GT #43: WAS 21-21 in UTA 14-29, Sat Jan 25th 9pm, CSN+

[Brazil88]

Kinda off topic, but....

if Whitman gets fired I really hope they hire Lionel Hollins. Don't think George Karl is the solution.

[hands11]

Big picture, the stuff you wrote is correct. But it was the starting group that struggled this game. The bench got them a 10 pts plus lead in the 2nd.

Our bench - 18 pts, Utah bench - 52. Our bench is the real problem, not starters. Randy's rotation is the problem and our GM roster is the problem.

AllStar break is good time to hire new coach, but I'm afraid it's not gonna happen and the season will be lost.

Never mind. I don't want to argue. Look for common ground. Not going to debate your response to just a piece of what I wrote.

There are lots of problems and they are interconnected.

[stevemcqueen1]

Big picture, the stuff you wrote is correct. But it was the starting group that struggled this game. The bench got them a 10 pts plus lead in the 2nd.

Our bench - 18 pts, Utah bench - 52. Our bench is the real problem, not starters. Randy's rotation is the problem and our GM roster is the problem.

AllStar break is good time to hire new coach, but I'm afraid it's not gonna happen and the season will be lost.

Randy will finish the season. We're not going to make an outside hire at this point. Hell Randy will get an extension before we fire him and hire someone from outside midseason.

What'd happen is Cassell or one of the other assistants would get promoted. And then they'd probably get the job over the summer.

The season was lost before it began if we're talking about actually contending. We never had the players or coach for that goal.

A better goal is to finish 3-6. 3rd or 4th is preferred, but really anything but the 7th or 8th seed is OK.

If we get the 7th or 8th seed we'll simply be embarrassed and lose in 4 or 5 games. It'd be nice to make the playoffs. But 7th or 8th has to be considered a failure.

Either way, Randy's contract is up this summer and we absolutely should get a new coach. But we all know we won't. I bet Randy gets another two year extension. We tread water as a mid seed during that time. Nene declines by the end. And we'll waste two more seasons of Wall's career. He'll have spent the first half of his career playing for a lame duck Flip Saunders and Wittman--arguably the weakest coach in the league. What a waste. We're a second rate organization.

[hands11]

Big picture, the stuff you wrote is correct. But it was the starting group that struggled this game. The bench got them a 10 pts plus lead in the 2nd.

Our bench - 18 pts, Utah bench - 52. Our bench is the real problem, not starters. Randy's rotation is the problem and our GM roster is the problem.

AllStar break is good time to hire new coach, but I'm afraid it's not gonna happen and the season will be lost.

Randy will finish the season. We're not going to make an outside hire at this point. Hell Randy will get an extension before we fire him and hire someone from outside midseason.

What'd happen is Cassell or one of the other assistants would get promoted. And then they'd probably get the job over the summer.

The season was lost before it began if we're talking about actually contending. We never had the players or coach for that goal.

A better goal is to finish 3-6. 3rd or 4th is preferred, but really anything but the 7th or 8th seed is OK.

If we get the 7th or 8th seed we'll simply be embarrassed and lose in 4 or 5 games. It'd be nice to make the playoffs. But 7th or 8th has to be considered a failure.

Either way, Randy's contract is up this summer and we absolutely should get a new coach. But we all know we won't. I bet Randy gets another two year extension. We tread water as a mid seed during that time. Nene declines by the end. And we'll waste two more seasons of Wall's career. He'll have spent the first half of his career playing for a lame duck Flip Saunders and Wittman--arguably the weakest coach in the league. What a waste. We're a second rate organization.

Not in that camp. I doubt he gets extended. They will have to many better options available, They haven't had that before. I fully expect them to get a legit head coach. Better then Doug Collins or Flip.

That's what I expect.

If Randy gets to ride out the season, they would have done more then enough for him. He will get that on his resume. Coached a team into the playoffs. Maybe he will learn something that helps his career. But I don't think there will be a line up of teams looking to sign him as their next head coach. And there in is a good gauge. He was in the right place at the right time and got a team to the playoffs. But would you pick him over the other available names. I don't think most teams would.

Nor should we.

[gaspar]

The Gortat hate is out of control. It is flat wrong to pin the loss on Gortat.

Wall and Beal combined to shoot 9-30. Wall had 4 assists and 4 turnovers. Trey Burke had 8 assists and 2 turnovers. He made 4 threes. Alec Burke shot well, too.

