Grunfeld a Great GM. Proves Doubters Wrong

[Jay81]

what makes Ernie a great GM is that it only took him 5 years to go from winning record to losing record to winning record(sort of). The pheonix GM took 1

[fishercob]

what makes Ernie a great GM is that it only took him 5 years to go from winning record to losing record to winning record(sort of). The pheonix GM took 1

He traded Jared Dudley and a 2nd round pick for Eric Bledsoe.

[closg00]

Ernie usually trades to correct his own mistakes, never to improve the team. PHX also got Gerald Green and Plumlee for Scola. Ironically, that was under the GM that got fired IIRC .

[dckingsfan]

And in addition to their own picks:

2014 first round draft pick from Minnesota
Minnesota's 1st round pick to Phoenix protected for selections 1-13 in 2014, 1-12 in 2015 or 1-12 in 2016; if Minnesota has not conveyed a 1st round pick to Phoenix by 2016, then Minnesota will instead convey its 2016 2nd round pick and 2017 2nd round pick to Phoenix [Minnesota-New Orleans-Phoenix, 7/27/2012]

2014 first round draft pick from Washington
Washington's 1st round pick to Phoenix protected for selections 1-12 in 2014, 1-10 in 2015, 1-10 in 2016, 1-10 in 2017, 1-10 in 2018 or 1-10 in 2019 or unprotected in 2020 [Phoenix-Washington, 10/25/2013]

2014 first round draft pick from Indiana
Indiana's 1st round pick to Phoenix protected for selections 1-14 in 2014, 1-14 in 2015, 1-14 in 2016, 1-14 in 2017, 1-14 in 2018 or 1-14 in 2019 or unprotected in 2020 [Indiana-Phoenix, 7/28/2013]

2015 first round draft pick from L.A. Lakers
L.A. Lakers' 1st round pick to Phoenix protected for selections 1-5 in 2015, 1-3 in 2016 or 1-3 in 2017 or unprotected in 2018 [L.A. Lakers-Phoenix, 7/11/2012]

[dckingsfan]

Assuming they resign Bledsoe (restricted):

G: Eric Bledsoe, Goran Dragic, Ishmael Smith, Archie Goodwin, Gerald Green

F: Channing Frye, Markieff Morris, Marcus Morris

C: Miles Plumlee, Alex Len

After signing Bledsoe they will be at about $40M, they will have 3 first round picks and plenty of cap space for FAs.

Sigh...

[rockymac52]

2015 first round draft pick from L.A. Lakers
L.A. Lakers' 1st round pick to Phoenix protected for selections 1-5 in 2015, 1-3 in 2016 or 1-3 in 2017 or unprotected in 2018 [L.A. Lakers-Phoenix, 7/11/2012]

^^^ This is probably a huge reason why the Lakers are willing to sit tight during free agency this summer and wait until 2015 to chase big name players. They need to be really bad next season if they want to keep their pick, being pretty bad but not awful won't get it done (unless they get real lucky in the lottery, but they can't count on that). I feel bad for Kobe, but hopefully he's still healthy enough to play at a high level in 2015-16 assuming they're able to get stars.

[DCZards]

^^^ This is probably a huge reason why the Lakers are willing to sit tight during free agency this summer and wait until 2015 to chase big name players. They need to be really bad next season if they want to keep their pick, being pretty bad but not awful won't get it done (unless they get real lucky in the lottery, but they can't count on that). I feel bad for Kobe, but hopefully he's still healthy enough to play at a high level in 2015-16 assuming they're able to get stars.

Don't feel too sorry for Kobe. He has 5 NBA championship rings and is going to make almost $80 million in salary over this season and the next two.

[pcbothwel]

Assuming they resign Bledsoe (restricted):

G: Eric Bledsoe, Goran Dragic, Ishmael Smith, Archie Goodwin, Gerald Green

F: Channing Frye, Markieff Morris, Marcus Morris

C: Miles Plumlee, Alex Len

After signing Bledsoe they will be at about $40M, they will have 3 first round picks and plenty of cap space for FAs.

Sigh...

I dont think they'll get any game changers with their 1st round picks. But I actually see a lot of resemblence to them and the Rockets. There getting a bunch of players on rookie contracts and will make a trade of them + 1st for a big player (their Harden). Then use cap space to sign 2nd star.
I could see either Bledsoe or Dragic traded along with one Morris twin and maybe Len and a 1st or two to get a star. Then that player along with Bledsoe/Dragic and some young pieces attracting a FA...

[TGW]

Notice how OP conveniently disappears once the Wizards lose games.

