Lather me with blather -- DRAFT thread 4

[jivelikenice]

Singleton at six would be a disaster of epic proportions.

I hope we can find a way to get Kanter. If not, I'm still hoping for a trade-back to get Leonard and a Morris brother. Or maybe just both Morris brothers. =p

Couldn't agree more. It would be a huge specific need based pick.

Forf those who are anti Marcus Morris, what do you expect him to project to as a player? 15ppg? more or less??

[thinker07]

Burks is a much better prospect at SG than NY IMO. Burks is much more versatile and can create going to the hoop. Nick is a great shooter, but adds very little else to the game.

Yes if I was going to draft either one TODAY, Burks would be a better prospect than NY. But NY has PROVEN that he can score in the NBA and Burks hasn't. Also the weakest part of Burks' game is his shooting which is NY's strongest attribute. If he was a strong pure shooter he would likely be a top 3 pick. So on a team with very poor pure shooting ability, I don't see how we are better off letting NY go and replacing him with Burks. We need more shooters not less.

[closg00]

Chalmers was a 34th pick, I think this draft will have better role-players than last years draft.

[Ruzious]

I would not be on board with Singleton @ 6. We'd be reaching too much just to fill specific roster needs. If we reach, I'd rather reach for a big like Tristian Thompson or further strengthen our backcourt with a superior prospect like Alec Burks there. We'd have a pretty dynamic 3 man backcourt with Wall, Burks, and Crawford.

There really aren't many - if any - good options at 6. Thompson is long, but he's under 6'9 and just 227 lbs at PF and with very limited offensive tools. Burks might be good, but picking him means your likely letting go of Nick Young, so you'd be basically recycling Nick. Singleton is solid, but the injury messed up his progress - and he supposedly got clearly bested by Marcus Morris recently. These players can help, but I think the Wiz need to do better.

Thompson may not have the ideal height, but his length makes up for that. In addition to that he seems to have a frame that can fill in a bit so size isn't an issue to me with him. You also have to take into consideration his defensive ability.
Burks is a much better prospect at SG than NY IMO. Burks is much more versatile and can create going to the hoop. Nick is a great shooter, but adds very little else to the game.

I mentioned Thompson's length. Anyway you slice him, he's an undersized PF. People talk about him being a defensive specialist only because he has no offensive game and he had a good game against Williams - who wants to be a 3. He can be a good defender, but he's only a good athlete; not a great one. There's simply nothing special about him currently and even potentially.

If Burks is a much better prospect than NY, he'd be a sure top 5 pick in this draft. He may eventually become the shooter Nick is, but he has a lousy reputation for defense.

[dangermouse]

If Kanter makes it to 5 i think hes ours at 6. My feeling is the Raps would rather take a PG here, or maybe even Valanciunas to put at C if he is on the board. Cavs at 4 really dictates our draft. It sucks that a rival has so much power lol. Cavs at #1 really isnt a given either, all indications are they want Kyrie, but if their medical team finds anything I think there is still a possibility they take DWill.

It could be a good strategy to get both DWill and Kyrie, a great draft for the Cavs. With Rubio finally making a decision to come over this year, I highly doubt Kahn would take a #1 PG prospect if he fell to them, especiallly if the rumours were saying it was because of Kyrie's injury... plus Rubio would not be happy. I guess they could use him in a trade, but teams would know they would be able to get him for less than what he is worth because of the Rubio situation...

This is like a poker game.

[popper]

I don't mean to be repetitive and I have not seen Burks, Brooks or Shumpert play. But based on the scouting reports and the combine results it looks to me like Shumpert could be the next D Wade. Why isn't he rated higher than the other two SG's?

[jivelikenice]

Burks is a much better prospect at SG than NY IMO. Burks is much more versatile and can create going to the hoop. Nick is a great shooter, but adds very little else to the game.