The poor rotations that Wittman used to end the third and start the fourth are as much to blame as anything. Washington has horrible depth.

Gortat missed a shot that would have tied the score at 92. He had no answer to stop Kanter. But the guy hsd 14 and 11 on 12 shots and finished +7. He and Ariza make the same amount. Wall is the player who will make the max.

The Wizards are mediocre because between coach and GM they keep Singleton, Vesely, and Maynor but waive Kendall Marshall. Instead of saving money to pay a guy who WANTED to play for Washington, DeJuan Blsir, Ernie Grunfeld rushed to overpay Maynor. Nene and Gortat need more than Booker or Seraphin to deal with Favors and Kanter.

Gortat is being hated on for being a free agent. Wizard fans love to hate one player ot another. You guys hating, Gortat need to consider his actual sslatu, actual performance, and that he didn't waive a PG who has 7 double doubles in only 12 starts. Blame this on a weak bench.

Sent from my SGH-M919 using RealGM Forums mobile app

I agree the blame should not be only on Gortat...as i said already, to me the blame for THIS specific game should be on the players. All of them (Ariza, Nene and for some parts Beal and Seraphin get a little less for being the better performers). Of course Gortat letting Kanter have a Olajuwon night is a big deal.

But, at least TO ME, what irritates me the most is not even his struggles on the defensive end. It's more about his passiveness on the subject. I mean, I can understand if he can't guard a young talented center because he's unathletic or because he was never taught the fundamentals of good defense. I just can't understand why he kept being so passive after being constantly abused by Kanter.

At some point you want your center to be called for a hard foul (not to hurt anyone, obviously), at least to show to your teammates, your coaches and the fans of your team that you give a ****. I understand that this is the NBA and most players are not going to be intimidated by a hard foul, but at least show your teammates you care about being penetrated in your behind without any lube. It must be much more frustrating to them then to us...because they're trying to make a stop and everytime the other team gives the ball to their center they score.

At one point, I was hoping for Whitman to send Vesely to the court (this is how frustrated one can be with Gortat's defense) just to see Vesely foul out in 5 minutes but at least make Kanter work harder for his points.

You can watch all Kenter's field goals HERE. Gortat was responsible for maybe two of them.

[Mickstix]

No excuses, they just a bust! And all the chatter on coach and GM.. Come on fellas, you guys are smarter then that! Ted will extend BOTH those guys just on the fact that they'll make the playoffs.. It's a championship equivalent in Ted's eyes.. WE ALREADY KNOW THIS!! Just look across the isle at The Caps and George McPhee..

[queridiculo]

The owner set the bar so low, of course Grunfeld will be back. Extending Wittman however would be the ultimate slap in the face, really tough to stomach.

[payitforward]

The owner set the bar so low, of course Grunfeld will be back. Extending Wittman however would be the ultimate slap in the face, really tough to stomach.

What's the difference? If Grunfeld is still our GM next year, that closes the book on this generation of the Wizards (i.e. beginning w/ the #1 pick in the 2010 draft). It doesn't matter who coaches a team that doesn't have good enough players.

[payitforward]

I wasn't able to watch last night's game, tho I recorded it (but probably won't bother with the pain of watching a last quarter loss). Our three starting bigs went 23-42 in 103 minutes; the rest of the team shot 16-49 in 137 minutes. Don't have to look much beyond that to see where the problems were on offense.

It also looks like we had no answer for Favors and Kanter, either on the boards or scoring. In a combined 64 minutes, they went 14-21 from the floor, 7-9 from the line, and grabbed 19 rebounds.

With Wall unable to put the ball in the bucket, and given Utah's unreal TS% in this game, it's kind of amazing we kept it close! Credit offensive rebounding and lack of TOs for that.

Hey, Utah was coming off of 3 days rest and eating home cooking; we were on the 2d night of a back-to-back on the road. We couldn't quite get it done in the 4th quarter -- yet, if Ariza makes w/ 10 seconds left we have a chance to win.

I'm not blaming anybody for this kind of loss!

[dckingsfan]

At some point we got stop putting all the blame on Whitman.

