all aspects.

Flip's love for KG is irritating to me.

While I'm sure KG has said some rotten things, on the whole - I would LOVE it if Wiz players emulated the way he plays the game. It's a huge compliment to compare anyone to him and nothing but a positive when Flip compares Jimmy Wall to him. I actually root for KG to do well because he plays so hard with passion to win. I don't root for Jared Jeffries and other nice guys who play soft and don't show any fight in them.

Post #265 » by **Ruzious** » Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:16 pm

pancakes3 wrote:back to jimmy wall. watching all these Rose highlights gives me mixed feelings. i don't think wall has it in him to be like derrick rose, which is a shame. the muscle mass just isn't there. wall is a skinny little thing. he doesn't have that butt that wade/rose has, much less the super stocky bottoms that williams and paul have. i think that will really hinder his dribble penetration ability, and his "and+1" ability. plus it looks like wall is a "one-footed-leaper" instead of a "two-footed-leaper" which means he has to gather steam before taking off...

OR maybe he can. who knows.

I think he can. Rose wasn't anywhere close to... Rose until this season. Wall has roughly the same abilities and attitude.

kblack · Post #266 » by **kblack** » Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:17 pm

Chocolate City Jordanaire wrote:DCZ and nate, Flip at one point last season showed more loyalty to KG than his own players and in fact reprimanded his own players through the media in a game they lost to Boston after some jaw-jacking with KG.

I think KG is a dirty player. I think he is a bully on small guys, young guys, Euros that he thinks he can punk. I think the guy has obviously been a great player, but he's not a guy I consider nice or worth emulating in all aspects.

Flip's love for KG is irritating to me.

Here's the thing, KG has kinda morphed into a bully as his athleticism and skills start to decline a bit. The reason that's the case and the reason why Flip constantly talks about him is because he is a very rare competitor in this league. Only a few players have that intrinsic desire that he displays. When he was with Minnesota, his desire to win and even bigger desire not to lose was unmatched. When you're around that type of player, there's nothing like it. His admiration is definitely warranted.

Now, as it relates to Wall, Flip sees that same type of desire. It's probably not more than 10-20 players in the league who have it. I agree with Flip and think that it's not a small thing that we have this young guy on OUR team. He's an absolute winner. There are way too many ultra talented players that don't have it. We've been around them for the last several years. Stats, recognition and so forth are more important than winning and destroying your opponent in every aspect of the game.

pancakes3 · Post #267 » by **pancakes3** » Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:29 pm

Ruzious wrote:
pancakes3 wrote:back to jimmy wall. watching all these Rose highlights gives me mixed feelings. i don't think wall has it in him to be like derrick rose, which is a shame. the muscle mass just isn't there. wall is a skinny little thing. he doesn't have that butt that wade/rose has, much less the super stocky bottoms that williams and paul have. i think that will really hinder his dribble penetration ability, and his "and+1" ability. plus it looks like wall is a "one-footed-leaper" instead of a "two-footed-leaper" which means he has to gather steam before taking off...

OR maybe he can. who knows.

I think he can. Rose wasn't anywhere close to... Rose until this season. Wall has roughly the same abilities and attitude.

rose as a rookie dueling with Rondo in the playoffs, forcing the C's to go 7 games was pretty jaw-dropping. i'm not sure wall right now would have been able to do the same.

FAH1223 · Post #268 » by **FAH1223** » Tue Apr 19, 2011 6:40 pm

Wall just has to work on being a better finisher around the basket, adding more upper body strength and of course his mid range jumper.

Other than that, his defense should improve with time...he will be a super star cause he has the mentality to do it

Post #269 » by **Ruzious** » Tue Apr 19, 2011 6:44 pm

kblack wrote:
Chocolate City Jordanaire wrote:DCZ and nate, Flip at one point last season showed more loyalty to KG than his own players and in fact reprimanded his own players through the media in a game they lost to Boston after some jaw-jacking with KG.

I think KG is a dirty player. I think he is a bully on small guys, young guys, Euros that he thinks he can punk. I think the guy has obviously been a great player, but he's not a guy I consider nice or worth emulating in all aspects.

Flip's love for KG is irritating to me.

Here's the thing, KG has kinda morphed into a bully as his athleticism and skills start to decline a bit. The reason that's the case and the reason why Flip constantly talks about him is because he is a very rare competitor in this league. Only a few players have that intrinsic desire that he displays. When he was with Minnesota, his desire to win and even bigger desire not to lose was unmatched. When you're around that type of player, there's nothing like it. His admiration is definitely warranted.

Now, as it relates to Wall, Flip sees that same type of desire. It's probably not more than 10-20 players in the league who have it. I agree with Flip and think that it's not a small thing that we have this young guy on OUR team. He's an absolute winner. There are way too many ultra talented players that don't have it. We've been around them for the last several years. Stats, recognition and so forth are more important than winning and destroying your opponent in every aspect of the game.

Very well said.

Post #270 » by **Ruzious** » Tue Apr 19, 2011 6:58 pm

pancakes3 wrote:
Ruzious wrote:
pancakes3 wrote:back to jimmy wall. watching all these Rose highlights gives me mixed feelings. i don't think wall has it in him to be like derrick rose, which is a shame. the muscle mass just isn't there. wall is a skinny little thing. he doesn't have that butt that wade/rose has, much less the super stocky bottoms that williams and paul have. i think that will really hinder his dribble penetration ability, and his "and+1" ability. plus it looks like wall is a "one-footed-leaper" instead of a "two-footed-leaper" which means he has to gather steam before taking off...

