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Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part V

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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part V 

Post#741 » by Chocolate City Jordanaire » Fri May 24, 2013 4:27 pm

fishercob wrote:Chad Ford tweets:

Muscala had one of the best workouts I've EVER seen for a big man. Literally missed just 2 shots entire workout. Crazy skills for big.


Muscala, by the way, had the highest shooting percentage of anyone at NBA Draft Combine.


I don't think he ends up lasting until 37. I think we'd have to do a Trevor Booker type deal up to the late first to get him.


Kevin pointed out a huge disparity between Muscala's NCAA eFG% and Olynyk's. IIRC Muscala shot .575 compared to KO's .675 on two-point shots.

I think workout shooting should not overshadow the regular season. Muscala might be great as a stretch four big man, but he can't score well in the low post like Olynyk can.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part V 

Post#742 » by sfam » Fri May 24, 2013 4:32 pm

15 minutes in on this podcast with Chad Ford from a Utah station, Ford, when pressed says Bennett has the best chance of becoming an all-star of anyone from this draft. He says its near impossible to tell this year. Last year, he would have immediately said, "Davis and Beal."

http://weareutahjazz.com/lockedonjazz/
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part V 

Post#743 » by nate33 » Fri May 24, 2013 4:36 pm

Chocolate City Jordanaire wrote:
fishercob wrote:Chad Ford tweets:

Muscala had one of the best workouts I've EVER seen for a big man. Literally missed just 2 shots entire workout. Crazy skills for big.


Muscala, by the way, had the highest shooting percentage of anyone at NBA Draft Combine.


I don't think he ends up lasting until 37. I think we'd have to do a Trevor Booker type deal up to the late first to get him.


Kevin pointed out a huge disparity between Muscala's NCAA eFG% and Olynyk's. IIRC Muscala shot .575 compared to KO's .675 on two-point shots.

I think workout shooting should not overshadow the regular season. Muscala might be great as a stretch four big man, but he can't score well in the low post like Olynyk can.

I'm not so sure about that. The one thing about the college game is that bigs rarely dominate. With zone defenses and the lack of floor spacing, even good big men can get shut down by ordinary teams. Circumstances change quite a bit when they hit the NBA and the face a lot more single coverage. Moreover, the ability to catch-and-shoot from the perimeter is a much more valued skill for a big at the NBA level because it keeps those elite defensive big men out of the lane when guards penetrate. (And guards penetrate all of the time because of the hand check rules.)

Olynyk no doubt has a much more varied offensive game than Muscala. But if Muscala can do one thing really well - knock down shots, he could pan out to be the more effective NBA player.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part V 

Post#744 » by Nivek » Fri May 24, 2013 4:37 pm

GhostsOfGil wrote:Kev, how does Bennett compare to Blake Griffin as a prospect?


Code: Select all

PER40   Bennett Griffin Griffin
Class   FR      SO      FR
Min     27.1    33.3    28.4
efg     .580    .657    .568
2p%     .587    .659    .571
3p%     .375    .375    .000
FT%     .701    .590    .589
eOrtg   117     120     112
Usg     19.1    22.4    19.0
Reb     12.0    17.3    12.8
Ast     1.4     2.7     2.6
Stl     1.0     1.3     1.4
Blk     1.8     1.4     1.2
Tov     2.7     4.0     3.2
PF      3.4     3.1     3.5
Pts     23.7    27.3    20.7


Very comparable as freshman. Bennett was a bit more efficient -- mainly by making his free throws. Griffin got more assists and steals; Bennett blocked more shots. It would have been nice if Bennett could have gone to the combine.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part V 

Post#745 » by thricethefun » Fri May 24, 2013 4:37 pm

I'm wondering how much we could get back in return for trading down to 5 or 6 in order to snag Len. I like him better as a prospect than Bennett or Porter. Of course I would only do this if Noel and Mclemore are both off the board.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part V 

Post#746 » by truwizfan4evr » Fri May 24, 2013 4:39 pm

I have to admit Bennett has a lot of talent but not sure if it will translate into the nba. What is his natural position? And does anyone think he has all star potential?
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part V 

Post#747 » by nate33 » Fri May 24, 2013 4:40 pm

Nivek wrote:
GhostsOfGil wrote:Kev, how does Bennett compare to Blake Griffin as a prospect?