TROLL

[hands11]

As for the Gortat effect on Wall. Could Wall have learned PnR without him? Maybe. But what I saw was he hadn't. Actually Wall was terrible as using picks let alone hitting a roll man off it. Also what I saw was it didn't take Wall long to add the PnR once Gortat arrived. Having an experienced PnR big clearly makes it a lot easier to learn. At least half the play or not more is the roll playing knowing how to set the pick, where, and then timing the roll, catching the pass and then scoring. Wall and Gortat where doing PnR just weeks after they started playing together. Coincidence or affect ? I can't prove it 100% but I think it easy to see Gortat has a lot to do with Wall learning to PnR so quickly after he was added. He was experienced at it. He made Wall part in it easy. Hell, Beal can even run it some now.

I'm not sure I agree with this. I agree with the general concept that adding a big man who is great in the pick and roll would obviously help Wall or any other PG perform better in the pick and roll, but in reality, I'm not sure Wall has actually gotten any better in the pick and roll this season. Here are some synergy stats for Wall to illustrate my point:

Pick and Roll Ball Handler's Offense:
2013: .79 PPP (64th %)
2014: .75 PPP (46th %)

Wall's efficiency when taking the shot in the PnR has actually slightly decreased, and he's now technically below average this season.

Pick and Roll Ball Handler's Passes to the Roll Man:
2013: .88 PPP (31st %) (48% of his passes in PnR go to the roll man, as opposed to spot up shooters or cutters)
2014: .93 PPP (38th %) (40% of his passes in PnR go to the roll man)

Wall has seen a slight increase in his efficiency when passing to the roll man, but he's actually looking to pass to the big man less frequently. Overall, these changes are probably negligible, and regardless, he's soundly below average in terms of efficiency when passing to the roll man.

Gortat's Offense as the Pick and Roll Man:
2013 (with Dragic): 1.16 PPP (82nd %)
2014 (with Wall): 1.03 PPP (59th %)

To be fair, you could look at this two ways: Gortat's stats got worse because Wall isn't as good of a distributor in the PnR as Dragic, or Gortat stats got worse because he got worse (or both).

Just some food for thought. Personally I'm not seeing much improvement in the PnR, either as the scorer or passer, from Wall, DESPITE now having one of the league's best pick and roll men in Gortat instead of one of the league's worst pick and roll men in Okafor (Okafor's PnR stats from 2013: .78 PPP (16th %)).

I don't think you can blame it all on Wall or assume Gortat has declined. The Wizards simply lack the ideal spacing the effectively run the P&R, unless they go small. I think it's gotten a little better with Nene out and they can run it more and more effectively, but when Nene & Booker have been getting the bulk of minutes at PF, defenses simply don't respect either as an outside threat and it's much harder to execute.

Which is why even before Gortat, some here wanted to see.

Wall, Beal, Webster, TA, Nene

Now with Gortat, MIller and Gooden, it should he even easier for us to run S4 line ups. And now we can even do it with two PGs if we want.

PHX is playing a S4. For teams that space you like that, if you can't beat them inside with power like Nene would do, you gotta match up.

http://www.popcornmachine.net/cgi-bin/g ... ame=PHOWAS

Notice when we make our run. They went to Wall, Miller, Beal, TA and Gortat. Then Gooden to Gortat.

[hands11]

The screen/roll analysis is interesting, but it's one tree in the proverbial forest. Wall has been doing some things better this season, and some other things about the same as he's always done them. The net effect is a fairly modest improvement in his overall production. And it's the overall production that matters most, because it's TOTAL impact that matters when looking at what causes winning and losing.

To be blunt, the "let's get Player X so that we can run Play A with Player Y" is wrong track anyway. For example, one of the major pieces of logic the Wizards used when they signed Darius Songaila (remember that?) was that he would be a good pick-and-pop partner with Antonio Daniels. I'm not sure they ever ran pick-and-pop with those two -- if they did, it wasn't a staple of their bench offense.

Absolutely agree. But with that said, Andre Miller and Marcin Gortat should make for a truly spectacular PnR combo.

Songaila was injured so much, hard to get anything established when you are not on the court.

[hands11]

^^^ This is probably a huge reason why the Lakers are willing to sit tight during free agency this summer and wait until 2015 to chase big name players. They need to be really bad next season if they want to keep their pick, being pretty bad but not awful won't get it done (unless they get real lucky in the lottery, but they can't count on that). I feel bad for Kobe, but hopefully he's still healthy enough to play at a high level in 2015-16 assuming they're able to get stars.

Don't feel too sorry for Kobe. He has 5 NBA championship rings and is going to make almost $80 million in salary over this season and the next two.

Maybe that is why they had to pay him so much.

Its all part of the tank. Kobe is injured anyway. This way he can focus on getting healthy next year and stat pad to get his all time records up while keeping the franchise with a better franchise face to sell tickets.

[milellie111]

Notice how OP conveniently disappears once the Wizards lose games.