Yes if I was going to draft either one TODAY, Burks would be a better prospect than NY. But NY has PROVEN that he can score in the NBA and Burks hasn't. Also the weakest part of Burks' game is his shooting which is NY's strongest attribute. If he was a strong pure shooter he would likely be a top 3 pick. So on a team with very poor pure shooting ability, I don't see how we are better off letting NY go and replacing him with Burks. We need more shooters not less.

I don't get the logic here at all. Maybe one guy from this draft will average more than Nick did this past season; does that mean we should prefer Nick to everyone in the draft? Come on....You take who you think will be the better all around basketball player for your team. We're not trying to win a title next year, we're trying to build a long-term winner here. I have no idea what our FO thinks of Burks, but if he's the BPA on our board by a decent margin at 6 you make the pick and worry about Nick Young later. And yes we'd miss Nick's shooting, but we need more than just that. We need versatile players who bring multiple elements to the floor. Nick is a shooter, period. He brings nothing else to the floor offensively.

[Ruzious]

Nick has shown he's a scorer, not just a shooter. In the Wiz offense playing next to Wall, he's needed much more as a spot-up shooter, and he deserves credit for adjusting to that role. Burks may eventually be a little better than Nick, but picking him would likely be like running in place on a treadmill. The team would not be getting anywhere.

[closg00]

Brian in Mankato, MN:
Bill - I am really worried Kahn is going to screw things up even worse than the Wolves already are. Are you hearing anything on the draft? Potential trades? They need a 2 guard, so I really wish they would make a play for Mayo. Thanks!

Bill Ingram:
I understand your concern, but I have it on good authority that a two-guard is the #1 priority this summer. Honestly, I'm waiting for the press conference about Rambis being fired . . .when a team is as good on paper and as bad in the standings as the Wolves were last season, something has to give. They're offering up the #2 pick in an effort to grab a true shooting guard, and I've heard the player they have targeted is DeRozan.

More draft intrigue, the Minny and Toronto swap picks for DeRozan and???

[pancakes3]

why not just kemba walker? a bit undersized but as good a sg the collegiate ranks has produced in a long while.

[nate33]

Brian in Mankato, MN:
Bill - I am really worried Kahn is going to screw things up even worse than the Wolves already are. Are you hearing anything on the draft? Potential trades? They need a 2 guard, so I really wish they would make a play for Mayo. Thanks!

Bill Ingram:
I understand your concern, but I have it on good authority that a two-guard is the #1 priority this summer. Honestly, I'm waiting for the press conference about Rambis being fired . . .when a team is as good on paper and as bad in the standings as the Wolves were last season, something has to give. They're offering up the #2 pick in an effort to grab a true shooting guard, and I've heard the player they have targeted is DeRozan.

More draft intrigue, the Minny and Toronto swap picks for DeRozan and???

Let's hope they acquire one via trade rather than target Nick Young in free agency.

[NbdyBeatsTheWiz]

I've been debating the same thing, pancakes. In my mind he will likely be the BPA (not Singleton, to be clear) when we pick. That is unless Kanter falls and our prayers are answered.

I just don't see him playing shooting guard all that well in the league, and see him trying to make the transition to the point position, playing in the Gilbert, Rose, shoot first mold.

Does anybody think that with our allegedly still growing John Wall (6'4", maybe eventually 6'5") the size issue for Kemba could be masked? Have Kemba defend the PG on D and let Wall defend the SG?
Then let Kemba loose on offense to run off screens, etc. and look for his shot?

Worst case scenario in my mind is we trade him after a year or so. I don't see him as a guy who's going to flop by any means, and he'll get the minutes (especially if Nick doesn't resign).

[pancakes3]

well, i was asking more of why doesn't Minny go after walker if they want a 2guard so badly especially since DeRozen is closer to a 3 than a 2.

