Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing (Part 2)

sashae · Post #261 » by **sashae** » Fri Feb 21, 2014 7:50 pm

Wizards GM Ernie Grunfeld was on 106.7 The Fan to talk about the trade Friday morning, and he was asked specifically about Mack and Marshall, and whether he had any regrets.
“Well, you know, we had Shelvin, he wasn’t at that time … he needed more time to grow,” Grunfeld said. “And maybe we didn’t have the time to let him grow in this situation. He’s had some solid games down [in Atlanta]. And Kendall Marshall, really, we didn’t have roster space for him. When we made the Okafor deal for Gortat we had a full roster already. And the reason that two or three other players actually were also put in the deal was to make this deal work from a salary cap standpoint. So Kendall never even really reported here because we never had any roster spots to be able to fit him in.”

closg00 · Post #262 » by **closg00** » Fri Feb 21, 2014 8:00 pm

sashae wrote:
Wizards GM Ernie Grunfeld was on 106.7 The Fan to talk about the trade Friday morning, and he was asked specifically about Mack and Marshall, and whether he had any regrets.
“Well, you know, we had Shelvin, he wasn’t at that time … he needed more time to grow,” Grunfeld said. “And maybe we didn’t have the time to let him grow in this situation. He’s had some solid games down [in Atlanta]. And Kendall Marshall, really, we didn’t have roster space for him. When we made the Okafor deal for Gortat we had a full roster already. And the reason that two or three other players actually were also put in the deal was to make this deal work from a salary cap standpoint. So Kendall never even really reported here because we never had any roster spots to be able to fit him in.”

Yeah, because we needed to hold-on to Chris Singleton at all costs.

dlts20 · Post #263 » by **dlts20** » Fri Feb 21, 2014 8:10 pm

I shouldve put this in this thread so here it is. I havent been as hard on the Marshall thing for EG as others have been but for some reason, this quote today drove me crazy. Here is what he said and then Ill respond:

After the Wizards traded for Miller, Marshall, a former Bishop O’Connell standout, responded on his Twitter account, “the irony.” Grunfeld was asked about Marshall on Thursday and said he was never in their plans.

“He’s played well,” Grunfeld said, but “in order to get the deal done for Gortat, we needed to put a couple of players in from a salary cap standpoint, so we never even really saw him at all. He was put in the deal just to get a deal done. But give him a lot of credit, he has played very well for the Lakers.”

This is the GM of a proffessional basketball team. How can you say that you never even really saw him at all and he was just put in the deal? Especially a guy from your own backyard? Where is your scouting team? You just throw guys in trades without even seeing if one of the throw ins is a steal or not? Especailly a guy who had a very respectable college career? Id rather him him say that we didnt think he was that good, or fit with us, or that we already had Maynor but dont just say that he was a throw in that youve never seen and didnt know if he could play or not. That sounds so unaware and incompetent, especially from someone in his role. It really bothers me for some reason

DCZards · Post #264 » by **DCZards** » Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:08 pm

I'm pretty sure that when EG says "we never really saw him" he was talking about Marshall showing up in DC after the trade...and not that the Zards haven't seen or scouted Kendall as a player at some point.

Post #265 » by **Ruzious** » Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:58 pm

closg00 wrote:
sashae wrote:
Wizards GM Ernie Grunfeld was on 106.7 The Fan to talk about the trade Friday morning, and he was asked specifically about Mack and Marshall, and whether he had any regrets.
“Well, you know, we had Shelvin, he wasn’t at that time … he needed more time to grow,” Grunfeld said. “And maybe we didn’t have the time to let him grow in this situation. He’s had some solid games down [in Atlanta]. And Kendall Marshall, really, we didn’t have roster space for him. When we made the Okafor deal for Gortat we had a full roster already. And the reason that two or three other players actually were also put in the deal was to make this deal work from a salary cap standpoint. So Kendall never even really reported here because we never had any roster spots to be able to fit him in.”

Yeah, because we needed to hold-on to Chris Singleton at all costs.

Did they ask him about why he signed Maynor or why he drafted Vesely? There are just so many questions that the only legit answer is "Yeah, I blew that one." And I don't even blame him for Marshall. Marshall is a poor athlete who was awful until he went to the D League this season and was reportedly awful in camp and wouldn't have made Phoenix' roster. Phoenix phans were happy to see him go. And there was no time try him out, since the trade was right before the season started.

hands11 · Post #266 » by **hands11** » Sat Feb 22, 2014 4:03 am

Sometimes it just takes a day to have something sink in.

We just traded the #6 pick and a future 2nd to get 37 year old Andre Miller and dump Maynor who EG jumped on for 2 years the first day of FA when if he was patient we could have sign Beno for 1 year or waited to see what happened like it did when we got K Marshall

But we didn't try Kendall because we had to keep Singleton

And all of this is in the context of failing to find a back up PG for TWO YEARS. We are talking about a back up PG. Not a franchise SF.