TROLL

Who's disappearing? I still stand by my assertion. Name me one team that doesn't lose games at home? Name me one team that has a perfect record? The plan is still in motion for a competitive run in the playoffs so i don't know where you get off somehow thinking that the Wizards are out of contention. Our guys are fighting hard out there and want to win. Pretty soon their hard work will pay off and they will win consistently. It is beneficial and imperative to experience losses and setbacks because it teaches many of the young guys that success is not given to you, it has to be earned. It also pushes them to work harder. Wall and Beal are experiencing that. Coach Wittman continues to groom and the team has put faith in his system. Getting Nene back for the playoffs will definitely help. We are watching this team grow right before our eyes physically amd mentally yet negativity still pervades amongst the fanbase. In comparison to other teams who sit at the bottom of conference standings, are plagued with financial woes, have many empty seats in their arena and owners/management who don't have such a commitment to winning, Ted and Ernie are way above average.

[milellie111]

Ernie usually trades to correct his own mistakes, never to improve the team. PHX also got Gerald Green and Plumlee for Scola. Ironically, that was under the GM that got fired IIRC .

I wouldn't refer to them as mistakes. It's the nature of the GM business. Some players fulfill expectations and some don't. The question is, who's expectations are not fulfilled? The owners? The GM's? The coaches? The fans? There are different expectations from different groups of individuals. This is the same for every Owner/GM/Coach/Fan of every team in the NBA.

[milellie111]

Ernie usually trades to correct his own mistakes, never to improve the team. PHX also got Gerald Green and Plumlee for Scola. Ironically, that was under the GM that got fired IIRC .

A good GM is one who knows when to cut his losses at the right time, adaptable to change and listens to the wishes and overall direction of management. Ted wanted a fresh rebuild with a young team that would EVENTUALLY grow and compete. Every business owner knows that success is not instant. Ernie followed the plan and continues to do so. A core of rising young stars complemented by mature veterans who work hard and can mentor. That will be the most important key in the playoffs.

[tontoz]

The Wizards have exactly one guy (Wall) who is an above average starter and is under contract for next season.

[montestewart]

Ernie usually trades to correct his own mistakes, never to improve the team. PHX also got Gerald Green and Plumlee for Scola. Ironically, that was under the GM that got fired IIRC .

I wouldn't refer to them as mistakes. It's the nature of the GM business. Some players fulfill expectations and some don't. The question is, who's expectations are not fulfilled? The owners? The GM's? The coaches? The fans? There are different expectations from different groups of individuals. This is the same for every Owner/GM/Coach/Fan of every team in the NBA.

Can't speak for anyone else, but I know my expectations are consistently fulfilled. Steady as she goes. Iceberg dead ahead.

[leswizards]

Ernie usually trades to correct his own mistakes, never to improve the team. PHX also got Gerald Green and Plumlee for Scola. Ironically, that was under the GM that got fired IIRC .

I wouldn't refer to them as mistakes. It's the nature of the GM business. Some players fulfill expectations and some don't. The question is, who's expectations are not fulfilled? The owners? The GM's? The coaches? The fans? There are different expectations from different groups of individuals. This is the same for every Owner/GM/Coach/Fan of every team in the NBA.

Can't speak for anyone else, but I know my expectations are consistently fulfilled. Steady as she goes. Iceberg dead ahead.

It is a shame when the fans have higher expectations than the owners and the GM.

[milellie111]

It intrigues me, i consistently hear "Fire Ernie, Fire Wittman", yet no viable replacements are proposed? If there are, how do you know those replacements will have greater success and know what they are doing? Ernie and Wittman have decades of experience in the NBA yet many say they want to bring in some "rookie" coach or GM that has little to no experience? It's not a simple task for anyone to just come in and take over the reins of a professional basketball team. It has been tried and 9 times out of 10 it fails. I know, it's natural for fans to ignore what they have and long for a new face. Almost comparable to how a man may have a perfect situation at home, yet look outside for a new "thrill".

[TGW]

It intrigues me, i consistently hear "Fire Ernie, Fire Wittman", yet no viable replacements are proposed? If there are, how do you know those replacements will have greater success and know what they are doing? Ernie and Wittman have decades of experience in the NBA yet many say they want to bring in some "rookie" coach or GM that has little to no experience? It's not a simple task for anyone to just come in and take over the reins of a professional basketball team. It has been tried and 9 times out of 10 it fails. I know, it's natural for fans to ignore what they have and long for a new face. Almost comparable to how a man may have a perfect situation at home, yet look outside for a new "thrill".

This is some grade-A stench right here, and proof that of trolling.

There are pages on top of pages of discussions on viable, proven replacements that could do a better job than Grunfeld and Whitman. You're just too lazy to look it up, and thus assume we haven't proposed any. Just off the top of my head, I've seen George Karl, Nate McMillian, Stan Van Gundy, and Lionel Hollins names thrown around. As far as GM candidates, Chris Wallace, Glen Grunwald, Donnie Walsh, Jeff Weltman, and whole long list of other names have been thrown around.

And all of these GM/coaches have had greater proven success than Grunfeld and Whitman.

And LOL at calling this a "perfect situation." You're trolling is embarrassing.