Code: Select all

PER40   Bennett Griffin Griffin
Class   FR      SO      FR
Min     27.1    33.3    28.4
efg     .580    .657    .568
2p%     .587    .659    .571
3p%     .375    .375    .000
FT%     .701    .590    .589
eOrtg   117     120     112
Usg     19.1    22.4    19.0
Reb     12.0    17.3    12.8
Ast     1.4     2.7     2.6
Stl     1.0     1.3     1.4
Blk     1.8     1.4     1.2
Tov     2.7     4.0     3.2
PF      3.4     3.1     3.5
Pts     23.7    27.3    20.7


Very comparable as freshman. Bennett was a bit more efficient -- mainly by making his free throws. Griffin got more assists and steals; Bennett blocked more shots. It would have been nice if Bennett could have gone to the combine.

Thank you for posting this, Nivek. I'll add that Griffin was a pretty sucky defender as a college player as well. He made no effort to rotate whatsoever, presumably to avoid fouling.

Do you have a PPA ranking for freshman Griffin versus Bennett? I'm curious to see how they compare after factoring the strength of schedule.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part V 

Post#748 » by nate33 » Fri May 24, 2013 4:41 pm

truwizfan4evr wrote:I have to admit Bennett has a lot of talent but not sure if it will translate into the nba. What is his natural position? And does anyone think he has all star potential?

Apparently, Chad Ford does.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part V 

Post#749 » by Nivek » Fri May 24, 2013 4:41 pm

Chocolate City Jordanaire wrote:Note: Before someone else notes this on those Wolters stats, some only go back to 2009-2010. I looked at many of the names ahead and it's a mixed bag. You find names like Steph Curry and JJ Redick behind Wolters, but Jaycee Carroll is at the top of one list. Jimmer Fredette is not far behind. Tyler Hansbrough is a career leader on the list.

Still, I like Wolters a lot.


I have two of your favorites with the same score -- both as latter part of the 1st round picks (20s): Zeke Marshall and Nate Wolters.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part V 

Post#750 » by TGW » Fri May 24, 2013 4:43 pm

Jim Boeheim isn’t an NBA GM, but if he was he knows who he would pick in the upcoming draft.

Georgetown’s Otto Porter Jr.

“If I’m picking, I pick him first in the draft,” Boeheim told a small group of reporters in the hallway at Madison Square Garden “I don’t even look at anybody else. I pick him first in the draft. I think he’s the best. I think he’ll be a great pro.”

Boeheim made the comments after the Syracuse defense held Porter Jr., the Big East Player of the Year, to 12 points on 4-of-13 shooting as the No. 5 Orange upset No. 1 Georgetown, 58-55 in OT, in the Big East Tournament semifinals.

Porter entered averaging 16.4 points, 7.4 rebounds and 2.7 assists, but did not have a big game in the last meeting between the teams in the Big East.

DraftExpress.com currently has Porter Jr. at No. 8 in its Mock Draft, with Nerlens Noel, Ben McLemore and Shabazz Muhammad 1-2-3.

Boeheim also said that he thought Porter was the best small forward in the history of the Big East.

“I don’t see a weakness in his game from a perimeter point of view of a guy that I’ve seen in this league over the years,” Boeheim said on the podium.

“There’s been so many great players, but centers, power forwards, point guards, two guards, but I don’t think I’ve seen a better small forward in this league. He’s just a complete player.

“If we were still in this league, I’d be saying that to get him out. But we’re not.”

Asked to elaborate on whether Porter Jr. ranks ahead of Carmelo Anthony, who led Syracuse to the 2003 NCAA championship, Boeheim said, “Yeah, I think so. Carmelo played three and four and he was the best scorer. I’m talking about a guys that’s really a multi-purpsoe guy, the best all-around, not necessarily the best player.

“That would be hard to get by Carmelo and Derrick Coleman and Chris Mullin and then the centers, Patrick [Ewing] and those guys,

“Just an all-around guy the guy does everything. I mean, really, the guy does everything.”
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part V 

Post#751 » by Nivek » Fri May 24, 2013 4:44 pm

nate33 wrote:
Nivek wrote:
GhostsOfGil wrote:Kev, how does Bennett compare to Blake Griffin as a prospect?