OR maybe he can. who knows.

I think he can. Rose wasn't anywhere close to... Rose until this season. Wall has roughly the same abilities and attitude.

rose as a rookie dueling with Rondo in the playoffs, forcing the C's to go 7 games was pretty jaw-dropping. i'm not sure wall right now would have been able to do the same.

Rose played well, but he was considerably out-played overall by Rondo. They both scored well at nearly 20 PPG, but Rose had a 45/35 A/TO ratio while Rondo had a sick 80/15. Granted, Rondo had the better teammates.

ST21 · Post #271 » by **ST21** » Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:36 am

you're right. rondo vastly outplayed rose in that series statistically.

heres proof.

http://img853.imageshack.us/img853/5035/32098298.jpg

that being said i believe wall is already a much better pg than rondo. wall putting up better numbers without 3 hall of famers and all that automatic playoff experience. give me wall over rondo any day.

rose is the measuring stick for pg's. along with d-will and cp3. it's a toss up for who is the best between those pg's

Dat2U · Post #272 » by **Dat2U** » Wed Apr 20, 2011 6:16 pm

Wall is much different than Rose IMO. Wall isn't going to be the next Rose. Rose is a lead guard, not necessarily a PG. Much like a prime Gilbert Arenas, Rose is first & foremost a scorer. Rose is more compact than Wall. More shifty. More herky jerky. Rose can contort his body in certain ways that few people can. His ballhandling is tighter than Wall's as well.

Wall has better court vision. Wall is a true PG. More unselfish. Probably has better straight end speed. No one is faster from one end of the court to the other than Wall. Wall is longer, takes longer strides. Wall projects to be a better defender. Wall will be like Rondo on steroids. He won't ever be quite the scorer or shot creator Rose is but will average double digits assists and 20 pts per game in his prime. Wall looks like a 20/10/5 player at minimum who will lead the league in steals and play solid defense. Wall could lead the league in FT attempts as well. You surround the right pieces around Wall and he may one day be an MVP candidate too.

dobrojim · Post #273 » by **dobrojim** » Wed Apr 20, 2011 7:41 pm

I'm stunned by how little faith Rondo appears to have in his
jumper. Last night he was turning down shots that most
rec league players would knock down on a pretty consistent
basis. That said he still managed to score 30 and lead his team
to a W. But seriously, I could not believe the shots he was
turning down.

Hopefully Wall will become something akin to Gary Payton
or a cross between Payton and Nate Archibald. Payton was
great defensively so maybe given how Wall did defensively
as a rookie, that is wishful thinking.

Rose is quite possibly the best player in the league right now.

DCZards · Post #274 » by **DCZards** » Wed Apr 20, 2011 8:18 pm

Dat2U wrote:Wall has better court vision. Wall is a true PG. More unselfish. Probably has better straight end speed. No one is faster from one end of the court to the other than Wall. Wall is longer, takes longer strides. Wall projects to be a better defender. Wall will be like Rondo on steroids. He won't ever be quite the scorer or shot creator Rose is but will average double digits assists and 20 pts per game in his prime. Wall looks like a 20/10/5 player at minimum who will lead the league in steals and play solid defense. Wall could lead the league in FT attempts as well. You surround the right pieces around Wall and he may one day be an MVP candidate too.

Well done, Dat. Your description of Wall's skills and potential couldn't be more on target. I hadn't thought about Wall leading the league the FT attempts, but you may right about that as well.

B-easy · Post #275 » by **B-easy** » Thu Apr 21, 2011 10:47 am

I would like to see way more than 20ppg for wall in his prime. You don't want his athleticism going to waste just to set people up. Also if Wall "could lead the league in FT attempts" then i pretty sure he'll be a 25ppg scorer.

Illuminaire · Post #276 » by **Illuminaire** » Thu Apr 21, 2011 9:04 pm

I hear that, but I think it's OK for Wall to have a distributor's mentality. If he averages 22/10/5 with a couple steals and at least average man defense, we will be looking really really good.

B-easy · Post #277 » by **B-easy** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 11:22 am

What kind of numbers do you guy's think wall will average next season. Especially considering that he was never 85% healthy after the injury this year.

DaRealHibachi · Post #278 » by **DaRealHibachi** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 4:42 pm

B-easy wrote:What kind of numbers do you guy's think wall will average next season. Especially considering that he was never 85% healthy after the injury this year.

18-20ppg on 44% shooting, 9-10 apg, 4-5rpg & 2 spg seems about right...

I hope he gets to average a double-double in his 2nd season...

orangeparka · Post #279 » by **orangeparka** » Sun Apr 24, 2011 8:01 am

For Wall's 2nd season, I'm guessing add a few points and a couple of assists, and increase his efficiency.

dangermouse · Post #280 » by **dangermouse** » Sun Apr 24, 2011 11:58 am

add a couple of points and a couple of assists and that is 18/10/5 straight up.

i think he's going to score a lot more next year. or at least look to score slightly more. im guessing this off season he is going to be working on his shot, if he starts off the season with some confidence who knows what he could do?

jwall averaging 20 isnt unthinkable, especially if nick young doesnt come back (i hope he does though).

oh yeah, john wall will wow us even more next year with his blinding speed. bank that. we will be in red or at least have red racing stripes incorporated into the uniforms. red makes everything go faster.