The level of failure there is really off the charts.

sashae · Post #267 » by **sashae** » Sat Feb 22, 2014 4:39 am

I am genuinely sad the Wizards didn't retain Kendall Marshall. He's very entertaining to watch, and REALLY sees the floor well.

closg00 · Post #268 » by **closg00** » Sat Feb 22, 2014 3:37 pm

sashae wrote:
Wizards GM Ernie Grunfeld was on 106.7 The Fan to talk about the trade Friday morning, and he was asked specifically about Mack and Marshall, and whether he had any regrets.
“Well, you know, we had Shelvin, he wasn’t at that time … he needed more time to grow,” Grunfeld said. “And maybe we didn’t have the time to let him grow in this situation. He’s had some solid games down [in Atlanta]. And Kendall Marshall, really, we didn’t have roster space for him. When we made the Okafor deal for Gortat we had a full roster already. And the reason that two or three other players actually were also put in the deal was to make this deal work from a salary cap standpoint. So Kendall never even really reported here because we never had any roster spots to be able to fit him in.”

Another self-indictment. Translation? The Wizards don't really have a player development program, or it is just one of the NBA's worst.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/dc- ... lvin-mack/

ozthegandp · Post #269 » by **ozthegandp** » Sat Feb 22, 2014 8:23 pm

woah. i just checked out what wolters has been doing in the last month. F eg.

Sent from my SPH-D710VMUB using RealGM Forums mobile app

tontoz · Post #270 » by **tontoz** » Mon Feb 24, 2014 6:57 pm

Other than a truly elite player such as LeBron James or Kevin Durant, draft picks have become the NBA's most valued commodity.

Teams were reluctant to even trade second round picks at the deadline due to their increased value. Not only do picks represent an opportunity for teams to improve with young talent, but they also give teams the ability to do so on a cheap salary.

"Firsts are so valuable with the new rules and tax," an Eastern Conference GM texted Sunday. "For the better teams who are picking late as well as teams close to the tax, they are so valuable because you can get players on cheap contracts and control them for four years."

dckingsfan · Post #271 » by **dckingsfan** » Mon Feb 24, 2014 7:01 pm

closg00 wrote:
sashae wrote:
Wizards GM Ernie Grunfeld was on 106.7 The Fan to talk about the trade Friday morning, and he was asked specifically about Mack and Marshall, and whether he had any regrets.
“Well, you know, we had Shelvin, he wasn’t at that time … he needed more time to grow,” Grunfeld said. “And maybe we didn’t have the time to let him grow in this situation. He’s had some solid games down [in Atlanta]. And Kendall Marshall, really, we didn’t have roster space for him. When we made the Okafor deal for Gortat we had a full roster already. And the reason that two or three other players actually were also put in the deal was to make this deal work from a salary cap standpoint. So Kendall never even really reported here because we never had any roster spots to be able to fit him in.”

Another self-indictment. Translation? The Wizards don't really have a player development program, or it is just one of the NBA's worst.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/dc- ... lvin-mack/

Should read: ABSOLUTELY DON'T HAVE

verbal8 · Post #272 » by **verbal8** » Mon Feb 24, 2014 7:07 pm

dlts20 wrote:I shouldve put this in this thread so here it is. I havent been as hard on the Marshall thing for EG as others have been but for some reason, this quote today drove me crazy. Here is what he said and then Ill respond:

After the Wizards traded for Miller, Marshall, a former Bishop O’Connell standout, responded on his Twitter account, “the irony.” Grunfeld was asked about Marshall on Thursday and said he was never in their plans.

“He’s played well,” Grunfeld said, but “in order to get the deal done for Gortat, we needed to put a couple of players in from a salary cap standpoint, so we never even really saw him at all. He was put in the deal just to get a deal done. But give him a lot of credit, he has played very well for the Lakers.”

This is the GM of a proffessional basketball team. How can you say that you never even really saw him at all and he was just put in the deal? Especially a guy from your own backyard? Where is your scouting team? You just throw guys in trades without even seeing if one of the throw ins is a steal or not? Especailly a guy who had a very respectable college career? Id rather him him say that we didnt think he was that good, or fit with us, or that we already had Maynor but dont just say that he was a throw in that youve never seen and didnt know if he could play or not. That sounds so unaware and incompetent, especially from someone in his role. It really bothers me for some reason

Actually the second part of the quote drives me crazy about them NEEDING to be added for salary cap reasons, that is absolutely false. Phoenix had(and actually does still have) about $5 million in cap space. Gortat, one player and cap space would have been enough to trade for Okafor, who will end up saving them about 5 million due to insurance payments.

rockymac52 · Post #273 » by **rockymac52** » Mon Feb 24, 2014 7:33 pm

IIRC, half of the people on this board loved the Maynor signing at the time. So I hope none of those people are the ones here criticizing Grunfeld's decision-making now. With that said, I wish we could've held on to AJ Price instead, but oh well, we'll survive.