Code: Select all

PER40   Bennett Griffin Griffin
Class   FR      SO      FR
Min     27.1    33.3    28.4
efg     .580    .657    .568
2p%     .587    .659    .571
3p%     .375    .375    .000
FT%     .701    .590    .589
eOrtg   117     120     112
Usg     19.1    22.4    19.0
Reb     12.0    17.3    12.8
Ast     1.4     2.7     2.6
Stl     1.0     1.3     1.4
Blk     1.8     1.4     1.2
Tov     2.7     4.0     3.2
PF      3.4     3.1     3.5
Pts     23.7    27.3    20.7


Very comparable as freshman. Bennett was a bit more efficient -- mainly by making his free throws. Griffin got more assists and steals; Bennett blocked more shots. It would have been nice if Bennett could have gone to the combine.

Thank you for posting this, Nivek. I'll add that Griffin was a pretty sucky defender as a college player as well. He made no effort to rotate whatsoever, presumably to avoid fouling.

Do you have a PPA ranking for freshman Griffin versus Bennett? I'm curious to see how they compare after factoring the strength of schedule.


The YODA scores for each guy (top score is Shaq's ridiculous sophomore season -- 36):

- Bennett -- 8
- Griffin (FR) -- 11
- Griffin (SO) -- 22

Schedule factor doesn't make much difference for freshman year. Griffin pulls ahead because of his outstanding athletic scores. Bennett gets no bonus (or penalty) because he couldn't participate.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part V 

Post#752 » by Ruzious » Fri May 24, 2013 4:49 pm

Nivek wrote:
GhostsOfGil wrote:Kev, how does Bennett compare to Blake Griffin as a prospect?


Code: Select all

PER40   Bennett Griffin Griffin
Class   FR      SO      FR
Min     27.1    33.3    28.4
efg     .580    .657    .568
2p%     .587    .659    .571
3p%     .375    .375    .000
FT%     .701    .590    .589
eOrtg   117     120     112
Usg     19.1    22.4    19.0
Reb     12.0    17.3    12.8
Ast     1.4     2.7     2.6
Stl     1.0     1.3     1.4
Blk     1.8     1.4     1.2
Tov     2.7     4.0     3.2
PF      3.4     3.1     3.5
Pts     23.7    27.3    20.7


Very comparable as freshman. Bennett was a bit more efficient -- mainly by making his free throws. Griffin got more assists and steals; Bennett blocked more shots. It would have been nice if Bennett could have gone to the combine.

I'd really like to know what his standing reach is. Considering his lack of height, that's a vital number to have. People have brought up good points - pro and con - on Bennett. I still haven't figured out how high I'd rate him.

Maybe this belongs in the trade thread, but it sounds like teams want to trade up for... Oladipo - supposedly Minnesota (9th pick) has already made it known they want him. I suspect there will be good trade down opportunities where the Wiz could still get who they want - and get a future 1st round pick. This might be EG's last chance to shine.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part V 

Post#753 » by Jay81 » Fri May 24, 2013 4:50 pm

i think porter has to be the pick. We cant afford another high lottery bust. If he is not there, then you take the best available player and made a deal if you have too
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part V 

Post#754 » by sfam » Fri May 24, 2013 4:50 pm

nate33 wrote:
truwizfan4evr wrote:I have to admit Bennett has a lot of talent but not sure if it will translate into the nba. What is his natural position? And does anyone think he has all star potential?

Apparently, Chad Ford does.

You don't draft Bennett as a SF. He's a PF. He can play some 3 in a big lineup, but really he's a PF, size issues and all (which are mitigated by his wingspan).
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part V 

Post#755 » by nate33 » Fri May 24, 2013 4:51 pm

I'm assuming Bennett's athletic scores are pretty good too. Maybe not at Griffin's level as a leaper, but he might have Griffin beat with respect to standing reach and definitely has him beat in wingspan.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part V 

Post#756 » by pancakes3 » Fri May 24, 2013 4:53 pm

nate33 wrote:
truwizfan4evr wrote:I have to admit Bennett has a lot of talent but not sure if it will translate into the nba. What is his natural position? And does anyone think he has all star potential?

Apparently, Chad Ford does.


And the Bennett glass half empty compels me to add that ford said that Bennett has the best chance to be an all-star, not that he has [significant amounts of] all-star potential. The wording is weird about the "this time last year" but I took the gist of it to mean that he thought that Beal and Davis were much more "sure" all-stars than Bennett.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part V 

Post#757 » by stevemcqueen1 » Fri May 24, 2013 4:54 pm

sfam wrote:As an aside, its pretty cool that a crappy defender like Bennett averages 1.4 blocks a game.