This is a horrible team they just lost to. Last 2 losses were against crap tanking teams. At some point we got put the blame on the players. Gortat plays **** defense all night long on Kanter, Wall only feels like he wants to play in the last possessions. His defense on Burke was bad too (another midget rookie going 4-5 on 3pt shots)

Beal disappeared, Webster with an airball and bad defense also. Temple not knowing his place and trying to do too much on the offensive end.

And above it all, blame should be on the players because it's another wasted opportunity to break the .500 mark and they just choked again. Don't they have any pride? It's beyond embarrassing, it's beyond frustrating.

I think it comes down to not having good playmaking nor defense off the bench. Guard depth is really problematic for Washington. Maybe Vesely could have helped better than Serapin in this game because he can be a disruptive defender. That's on Wittman.

However, if you need Vesely's help thst speaks to just how bad the bench is.

If you are a coach and you have to choose between Seraphin and Vesely and your backup PG is Temple... let's just say you are totally screwed.

[payitforward]

At some point we got stop putting all the blame on Whitman.

This is a horrible team they just lost to. Last 2 losses were against crap tanking teams. At some point we got put the blame on the players. Gortat plays **** defense all night long on Kanter, Wall only feels like he wants to play in the last possessions. His defense on Burke was bad too (another midget rookie going 4-5 on 3pt shots)

Beal disappeared, Webster with an airball and bad defense also. Temple not knowing his place and trying to do too much on the offensive end.

And above it all, blame should be on the players because it's another wasted opportunity to break the .500 mark and they just choked again. Don't they have any pride? It's beyond embarrassing, it's beyond frustrating.

Utah isn't a good team, but their last loss was to Minny -- not a "crap tanking team." And they were at home on 3 days rest.

Of course the players are responsible for this or any loss -- if that weren't true, you couldn't give the players credit for their wins! But "blame"...? That's the wrong word.

Are you going to blame Garrett Temple for not being a better NBA player than he is? Or Webster for missing a shot when he's playing w/ the flu, because we have no bench and we're on night 2 of a b2b on the road? Or Harrington and Maynor for being two washed up players coming off injuries?

In truth, I wouldn't even have written this post except you left out the one guy who certainly is to blame -- Ernie Grunfeld. Fire Ernie and you take the biggest single step forward possible for this franchise. Extend him, and this generation of the Wizards is a lost cause.

[DCZards]

I wasn't able to watch last night's game, tho I recorded it (but probably won't bother with the pain of watching a last quarter loss). Our three starting bigs went 23-42 in 103 minutes; the rest of the team shot 16-49 in 137 minutes. Don't have to look much beyond that to see where the problems were on offense.

It also looks like we had no answer for Favors and Kanter, either on the boards or scoring. In a combined 64 minutes, they went 14-21 from the floor, 7-9 from the line, and grabbed 19 rebounds.

With Wall unable to put the ball in the bucket, and given Utah's unreal TS% in this game, it's kind of amazing we kept it close! Credit offensive rebounding and lack of TOs for that.

Hey, Utah was coming off of 3 days rest and eating home cooking; we were on the 2d night of a back-to-back on the road. We couldn't quite get it done in the 4th quarter -- yet, if Ariza makes w/ 10 seconds left we have a chance to win.

I'm not blaming anybody for this kind of loss!

There you go again, pif, trying to be reasonable and factual. You know these game threads are all about white-hot emotion, hate and blame. You can't reason with that kind of stuff.

But you're right. If you're going to blame anyone it's EG and this team's utter lack of depth.

[tontoz]

The Wizards lost because they aren't that good. Even though they are relatively healthy they have lost to 3 crap teams (Detroit, Boston, Utah) over the last 5 games.

[Dark Faze]

The Wizards lost because they aren't that good. Even though they are relatively healthy they have lost to 3 crap teams (Detroit, Boston, Utah) over the last 5 games.

but we'll extend everyone anyway

[SUPERBALLMAN]

Kinda funny looking at headlines and seeing Bulls are interested in getting 'Melo, meanwhile the Wizards are interested in Gortat (their own player).

The problem with games like the win vs the Heat is it gives Ted and Ernie the belief this is a team on the verge, and when healthy and playing like they can they can compete with the top teams in the league.

I suppose I'm not opposed to signing Gortat to a contract that would expire with Nene's, as we're kind of stuck until then with Nene anyway, and the two of them do seem to compliment each other fairly well. Interested in team's thinking on Ariza moving forward, he's really playing at a high level and seems a better fit for this team than even Gortat.

