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NatP4 wrote:

payitforward wrote:

NatP4 wrote:...Numbers look very similar to Kawhi in his first two NBA seasons....

Uuuuh, similar how? Don't look remotely similar as far as I can see.

Kawhi per 36: 11.9 points 7.7 rebounds 1.6 assists 2.0 steals 0.6 blocks 57% TS

Bilal per 36: 11.0 points 5.3 rebounds 2.2 assists 1.2 steals 1.0 blocks 54.7% TS

Kawhi was a year older and played on a 50 win Spurs team, as opposed to a team with 11 wins, but never mind that!

It's worth noting that league efficiency was WAY WORSE in Kawhi's rookie season. League average TS% was just .527. It is currently .581. So Kawhi's TS% was 4.3 percentage points above league average. Bilal's is 3.4 percentage points below league average. That's a pretty massive difference in efficiency.

Pace is also about 7% faster now. So on a per-possession basis, you can add 7% to those Kawhi stats to make a proper apples-to-apples comparison. So that would be like 12.9 points, 8.2 rebounds, 1.7 assists, 1.2 steals, 1.0 blocks, and a .625 TS%

That’s not how that works, but sure I’ll play that game.

Can I get a team adjustment based on best team in the league with 3 hall of famers and one of the greatest coaches of all time versus worst team in the league?

NatP4 wrote:That’s not how that works, but sure I’ll play that game.

Can I get a team adjustment based on best team in the league with 3 hall of famers and one of the greatest coaches of all time versus worst team in the league?

I'm not trying to argue with you. I just want those Kawhi numbers put into perspective. You can agree or disagree with the context if you like. But it's pretty undeniable that league efficiency is way different now than it was in Kawhi's rookie year and player evaluations have to factor that. Perhaps one should also account for the fact that Kawhi had better teammates. I don't know exactly how you do that. But I don't think a pure statistical argument that Bilal = Kawhi really holds water.

I didn’t disagree with the context, I disagree with you only providing context that fits your narrative.

“Perhaps one should also account for the fact that Kawhi had better teammates” is such a ridiculous statement. Of course they should. He played on the best team in the league with Tony Parker, Tim Duncan, and Manu Ginobili. They won 50 games. The wizards are 11-53.

NatP4 wrote:I didn’t disagree with the context, I disagree with you only providing context that fits your narrative.

“Perhaps one should also account for the fact that Kawhi had better teammates” is such a ridiculous statement. Of course they should. He played on the best team in the league with Tony Parker, Tim Duncan, and Manu Ginobili. They won 50 games. The wizards are 11-53.

Yes, but does being alongside better teammates help or hurt your individual production? Presumably, Kawhi was more ignored by defenses focusing on Parker, Manu and Duncan, but at the same time, Kawhi lacked opportunities to score and create since he was an afterthought in the offense. And he also had Duncan sucking up all those rebounds that might otherwise fall in his lap. I would expect higher efficiency, but lower usage and rebounding in a situation like San Antonio relative to a situation like ours. Kawhi had higher efficiency, higher usage and higher rebounding than Bilal. For goodness sake, the fact that he was able to be a viable starter on a contender should say something. Do you honestly think that Bilal right now would be a viable starter on a team like Boston or Denver?

I like Bilal as much as the next guy, but comparing him to rookie Kawhi is a stretch. That's all I'm saying.

NatP4 wrote:I didn’t disagree with the context, I disagree with you only providing context that fits your narrative.

“Perhaps one should also account for the fact that Kawhi had better teammates” is such a ridiculous statement. Of course they should. He played on the best team in the league with Tony Parker, Tim Duncan, and Manu Ginobili. They won 50 games. The wizards are 11-53.

The team was even better than a 50 win team given that it was a shortened season. It was on pace for 62 wins in a normal season.
OTOH, Kawhi was able to play 24 minutes per game on a team that was a title contender on a team where Manu and Richard Jefferson (and later Stephen Jackson) play the same position as him which is very impressive. Bilal has been spoon-fed minutes on a team which isn't competing for anything- while it has been good for his development- there were times in the season where he didn't play up to that standard.

I think that Bilal would be a viable starter on the 2011-2012 Spurs, absolutely.

Overall point, there’s nothing alarming about Bilal struggling for a stretch during his 19 year old rookie season while playing for the worst team in the league.

His rookie season has been fine. He’s an exciting young building block piece.

he lives and dies with shooting, and at his age and agility he should go more towards the basket to draw fouls instead of shooting, but the dilemma is that he needs NBA game shooting to get better ! started 0-7 from 3 and finished with 3-3.

remi_222 wrote:he lives and dies with shooting, and at his age and agility he should go more towards the basket to draw fouls instead of shooting, but the dilemma is that he needs NBA game shooting to get better ! started 0-7 from 3 and finished with 3-3.

Got to give credit again to keefe for allowing him to rise through abismal performance - Brooks or Wes would just bench and 'punish' him so that he can 'learn' he 'needs' to better to get playing time.

This was a priceless learning experience - learning that even when you suck - you can get better and pull yourself out of this hole during game..

WTF…

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The curse of Les Boulez is hard to shake but this is as good a time for it to happen as any.

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Damn, a fracture. smh.

That’s going to impact his offseason training, which is probably more important than in-season minutes.

Frichuela wrote:WTF…

Read on Twitter

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Read on Twitter

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Say thanks to DeMar DeRozan

Coulibaly hurting his wrist will set back his offseason training a bit. Interestingly, if Avdija had hurt his right wrist, it might actually help his training.

nate33 wrote:Coulibaly hurting his wrist will set back his offseason training a bit. Interestingly, if Avdija had hurt his right wrist, it might actually help his training.

I don't get the humor.

Eh it'll probably only eat into his off-season training a little bit. Skill training should be good to go in a couple of months or so, just no full contact stuff. Hopefully he connects with Drew Hanlen who has a track record of enhancing the bag of a few Wizards who have rotated in and out with us.

^ One of the std complaints about Deni is that he can't use his left hand.

When my younger child was playing frosh/JV hoops, there was another player
on the team who was all right hand. I mean she literally never used her left hand to
dribble. If I had been a coach, I would have said if you dribble with your right
hand in prax, it's an immediate TO, especially if you do it on the left side of the court.

Too bad about Bilal. He won't be able to shoot 500 (or more) 3s a day until it heals.

The play he got hurt on looked borderline flagrant the way he got pulled down.

Runner300 wrote:

nate33 wrote:Coulibaly hurting his wrist will set back his offseason training a bit. Interestingly, if Avdija had hurt his right wrist, it might actually help his training.

I don't get the humor.

Deni needs to work on his left hand.

Not that bad of an injury, should be able to get back to training within 2 months or size