Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part VI

[Knighthonor]

My concern with Porter is how the Wizards plan to develop him.

[rockymac52]

My concern with Porter is how the Wizards plan to develop him.

What does that even mean? Don't you have that same concern for literally every other prospect in the draft?

[nate33]

My concern with Porter is how the Wizards plan to develop him.

What does that even mean? Don't you have that same concern for literally every other prospect in the draft?

[verbal8]

My concern with Porter is how the Wizards plan to develop him.

What does that even mean? Don't you have that same concern for literally every other prospect in the draft?

I think with Porter it would be the lowest concern. Wall and Beal seem to have developed well with the Wizards. They seem to be guys who are motivated on their own to improve. Porter looks like one of the lowest risk prospects in this regard. Oladipo seems similar in this area.

Where I think the Wizards have failed is those who need more structure and support in their development. It seems the success stories with those types of players have been where they can be offered a relatively limited role and then earn more minutes(i.e. Stephenson). Even with organizations that seem to have the right approach, it isn't 100%(Rockets - Royce White) or doesn't last(Spurs, Steven Jackson).

[hands11]

What could the wizards offer for Cousins if its not wall or Beal involved in the package?

The 3rd overall pick is a pretty good start. Or the 2014 1st round pick. Then take on a bad contract maybe with Salmons. And then maybe give them Okafor as well, since he'd be useless to us now that we have Cousins, and he's expiring so they'd like that.

You are way undervaluing a player like Okafor. Look how much he helped stabilize our front court. A productive vet like him on an expiring is a really nice asset.

They spent a 5th on Cousins and got several years of use out of him. Giving them a 3rd should gives them most of their value back. That gets you Otto, Burke, Noel, McLemore, Zeller as possible options.

I would not overpay to end up paying Cousin a boat load very shortly. The 3rd pick and a player with enough $$ to make it work is plenty. Its not like they drafted him and he has way out performed expectations. He is basically who we though he would be.

Adding Cousins while Okafor and Nene are still hear is worth a lot more to me then with them not here.

And thats only if I don't feel I can get a good player with the 3rd on my own who will end up costing a lot less.

Projecting him, and other like him, as a force in the league is definitely something we need to do. We need a player to match up with players like him, and I don't think we have it. Nene can't really keep up. Not unless is looks a lot healthier next year. Okafor is getting older but he can mostly handle him for now. Noel wouldn't be able to do it. Nor will Zeller.

Oddly, I think a key in this draft will be adding a player like Jackie Carmichael or Colton Iverson. They are the types that might be enough to slow him down.

Now I would love to think Kevin S could do it. He has the body to do it. I'm just not convinced he will ever show to fire and will to do it. This is a really big year for Kevin S. Only a Wiz insider would know if he is developing this mental approach. If he isn't, we need to move him. No sense in having a 6-9 265 player who plays like he is only 230.

So we Nene and Kevin right and moving forward who could defend a Cousins. But there are questions there. If they are healthy ( Nene ) and mature ( Kevin ) we are set. If not, we have a hole in the roster.

[Dark Faze]

I think you wait to see Cousins 4th year production before you make a move on him. Right now his stats are just so bad in every conceivable metric. Getting an offensive focused big who is terribly inefficient offensively would be a dumb contract to take on, nevermind the fact that his teammates always hate him.

I understand why people want him though. His flat out per game stats are nice but once efficiency and usage come into the picture I wouldn't touch him with a 10 foot pole.

[Rafael122]

Well here's the thing, is Cousins inefficient because of bad point guard play? Who's to say he won';t improve and get himself in control with Wall as his point guard?

[hands11]

My concern with Porter is how the Wizards plan to develop him.

What does that even mean? Don't you have that same concern for literally every other prospect in the draft?

I think with Porter it would be the lowest concern. Wall and Beal seem to have developed well with the Wizards. They seem to be guys who are motivated on their own to improve. Porter looks like one of the lowest risk prospects in this regard. Oladipo seems similar in this area.

Where I think the Wizards have failed is those who need more structure and support in their development. It seems the success stories with those types of players have been where they can be offered a relatively limited role and then earn more minutes(i.e. Stephenson). Even with organizations that seem to have the right approach, it isn't 100%(Rockets - Royce White) or doesn't last(Spurs, Steven Jackson).

I think the Wizard ability to develop players get way over stated here. Its not a static equation.

The best things a club can do in that regard is:

1 - Pick the right players - that's skills, smarts, work ethic, character, etc
2 - Have a good HC, systems, team for those new players to come to.
3 - Pick players who you can get minutes because of #1. They need to fit what you are doing.