I think it demonstrates that Bennett's defensive problems are more an issue of effort, experience, and approach than actual ability. He's somewhat clueless playing big man D. And he has dogged it, especially in transition. But I've seen him lock down much smaller players on the perimeter and force them to pass out or take contested jumpers. He actually has the makings of a good perimeter defender within him. He is laterally fluid and very long.

He's a good shot blocker and that includes blocking jumpers on the perimeter. People don't realize just how high he can get. He's got very long arms.

You're going to be building him up from a very undeveloped point on D though. If we draft him, I hope Randy signs off on it and knows what a project he has in store for himself. I hope he gets to know Bennett and figures out what makes him tick because he is going to be doing a LOT of teaching.

But if it worked... Bennett could be excellent. He's got rough edges on offense too though. He needs to learn how to play off the ball and give his guards a target to throw to in the interior.

If we were a good teaching team that had this great culture of taking immature or unfocused players and getting the most out of them, I'd be all for Bennett. But I just don't trust the Wizards to handle Bennett like he needs to handled. He's going to be somewhat high maintenance.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part V 

Post#758 » by truwizfan4evr » Fri May 24, 2013 4:55 pm

nate33 wrote:
truwizfan4evr wrote:I have to admit Bennett has a lot of talent but not sure if it will translate into the nba. What is his natural position? And does anyone think he has all star potential?

Apparently, Chad Ford does.

He has bust written all over him i think he could be a decent back up power forward in nba but that's not what wizards need. He look out of shape and he takes a lot of bad shots we don't need another Dray on this team.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part V 

Post#759 » by Dat2U » Fri May 24, 2013 4:55 pm

Deeptu McPullup wrote:I have concern with both guys in that, despite all the glue-gooped oohs-n-ahs (or would that be "ooze-n-ahs"?), we don't end up being that much more effective than if we just rolled with a designated hitter of a squat-n-plop corner 3 man.

The corner 3 is the best shot in basketball with Webster giving an outright silly 1.8 PPS from the right corner. It's an easy, low risk release valve that sets the stage for "kind of a big deal around here" guys to create high percentage rimshots as you preemptively put paid to the slinking charlatans who'd otherwise clog the keyhole with double teams.


Beal is elite in the left pocket, but you'd be remiss to have him hanging a hammock there and taking a nap for 36 minutes. I can't help but think we can get by with a specialist at the other wing slot and commit our resources better up front. There's a reason the mid-range game is lamented as a lost art by the old timers.

Are Dipo or Porter going to generate better offensive looks and final outcomes than we could have gotten with a cheap specialist who plays at least respectable defense? Maybe, but I expect the drop off there is less than the difference between the bigs we're going to have and what we might be able to do up front if we used the third pick to bait the hook.


It's an excellent point. Webster & Ariza did more than adequate job at SF last season. My response is, how sustainable is that level of performance from year to year? Is it really realistic to expect Webster to duplicate 1.8 PPS from the right corner year after year? Ariza also shot very well last year for the most part, above his career average. Can we also expect that type of performance again?

Secondly, Webster is a UFA. While he made his intentions clear about wanting to stay in DC, what if another team makes him a better offer? What happens if we choose to go in another direction in the draft b/c we believe Webster/Ariza will be a part of our core, but we lose Webster in FA? Ariza is only signed through next season. Is he someone that we want or can expect to keep long term? I have my doubts. There are unanswered questions about the SF spot which potentially could be resolved by drafting Porter. Is Porter posting a 1.8 PPS from the right corner next year, unlikely, but defensively, on the boards and decision making wise, he offers a certain amount of length & versatility that Webster isn't going to provide us with.

My thought is, outside of Wall & Beal, I'm not sure it makes sense to give too much consideration to guys that may or may not be here long term. The only certainty is that the Wizards are building around Wall, Beal and whatever we get out of the 3rd pick (whether rookie or vet through trade). I'd focus on making sure those 3 pieces fit, and worry about adding the complimentary pieces around those 3 after the draft. There's too much importance in getting the 3rd pick right, that worrying about how 2nd or 3rd tier options and impending free agents fit into the overall scheme may take us away from the key overall point. The Wizards need to get this draft right.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part V 

Post#760 » by AFM » Fri May 24, 2013 4:56 pm

He has the same wingspan as Otto Porter, 7'1". Way more explosive though.

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