Discussing Other Teams' Moves Part 5

thricethefun · Post #261 » by **thricethefun** » Thu Jun 25, 2015 1:42 am

Y'all see that Toronto is making Lowry, Derozen, and Valuncias available for trades? We literally broke their franchise

Post #262 » by **LyricalRico** » Thu Jun 25, 2015 2:19 am

Wow, Portland looks like they are hitting the reset button in anticipation of losing Aldridge and Matthews. Couldn't they have gotten more for Batum, though?

Charlotte getting Batum without having to give up Zeller or MKG is interesting. Plus they apparently also add Lamb. Very interesting.

closg00 · Post #263 » by **closg00** » Thu Jun 25, 2015 2:21 am

thricethefun wrote:Y'all see that Toronto is making Lowry, Derozen, and Valuncias available for trades? We literally broke their franchise

It amazing that Casey wasn't fired, they want to rebuild/shake things up with Casey as HC!?

#FireErnie ~ Because he believed Stephen Curry couldn't help us and Jan Vesely could.

gambitx777 · Post #264 » by **gambitx777** » Thu Jun 25, 2015 4:36 am

I wounder if Webby and a future second would get us Zeller? I would much rather take a shot at zeller than keep webby

closg00 · Post #265 » by **closg00** » Thu Jun 25, 2015 9:57 am

gambitx777 wrote:I wounder if Webby and a future second would get us Zeller? I would much rather take a shot at zeller than keep webby

The Cavs want a wing, not a broken wing. It's going to take a real asset to get Cody.. A little bit better than a broken Webby.

#FireErnie ~ Because he believed Stephen Curry couldn't help us and Jan Vesely could.

hands11 · Post #266 » by **hands11** » Thu Jun 25, 2015 10:46 am

Ruzious wrote:
FAH1223 wrote:
Ruzious wrote:I think it's a safe bet that the Sacramento leadership combo of George Karl and Vlade Divac ain't gonna work. Apparently Karl now wants Javale McGee. He doesn't want Cousins, but he wants more of Javale... Vlade probably can't wait to here more leaks from Karl.

It's all the owner's fault.

Should have let Corbin finished the season, then let Vlade pick his own coach.

Terrible.

We could see it all starting to crash when they fired Malone early last season.

And right before the draft seems like a good time for a smart team to fleece them.

I didn't closely follow the sequence of events for that. What happened in what order to their front office ?

Owner fired GM and HC.. hired coach then hired GM ?

hands11 · Post #267 » by **hands11** » Thu Jun 25, 2015 10:51 am

tontoz wrote:
Ruzious wrote:I think it's a safe bet that the Sacramento leadership combo of George Karl and Vlade Divac ain't gonna work. Apparently Karl now wants Javale McGee. He doesn't want Cousins, but he wants more of Javale... Vlade probably can't wait to here more leaks from Karl.

When Karl had McGee in Denver he called him "lazy and crazy" and didnt play him much. Now Karl wants him with the Kings?

As a vet min back up, he might be interested if they are rebuilding the team. McGee is spot mins off the bench was productive in there last playoff run. Its just at 10M, he was no way worth it. McGee is a Gooden deal this year. Getting paid $12,000,000 from PHI.

He is 27 now. Might be a Birdman finally now that he should fully realize the dreams of being Wilt are not happening.

hands11 · Post #268 » by **hands11** » Thu Jun 25, 2015 11:29 am

thricethefun wrote:Y'all see that Toronto is making Lowry, Derozen, and Valuncias available for trades? We literally broke their franchise

no.. it was broken already.. all we did was SWEPT them over the edge.

I told you'll not to worry about them. Regular season record would look good but not to worry about them in the playoffs. That was my preseason prediction in the conference standing thread. I recall a few who where propping themselves for picking TOR high half way through the year when they looked ATL good. Time slicing doesn't show you the big picture. Always keep your eyes on the big picture. I projected them as a first round exit before the season started.

Nothing was more fun to telling those TOR fans we were going to sweep them before the series started and watching their head explode telling me I was nuts. Well some here said the same.

They went from :crazy:

before game 1 to :oops:

in game 4. From denial to acceptance.

Toronto's only hope was for D Roz to make the leap and take over that team. And that's hard for him to do with Lowry there sucking up air n cap space. They have depth but they needed a franchise elite player. Lowry is a good talent but not a franchise guy.

The fan base was hungry for a winner and got ahead of themselves. Remember the Lowry vs Wall posts ? I tried to warn them.. just wait. They might look kind of even right now but Wall is going to keep climbing. Lowry won't. Ships sailing in different directions.

What they need to do next is tough. They can blow it up and tank for a few year or try to patch it up. But they really don't have the pieces to get a top pick. They might do best to dunk Lowry with their pick and try to patch it up. They could end up 6th to 8th and make the playoff again. Keep the franchise in the headlines and try to attract a FA the following year. Maybe D Roz steps up once Lowry is gone and becomes their Paul George.

