Discussing Other Teams' Moves

[fishercob]

this is a disgrace

[nate33]

Gasol is a top 25 player. Odom is a top 40 player. CP3 has knee problems. I would never have done that deal if I were LA.

This was my thinking too. Though I'd say Gasol is a top 15 player and Odom is more like top 60. But the point still stands. I think this trade makes the Lakers worse. The Lakers don't need a pure PG like Paul. They already have a bunch of star players who can create shots and pass the ball (Kobe, Odom, Gasol). All they needed was a PG who can shoot, defend and manage an offense. A guy like Chauncey Billups would have been perfect, and much much cheaper.

Now, if the Lakers turn around and grab Dwight Howard too, then I'll be seriously pissed. But for now, I'm not that impressed. The Lakers got younger, that's probably the most important development. With Paul and Bynum in the fold, they'll be relevant for the next 5 years at least.

[7-Day Dray]

David Stern is a pussy.

[Ruzious]

I'd really like to hear what the basis for Stern's decision to stop this trade is, cuz it can't be just that it gives the Lakers a star - I don't think it's even a good trade for the Lakers - for the reasons MHD mentioned.

And it can't be that it's not fair to the Hornets. If they're forced to hold on to Paul all season and get nothing for him next year, they're absolutely screwed.

So, exactly who is protected here?

The commissioner has to have a valid reason to void a trade. This isn't pro wrestling with Vince McMahon making up rules on the fly. You come up with a CBA, because you have to have rules, and you have to stick by those rules. Otherwise, your business has no integrity, and your fans find other hobbies to replace it.

Stern better step up with a reasonable explanation, or allow the trade.

[MJG]

I can't believe that this deal may be canceled. This was about as fair of a superstar deal as you'll see all around. If this isn't considered an approvable deal, then what exactly would the Hornets have to trade Paul for to get the thumbs up?

[no D in Hibachi]

Gasol is a top 25 player. Odom is a top 40 player. CP3 has knee problems. I would never have done that deal if I were LA.

This was my thinking too. Though I'd say Gasol is a top 15 player and Odom is more like top 60. But the point still stands. I think this trade makes the Lakers worse. The Lakers don't need a pure PG like Paul. They already have a bunch of star players who can create shots and pass the ball (Kobe, Odom, Gasol). All they needed was a PG who can shoot, defend and manage an offense. A guy like Chauncey Billups would have been perfect, and much much cheaper.

Now, if the Lakers turn around and grab Dwight Howard too, then I'll be seriously pissed. But for now, I'm not that impressed. The Lakers got younger, that's probably the most important development. With Paul and Bynum in the fold, they'll be relevant for the next 5 years at least.

Gasol is still a good player, don't get me wrong, but last year his play started to decline. I don't think the Lakers would win another championship with him as Kobe's sidekick. He may be a top 15 player as long as he's the second best player on his team, but if he's the lead banana I think his overall rating diminishes. The Lakers gave up value for sure, but the real sin in all this scandalous mess is on the Hornets/NBA who acquired the two worst players in the trade while gaving up a top 7ish player in the league. They got no draft picks or no young budding players. If the Hornets were not owned by the NBA I'd just be pissed because the Lakers are keeping their window open another 3-5 years, but since the NBA is involved I can't help but think this is a conflict of interests to epic proportions.

[no D in Hibachi]

Whether you think this is a fair trade or not for the Lakers. I think the one thing we can draw from this trade is that the NBA needs to get out of the ownership business. It's simply not good for the image of the league.

[nate33]

I think we should sell high on McGee. He's going to get an outrageous contract that he won't be worth at all. Blatche looks underpaid now . I'd want a pick in this upcoming draft and a young prospect. Perfect deal is Utah's GSW pick that is top 8 protected where we take back Okur who is expiring. Utah doesn't need McGee, so I/m figuring out a Wiz send McGee to Team X who sends assets to Utah who sends Okur+GSW pick to Wiz.

