Moderators: montestewart, LyricalRico, nate33
NatP4 wrote:I would definitely not trade our 1st for Brunson. Jones at the MLE is a way better option.
9 and 20 wrote:Gafford and Zingus playing together - does that change anything? Maybe it makes room for Bryant to come back? Doubt it, but it does mean we may need a decent third string center. Embiid-slayer Gafzingus takeover begins.
Also, maybe less room for one of the forwards. So either Kuzma or Rui getting sent out is more likely now. I'm good with it. Kuzma occasionally going off for 25 and 7 but more often wild flailing is entertaining but not really winning basketball. Rui can only be good at 1 thing at a time. Last year, it was shoulder bump at the key, jumper. This year, it's open 3's. Get me some better basketball players, Terd, or get lost.
B8RcDeMktfxC wrote:NatP4 wrote:I would definitely not trade our 1st for Brunson. Jones at the MLE is a way better option.
The MLE will be $10.35m. Ty Jones is extremely likely to make a decent amount more than that.
Here's a somewhat suggestive recent article on the value of good backup PGs and this year's PG FA market from a Memphis pov.
https://eu.commercialappeal.com/story/sports/nba/grizzlies/2022/04/01/tyus-jones-contract-memphis-grizzlies-nba-free-agents-2022-unrestricted/7173784001/
Logical teams who could be searching for point guard help are the Washington Wizards, Los Angeles Lakers, New York Knicks, Orlando Magic and the New Orleans Pelicans.
B8RcDeMktfxC wrote:NatP4 wrote:I would definitely not trade our 1st for Brunson. Jones at the MLE is a way better option.
The MLE will be $10.35m. Ty Jones is extremely likely to make a decent amount more than that.
Here's a somewhat suggestive recent article on the value of good backup PGs and this year's PG FA market from a Memphis pov.
https://eu.commercialappeal.com/story/sports/nba/grizzlies/2022/04/01/tyus-jones-contract-memphis-grizzlies-nba-free-agents-2022-unrestricted/7173784001/
nate33 wrote:B8RcDeMktfxC wrote:NatP4 wrote:I would definitely not trade our 1st for Brunson. Jones at the MLE is a way better option.
The MLE will be $10.35m. Ty Jones is extremely likely to make a decent amount more than that.
Here's a somewhat suggestive recent article on the value of good backup PGs and this year's PG FA market from a Memphis pov.
https://eu.commercialappeal.com/story/sports/nba/grizzlies/2022/04/01/tyus-jones-contract-memphis-grizzlies-nba-free-agents-2022-unrestricted/7173784001/
I found this passage to be the most illuminating:Logical teams who could be searching for point guard help are the Washington Wizards, Los Angeles Lakers, New York Knicks, Orlando Magic and the New Orleans Pelicans.
The Lakers have only the room exception so we can outbid them. The Magic have 3 young PGs and aren't looking for a 4th. The Pelicans have only about $4M in luxtax room. That leaves just the Knicks, who will probably go after Brunson.
Ruzious wrote:B8RcDeMktfxC wrote:NatP4 wrote:I would definitely not trade our 1st for Brunson. Jones at the MLE is a way better option.
The MLE will be $10.35m. Ty Jones is extremely likely to make a decent amount more than that.
Here's a somewhat suggestive recent article on the value of good backup PGs and this year's PG FA market from a Memphis pov.
https://eu.commercialappeal.com/story/sports/nba/grizzlies/2022/04/01/tyus-jones-contract-memphis-grizzlies-nba-free-agents-2022-unrestricted/7173784001/
He's leading the league in assist/to ratio for the 4th straight year? So it must be a fluke.
If he costs more than the MLE, maybe sign and trade with Kuz is the way to go. Kuz is nice for then because his expiring contract gives them flexibility.
CntOutSmrtCrazy wrote:Bryant by all accounts is a hard worker, is a great teammate, plays with hustle and passion, he just happens to have one fatal flaw that makes him a massive liability on an NBA court, and that's defense. Now if he somehow turns into an adequate defender then good on him, we just haven't seen a shred of evidence or a sustained stretch from him, even in a single game, that makes you believe that's a possibility.
B8RcDeMktfxC wrote:Ruzious wrote:B8RcDeMktfxC wrote:The MLE will be $10.35m. Ty Jones is extremely likely to make a decent amount more than that.
