Official Trade Thread - Part XXVII

[LyricalRico]

I was just reading the latest Mock Draft. Of course the order hasn't been set yet, but if Utah ends up in a position where the best player available is a 4 or a 5, and we resign Ariza, we should see if they have interest in a Porter for Kanter trade to balance both rosters.

Didn't Kanter take a step back this year? Also, I believe he'll be going into the last year on his rookie deal so we'd have to pay him in 2015.

[deneem4]

Wizards dream team

wall(14mil) vasquez(5mil)
beal(4.5mil)b.rush(2mil)rice (.5mil)
porter(4.5mil)/sefolosha(4mil)
Hawes (8mil)/ersan(7mil)
Pekovic(12mil)/okafor(5mil)

got a post and stretch big man with defensive and another stretch coming off the bench
make use our of porter while having sefolosha to teach him defensively
another 3pt shooter in rice and facilitator in rush

[verbal8]

Wizards dream team

wall(14mil) vasquez(5mil)
beal(4.5mil)b.rush(2mil)rice (.5mil)
porter(4.5mil)/sefolosha(4mil)
Hawes (8mil)/ersan(7mil)
Pekovic(12mil)/okafor(5mil)

got a post and stretch big man with defensive and another stretch coming off the bench
make use our of porter while having sefolosha to teach him defensively
another 3pt shooter in rice and facilitator in rush

How do you propose to assemble that line-up? Not sure I am a fan of paying Hawes $8 million/year. I don't think Okafor is the right option at back-up center, but I am sure one can be found in the $4-$5 million range, not to mention Gooden will likely be back.

[verbal8]

I was just reading the latest Mock Draft. Of course the order hasn't been set yet, but if Utah ends up in a position where the best player available is a 4 or a 5, and we resign Ariza, we should see if they have interest in a Porter for Kanter trade to balance both rosters.

Didn't Kanter take a step back this year? Also, I believe he'll be going into the last year on his rookie deal so we'd have to pay him in 2015.

I realize the trade values of Kanter and Porter aren't too far apart. However I would want something to compensate for the 2 years additional years of a rookie deal that Porter has remaining.

It would have to go through a 3rd team, but I wonder if Webster(or even an Ariza S&T) might bring back enough to acquire Kanter.

[dckingsfan]

The Mavs would much rather sign Marcin Gortat, whom they targeted in the 2009 offseason, away from the Washington Wizards. Or trade for old friend Tyson Chandler if the New York Knicks go into rebuilding mode and want to slash salary. Entering next season with Samuel Dalembert as the starting center again after using the cap space to upgrade other positions wouldn’t be a worst-case scenario, either. ESPN.com

[deneem4]

Wizards dream team

wall(14mil) vasquez(5mil)
beal(4.5mil)b.rush(2mil)rice (.5mil)
porter(4.5mil)/sefolosha(4mil)
Hawes (8mil)/ersan(7mil)
Pekovic(12mil)/okafor(5mil)

got a post and stretch big man with defensive and another stretch coming off the bench
make use our of porter while having sefolosha to teach him defensively
another 3pt shooter in rice and facilitator in rush

How do you propose to assemble that line-up? Not sure I am a fan of paying Hawes $8 million/year. I don't think Okafor is the right option at back-up center, but I am sure one can be found in the $4-$5 million range, not to mention Gooden will likely be back.

sign trade ariza for pek
send nene and our pick to the bucks for ersan... (nene and sanders would be a nice fit and can maybe balance out the locker attitude
Send webster and miller some where anywhere...

wolves need defense and a 3pt shooter...Being has been looking like a better match near love
bucks need a reliable big
yea maybe we can resign gooden instead of okafor but gooden has been playing for a contract, but if he shows interest in returning to play we can keep him instead

might can switch vasquez with sessions depending on who's cheaper

our player stock has definitely gone up in these playoffs...bucks can have nene and Henson to bag him up without limiting Henson minutes because of nene health
cavs will try to retain Hawes but we can take him at that price and a 45% 3pt shooting 4 is perfect next to wall especially if we can get pek who's post game Is Unstoppable 1on1

[Dark Faze]

The Mavs would much rather sign Marcin Gortat, whom they targeted in the 2009 offseason, away from the Washington Wizards. Or trade for old friend Tyson Chandler if the New York Knicks go into rebuilding mode and want to slash salary. Entering next season with Samuel Dalembert as the starting center again after using the cap space to upgrade other positions wouldn’t be a worst-case scenario, either. ESPN.com

this is a legitimate concern--the center positon is deep enough now that there's not really a market for overpaying them which is advantageous to us, but the Mavs are one of the few teams in the league that don't have a legitimate starting C. There are also rumors that Dirk is willing to take a significant discount in order to bring in talent. Gortat seems like the perfect choice for them.

