2012 NBA Draft - Part III

[Dat2U]

Guys in the draft I'm very skeptical off:

1. Austin Rivers... production doesn't match name. Lowest PER of any draft eligible underclassmen. Good shot creator and nice first step but not an elite athlete. Undersized SG. Not PG skills whatsoever.

2. Tyshawn Taylor... Talented but low IQ athlete who's too unreliable to be a backup PG on the next level. Very streaky, can go stretches were he's absolutely terrible. Hit and miss decision maker on his best days.

3. Tony Wroten. Tyreke Evans Jr. Ball dominate SG masquerading as a PG. Has flashy passing skills but no clue how to run a team. Displayed terrible shot selection and had terrible efficiency his freshman season. I don't see how he fits within a team concept.

4. Maurice Harkless. Very inefficient at this stage. Shot selection is in question. Really needed to return to school for seasoning. A project.

5. Royce White. Far too turnover prone to continue the same role in college. How effective & how engaged will he be without being the focal point of the offense. Not to mention the off-court concerns he has. Too many questions to be a #1 round pick IMO.

[rockymac52]

Guys in the draft I'm very skeptical off:

1. Austin Rivers... production doesn't match name. Lowest PER of any draft eligible underclassmen. Good shot creator and nice first step but not an elite athlete. Undersized SG. Not PG skills whatsoever.

2. Tyshawn Taylor... Talented but low IQ athlete who's too unreliable to be a backup PG on the next level. Very streaky, can go stretches were he's absolutely terrible. Hit and miss decision maker on his best days.

3. Tony Wroten. Tyreke Evans Jr. Ball dominate SG masquerading as a PG. Has flashy passing skills but no clue how to run a team. Displayed terrible shot selection and had terrible efficiency his freshman season. I don't see how he fits within a team concept.

4. Maurice Harkless. Very inefficient at this stage. Shot selection is in question. Really needed to return to school for seasoning. A project.

5. Royce White. Far too turnover prone to continue the same role in college. How effective & how engaged will he be without being the focal point of the offense. Not to mention the off-court concerns he has. Too many questions to be a #1 round pick IMO.

As a Mizzou fan it absolutely KILLS me to say this, but I think Tyshawn Taylor will find his niche in the NBA and be an asset for whichever team he ends up with. If Mario Chalmers can make it in this league, so can he as far as I'm concerned. Not saying he's going to be great or anything. I can't see him ever being a starting PG, but I think he'll make it as a backup somewhere (and as far as we're concerned, I'm positive that he's an upgrade over Mack). Simply put, he facilitated the offense for a very good team. He can be deadly from 3 point range at times, and he's so easy to forget about, but then before you can blink he just torches you for 9 points.

As for Royce White, I think he absolutely deserves to be a late 1st round pick, however, I do share some of your concerns. In college he played like a star. Despite being a PF, he had ample opportunities to take the ball up court and run the offense to his liking. He was the MAN at Iowa State, and he and everyone else knew it. Even though he is an incredibly skilled and physically gifted player, he most likely will never be given the opportunity to be the focal point of any NBA team (unless the Bobcats take him haha). I'm curious to see how he adapts and if he can handle being a role player, and if he can play well off the ball. I think he has the skills to make it happen. And I think he knows he's not going to be the focal point of his team's offense in the NBA. In regards to his off the court concerns about his attitude and his anxiety disorder, I don't think it's going to effect him at all in the NBA. He doesn't like flying in planes. Oh well. His team will accommodate him appropriately. I think last year he drove everywhere on his own with his grandpa or dad or something like that. You'd obviously like him to be with the rest of the team, but you gotta do what you gotta do. I'm not advocating we draft him, mainly because I'm not sure how he's going to succeed as a role player, but he could be an incredible value late in the 1st or early in the 2nd.

[doclinkin]

I realize the Beal mixtape was a "best of...." compilation but, boy, was his shooting range and variety of offensive moves impressive.

Thing about his range which likely accounts for his less than stellar 3pt shooting %. He never seems to have a repeatable depth or favorite spot on the floor. Makes him unpredictable, which would help against scouting: he's a threat to pull up from everywhere at any time, but also means he can't simply groove his shot an recalibrate it based on routine (unlike Ray Allen for instance). Probably attributable to his youth. He'll find a groove, and the longer NBA line may actually help force him to groove a repeatable shot since it cuts out a significant percent of his variation.