BUT... a walker/crawford backup duo will win us games for sure. defensive backcourt size isn't much of an issue in those early 2Q doldrums where the starters are resting and you have the likes of JJ Barea and Nate Robinson running around. Heck, Jason Terry and Jamal Crawford have carved out careers as "sparkplugs" and kemba/jordan are as sparky as they come.

of course come re-up time it will be a nightmare but hopefully we will have flipped one of them for a vet piece by then.I just think a solid backcourt with Wall playing a ton of minutes, JC and unnamed guard nabbing 24 apiece, and Nick playing starter minutes at sg and spot minutes at SF will make us a very interesting team - at least a team worth contemplating if not persuing

[Ruzious]

I've been debating the same thing, pancakes. In my mind he will likely be the BPA (not Singleton, to be clear) when we pick. That is unless Kanter falls and our prayers are answered.

I just don't see him playing shooting guard all that well in the league, and see him trying to make the transition to the point position, playing in the Gilbert, Rose, shoot first mold.

Does anybody think that with our allegedly still growing John Wall (6'4", maybe eventually 6'5") the size issue for Kemba could be masked? Have Kemba defend the PG on D and let Wall defend the SG?
Then let Kemba loose on offense to run off screens, etc. and look for his shot?

Worst case scenario in my mind is we trade him after a year or so. I don't see him as a guy who's going to flop by any means, and he'll get the minutes (especially if Nick doesn't resign).

But aren't his strengths and weaknesses at the 2 similar to Crawford's - are you really gaining anything significant? Granted, Walker is faster and quicker while Crawford is bigger, but they're basically both relentless scorers who can pass well. Both have a lot to prove as far as being catch and shoot 3 point shooters - Walker made just 33% of his 3's last season. If Young is signable at a reasonable price, isn't a backcourt of Wall, Young, and Crawford more capable than one of Wall, Walker, and Crawford? They really need a knockdown 3 point shooter next to Wall. Walker hasn't shown he's that type of player, imo.

[tontoz]

Let's hope they acquire one via trade rather than target Nick Young in free agency.

I am more worried about Chicago. He would fit in perfectly there on both ends.

[LyricalRico]

Re: Minny trading for DeRozan

Thinking about it, DeRozan+5 for the 2 makes sense if the Raptors are serious about moving Bargnani to PF. I would think they'd go for Kanter since he potentially fills in the things Bargs lacks (strength, rebounding, post scoring).

If that happens, I see picks 3/4 being Williams and Valanciunas (in either order) and then I'd have to think Minny would go big at the 5 spot. Maybe Biyombo? I seem to recall reading something (I think by Chad Ford) saying that Minny would even consider Biyombo at 2, so taking him at 5 makes sense IMO. That would pretty much leave us with squat, though.

1 - Irving
2 - Kanter
3 - Williams
4 - Valanciunas
5 - Biyombo
6 - ???

Could we pre-empt that scenario by moving up to Utah's spot with an offer like Seraphin+6 for Okur+3? Could work if they really want a guard and wouldn't have to worry about Toronto taking their guy since they traded up for Kanter. I'd take Williams, of course.

[nate33]

Let's hope they acquire one via trade rather than target Nick Young in free agency.

I am more worried about Chicago. He would fit in perfectly there on both ends.

Chicago can't afford him under any kind of hard cap. They've already commited $61M to just nine players (Boozer, Noah, Deng, Rose, Korver, Brewer, Watson, Asik and Gibson). The only conceivable way they put themselves into position to go after Young is by using Asik and/or Gibson as incentive to dump one of Korver or Brewer. That probably wouldn't be wise; and even if they did, I doubt it would put them far enough under the cap to get Young.

Minnesota is probably the biggest threat to go after Young. They are in crying need for a SG and they have a payroll of just $47M ($52M after including the #2 pick). They might need to move a piece to get the necessary cap room, but most of their pieces are movable so it shouldn't be much of a problem. Our best assurance there is that Minnesota probably isn't dying for another young player with questionable basketball IQ. Rumors are that they are looking for an established vet who can lead them.

[nate33]

Re: Minny trading for DeRozan

Thinking about it, DeRozan+5 for the 2 makes sense if the Raptors are serious about moving Bargnani to PF. I would think they'd go for Kanter since he potentially fills in the things Bargs lacks (strength, rebounding, post scoring).