If that happens we might bein for a world of hurt. Assuming Detroit is willing to match any offers for Monroe, we'd have to be content with a signing of Hill and Okafor or something similar.

[deneem4]

The Mavs would much rather sign Marcin Gortat, whom they targeted in the 2009 offseason, away from the Washington Wizards. Or trade for old friend Tyson Chandler if the New York Knicks go into rebuilding mode and want to slash salary. Entering next season with Samuel Dalembert as the starting center again after using the cap space to upgrade other positions wouldn’t be a worst-case scenario, either. ESPN.com

this is a legitimate concern--the center positon is deep enough now that there's not really a market for overpaying them which is advantageous to us, but the Mavs are one of the few teams in the league that don't have a legitimate starting C. There are also rumors that Dirk is willing to take a significant discount in order to bring in talent. Gortat seems like the perfect choice for them.

If that happens we might bein for a world of hurt. Assuming Detroit is willing to match any offers for Monroe, we'd have to be content with a signing of Hill and Okafor or something similar.

Hawes

[Dark Faze]

Wizards dream team

wall(14mil) vasquez(5mil)
beal(4.5mil)b.rush(2mil)rice (.5mil)
porter(4.5mil)/sefolosha(4mil)
Hawes (8mil)/ersan(7mil)
Pekovic(12mil)/okafor(5mil)

got a post and stretch big man with defensive and another stretch coming off the bench
make use our of porter while having sefolosha to teach him defensively
another 3pt shooter in rice and facilitator in rush

How do you propose to assemble that line-up? Not sure I am a fan of paying Hawes $8 million/year. I don't think Okafor is the right option at back-up center, but I am sure one can be found in the $4-$5 million range, not to mention Gooden will likely be back.

sign trade ariza for pek
send nene and our pick to the bucks for ersan... (nene and sanders would be a nice fit and can maybe balance out the locker attitude
Send webster and miller some where anywhere...

wolves need defense and a 3pt shooter...Being has been looking like a better match near love
bucks need a reliable big
yea maybe we can resign gooden instead of okafor but gooden has been playing for a contract, but if he shows interest in returning to play we can keep him instead

might can switch vasquez with sessions depending on who's cheaper

our player stock has definitely gone up in these playoffs...bucks can have nene and Henson to bag him up without limiting Henson minutes because of nene health
cavs will try to retain Hawes but we can take him at that price and a 45% 3pt shooting 4 is perfect next to wall especially if we can get pek who's post game Is Unstoppable 1on1

our pick for Ersan? Seriously? Nevermind the fact that the Bucks have a loaded frontcourt already and have a great shot at getting Embiid in the draft.

The Wolves would never make that deal. As good as Dieng looks he's still not ready for primetime and shipping out Pek for a fantastic roleplayer in Ariza is a good way to ask him to demand a trade that year.

A Hawes and Pek frontcourt would be super soft. We are where we are because we're surviving the front court battles we've been put through. We would never have made it past Chicago with the above group.

[deneem4]

How do you propose to assemble that line-up? Not sure I am a fan of paying Hawes $8 million/year. I don't think Okafor is the right option at back-up center, but I am sure one can be found in the $4-$5 million range, not to mention Gooden will likely be back.

sign trade ariza for pek
send nene and our pick to the bucks for ersan... (nene and sanders would be a nice fit and can maybe balance out the locker attitude
Send webster and miller some where anywhere...

wolves need defense and a 3pt shooter...Being has been looking like a better match near love
bucks need a reliable big
yea maybe we can resign gooden instead of okafor but gooden has been playing for a contract, but if he shows interest in returning to play we can keep him instead

might can switch vasquez with sessions depending on who's cheaper

our player stock has definitely gone up in these playoffs...bucks can have nene and Henson to bag him up without limiting Henson minutes because of nene health
cavs will try to retain Hawes but we can take him at that price and a 45% 3pt shooting 4 is perfect next to wall especially if we can get pek who's post game Is Unstoppable 1on1

our pick for Ersan? Seriously? Nevermind the fact that the Bucks have a loaded frontcourt already and have a great shot at getting Embiid in the draft.