[fishercob]

I realize the Beal mixtape was a "best of...." compilation but, boy, was his shooting range and variety of offensive moves impressive.

Thing about his range which likely accounts for his less than stellar 3pt shooting %. He never seems to have a repeatable depth or favorite spot on the floor. Makes him unpredictable, which would help against scouting: he's a threat to pull up from everywhere at any time, but also means he can't simply groove his shot an recalibrate it based on routine (unlike Ray Allen for instance). Probably attributable to his youth. He'll find a groove, and the longer NBA line may actually help force him to groove a repeatable shot since it cuts out a significant percent of his variation.

Good point. Once he gets into a pro system with a clear attack plan that says "we want three taken from here (corners and top of the key, for instance) and no long two's" he's likely to improve the same five or six shots over and over and over.

[miller31time]

Thing about his range which likely accounts for his less than stellar 3pt shooting %. He never seems to have a repeatable depth or favorite spot on the floor. Makes him unpredictable, which would help against scouting: he's a threat to pull up from everywhere at any time, but also means he can't simply groove his shot an recalibrate it based on routine (unlike Ray Allen for instance).

If I didn't know better, I'd have thought you were talking about Gilbert (though Arenas' stroke was probably more pure and accurate).

[go'stags]

I like Tyshawn Taylor in the NBA, but not at PG. His decision making is nowhere near good enough. I more like him as a Leandro Barbosa type player at the next level. And I mean that in a complimentary way.

[doclinkin]

In regards to his off the court concerns about his attitude and his anxiety disorder, I don't think it's going to effect him at all in the NBA. He doesn't like flying in planes. Oh well. His team will accommodate him appropriately. I think last year he drove everywhere on his own with his grandpa or dad or something like that. You'd obviously like him to be with the rest of the team, but you gotta do what you gotta do. I'm not advocating we draft him, mainly because I'm not sure how he's going to succeed as a role player, but he could be an incredible value late in the 1st or early in the 2nd.

No, he will have to fly. Pretty much no two ways about it. But I suspect he will find a way to adjust.

Personally I'm less concerned about his high TO rate, to reiterate, he won't have to force the action in the NBA, will have a far lower usage rate and will have better quality teammates at the other end of that pass. His Ast/to rate was 1.31. Better than, say Bradley Beal for instance (1.05). He will still rebound at a good rate, and will make some nice passes to open shooters, he just won't be posted at the top of the key running the show.

If he falls to a 2nd round slot he's a steal for the team that drafts him.

[Jay81]

If we end up with pick 6...I still think barnes will be a good fit for us and a good nba player

http://www.draftexpress.com/article/Fin ... arnes-3900

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Guys in the draft I'm very skeptical off:

1. Austin Rivers... production doesn't match name. Lowest PER of any draft eligible underclassmen. Good shot creator and nice first step but not an elite athlete. Undersized SG. Not PG skills whatsoever.

2. Tyshawn Taylor... Talented but low IQ athlete who's too unreliable to be a backup PG on the next level. Very streaky, can go stretches were he's absolutely terrible. Hit and miss decision maker on his best days.

3. Tony Wroten. Tyreke Evans Jr. Ball dominate SG masquerading as a PG. Has flashy passing skills but no clue how to run a team. Displayed terrible shot selection and had terrible efficiency his freshman season. I don't see how he fits within a team concept.

4. Maurice Harkless. Very inefficient at this stage. Shot selection is in question. Really needed to return to school for seasoning. A project.

5. Royce White. Far too turnover prone to continue the same role in college. How effective & how engaged will he be without being the focal point of the offense. Not to mention the off-court concerns he has. Too many questions to be a #1 round pick IMO.

If Austin Rivers wasn't Doc's son and if he hadn't gone to Duke, he would be someone advised to stay in school. I think he's a terrible pick.

If Royce White belongs in the first round, Draymond Green belongs in the lottery.