Or just burn it to the ground and hope they get lucky in the draft over the next 3 years.

hands11 · Post #269 » by **hands11** » Thu Jun 25, 2015 11:35 am

LyricalRico wrote:Wow, Portland looks like they are hitting the reset button in anticipation of losing Aldridge and Matthews. Couldn't they have gotten more for Batum, though?

Charlotte getting Batum without having to give up Zeller or MKG is interesting. Plus they apparently also add Lamb. Very interesting.

Well what other choice did they have.. what do they really have ?

The have Lillard and CJM.

http://hoopshype.com/salaries/portland_trail_blazers/

MEM might fair better but they have their work cut out as well.

The league could well get a huge reshuffle the next 2 years. The new CBA is finally kicking in full force. And now the 2016 cap. Going to be interesting.

hands11 · Post #270 » by **hands11** » Thu Jun 25, 2015 11:50 am

closg00 wrote:
thricethefun wrote:Y'all see that Toronto is making Lowry, Derozen, and Valuncias available for trades? We literally broke their franchise

It amazing that Casey wasn't fired, they want to rebuild/shake things up with Casey as HC!?

I never thought he would get fired. He is not their biggest problem. Its deeper then that.

Casey is fine for where they are right now. Honestly. Not like a great brand name is going to want to go there. He is a nuts and bolts Randy level coach. What he needs is a franchise player and a lest one good vet mentor. Vince Carter would have been great for them this year.

They rose because the East was in a reshuffle and they had a team of deep medium/good players. But they couldn't even get past old BRK last year and still haven't gotten out of the first round. The East is rebuilding. IND will be back. NY will recover. MIA is always in it to rebuild. MIL is rising. WAS and CLE.

BOS was rebuilding as well and still are but could get it together at any time but like TOR, BOS needs a franchise player.

First question for a franchise. Who are you building around ? Who is your franchise player ? What is the answer in TOR ? Lowry ? Is so, that isn't going to work. Is it D Roz ? If it is, you better get the right mentors around him to grow him. Lowry is not the answer there either.

Their GM who so many seem to like as a great GM build a going nowhere team. And the great Rudy trade .. LOL.. TORs record after the Rudy trade.. that was all TOR fans could talk about. :nonono:

FAH1223 · Post #271 » by **FAH1223** » Thu Jun 25, 2015 12:17 pm

hands11 wrote:I didn't closely follow the sequence of events for that. What happened in what order to their front office ?

Owner fired GM and HC.. hired coach then hired GM ?

Basically

Mike Malone was fired. Then Karl got hired for the last 30 games. Vlade Divac then became the GM...

Post #272 » by **Ruzious** » Thu Jun 25, 2015 12:53 pm

FAH1223 wrote:
hands11 wrote:I didn't closely follow the sequence of events for that. What happened in what order to their front office ?

Owner fired GM and HC.. hired coach then hired GM ?

Basically

Mike Malone was fired. Then Karl got hired for the last 30 games. Vlade Divac then became the GM...

I heard on the radio that Karl was their 5th coach in 5 years. The unfair thing is - some people blame Cousins for that. But they have had multiple front offices that simply haven't put talent around him. Their second best player was Rudy Gay - who was a disaster in Toronto. And the year before that, Isaiah Thomas was their second player - and he was lured away with a contract averaging less than 7 mil a year. When you're 2nd best player can't get more than that on the open market, what does that tell you about the level of talent around him - not to mention - what does it tell you that he left Sacto in the first place? The problem with Sacto has been their management.

queridiculo · Post #273 » by **queridiculo** » Thu Jun 25, 2015 1:09 pm

Ruzious wrote:The unfair thing is - some people blame Cousins for that. But they have had multiple front offices that simply haven't put talent around him. Their second best player was Rudy Gay - who was a disaster in Toronto. And the year before that, Isaiah Thomas was their second player - and he was lured away with a contract averaging less than 7 mil a year. When you're 2nd best player can't get more than that on the open market, what does that tell you about the level of talent around him - not to mention - what does it tell you that he left Sacto in the first place? The problem with Sacto has been their management.

Given how big of a disaster that franchise has been since the Webber/Divac days you have to give Cousin's some credit for signing an extension in the first place.

He could have gone anywhere he wanted to and showed a tremendous amount of good will foregoing an ETO as part of the deal he signed. The reward for his loyalty? A backstabbing coach basically refusing to work with him.

Vivek Ranadivé is 100% to blame for that situation.

Good on him for wanting to leave that train wreck behind.

closg00 · Post #274 » by **closg00** » Thu Jun 25, 2015 2:03 pm

Who are Kings asking for in the Cousins trade talks? Jordan Clarkson of-course.

#FireErnie ~ Because he believed Stephen Curry couldn't help us and Jan Vesely could.

Post #275 » by **LyricalRico** » Thu Jun 25, 2015 4:45 pm

Jody Genessy: There continue to be rumblings about how the Jazz want to — and can — re-acquire Paul Millsap and might trade Derrick Favors, per my source.