The Wolves would never make that deal. As good as Dieng looks he's still not ready for primetime and shipping out Pek for a fantastic roleplayer in Ariza is a good way to ask him to demand a trade that year.

A Hawes and Pek frontcourt would be super soft. We are where we are because we're surviving the front court battles we've been put through. We would never have made it past Chicago with the above group.

Bucks will get a guard or sf...henson, zaza, larry, ersan don't sound lik the loaded backcourt you would want to have...they have no vet that can bang long...zaza is injury prone...Larry c an only block and dunk
henson still needs grooming

ariza has deng like this season...especially in the playoffs...wolves have been having great interior defense with gorgui on the floor...to get a player like ariza they can transform to a normal roster...3pt shooter in 4 positions with 2 defensive minded guys...might have to throw webster but il do that...not to mention this is the wolves last chance before loves leaves

I guess Hibbert is a soft player too??
No...that mentality comes from coaching and chemistry, pek is nowhere near soft..Hawes might not be the toughest but wasn't nene jus saying he didn't want to bang with bigger guys?
Besides both those guys a re 7ft...pek is damn near Hibbert size...and moves like nene..I il definitely take them over our current frontcourt...elite floor spacing big and post big

[dckingsfan]

The Mavs would much rather sign Marcin Gortat, whom they targeted in the 2009 offseason, away from the Washington Wizards. Or trade for old friend Tyson Chandler if the New York Knicks go into rebuilding mode and want to slash salary. Entering next season with Samuel Dalembert as the starting center again after using the cap space to upgrade other positions wouldn’t be a worst-case scenario, either. ESPN.com

this is a legitimate concern--the center positon is deep enough now that there's not really a market for overpaying them which is advantageous to us, but the Mavs are one of the few teams in the league that don't have a legitimate starting C. There are also rumors that Dirk is willing to take a significant discount in order to bring in talent. Gortat seems like the perfect choice for them.

If that happens we might bein for a world of hurt. Assuming Detroit is willing to match any offers for Monroe, we'd have to be content with a signing of Hill and Okafor or something similar.

Hawes

Don't think he is a bit soft?

[deneem4]

this is a legitimate concern--the center positon is deep enough now that there's not really a market for overpaying them which is advantageous to us, but the Mavs are one of the few teams in the league that don't have a legitimate starting C. There are also rumors that Dirk is willing to take a significant discount in order to bring in talent. Gortat seems like the perfect choice for them.

If that happens we might bein for a world of hurt. Assuming Detroit is willing to match any offers for Monroe, we'd have to be content with a signing of Hill and Okafor or something similar.

Hawes

Don't think he is a bit soft?

45% 3pt shooter...and I think he can adjust to our defense
okafor and gooden off the bench if things get too intense

[payitforward]

There is tons that I post about first that I don't get credit for, but I'm not sure I was the one that brought up the Miller buyout and resigning idea first. If I did, I forgot I did. lol

You did. And, man, it would be more fun to read your posts if you weren't always puffing out your chest with your imaginary far-sightedness. Or, at the very least, stick your hand up and say "yup, that was me", when people remind you of all the complete nonsense you've written.

But one thing I don't think has fully sunk in to folks here is this, the new CBA. What will next years contracts look like. 7/8M a year contracts aren't going to get throw around like they used to be. 10M contracts are now making bank..

BS, amigo. In the history of professional sports, there has never been a cap agreement that drove player salaries down. In any league. The only way that happens is if overall team/league revenues go down -- which they are not.

Also, its ok to have contracts filling your cap.... ...players 30 and up. ...Once you fill you cap, you still have MLE and ...as many min vet contracts as you want. A player like Caron ... Okafor ...Maybe Ray Allen...