[DCZards]

If Austin Rivers wasn't Doc's son and if he hadn't gone to Duke, he would be someone advised to stay in school. I think he's a terrible pick.

If Royce White belongs in the first round, Draymond Green belongs in the lottery.

Agree that Rivers should have stayed in school, but I expect him to turn out to be one of the top ten players in this draft.

[hands11]

I realize the Beal mixtape was a "best of...." compilation but, boy, was his shooting range and variety of offensive moves impressive. He's also very physical for a SG. I'd take Beal over MKG because he fills a critical need as a shooter, and at this point there's really no certainty as to whether Beal or MKG, Robinson, Drummond, etc., are the BPA after Davis.

A Ray Allen/Iggy blend.

Kind of interesting don't you think?

[theboomking]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZEiz90oLB4&feature=related[/youtube]


Stats not so dissimilar from Beal's. Ross rebounds just as well as Beal, and shot for a higher 3 point percentage. He passes the eye test as well, as his stroke looks just as pure to my eye. I love Beal and I know he is a freshman, but if I looked at stats and highlights and didn't know better, I would take Ross. I guess that is why there is game tape.
http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketb ... rence-ross
http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketb ... adley-beal

ESPN has Ross going at 16. It wouldn't be beyond the pale for us to trade up in the draft as we did with Seraphin and wind up with Gilchrist and Ross.

Nivek, what does YODA say about Ross?

[MF23]

He's nowhere near the player Beal is.

[theboomking]

He's nowhere near the player Beal is.

I know. That is why I said you needed to actually watch the game tape to evaluate them, comparatively. Ross is also 3 years older. That is a big deal.

My point was really that Ross could wind up being very productive, will go much lower than Beal, and would be an excellent selection in the mid-teens.

[SUPERBALLMAN]

As far as trying to pick up another later 1st, maybe for some sort of package of our 2nd rounders w/ Crawford or cash, what SF targets might be available? Anyone like Jeff Taylor from Vanderbilt?

[hands11]

For pure NBA ready body who can come in and contribute right away with star personality/fight, its hard not to like Robinson. This team needs to get even more tough. The team needs more rebounding. Robinson seem to be the best combination. Kind of like a Booker with more handles and a better shot. But Booker can jump out of the gym.

Beal I think is there with the NBA body, but he is a little more of a low key personality. I could see it maybe taking Beal a year to get it going as he feels he way into where he fits on the team and in the league. But maybe I am wrong there. I wanted the highlight video again and he is pretty animated. Beal was my first pick early, I'm just trying to stay open minded.

MKG has pieces that I think will need to be groomed. Brought to a team like SA, I think he would develop more quickly.

Davis actually is the one I think is going to take at least a year. He is pretty thin. I'm not counting on him coming in and taking over. He may have to most upside, but he is going to have to build an NBA body and grow an NBA game.

Bottom line. We pretty much can't lose in the top 4 picks. That is something I have felt for a while. It really comes down to who will produce the quickest or file the greatest need. They are all good and all fill a need.

Accumulate assets. Figure the rest out later. Either Davis or Robinson would make our front court mega nasty. Maybe the best in the league if you consider all the players we would have. Beal obviously plug a hole and should stick around for a long time. I see MKG as a glue SF.

[dobrojim]

playing for Pop in SAN makes any good player look better.

Davis will be the consensus ROY barring major missed time due to injury

[hands11]

Now just from reading stuff about MKG, I guess he has more leadership skills. That would give him the edge in draft order. But for the Wizards, is that more important that a SG who is likened to a young Ray Allen who can defend and also play some SF ? Tough call. Hard not to go with Beal. But it seems like MKG would be nice to have also.

I don't think the Wizards have a leadership vacuum anymore. With McGee, Blatche and Young gone, and Nene, Booker and Seraphin taking over the locker room, the team is in good hands. Wall could probably use a veteran counterpart at backup PG.

KS is playing great but I dont know that I am counting him a leader. He is still a very young man and there is the language issue. Not saying he cant get there.

Booker is a glue type leader. He is a leader I believe. I just wonder if he sticks around longer term or not. I want him to. Dont get me wrong.

Im talking about a leader like Nene is one.

I will have to learn more about these top pick personalities. Its the little kinks in the armor you want to look for.