Here's a somewhat suggestive recent article on the value of good backup PGs and this year's PG FA market from a Memphis pov.
https://eu.commercialappeal.com/story/sports/nba/grizzlies/2022/04/01/tyus-jones-contract-memphis-grizzlies-nba-free-agents-2022-unrestricted/7173784001/
He's leading the league in assist/to ratio for the 4th straight year? So it must be a fluke.
If he costs more than the MLE, maybe sign and trade with Kuz is the way to go. Kuz is nice for then because his expiring contract gives them flexibility.
Kuz has good value as a trade asset imo. Dallas would be extremely happy to get him back if Brunson wants to leave, you would think.
NatP4 wrote:B8RcDeMktfxC wrote:Ruzious wrote:He's leading the league in assist/to ratio for the 4th straight year? So it must be a fluke.
If he costs more than the MLE, maybe sign and trade with Kuz is the way to go. Kuz is nice for then because his expiring contract gives them flexibility.
Kuz has good value as a trade asset imo. Dallas would be extremely happy to get him back if Brunson wants to leave, you would think.
I still believe Dallas would do that trade and that Brunson is well worth 18 mill/year
doclinkin wrote:CntOutSmrtCrazy wrote:Bryant by all accounts is a hard worker, is a great teammate, plays with hustle and passion, he just happens to have one fatal flaw that makes him a massive liability on an NBA court, and that's defense. Now if he somehow turns into an adequate defender then good on him, we just haven't seen a shred of evidence or a sustained stretch from him, even in a single game, that makes you believe that's a possibility.
TB did have a sustained stretch of defense under the spotlight in the Bubble play-in games. Here we see him snuffing Embiid with footwork and long arms. A few other examples of his improved footwork, swiveling his hips to run with an attacker. He was active with rebounds and blocks and taking up space.
I'd take that guy back if we could get him.
In rehab he did look quicker in his side to side movement, I get the feeling he was still recuperating during the season. There was a reason they kept him out for a full year, plus some, even though people were arguing that it should have taken half that time. KD can come back from a leg injury because he has reserves of skill that nobody else can tap and is not a front court last line defender. Bryant as a hustle and energy guy is shot if he is handicapped already more than his natural limit. Can he come back better? Sure. I expect with a full offseason more he will improve, given his willingness to work. I personally would like him re-signed on an injury discount. Seems to me if he rehabs back to that brief bright level (and how he started the following season prior to injury) then we would have a solid back up who can approximate some of the things Porzingus is able to do well.
If no oh well and I wish him well. TB is a solid guy, I like him.
FAH1223 wrote:
Just load up on 6'9 guys who can guard and shoot
nate33 wrote:doclinkin wrote:CntOutSmrtCrazy wrote:Bryant by all accounts is a hard worker, is a great teammate, plays with hustle and passion, he just happens to have one fatal flaw that makes him a massive liability on an NBA court, and that's defense. Now if he somehow turns into an adequate defender then good on him, we just haven't seen a shred of evidence or a sustained stretch from him, even in a single game, that makes you believe that's a possibility.
TB did have a sustained stretch of defense under the spotlight in the Bubble play-in games. Here we see him snuffing Embiid with footwork and long arms. A few other examples of his improved footwork, swiveling his hips to run with an attacker. He was active with rebounds and blocks and taking up space.
I'd take that guy back if we could get him.
In rehab he did look quicker in his side to side movement, I get the feeling he was still recuperating during the season. There was a reason they kept him out for a full year, plus some, even though people were arguing that it should have taken half that time. KD can come back from a leg injury because he has reserves of skill that nobody else can tap and is not a front court last line defender. Bryant as a hustle and energy guy is shot if he is handicapped already more than his natural limit. Can he come back better? Sure. I expect with a full offseason more he will improve, given his willingness to work. I personally would like him re-signed on an injury discount. Seems to me if he rehabs back to that brief bright level (and how he started the following season prior to injury) then we would have a solid back up who can approximate some of the things Porzingus is able to do well.
If no oh well and I wish him well. TB is a solid guy, I like him.
What's good about Bryant is that he could be a poor man's Porzingis in our system. He has the pick and pop ability and the passing ability (though not the post scoring ability). If (when) Porzingis gets hurt, Bryant could replace him and everyone else could continue in essentially the same role.
But when Porzingis is healthy, I don't see any minutes available for Bryant. He would have to agree to a role where he sits most games but starts in the others.
dckingsfan wrote:I would rather have a defensive presence at C to back up Porzingis and Gafford, my 1/2 cent.