Dude, get a grip will you? If a player is capable of contributing in any real way, he doesn't have to sign for the veteran minimum. And Ray Allen no less? He's gonna need to take a vet minimum salary?

You can fill up the cap and still not be stuck, because you can make trades. ...Webby is the one who is earning a little to much for that he currently does. But Webby is also a player other teams would want so its not a big deal when the time come that they might want to move him. Even Kevin has value. So does Booker.

...projects ...Well Wall and Beal are existing project stage now and Otto will be next years project. After that, they will decide if they want Kevin and Glen to get added to that list or cut bait for player that do things consistently now that will help them.

Wow.... Do you even think through what you write before your fingertips do the work for you? Do you remember the corner OKC got into w/ Harden?

And... if Webster is over-paid, that means other teams won't want his salary for the production he provides. Duh. Doesn't mean he can't be traded in any scenario. Just not for equivalent value -- that's how you wind up giving away a high lottery pick from 2 years ago for a guy who is 38 and obviously has little future value.

And, do you even know where our players are in their rookie contracts and our control over them? You think we will be deciding anything about Kevin the year after next? NOW is when they have to decide about Kevin.

...Oddly, people still don't see how this model they are doing can work. We don't need to replace Nene, TA or Gortat. They are 3 players that are core to a great starting 5 with have two young rising star studs.. one 20 and one 23 that many are saying will be the best two player back court in the NBA. What's wrong with that ?

Damn you just can't get enough of being twerpy, can you? Did anyone suggest replacing Wall and/or Beal? No. Did anyone suggest it would even be possible to trade Nene's $16m salary? No. Did anyone doubt the high level Ariza is playing at? No. Did anyone criticize Gortat (who's value I, for example, knew before you even knew his name)? No.

Obviously, the model has worked for the present and in the current Eastern Conference. We just won the away opener of our round 2 playoff series, and you make a jackass statement like "people still don't see how this model they are doing can work."

Really all they need is to keep it together and work up upgrading the bench. ...Right now it all rides on bring TA and Gortat back and Otto working out.

Yes, that was the problem being discussed -- how to afford to bring Ariza and Gortat back w/o completely hamstringing the future. As usual, you turned a question which is interesting and complicated into an opportunity to pat yourself on the back.

When am I going to hear you remember calling Vesely our franchise player? Talking about how good Chris Singleton is (a for-sure NBA starter as a rookie)? Predicting a break-out season for Seraphin? Being perfectly ok w/ the Maynor deal? Talking about how good Jannero Pargo is? Etc.

Or, for that matter, damning Ernie for the Gortat trade (which you love now of course)?

Like I've said before, Hands -- you blow in the wind. You like to be right. So whenever something good happens, why "that's what I've been saying all along...."

[payitforward]

No need to be rigid in the plan. I should have rephrased step 1 to say "Keep them competitive", because you can afford to make adjustments. Lets say before FA starts you go to TA and Gortat to get a feel for what they'll get. Lets assume in this scenerio that Gortat has interest from the Mavs and we feel he'll get the 4/44 deal. We also assume that TA has some interest, but because of the market, he’s really only seeing 3-4 yr right above the MLE (about 7M).

I know what. Lets assume we sign Ariza for the veteran minimum -- problem solved....

Ariza has had one of the best seasons of any 3 in the league. He's on a big post-season stage. He is killing it, absolutely killing it, on that stage. This is the biggest contract he'll ever sign in the NBA. He'd be an idiot not to take the biggest, longest offer he can get and just waltz off with that. And he's no idiot. Ditto Gortat.

We can keep them; we'll just have to pay their market value and accept the fact that we are left with, as I said, 7 guys at somewhere around $62m and very few ways to build for the future.

As far as your idea of getting younger while staying "competitive," yes, that would be great. Depending what players "younger" stands for in that equation, I'd be delighted to move Gortat and Ariza. Only problem is they are both UFA, so you can't exactly "move" them, can you?

[payitforward]

forgive me if already posted and I dont see the FA thread but did anyone see this on the main board?