Example. Blake Griffin. He is a beast .. right. But there is a side of him that isn't. He gets punked to much for my liking. Not saying he needs to go all Ron Ron or anything but something is missing. Same thing that has been missing from LeBron. Great talent but missing something. Something Kobe has. Something the calm Duncan has. It in Rondo, CP3, etc.

[Ruzious]

Now just from reading stuff about MKG, I guess he has more leadership skills. That would give him the edge in draft order. But for the Wizards, is that more important that a SG who is likened to a young Ray Allen who can defend and also play some SF ? Tough call. Hard not to go with Beal. But it seems like MKG would be nice to have also.

I don't think the Wizards have a leadership vacuum anymore. With McGee, Blatche and Young gone, and Nene, Booker and Seraphin taking over the locker room, the team is in good hands. Wall could probably use a veteran counterpart at backup PG.

KS is playing great but I dont know that I am counting him a leader. He is still a very young man and there is the language issue. Not saying he cant get there.

Booker is a glue type leader. He is a leader I believe. I just wonder if he sticks around longer term or not. I want him to. Dont get me wrong.

Im talking about a leader like Nene is one.

I will have to learn more about these top pick personalities. Its the little kinks in the armor you want to look for.

Example. Blake Griffin. He is a beast .. right. But there is a side of him that isn't. He gets punked to much for my liking. Not saying he needs to go all Ron Ron or anything but something is missing. Same thing that has been missing from LeBron. Great talent but missing something. Something Kobe has. Something the calm Duncan has. It in Rondo, CP3, etc.

If Blake Griffin and Lebron are missing something, I want to be missing whatever they're missing.

And Anthony Davis is so far ahead of everyone else in this draft class, there's no comparison. If I had the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, and 5th picks in this draft, I would try to trade all of them to get Davis.

[Nivek]

Agree on all these guys.

Guys in the draft I'm very skeptical off:

1. Austin Rivers... production doesn't match name. Lowest PER of any draft eligible underclassmen. Good shot creator and nice first step but not an elite athlete. Undersized SG. Not PG skills whatsoever.

Shot creation is borderline worthless unless the shots go through the hoop. Rivers shot the 3 decently, but was awful inside the arc and (red flag) from the FT line. His poor efficiency can't be explained away by high usage because his usage wasn't actually all that high (about 17 possessions per 40 minutes -- AVERAGE for the 157 players I've evaluated for this year's draft is 16.0 possessions used per 40). Average efficiency among those players: 112 points produced per 100 possessions. Rivers: 101. Then add in that Rivers doesn't rebound, assist, steal the ball, or block shots. His game is shooting (and not all that well) and turnovers. I think his game and his body need a TON of work.

2. Tyshawn Taylor... Talented but low IQ athlete who's too unreliable to be a backup PG on the next level. Very streaky, can go stretches were he's absolutely terrible. Hit and miss decision maker on his best days.

I have him with a "don't draft" rating. Which is not a good sign considering that he's a senior.

3. Tony Wroten. Tyreke Evans Jr. Ball dominate SG masquerading as a PG. Has flashy passing skills but no clue how to run a team. Displayed terrible shot selection and had terrible efficiency his freshman season. I don't see how he fits within a team concept.

Awful shooting from everywhere -- below 50% from 2pt range, below 20% from 3pt range, below 60% from the FT line. Good athlete. Looks great on the floor. His game is bad. 5.0 assists per 40 looks nice until you notice the 5.1 turnovers per 40. He was even less efficient than Rivers -- 94 points produced per 100 possessions. I have him with a mid-2nd round score.

4. Maurice Harkless. Very inefficient at this stage. Shot selection is in question. Really needed to return to school for seasoning. A project.

Agree with every word. End of the 2nd round grade in YODA.

5. Royce White. Far too turnover prone to continue the same role in college. How effective & how engaged will he be without being the focal point of the offense. Not to mention the off-court concerns he has. Too many questions to be a #1 round pick IMO.

Another guy with a "don't draft" rating in YODA. Maybe a late 2nd round pick based on the unusual passing skills for a PF. But, any enthusiasm I'd have him for would be tempered by the turnovers.