Official Trade Thread - Part XXXII

[Dat2U]

For 5 draft picks. they might. They can waive the physical (I think). I get it Obviously you offer two firsts and 2 seconds first, but im just saying. You have a realistic show at a ring, this year and for the next 2-4 years if you do that. I get you don't want to make a bad move, But you're not doing what the nets did. they did all that pick swapping **** too which, ruined their picks on the years they did have them.I get it, but if there is blood in the water, and a ring is up for grabs, Take it. You are not wrong in anyway, but if we did it, and things did go to **** 5 years later. but we one a ring this year or next, is it not worth it?

We don't have a realistic shot at a ring. Even with Melo. Getting past Cleveland would still be a huge challenge. And there's still no way we'd match up with Golden State out west. Getting to the Eastern Conference finals is our best case scenario I think. I believe we can do that without mortgaging the future.

[Meliorus]

For 5 draft picks. they might. They can waive the physical (I think). I get it Obviously you offer two firsts and 2 seconds first, but im just saying. You have a realistic show at a ring, this year and for the next 2-4 years if you do that. I get you don't want to make a bad move, But you're not doing what the nets did. they did all that pick swapping **** too which, ruined their picks on the years they did have them.I get it, but if there is blood in the water, and a ring is up for grabs, Take it. You are not wrong in anyway, but if we did it, and things did go to **** 5 years later. but we one a ring this year or next, is it not worth it?

We don't have a realistic shot at a ring. Even with Melo. Getting past Cleveland would still be a huge challenge. And there's still no way we'd match up with Golden State out west. Getting to the Eastern Conference finals is our best case scenario I think. I believe we can do that without mortgaging the future.

Is Melo really good or am I just missing something?

[NatP4]

For 5 draft picks. they might. They can waive the physical (I think). I get it Obviously you offer two firsts and 2 seconds first, but im just saying. You have a realistic show at a ring, this year and for the next 2-4 years if you do that. I get you don't want to make a bad move, But you're not doing what the nets did. they did all that pick swapping **** too which, ruined their picks on the years they did have them.I get it, but if there is blood in the water, and a ring is up for grabs, Take it. You are not wrong in anyway, but if we did it, and things did go to **** 5 years later. but we one a ring this year or next, is it not worth it?

We don't have a realistic shot at a ring. Even with Melo. Getting past Cleveland would still be a huge challenge. And there's still no way we'd match up with Golden State out west. Getting to the Eastern Conference finals is our best case scenario I think. I believe we can do that without mortgaging the future.

Is Melo really good or am I just missing something?

22 points on 19 shots while not being able to guard his position! Ya!

[montestewart]

Anthony once made it (somewhat improbably) to the WCF. He probably thought he was the best player on that team, though his contribution probably ranked no better than 3rd. I agree with the "black hole" characterization of his game, which has only gotten teams so far, and he appears to have peaked anyway. If he's on, active, and contributing, or if he's sitting on the bench, probably wouldn't make that much of a difference in the team's record. Might make them worse if he's hogging the ball and disrupting team play and team development. And it would eat up a lot of payroll space.

Getting him in the way mentioned would be EG's most egregious case of selling the farm for a likely declining talent. The only way I could see him being successful on any team at this point is in a significantly lower usage and lower minutes catch-and-shoot stretch 4, a role I doubt he would accept, particularly at the salary commensurate with that role.

[Meliorus]

Melo is not good. I'd rather have Markieff's defense. No reason we should be giving up multiple picks for a 32 year old already in decline. It's a seller's market. I'll trade Mahinmi + a 2nd rounder for him at most.

[Ruzious]

And it tells you something that even when he set a team record for the storied NY Knicks against Warshington for most points in a quarter, he was mostly useless in the 2nd half as his team lost. Even in a record-setting game for him, he was just pretty good.

[Sluggerface]

In regards to the whole Melo situation. If you can convince Phil to take on Nicholson, Smith, and Mahinmi + a couple of 1sts. It's a really tempting deal imo. The 4 is by far our worst position on the roster. Morris is using 20% of the teams possessions when he's on the court just by nature of teams dedicating so much attention to Wall and Beal (and now Porter). A lot of those are open shots. Swapping Morris out for Melo would be a complete 180. I think the concern that Melo will just chuck like he usually does is unwarranted imo. Virtually every situation that Melo has been in he's been the first or second best scorer on the roster. That doesn't happen in Washington. He'd just fill the same role that Pierce did when he was here. An outlet for Wall and a crunch time isolation scorer once the offense breaks down.

Getting Melo also helps the bench by forcing Kieff down in the rotation. With Oubre making strides, that leaves Washington just needing a combo guard to have a really good 8 man rotation for the duration of Melo's contract. Then you can use Melo's expiring to revamp the roster around Wall, Beal, and Porter.

[nate33]

Melo is not good. I'd rather have Markieff's defense. No reason we should be giving up multiple picks for a 32 year old already in decline. It's a seller's market. I'll trade Mahinmi + a 2nd rounder for him at most.

