nate33 wrote:NatP4 wrote:I have no idea, probably not. Vanderbilt could be one of those guys that people (incorrectly) label as being to small to play the 5, and an obvious non-shooter incapable of playing the 4, and nothing more than an energy 3rd big. It’s a great fit for the wizards with a 5 man that can shoot from everywhere.
The Jazz look to be tearing everything down and going the OKC route of acquiring tons of picks. Vanderbilt is already 23. There’s reason to believe that they would part with him. Rui might not be the guy they want in return, but it’s hard to know how the rest of the league values him.
The bigger point: we should try to acquire Jared Vanderbilt and move Rui/Kuzma
The problem with Vanderbilt is that he eliminates the big advantage of having a big man who can shoot from everywhere. The great thing about playing 5-out is that it opens up the paint for penetration and backdoor cuts. With Vanderbilt, you have to play him in the dunker's spot on offense, where his defender will be able to cheat away and protect the rim.
Vanderbilt is the classic example of a guy that PIF loves because of his box score numbers (particularly rebounding and steals), but he does poorly is some of the facets of the game that don't show up in the box score (spacing). He doesn't suck or anything. He's definitely a good defender. But his presence on the floor is going to hamstring the offense quite a bit.
I don't "love" Vanderbilt, & I appreciate your point. A less partisan way to put it would be to say that you can't have more than one Vanderbilt-type on the floor at the same time.
Then again, nobody's perfect. Except for the occasional superstar, any guy that comes onto the floor brings both advantages & disadvantages. The numbers he puts up help you understand the balance between the two. & other factors don't easily make it into the standard numbers -- many parts of defense, for example. & spacing.
So, when we judge between two players (or simply compare them) we are certain to find things they do well & others they don't do well. Even when they are pretty different, however, it's quite conceivable that they would be of about equivalent value. Or, of course, that one is overall better than the other (or worse).
&, on that note, since you feel free to critique/characterize the way I judge players (& that's not a complaint -- sincerely not! -- you should feel free to do that!), I'll take the same liberty in your direction, & I'm sure you won't mind any more than I do: when you judge a player, nate, you have a tendency to make up your mind about him & then marshal the numbers you need to support your judgment.
For example, during most his first two years, you did that pretty consistently in re: Rui. Then, after a while, you got tired of his obvious faults & we didn't hear about those numbers. Instead we began to hear about his obvious weaknesses -- usually the very ones you'd previously called unimportant when I brought them up.
Rebounding is the most obvious example. For quite a while, Rui's weak rebounding was unimportant, because, as you put it, the distinction between 3 & 4 had vanished & above all good rebounding by your 4 was no longer necessary. More recently, once your take on Rui had shifted significantly, you began pointing out his limitations frequently & quite often with a mention of his weak rebounding.
Don't get me wrong: this is no big deal! We're not writing Phd dissertations here! We're just fans expressing our opinions. & in a situation where being right gains a person nothing, & being wrong costs a person nothing, this is what always happens. A basketball discussion board is a trivial example --above all b/c our opinions here have no secondary effects, they can't affect anyone or anything but simply bounce around like coins shaken in a can.
Well... that went on a while -- apologies! As to Jarred Vanderbilt, have you looked at hi on-off numbers? How various lineups he's in perform?
Probably not & -- it's fair to ask -- why should you? Who cares about this guy? Who brought him up anyway...? Oh yeah, it was Nat.
Nat is right: we should trade Kuzma! Doesn't have to be for Jarred Vanderbilt however....