Wall, as talented as he was, didn't develop as fast as he could because of #2
Beal developed faster because while at the start of the year, #2 wasn't fully in place but he got that latter in year one. And it really helped him. Nene, Okafor, Webster and Trevor A and Randy have a lot to do with why Wall and Beal developed nicely last year. As do Wall and Beal being who they are. Its because of all 3 things.

Ves, Singleton, Kevin S all came to a blown up team. New owner. Fired coach. Vets shipped off. Now if Wall was hurt by the lack of quality stability, you think these three weren't? Plus they were not Wall or Beal level people/talents.

This is why its important to keep players like Nene, Okafor, and Webster. They can't let this team get to young again before Wall and Beal have matured enough to carry it forward. And key to that is getting them into the playoffs next year. For me, I think they will need that level of experience for two years before they will be ready to lead well enough that you can afford to start trimming back a little on the Okafor/Nene type of player on the team.

Best path I see for the Wizards would be to plan on having Okafor here longer term. Let him transition to the bench eventually. And Webster need to stay at least 3 years as well. Probably Nene as well.

The big question right now is Nene. What do we really have in Nene ? If he can rebound healthy this year, we are looking really good. If he doesn't, they could still benefit from him being around, but he would be overpaid. Nothing that would kill them. Just not ideal. He brings enough with his vet presence and experience that they need to keep him around. Then after two more seasons, he is an expiring.

Point is, its a combination of things that leads to what people call player development. Its not just sending players to the DL. All three things are important. As the Wizards stand today, they should have a easy time watching their pick develop given what they will have available to them and how the team is currently set up.

Whoever they add, this is the best situation any draft pick they have added has had in a long long time. As long as they don't ship off the vets.

[Dark Faze]

Well here's the thing, is Cousins inefficient because of bad point guard play? Who's to say he won';t improve and get himself in control with Wall as his point guard?

Probably not. He takes a ton of shots. He averages almost 17 attempts per game for his career as a C...think about that for a moment.

If he only takes good shots and rarely iso's then of course he can be efficient, but if he does that then he's not really the Demarcus Cousins you were expecting. Ideally you want him to be able to dominant in isolation at a high percentage but he's simply been incapable of that. Having John wouldn't help him at all there.

If he stops all of his bad habbits and shoots maybe 12 shots a game as he should then he can have a great percentage, but his stats would probably only be something like 14, 10 and 2 with average to bad defense.

Every aspect of his averages are based off of high volume bad shooting. The high free throw attempts are there because he misses shots, gets boards and gets fouled during the finish, or he's taking so many bad outside shots that guys fall for the fake and foul him on the drive. Rebounds, free throw attempts, essentially everything you want from DMC goes down considerably if he actually plays efficiently.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

I think you wait to see Cousins 4th year production before you make a move on him. Right now his stats are just so bad in every conceivable metric. Getting an offensive focused big who is terribly inefficient offensively would be a dumb contract to take on, nevermind the fact that his teammates always hate him.

I understand why people want him though. His flat out per game stats are nice but once efficiency and usage come into the picture I wouldn't touch him with a 10 foot pole.

Yeah, I agree, DF.

I think the longer the Wizards wait the better for any Cousins trade. Okafor is a solid veteran on an expiring deal who can become a very valuable trade asset. So is Ariza. The best thing would probably be to wait because other deals are possible.

I like Cousins but the most I would.want is to swap picks and give Seraphin, and to possibly absorb Salmons' bad contract. I would not give up a lottery pick because Cousins needs a new deal and as much as I like him there certainly are risks with him,

[Dark Faze]

Yep.

And for all we know Nene finally gets right and our starting frontcourt plays 75+ games each with good numbers.

We have to see how things play out.

New quotes out from Wall reemphasizing the want of a stretch 4.

It's kind of starting to bug me. I don't know if he's a huge fan of Bennett or if he simply has no idea about who's available in this draft and is simply asking for what most penetrate and kick guys would want or what, but I think it sends a mixed message about what he's advocating for. He says he wants vets, but knows our front court is set. He wants a stretch 4, does he want Nene gone? Does he care that much about a stretch 4 coming off the bench?

I just wish he'd go into more detail, specifically if he likes Bennett or not over Porter.

[verbal8]

Cousins looks like Chris Kaman with better rebounding, better passing but more fouls. In a "buy-low" scenario he might be a good addition, however I think there is enough interest that another team will make a better offer.