I agree. Given Melo's current lack of interest and ability to play defense, I just don't see him as a plus player on a good team. His high usage offense at reasonable efficiency can help carry a bad team up to "decent" status, but I don't think he can make a decent team "good" anymore.

As Meliorus points out, the dropoff in defense by swapping Kieff for Anthony would probably offset the modest gains in offense. After all, as a team, we have an ORtg of 109.5. Would Melo's ORtg of 111 really boost us all that much?

[Meliorus]

Melo is not good. I'd rather have Markieff's defense. No reason we should be giving up multiple picks for a 32 year old already in decline. It's a seller's market. I'll trade Mahinmi + a 2nd rounder for him at most.

I agree. Given Melo's current lack of interest and ability to play defense, I just don't see him as a plus player on a good team. His high usage offense at reasonable efficiency can help carry a bad team up to "decent" status, but I don't think he can make a decent team "good" anymore.

As Meliorus points out, the dropoff in defense by swapping Kieff for Anthony would probably offset the modest gains in offense. After all, as a team, we have an ORtg of 109.5. Would Melo's ORtg of 111 really boost us all that much?

The worst part is that we have to give up ASSETS to get him. If he was sitting there for free, maybe.

People need to stop proposing fair, balanced trades. There are way more sellers than buyers. Ernie is not in desperation mode right now. I don't see us making a move unless it's heavily lopsided in our favor.

[gambitx777]

Melo is not good. I'd rather have Markieff's defense. No reason we should be giving up multiple picks for a 32 year old already in decline. It's a seller's market. I'll trade Mahinmi + a 2nd rounder for him at most.

I agree. Given Melo's current lack of interest and ability to play defense, I just don't see him as a plus player on a good team. His high usage offense at reasonable efficiency can help carry a bad team up to "decent" status, but I don't think he can make a decent team "good" anymore.

As Meliorus points out, the dropoff in defense by swapping Kieff for Anthony would probably offset the modest gains in offense. After all, as a team, we have an ORtg of 109.5. Would Melo's ORtg of 111 really boost us all that much?

But it is worth it to get ride of mahimi Nicholson and Burke ? Like yes black while ISO Mello we do not need. But he does have shooting ability and he can play serviceable D when he tries. And cares. But why is he buys in as a third or fourth option stretch 4? He can't shoot 3 balls. And from wall. If he baout in for a ring he could seriously help. Yes his personal scoring would dip, but his efficiency would go up. And more importantly we would ad Morris to the bench and that would greatly increase our bench power. Yes if we trade for Mello and he tries to be all-star ISO black whole Mello we are doomed but **** just talk to him and see if he is willing to accept what we need from him. And when you replace mahinmi and Burke off the street with vets you get a bench boost there too!

[stevemcqueen1]

As Meliorus points out, the dropoff in defense by swapping Kieff for Anthony would probably offset the modest gains in offense. After all, as a team, we have an ORtg of 109.5. Would Melo's ORtg of 111 really boost us all that much?

If New York is trying to give Melo away, then keep Markieff. You could start Melo and make Keef the third big. And a small line up with Melo at the 4 and Keef at the 5 would be dominant.

Melo is a deadly three ball shooter off the catch, so that's one way he'd improve our offense over playing Keef. The other big benefit would be playing Melo with the reserves. It would be nice having a shot creator with that group because Burke is a weak playmaker.

But you and Meliorus are right that Melo isn't worth making any trades that significantly disrupt the current rotation. Too limited and too expensive at this point in his career. I think you only trade for him if you can get him for next to nothing. Bad contracts and maybe a single first round draft pick.

There is something to be said for adding a scoring forward like him to a well built roster though. Getting Adrian Dantley and, later, Mark Aguirre put the Bad Boys Pistons over the top.

[deneem4]

Clippers need to move crawford...yea hes old and expensive but Nicholson and burke works if they throw in a 2nd

[pineappleheadindc]

You've pointed out that we'd never be able to deal Mahinmi now (& who knows when?).

PIF let me ask you a question bro.
I mentioned a Mello tade a few pages back.
Mahinmi, nicholson, and burke, 3 unprotected firsts and 2 seconds for mello.
That's 5 picks. yes I know. But Adding mello and no talent net loss, since mahinmi has not played and nicholson and burke are basically net negatives or neutrals. Is a pure 100 percent gain talent wise, if mello buys in to the john wall style of play and we can keep his minutes down by playing morris off the bench, while dumping Mahinmi and Nicholson, and still having the ability to max Otto. is that worth it? Thats a huge gain and addition by subtraction? Because with nicholson and mahinmi basically being what mellos contract it and the cap going up a little more, we will be in the same cap situation with a much better team.

This is an Ernie Grunfeld special.

Big overpay, bargaining against himself at this level, to bring in an aging player who kills ball movement and chemistry because he's a "trusted veteran".