Monroe is the only FA that really interests me. Monroe or Kanter could be better long term answers than Gortat. Nene at this point is really limiting our options however.

I would really to get a top level coach for this team regardless. My top choice would be Nate McMillan.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nate_McMillan

[Kanyewest]

There was no energy from Wall- it looked like he was sick.

[nate33]

I wasn't able to watch last night's game, tho I recorded it (but probably won't bother with the pain of watching a last quarter loss). Our three starting bigs went 23-42 in 103 minutes; the rest of the team shot 16-49 in 137 minutes. Don't have to look much beyond that to see where the problems were on offense.

It also looks like we had no answer for Favors and Kanter, either on the boards or scoring. In a combined 64 minutes, they went 14-21 from the floor, 7-9 from the line, and grabbed 19 rebounds.

With Wall unable to put the ball in the bucket, and given Utah's unreal TS% in this game, it's kind of amazing we kept it close! Credit offensive rebounding and lack of TOs for that.

Hey, Utah was coming off of 3 days rest and eating home cooking; we were on the 2d night of a back-to-back on the road. We couldn't quite get it done in the 4th quarter -- yet, if Ariza makes w/ 10 seconds left we have a chance to win.

I'm not blaming anybody for this kind of loss!

There you go again, pif, trying to be reasonable and factual. You know these game threads are all about white-hot emotion, hate and blame. You can't reason with that kind of stuff.

But you're right. If you're going to blame anyone it's EG and this team's utter lack of depth.

I agree with PIF. The Wizards weren't hitting from the perimeter. Utah's bigs were on fire. And despite that, we were in the game all night and really could have won it if Beal hit that wide open 3 with about 1:30 to go in the 4th. That would have tied it up and changed the outcome in the last minute.

It wasn't a great game by the Wizards, but it wasn't awful. I chalk this one up to randomness. Some days, the other team hits shots and you don't, and you end up losing. Move on to the next game.

[hands11]

Kinda funny looking at headlines and seeing Bulls are interested in getting 'Melo, meanwhile the Wizards are interested in Gortat (their own player).

The problem with games like the win vs the Heat is it gives Ted and Ernie the belief this is a team on the verge, and when healthy and playing like they can they can compete with the top teams in the league.

I suppose I'm not opposed to signing Gortat to a contract that would expire with Nene's, as we're kind of stuck until then with Nene anyway, and the two of them do seem to compliment each other fairly well. Interested in team's thinking on Ariza moving forward, he's really playing at a high level and seems a better fit for this team than even Gortat.

Monroe is the only FA that really interests me. Monroe or Kanter could be better long term answers than Gortat. Nene at this point is really limiting our options however.

I would really to get a top level coach for this team regardless. My top choice would be Nate McMillan.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nate_McMillan

Interesting. No Wall post game interview.

http://www.monumentalnetwork.com/videos ... me-1-25-14

Just Randy, TA, Gortat and Beal. That's unusual.

I disagree with the posts saying its just about EG and people that comment on other things are wrong in some way. Sure, ultimately for them to have a long term path they need to change EG, then change the coach and get the right fit of players. Most agree with that and have for a while. But just because that is true doesn't mean there isn't game to game commentary to take place which is looking at things in the exact reverse of the pyramid isn't valid.

From the ground up, how did players play? How did the coach use what he had ?

Coaching is a huge issue but it doesn't seem like there is an answer until the season is over which is very frustrating because with a better coach they could be 4-5 or more games over .500.

As for moves, I think all most here would want an EG on his way out to do is tweak. They could really use help at back up PG. We can still hold out hope for that, but things aren't looking good. EG missed at the easy windows to do that. Can he move Maynor and Singleton ? Its not looking good.

Coach ? Again, not likely they change unless its looking like they are falling out of the playoffs. If its falling apart they might change to Newman or Sam just to end the pain of watching Randy.

That leaves the players and that's what's concerning. Not because of the bench which we now could use some help. The bench last game was Booker and Webster. Most like those two. Then Kevin. Kevin was 3-5, 3 rebounds, 1 assist in 13 mins for 6 pts. That's not terrible. Then Temple. Well 14 mins of Temple who was 4-4 from the line, 2 rebounds in 14 minutes didn't lose them the game.

They lost because of Wall mostly. And since that was also the case the game before last, this is the real story.