If that happens, I see picks 3/4 being Williams and Valanciunas (in either order) and then I'd have to think Minny would go big at the 5 spot. Maybe Biyombo? I seem to recall reading something (I think by Chad Ford) saying that Minny would even consider Biyombo at 2, so taking him at 5 makes sense IMO. That would pretty much leave us with squat, though.

1 - Irving
2 - Kanter
3 - Williams
4 - Valanciunas
5 - Biyombo
6 - ???

Could we pre-empt that scenario by moving up to Utah's spot with an offer like Seraphin+6 for Okur+3? Could work if they really want a guard and wouldn't have to worry about Toronto taking their guy since they traded up for Kanter. I'd take Williams, of course.

The sense on the Toronto board is that they're tired of soft Europeans and are happy with the new direction of the franchise focused around athletes like DeRozan, Davis, Amir, etc. I think they'd be loathe to trade DeRozan, and if they did, I think they'd draft Williams, not Kanter.

Either way, I think it's a bad move for Toronto. The only way I'd willingly trade DeRozan + #5 is if Irving is still on the board at #2.

[tontoz]

Let's hope they acquire one via trade rather than target Nick Young in free agency.

I am more worried about Chicago. He would fit in perfectly there on both ends.

Chicago can't afford him under any kind of hard cap. They've already commited $61M to just nine players (Boozer, Noah, Deng, Rose, Korver, Brewer, Watson, Asik and Gibson). The only conceivable way they put themselves into position to go after Young is by using Asik and/or Gibson as incentive to dump one of Korver or Brewer. That probably wouldn't be wise; and even if they did, I doubt it would put them far enough under the cap to get Young.

Minnesota is probably the biggest threat to go after Young. They are in crying need for a SG and they have a payroll of just $47M ($52M after including the #2 pick). They might need to move a piece to get the necessary cap room, but most of their pieces are movable so it shouldn't be much of a problem. Our best assurance there is that Minnesota probably isn't dying for another young player with questionable basketball IQ. Rumors are that they are looking for an established vet who can lead them.

I didn't even think about the cap lol. In the offseason I can be a bit absentminded.

There are a bunch of wings available so hopefully Minny will be looking for a UFA if they don't make a draft day trade.

[verbal8]

Re: Minny trading for DeRozan

Thinking about it, DeRozan+5 for the 2 makes sense if the Raptors are serious about moving Bargnani to PF. I would think they'd go for Kanter since he potentially fills in the things Bargs lacks (strength, rebounding, post scoring).

If that happens, I see picks 3/4 being Williams and Valanciunas (in either order) and then I'd have to think Minny would go big at the 5 spot. Maybe Biyombo? I seem to recall reading something (I think by Chad Ford) saying that Minny would even consider Biyombo at 2, so taking him at 5 makes sense IMO. That would pretty much leave us with squat, though.

1 - Irving
2 - Kanter
3 - Williams
4 - Valanciunas
5 - Biyombo
6 - ???

Could we pre-empt that scenario by moving up to Utah's spot with an offer like Seraphin+6 for Okur+3? Could work if they really want a guard and wouldn't have to worry about Toronto taking their guy since they traded up for Kanter. I'd take Williams, of course.

That is a bad scenario for the Wizards. However the pick would be pretty ripe for a trade down with Knight and Walker still available. Like Sacramento takes the remaining, one so most teams would have incentive to move up.

The Bobcats could deal the 9th and 19th picks for the Wizards 6th and 2nd rounder. The Bobcats move up cheap, but the Wizards get something in return rather than having to reach at the 6 spot. The best options at 9 are probably Marcus Morris, Klay Thompson and Alec Burks(although one of them may be taken already). I am assuming Leonard would be picked at 7 or 8).

An entertaining scenrio would be if Walker was still on the board and the Wizards could trade down again. Maybe to 12 and a protected future 1st from Utah. At 12 if all the guys mentioned at 9 are gone, I would go with Faried.