The only scenario I see as the Wizards having an attractive offer that doesn't involve Wall or Beal would be Noel being available with the 3rd pick and Porter being taken. The 3rd pick might be very appealing for Sacramento in that scenario.

I think you wait to see Cousins 4th year production before you make a move on him. Right now his stats are just so bad in every conceivable metric. Getting an offensive focused big who is terribly inefficient offensively would be a dumb contract to take on, nevermind the fact that his teammates always hate him.

I understand why people want him though. His flat out per game stats are nice but once efficiency and usage come into the picture I wouldn't touch him with a 10 foot pole.

Yeah, I agree, DF.

I think the longer the Wizards wait the better for any Cousins trade. Okafor is a solid veteran on an expiring deal who can become a very valuable trade asset. So is Ariza. The best thing would probably be to wait because other deals are possible.

I like Cousins but the most I would.want is to swap picks and give Seraphin, and to possibly absorb Salmons' bad contract. I would not give up a lottery pick because Cousins needs a new deal and as much as I like him there certainly are risks with him,

[nate33]

I just wish he'd go into more detail, specifically if he likes Bennett or not over Porter.

The last thing Wall needs to do is to go public about which specific player he wants in the draft. First, it limits our negotiating position with respect to trades. Secondly, it makes Wall seem like an ass for trying to run the team when he is only a 22-year-old with 184 career games under his belt.

I'm sure the front office knows exactly what Wall wants.

[Dat2U]

I haven't read anything saying Wall wants us to draft a specfic player. I wouldn't worry about what Wall wants at this stage, although he's right about wanting a stretch 4 and a 3rd guard.

[verbal8]

I haven't read anything saying Wall wants us to draft a specfic player. I wouldn't worry about what Wall wants at this stage, although he's right about wanting a stretch 4 and a 3rd guard.

I think this a good sign that he seems to realize what the team is missing to be successful. I also agree with Nate's point that you don't want an player early in his career serving as de facto GM. I think the track record of that is worse than EG's.

[fishercob]

I hope we come away from this draft with a center with big defensive upside. There seem to be many more such guys than in a typical draft. So whether it's moving up for Noel, or Len, Adams, Gobert, Lucas Nogueira, Jaiteh -- or even one of the older guys like Dieng or Withey -- I hope we get a young defensive center.

[Dark Faze]

I haven't read anything saying Wall wants us to draft a specfic player. I wouldn't worry about what Wall wants at this stage, although he's right about wanting a stretch 4 and a 3rd guard.

The only 4 who has legitimately shown stretch 4 ability is Bennett, so he may as well have simply said it.

I'm starting to think he might be the pick. That in combination with Ernies comments about how he may have chosen the guy at 3 that may have been available at 8, Bennett falls right in line with his and Walls comments.

[truwizfan4evr]

I haven't read anything saying Wall wants us to draft a specfic player. I wouldn't worry about what Wall wants at this stage, although he's right about wanting a stretch 4 and a 3rd guard.

I think this a good sign that he seems to realize what the team is missing to be successful. I also agree with Nate's point that you don't want an player early in his career serving as de facto GM. I think the track record of that is worse than EG's.

Well Wall wanted Beal and he was right about that. I don't mind if wall give his opinion on whom wizards should get he has to play with these players so he has a good idea on whom wizards should take a good look at in the draft.

[pancakes3]

I hope we come away from this draft with a center with big defensive upside. There seem to be many more such guys than in a typical draft. So whether it's moving up for Noel, or Len, Adams, Gobert, Lucas Nogueira, Jaiteh -- or even one of the older guys like Dieng or Withey -- I hope we get a young defensive center.

I agree. There have been a lot of good young C's as of late and this draft is deeper than most in terms of Center talent. A Pekovic/Vucevic type pickup in Adams/Len at the expense of Porter almost makes it seem worth it.

[fishercob]

I haven't read anything saying Wall wants us to draft a specfic player. I wouldn't worry about what Wall wants at this stage, although he's right about wanting a stretch 4 and a 3rd guard.

The only 4 who has legitimately shown stretch 4 ability is Bennett, so he may as well have simply said it.

I'm starting to think he might be the pick. That in combination with Ernies comments about how he may have chosen the guy at 3 that may have been available at 8, Bennett falls right in line with his and Walls comments.

Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. I don't think Wall has a vested interest in an individual; I think he wants a forward he can pick and pop with. That could be Bennett. But it could also be Zeller or Olynyk or Porter or Ilyasova of Carl Landry.