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1320573

Says in Polish that the Wiz/Gortat have talked about multi-year at $10m; both happy with that.

That's great value for a player of his productivity. Only one problem.... What happens if/when his camp starts to see bigger offers from elsewhere. Or, put differently, this means absolutely nothing at all!

[Rafael122]

forgive me if already posted and I dont see the FA thread but did anyone see this on the main board?

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1320573

Says in Polish that the Wiz/Gortat have talked about multi-year at $10m; both happy with that.

That's great value for a player of his productivity. Only one problem.... What happens if/when his camp starts to see bigger offers from elsewhere. Or, put differently, this means absolutely nothing at all!

Gortat strikes me as a guy who is pretty loyal. Doubt he'll move on unless the offer blows away what Ernie is giving him.

[dckingsfan]

I think he is going to get paid the median of:
DeMar DeRozan
Nicolas Batum
Thaddeus Young
Tyreke Evans
Danilo Gallinari

[dckingsfan]

Hawes

Don't think he is a bit soft?

45% 3pt shooter...and I think he can adjust to our defense
okafor and gooden off the bench if things get too intense

Yep, just not sold on him on the defensive end... I don't think he would adjust.

[pcbothwel]

No need to be rigid in the plan. I should have rephrased step 1 to say "Keep them competitive", because you can afford to make adjustments. Lets say before FA starts you go to TA and Gortat to get a feel for what they'll get. Lets assume in this scenerio that Gortat has interest from the Mavs and we feel he'll get the 4/44 deal. We also assume that TA has some interest, but because of the market, he’s really only seeing 3-4 yr right above the MLE (about 7M).

I know what. Lets assume we sign Ariza for the veteran minimum -- problem solved....

Ariza has had one of the best seasons of any 3 in the league. He's on a big post-season stage. He is killing it, absolutely killing it, on that stage. This is the biggest contract he'll ever sign in the NBA. He'd be an idiot not to take the biggest, longest offer he can get and just waltz off with that. And he's no idiot. Ditto Gortat.

We can keep them; we'll just have to pay their market value and accept the fact that we are left with, as I said, 7 guys at somewhere around $62m and very few ways to build for the future.

As far as your idea of getting younger while staying "competitive," yes, that would be great. Depending what players "younger" stands for in that equation, I'd be delighted to move Gortat and Ariza. Only problem is they are both UFA, so you can't exactly "move" them, can you?

Right, because a 4yr/30M contract for Ariza is the same as "Lets assume we sign Ariza for the veteran minimum -- problem solved....". Stop guessing with your emotions and realize that FA are a product of Market forces. Beyond saying Ariza is having a great season, you have to analyze what he brings. Facts: He is 29, Not a primary ball-handler, Not a primary facilitator, Not a primary scorer, Not a primary bigman. He is a glue guy on contender, and contenders can only give him the MLE. If some asinine GM wants to give him 4/40, then let him walk...but it wont happen. So if he gets the MLE thrown at him left and right, offer him just over..Or give him the Paul Milsap deal (2/19M) He'll be 31 and perfect for a MLE to finish out his prime.

As for Gortat, I was only using a hypothetical in S&T as Dallas would clear 8M in the trade to then use to sign other FA's (Stephenson, Deng, Melo?) and resign Dirk.
Its probably irrelevant as I've heard he really likes the area and playing with Wall/Beal. Ill go on the record and say he re-ups for 3yr/32M... So basically the Vet Min

[deneem4]

Don't think he is a bit soft?

45% 3pt shooter...and I think he can adjust to our defense
okafor and gooden off the bench if things get too intense

Yep, just not sold on him on the defensive end... I don't think he would adjust.

Well ignore hawes...
A frontcourt of
Gortat (10mil)/ersan(7mil)
Pek (12mil)/

Pick between
okafor
humpries
Jason Smith for last rotation spot
and or drew gooden if he don't ask too much

I jus think we need at least 1 3pt stretch 4...i dont think our playoff odds will get this lucky again and we need a big or 2 that can consistently knock down the open jumper defenses give us...gortat Is capable and ersan or hawes ideal...pek isn't the guy but he's a better pnr than gortat... (yes it gets better than gortat) he also have a better touch around the basket and rebounds better.