And throw away so many future picks as to guarantee suckage just down the road.

Jeez.

[pineappleheadindc]

Clippers need to move crawford...yea hes old and expensive but Nicholson and burke works if they throw in a 2nd

THIS is good (unlike the Melo trade). Gets us out of Nicholson (WTF was Ernie doing?...four freaking years.)

[pineappleheadindc]

I like playing with ESPN's Trade Machine if, for no other reason, than laughs.

I just dumped Nicholson for Brandon Jennings as an unnecessary part of the Melo to Clips ongoing soap opera. Yeah, he kinda sucks. But he'd just a back-up and I'm probably the biggest hater of the Nicholson signing on this board.

I feel oddly happy with this trade -- Almost Lyrical-like. (Come back please)

[NatP4]

I like playing with ESPN's Trade Machine if, for no other reason, than laughs.

I just dumped Nicholson for Brandon Jennings as an unnecessary part of the Melo to Clips ongoing soap opera. Yeah, he kinda sucks. But he'd just a back-up and I'm probably the biggest hater of the Nicholson signing on this board.

I feel oddly happy with this trade -- Almost Lyrical-like. (Come back please)

Can we swap Austin rivers and Brandon Jennings in this trade and throw in Trey Burke to make salaries match?

[Kanyewest]

Anthony once made it (somewhat improbably) to the WCF. He probably thought he was the best player on that team, though his contribution probably ranked no better than 3rd. I agree with the "black hole" characterization of his game, which has only gotten teams so far, and he appears to have peaked anyway. If he's on, active, and contributing, or if he's sitting on the bench, probably wouldn't make that much of a difference in the team's record. Might make them worse if he's hogging the ball and disrupting team play and team development. And it would eat up a lot of payroll space.

Getting him in the way mentioned would be EG's most egregious case of selling the farm for a likely declining talent. The only way I could see him being successful on any team at this point is in a significantly lower usage and lower minutes catch-and-shoot stretch 4, a role I doubt he would accept, particularly at the salary commensurate with that role.

I'm curious who you thought was the 2nd best player on that 2010 Nuggets team (Nene?). Personally, I would say that Billups was 1A and Anthony was 1B which was a very deep team, especially since they did a good job sharing the ball. I would say the lack of postseason success was mostly due to how tough the Western Conference was, especially since they finished with 50+ wins in in 2007 and 2008 only to face 2 teams on the first round that went on to go to the NBA Finals .

That being said, there would be enough concerns not to throw the complete farm at him like Brooklyn did when they traded for KG and Pierce. Anthony isn't even as efficient as either Pierce or Garnett when the Nets traded for him; that trade would be horrendous.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Clippers need to move crawford...yea hes old and expensive but Nicholson and burke works if they throw in a 2nd

THIS is good (unlike the Melo trade). Gets us out of Nicholson (WTF was Ernie doing?...four freaking years.)

Seconded.

Great idea.

[JWizmentality]

Clippers need to move crawford...yea hes old and expensive but Nicholson and burke works if they throw in a 2nd

Marcus Thornton on steroids. No thanks.

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[montestewart]

Anthony once made it (somewhat improbably) to the WCF. He probably thought he was the best player on that team, though his contribution probably ranked no better than 3rd. I agree with the "black hole" characterization of his game, which has only gotten teams so far, and he appears to have peaked anyway. If he's on, active, and contributing, or if he's sitting on the bench, probably wouldn't make that much of a difference in the team's record. Might make them worse if he's hogging the ball and disrupting team play and team development. And it would eat up a lot of payroll space.

Getting him in the way mentioned would be EG's most egregious case of selling the farm for a likely declining talent. The only way I could see him being successful on any team at this point is in a significantly lower usage and lower minutes catch-and-shoot stretch 4, a role I doubt he would accept, particularly at the salary commensurate with that role.

I'm curious who you thought was the 2nd best player on that 2010 Nuggets team (Nene?). Personally, I would say that Billups was 1A and Anthony was 1B which was a very deep team, especially since they did a good job sharing the ball. I would say the lack of postseason success was mostly due to how tough the Western Conference was, especially since they finished with 50+ wins in in 2007 and 2008 only to face 2 teams on the first round that went on to go to the NBA Finals .

That being said, there would be enough concerns not to throw the complete farm at him like Brooklyn did when they traded for KG and Pierce. Anthony isn't even as efficient as either Pierce or Garnett when the Nets traded for him; that trade would be horrendous.

Yep, Nene (regular season). Anthony exploded in the playoffs, but then reverted back to the player he's developed a reputation for being, one who can take over games, frequently at the expense of the team, and rarely makes positive defensive contributions. The memory of his teams reminds me of the memory of the Iverson Sixers making it to the Finals, as if it was just one man who improbably carried a bunch of non-contributors to the success.

Anthony is definitely amazing at times (like the 2nd quarter) but I'm happy to watch another teams pay for that, in so many ways. I'm open to adding veterans, but probably less of an alpha would work better.