I don't think things will turn out as dire as you think. This offseason is unusual for three reasons:

1. Many teams sacrificed to get under the cap last year because they feared the new CBA
2. The new amnesty provision is in place which reassures some teams they can cut future salary if they need to.
3. Teams aren't yet facing the higher luxtax penalties that will kick in in 2013.

As a result, there is a bit of a feeding frenzy in the free agency market right now. It will settle down, I guarantee it. A bunch of teams are going to make some dumb mistakes right now, and they'll learn their lesson by next year.

Look at it this way, last year, 8 teams were over the luxtax limit and had to pay 100% on their overpayment. That total tax payed by those 8 teams amounted to $76M. Under the new rules, those same 8 teams would end up paying a total tax of $162M. That's a serious financial disincentive to exceed the luxury tax. My guess is that the total league payroll is going to shrink a bit, probably by about $40M or so. So once this current frenzy settles doing, you can expect $40M less dollars pursuing free agents every year. Contracts will get smaller, not bigger.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Battier is good for the Heat, but I don't see it as a crazy good signing. He plays best at the two positions where they have possibly the best players in the entire league. His third best position happens to coincide with the Heat's best non-big3 player, Haslem.

So... he's kind of a redundant piece, honestly. He makes them deeper, but I don't know if he makes them better unless they get really creative with the lineup - like having Wade and Lebron alternate at PG/SG.

All good points, and they are still weakest at point guard and center -- which helps our Dwight sales pitch in a roundabout way. Convince Dwight that his best chance at beating Miami is joining up with a dominant PG.

I think they drafted a great PG in Norris Cole. He is going to be terrific for them.

Eddy Curry's lost a zillion pounds. They have Battier. They are going to win it this season.

I don't mind because I like the newest Lebron interviews. Dude has been humiliated and humbled from last season. I know he's still the same guy, but I don't dislike him immensely any more. He actually said he can see what he did from the view of Cleveland fans, now, and would do things differently.

Watching him get dogged out by DeShawn, Haywood, and the rest of the Mavs was enough for me.

Miami will win it, barring a HUGE upset.

[willbcocks]

What a complete clusterf#$^. I am embarassed for Stern and the league right now.

[MJG]

Whether you think this is a fair trade or not for the Lakers. I think the one thing we can draw from this trade is that the NBA needs to get out of the ownership business. It's simply not good for the image of the league.

Yea, I hope we can all agree on that. The league looks like a bunch of schmucks regardless of whatever the final decision is.

[miller31time]

Now, Paul is saying he won't report to camp.

I understand why he's upset and he has a right to be, but he needs to fulfill the contract he signed.

[JWizmentality]

The NBA, where "LOL WUT!" happens.

[GhostsOfGil]

@WojYahooNBA

To listen to the GM's, coaches, players, agents reaching out to me tonight: I think the NBA has changed forever with Stern's act tonight.

[mhd]

One thing that needed to be in the CBA was compensation if your star FA left. What about Gold FA (1st team all NBA in one of the past 2 years) means 4th pick in the draft, Silver (2nd team), 6th pick, and Bronze (3rd team), 8th pick.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

During the whole players vs owners lockout battle, I got the impression Stern was as much antagonist to the players as he was mouthpiece of the owners. He was a very polarizing figure. All along I felt there would be games on Christmas and that Stern had the juice to make the lockout end when that date approached. I thought all along Stern is from a different generation and his patronizing tone made things much worse for the players.

The thing is, however, Stern through the lockout was viewed as a mediator and the face of the NBA by the media and the average fan. Stern was the one telling the players what was good for them, according to most. He made the NBA profitable, according to most. While Billy Hunter was characterized as a goof, the players as thugs and greedy; Stern and the owners were called good businessmen and knowledgeable about the cost of operating teams. Stern was given nothing but kudos, with an occasional article about his deadlines not being heeded. Other than that, Stern was the man.

Now, the masses are seeing the emperor of the NBA make his modus operandi apparent for all to see. This is how Stern rolls: "Chris Paul and the Lakers, I say no. ... Next."