To me the season started being about Wall and Beal and that's still the case. Neither is playing up to their potential. At least Beal got 8 assists, but his shooting still sucked. Wall ? Lets hope he was sick and sucking it up because that was a serious egg he laid.

This team is only going to be good now and down the road if Wall is really good. What the hell is going on with Wall ? Why can't he say focused ? Is he starting to tone out Randy ? Has he given up on him as a coach ?

Randy will last only as long as he isn't losing Wall and Beal. They already tied his hands so he can't injury Beal. I think they know he is on his way out. They will let him coach as long as possible but they aren't going to sit by and watch him do damage. I think Randy is skating on thin ice.

[Youheardme90]

I wasn't able to watch last night's game, tho I recorded it (but probably won't bother with the pain of watching a last quarter loss). Our three starting bigs went 23-42 in 103 minutes; the rest of the team shot 16-49 in 137 minutes. Don't have to look much beyond that to see where the problems were on offense.

It also looks like we had no answer for Favors and Kanter, either on the boards or scoring. In a combined 64 minutes, they went 14-21 from the floor, 7-9 from the line, and grabbed 19 rebounds.

With Wall unable to put the ball in the bucket, and given Utah's unreal TS% in this game, it's kind of amazing we kept it close! Credit offensive rebounding and lack of TOs for that.

Hey, Utah was coming off of 3 days rest and eating home cooking; we were on the 2d night of a back-to-back on the road. We couldn't quite get it done in the 4th quarter -- yet, if Ariza makes w/ 10 seconds left we have a chance to win.

I'm not blaming anybody for this kind of loss!

There you go again, pif, trying to be reasonable and factual. You know these game threads are all about white-hot emotion, hate and blame. You can't reason with that kind of stuff.

But you're right. If you're going to blame anyone it's EG and this team's utter lack of depth.

I agree with PIF. The Wizards weren't hitting from the perimeter. Utah's bigs were on fire. And despite that, we were in the game all night and really could have won it if Beal hit that wide open 3 with about 1:30 to go in the 4th. That would have tied it up and changed the outcome in the last minute.

It wasn't a great game by the Wizards, but it wasn't awful. I chalk this one up to randomness. Some days, the other team hits shots and you don't, and you end up losing. Move on to the next game.

I would tend to agree with that sentiment, you have to move on and remember that it is only January. Having said that, games like these tend to further highlight our lack of depth. Most good teams have a solid second unit, or at least 1 or 2 players coming off the bench to sustain the team in the second night of back to backs. We simply don`t have that right now, at least not consistently.

[payitforward]

I wasn't able to watch last night's game, tho I recorded it (but probably won't bother with the pain of watching a last quarter loss). Our three starting bigs went 23-42 in 103 minutes; the rest of the team shot 16-49 in 137 minutes. Don't have to look much beyond that to see where the problems were on offense.

It also looks like we had no answer for Favors and Kanter, either on the boards or scoring. In a combined 64 minutes, they went 14-21 from the floor, 7-9 from the line, and grabbed 19 rebounds.

With Wall unable to put the ball in the bucket, and given Utah's unreal TS% in this game, it's kind of amazing we kept it close! Credit offensive rebounding and lack of TOs for that.

Hey, Utah was coming off of 3 days rest and eating home cooking; we were on the 2d night of a back-to-back on the road. We couldn't quite get it done in the 4th quarter -- yet, if Ariza makes w/ 10 seconds left we have a chance to win.

I'm not blaming anybody for this kind of loss!

There you go again, pif, trying to be reasonable and factual. You know these game threads are all about white-hot emotion, hate and blame. You can't reason with that kind of stuff.

But you're right. If you're going to blame anyone it's EG and this team's utter lack of depth.

I blame myself really -- for not knowing how to get to Ted and explain how messed up he's made things! I know he'd listen, because -- like me -- he's "reasonable and factual."

And I blame all you guys who thought we made good decisions around Maynor and Harrington. I blame Hands too, because of how much he likes to be right all the time.

But other than me, the person most to blame is Nivek; really, it's all his fault. If he weren't able to explain to our players how relatively non-productive they are, maybe they wouldn't get down on themselves.

And LyricalRico too -- really it's all his fault, isn't it? I'm sure of it.

Not to worry, we're going to win in California, and when we do it'll be because of me. Oh what the heck... because of you too Zards.