CntOutSmrtCrazy wrote:nate33 wrote:doclinkin wrote:
TB did have a sustained stretch of defense under the spotlight in the Bubble play-in games. Here we see him snuffing Embiid with footwork and long arms. A few other examples of his improved footwork, swiveling his hips to run with an attacker. He was active with rebounds and blocks and taking up space.
I'd take that guy back if we could get him.
In rehab he did look quicker in his side to side movement, I get the feeling he was still recuperating during the season. There was a reason they kept him out for a full year, plus some, even though people were arguing that it should have taken half that time. KD can come back from a leg injury because he has reserves of skill that nobody else can tap and is not a front court last line defender. Bryant as a hustle and energy guy is shot if he is handicapped already more than his natural limit. Can he come back better? Sure. I expect with a full offseason more he will improve, given his willingness to work. I personally would like him re-signed on an injury discount. Seems to me if he rehabs back to that brief bright level (and how he started the following season prior to injury) then we would have a solid back up who can approximate some of the things Porzingus is able to do well.
If no oh well and I wish him well. TB is a solid guy, I like him.
What's good about Bryant is that he could be a poor man's Porzingis in our system. He has the pick and pop ability and the passing ability (though not the post scoring ability). If (when) Porzingis gets hurt, Bryant could replace him and everyone else could continue in essentially the same role.
But when Porzingis is healthy, I don't see any minutes available for Bryant. He would have to agree to a role where he sits most games but starts in the others.
So you would be comfortable with Bryant starting 20+ games a year if the goal is to win games with Beal on the roster? Not saying that's my preference, I would like a rebuild, but let's go with the assumption of trying to win with Beal.
Calling Bryant even a poor man's Porzingis at this point is a mighty stretch other than they can both shoot a jumper. How many more games of defensive lapse after defensive lapse do we have to witness to send that point home? The only thing that keeps him from the Neto territory in terms of being a defensive liability is that he has length. Other than that you can almost guarantee that the other team is going to have much less resistance scoring the moment he enters a game.
So a highlight reel block on Embiid, in the bubble, isn't going to change everything I've seen since he's come back from his injury. Or change what we've all seen from his entire tenure in DC. I think some are conflating being a great, hard working guy with being a impactful NBA player.
Frichuela wrote:dckingsfan wrote:I would rather have a defensive presence at C to back up Porzingis and Gafford, my 1/2 cent.
This. 100%.
nate33 wrote:CntOutSmrtCrazy wrote:nate33 wrote:What's good about Bryant is that he could be a poor man's Porzingis in our system. He has the pick and pop ability and the passing ability (though not the post scoring ability). If (when) Porzingis gets hurt, Bryant could replace him and everyone else could continue in essentially the same role.
But when Porzingis is healthy, I don't see any minutes available for Bryant. He would have to agree to a role where he sits most games but starts in the others.
So you would be comfortable with Bryant starting 20+ games a year if the goal is to win games with Beal on the roster? Not saying that's my preference, I would like a rebuild, but let's go with the assumption of trying to win with Beal.
Calling Bryant even a poor man's Porzingis at this point is a mighty stretch other than they can both shoot a jumper. How many more games of defensive lapse after defensive lapse do we have to witness to send that point home? The only thing that keeps him from the Neto territory in terms of being a defensive liability is that he has length. Other than that you can almost guarantee that the other team is going to have much less resistance scoring the moment he enters a game.
So a highlight reel block on Embiid, in the bubble, isn't going to change everything I've seen since he's come back from his injury. Or change what we've all seen from his entire tenure in DC. I think some are conflating being a great, hard working guy with being a impactful NBA player.
"Comfortable" is a stretch. But you have the play the hand you are dealt. Porzingis is our starting center. He is good, but he will miss 20 games. Gafford is our backup center. He is good but seems to only be effective for 20-24 minutes. So we need a 3rd center who can fill in for when Porzingis is hurt, but won't won't cost that much. I think Bryant makes a fair bit of sense. He is Porzingis without the defense. We won't have to change our entire system. Just plug Bryant in and live with worse defense. Another option would be a guy like Robin Lopez for the Biannual Exception or something, but I don't think that's likely.
Bear in mind, assuming we pay a starting PG the full MLE, the only way to sign a backup center is with the vet minimum exception, the BAE, or Bird Rights on Bryant. Can you find a guy with the BAE ($3M) who will be better than Bryant?