Hilarious. Utah lets Milsap walk and pays Favors...just to now have to try to trade Favors so they can REALLY pay Milsap this time.

dckingsfan · Post #276 » by **dckingsfan** » Thu Jun 25, 2015 5:27 pm

LyricalRico wrote:Wow, Portland looks like they are hitting the reset button in anticipation of losing Aldridge and Matthews. Couldn't they have gotten more for Batum, though?

Charlotte getting Batum without having to give up Zeller or MKG is interesting. Plus they apparently also add Lamb. Very interesting.

Spencer Hawes, Matt Barnes, Nicolas Batum

PG: Walker, Roberts
SG: Daniels
SF: Batum, MKG, Hairston, Barnes
PF: Williams, Hawes, Zeller
C: Jefferson, Biyombo

Guess they will be taking guards in the draft and FA

Post #277 » by **LyricalRico** » Thu Jun 25, 2015 5:35 pm

dckingsfan wrote:
LyricalRico wrote:Wow, Portland looks like they are hitting the reset button in anticipation of losing Aldridge and Matthews. Couldn't they have gotten more for Batum, though?

Charlotte getting Batum without having to give up Zeller or MKG is interesting. Plus they apparently also add Lamb. Very interesting.

Spencer Hawes, Matt Barnes, Nicolas Batum

PG: Walker, Roberts
SG: Daniels
SF: Batum, MKG, Hairston, Barnes
PF: Williams, Hawes, Zeller
C: Jefferson, Biyombo

Guess they will be taking guards in the draft and FA

Well, they did get Lamb so they've got at least one guy at SG. Even so, they really don't have a legit starter at either SG or PF IMO. I'm interested to see what they do with MKG and the #9. Those are their most viable assets to fill those spots.

I_Like_Dirt · Post #278 » by **I_Like_Dirt** » Thu Jun 25, 2015 5:42 pm

Did the Hornets actually get Lamb? On one hand, I saw they traded Barnes for Lamb yesterday, and on the other I saw they traded Barnes for Ridnour today. Which is it? Heck, even if they have both, all the uglier. A guard rotation of Walker, Lamb, Ridnour, Roberts and Daniels? A bigman rotation of Jefferson, Zeller, Williams, Hawes and Biyombo? Are they foolish enough to draft Kaminsky with their pick? It definitely seems like one of the patented moves from the Bobcats scouting manual which involves doing all your scouting from highlights of the NCAA tournament. How good do people really think MKG and Batum are to make up for the less than amazing guards and bigs? To me, this looks like the Bobcats openly declaring they're happy winning 35 games every season and hoping that's good enough to make the playoffs and aren't going to do anything to rock that boat any time soon.

Edit:

NVM - cleared up the Lamb/Ridnour issues. They traded Barnes for Ridnour and then traded Ridnour and a 2nd rounder for Lamb. Any chance the Bobcats do better than their 28th ranked offense from last season? Better than their 9th ranked defense? The Blazers got worse, but also made one of those moves that generally tends to keep the western conference ahead of the eastern conference every single season.

dckingsfan · Post #279 » by **dckingsfan** » Thu Jun 25, 2015 6:16 pm

LyricalRico wrote:
dckingsfan wrote:
LyricalRico wrote:Wow, Portland looks like they are hitting the reset button in anticipation of losing Aldridge and Matthews. Couldn't they have gotten more for Batum, though?

Charlotte getting Batum without having to give up Zeller or MKG is interesting. Plus they apparently also add Lamb. Very interesting.

Spencer Hawes, Matt Barnes, Nicolas Batum

PG: Walker, Roberts
SG: Lamb, Daniels
SF: Batum, MKG, Hairston, Barnes
PF: Williams, Hawes, Zeller
C: Jefferson, Biyombo

Guess they will be taking guards in the draft and FA

Well, they did get Lamb so they've got at least one guy at SG. Even so, they really don't have a legit starter at either SG or PF IMO. I'm interested to see what they do with MKG and the #9. Those are their most viable assets to fill those spots.

Updated with Lamb. I Agree with you though - Jefferson/Williams - meh Biyombo/Hawes is okay for a second unit. But they desparately need a SG in the draft. Justise Winslow, Mario Hezonja or Devin Booker??

Post #280 » by **LyricalRico** » Thu Jun 25, 2015 6:30 pm

^ Speaking of Hezonja:

Adrian Wojnarowski: Knicks keep pursuing deals to move out of No. 4 spot and back in lottery, league sources tell Yahoo.

Would Zeller+9 be enough for the #4, where Charlotte could take Hezonja? Heck, at that point, I'd see if anyone would take MKG+Marvin for a legit starting PF. Utah is supposedly shopping Favors so they can bring Milsap back.

Jefferson/Biyombo
Favors/Hawes
Batum/FA
Hezonja/Lamb
Walker/Roberts