[LyricalRico]

@WojYahooNBA

To listen to the GM's, coaches, players, agents reaching out to me tonight: I think the NBA has changed forever with Stern's act tonight.

CP3 reportedly already exploring legal action. Odom is confused (but what's new), and everybody else from all 3 teams is going to be awkward at a minimum. But it's not just those teams that were involved in the deal.

I wonder what the Knicks are thinking. Did they make their agreement with Chandler after they were under the impression that Paul was going to LA? If so, do they back out and return to pursuing CP3? What happens to Chandler? And what about Billups, who was reportedly going to be amnesty-ed to allow for a signing that might not happen?

I mean, how could the NBA allow it to get so far as to let it be reported as a completed 3-team trade...only to then say "sike, made you look"? Really got a bad taste in my mouth over this one. I was already skeptical about coming back to basketball, but the "hot stove" stuff was bringing me back around. This crap makes me want to stay away until Stern retires.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

What a complete clusterf#$^. I am embarassed for Stern and the league right now.

Embarrassed?

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=a ... 1&expire=1

“The owners half-pushed this, and Stern took it the rest of the way,” a league source told Yahoo! Sports. “In the end, David didn’t like that the players were dictating where they wanted to go, like Carmelo had, and he wasn’t going to let Chris Paul dictate where he wanted to go.”

One month ago someone described Stern's actions in very politically incorrect terms.

Kessler's 'plantation workers' comment draws David Stern's anger

http://content.usatoday.com/communities ... ns-anger/1

Players' attorney Jeffrey Kessler said the owners are treating his side like "plantation workers."

This echoes the comments by HBO's Bryant Gumbel last month when he called commissioner David Stern a "modern day plantation overseer."

The literal analogy of plantation workers isn't right--NBA players are millionaires (mostly). They are not slaves. No one is whipping them. Bad analogy on almost every level ...

That said, PLAYERS ARE OWNED AND THIS COMMISSIONER DOESN'T WANT THEM TO BE FREE TO CHANGE EMPLOYERS! No choice but to work where Stern says work, even after 7 years with that team. Even indentured servants got to leave after a fixed amount of time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indentured_servant

David Stern has done a really bad thing and he did it for MONEY. New Orleans loses a team eventually and tanks financially immediately if Paul leaves. Stern and the owners did it for money. Screw Chris Paul or living up to the CBA.

The owners and Stern are definitely not caring about the labor force. I see where Kessler was going with his statement.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

@WojYahooNBA

To listen to the GM's, coaches, players, agents reaching out to me tonight: I think the NBA has changed forever with Stern's act tonight.

CP3 reportedly already exploring legal action. Odom is confused (but what's new), and everybody else from all 3 teams is going to be awkward at a minimum. But it's not just those teams that were involved in the deal.

I wonder what the Knicks are thinking. Did they make their agreement with Chandler after they were under the impression that Paul was going to LA? If so, do they back out and return to pursuing CP3? What happens to Chandler? And what about Billups, who was reportedly going to be amnesty-ed to allow for a signing that might not happen?

I mean, how could the NBA allow it to get so far as to let it be reported as a completed 3-team trade...only to then say "sike, made you look"? Really got a bad taste in my mouth over this one. I was already skeptical about coming back to basketball, but the "hot stove" stuff was bringing me back around. This crap makes me want to stay away until Stern retires.

The whole lockout wouldn't have happened IMO if Stern was not personally saber rattling with Billy Hunter.

When the players took legal action, although the league probably would have won a protracted court battle; Stern definitely looked to have issued an ultimatum that the players' legal counsel would have run with in their court case against the NBA. Stern messed up so badly that he had to come back and negotiate after the league's final offer.

So much has been complicated because of the control of David Stern. LR, I've wanted Stern out for a long time. I know he's on the way out now.

[Bickerstaff]

I don't like the way this was handled, but I think it's really not fair to say it was about the monetary value of the Hornets. I also don't see this as an anti-player move so much as an anti-superteam move.