JonathanJoseph · Post #274 » by **JonathanJoseph** » Mon Feb 24, 2014 10:08 pm

And now Beno Udrih was waived by the Knicks. Another backup PG that we could have had for free. The Grunfeld comedy of errors is neverending.

tontoz · Post #275 » by **tontoz** » Mon Feb 24, 2014 10:55 pm

rockymac52 wrote:IIRC, half of the people on this board loved the Maynor signing at the time. So I hope none of those people are the ones here criticizing Grunfeld's decision-making now. With that said, I wish we could've held on to AJ Price instead, but oh well, we'll survive.

plenty of people criticized the signing, including you.

viewtopic.php?f=35&t=1260201&start=315

TGW wrote:Pointless signing. This does nothing to improve the team, and Price had a higher PER than Maynor last season. AT BEST, this is a lateral move, and a typical Ernie Grunfeld signing.

Dat2U wrote:I hate to be the one to say it, because I seem to always say it, but terrible signing.

The guy is simply not very good. No other way to put it. We've officially downgraded from A.J. Price.

Upper Decker wrote:I'm going on record, I hate the signing. I think Maynor's trash. He's the Chris Singleton of NBA PG's. AJ Price is a better option.

sfam wrote:Exactly. The MLE or some serious trades should be contemplated for backup PG. I certainly wish Eric Maynor to do well, but this is pretty uninspiring.

miller31time wrote:
Agreed. We have the money to sign a better player, so why this guy? Hell, AJ Price (who actually knows the system) seems like a better option.

I don't get it.

rockymac52 wrote:I hate to be this pessimistic and negative about a backup PG signing, but I really do not like this signing. I think AJ Price was, is, and will continue to be better than Eric Maynor. Furthermore, I'm pretty sure we could have signed AJ Price on a 1 year deal for less money.

Jay81 wrote:Awful awful move. Why do we constantly sign terrible free agents

FAH1223 wrote:If Wall gets injured, atleast we will be bad again and can enter the tank wars

closg00 wrote:
+1 Very typical Grunfeld signing. Rather than seeing if Nate Wolters might be the next Steve Nash, he signs someone coming off an injury. Ernie loves those guys for some reason. Just hope he's better than Price.

Ed Wood wrote:Evenin'. The pessimist in me wants to clarify that (speaking for myself) the disappointment that accompanies a move like this isn't a matter of believing that it torpedoed the team's future prospects or that an alternative could have elevated them, it's that these things so often seem to amount to the team making moves that don't have any real chance of making a difference nor demonstrating any apparent interest or flair in maximizing its return in marginal situations like this one.

I'm sure this isn't totally fair but the moves and the players that seem to annually fill out the roster makes me feel that the team adopts that same "back up point, does it matter all that much what we have there?" mentality and the result is players who make it very clear it doesn't.

Not every move has to dazzle, but I don't want the team to feel that way. Frankly, when Hilton Armstrong and Darius Songaila are players you slot into your rotation you have failed to convince me that you don't just not give a ****.

tontoz wrote:

After the draft the biggest need on the roster was a quality backup for Wall. EG addresses this need with Eric Maynor on the 1st day of free agency while other much better options are unsigned.

Scrubs like Maynor can be signed a month or more down the road. What is the hurry to sign him now?

[/quote]

rockymac52 · Post #276 » by **rockymac52** » Mon Feb 24, 2014 10:57 pm

Right, like I said, half of the board felt otherwise by my best estimation. I disagreed then and I disagree even more so now, but in the end it all worked out pretty decently.

tontoz · Post #277 » by **tontoz** » Mon Feb 24, 2014 10:59 pm

I don't think anyone actually "loved" the signing. A surprising number were ok with it but i don't remember anyone being enthusiastic about it.

hands11 · Post #278 » by **hands11** » Tue Feb 25, 2014 12:14 am

rockymac52 wrote:IIRC, half of the people on this board loved the Maynor signing at the time. So I hope none of those people are the ones here criticizing Grunfeld's decision-making now. With that said, I wish we could've held on to AJ Price instead, but oh well, we'll survive.

We covered this already. It wasn't close to half. Most didn't like it. Only a handful did.

Go read the first 4 pages our so of the Maynor tread.

But ironic that EG trades Ves and then two games later Nene goes down. And he didn't draft Len. :roll:

You watching all this Ted ?

sashae · Post #279 » by **sashae** » Tue Feb 25, 2014 12:46 am

$50 bucks says Nene's injury provides air cover for Grunfeld getting resigned -- it's not his fault the starting C got injured! The team is playoff bound!

I WANT TO BE WRONG.

hands11 · Post #280 » by **hands11** » Tue Feb 25, 2014 1:08 am

sashae wrote:$50 bucks says Nene's injury provides air cover for Grunfeld getting resigned -- it's not his fault the starting C got injured! The team is playoff bound!

I WANT TO BE WRONG.

Not me. I think the damage was already done in all the moves he made over two years just to get a 37 year old back up PG when so much slipped through his fingers and it ended up costing him Ves his #6 pick and a 2nd and now Nene is out and he doesn't have Ves. And he didn't pick a center in this draft that was super deep in centers.

I think Nene going down hurts him. Not helps him.

I just don't see how Ted can't add up all of that. Its a compounded FUBAR.

IS IT TIME TO FIRE ERNIE GRUNFELD?