Alex Sarr

[Dat2U]

Age matters so much. Sarr & Carrington are 19. Bilal is still only 20. Kyshawn is 21 so he should be a little more advanced and he is. Jaylen Wells who is arguably the best rookie this season is 22. Yaxel Lendeborg who looks developed and is a good bet to be drafted no later than early 2nd is also 22. Kam Jones & Nique Clifford are 23. Eric Dixon is 24! Six years older than some of the 18 yr old kids in this draft.

Now on the flip side, there are currently only 6 19 yr old players in the league as of today. They all suck, as expected. Risacher & Sarr are the best of this group so far.

There is only one guy 20 yrs or younger that is providing a positive impact according to EPM, Dereck Lively II. Jared McCain is a distant 2nd at -0.2.

So drafting an 18 or 19 yr old likely leads to a poor 1st season performance by most statistical measures.

You want instant results, draft a mature player but be wary that they plateau fairly quickly and if they aren't productive from jump, they aren't likely to become productive because their development curve is already maxed out.

[dckingsfan]

I think having a beef cake already physically ready center for Sarr to lean on when he just gets too overpowered could be useful for a couple years 'till he fills out.

This. I really hope this is the direction we go with Sarr.

[dobrojim]

Jaimie Jacquez

[smoothSeph]

Age matters so much. Sarr & Carrington are 19. Bilal is still only 20. Kyshawn is 21 so he should be a little more advanced and he is. Jaylen Wells who is arguably the best rookie this season is 22. Yaxel Lendeborg who looks developed and is a good bet to be drafted no later than early 2nd is also 22. Kam Jones & Nique Clifford are 23. Eric Dixon is 24! Six years older than some of the 18 yr old kids in this draft.

Now on the flip side, there are currently only 6 19 yr old players in the league as of today. They all suck, as expected. Risacher & Sarr are the best of this group so far.

There is only one guy 20 yrs or younger that is providing a positive impact according to EPM, Dereck Lively II. Jared McCain is a distant 2nd at -0.2.

So drafting an 18 or 19 yr old likely leads to a poor 1st season performance by most statistical measures.

You want instant results, draft a mature player but be wary that they plateau fairly quickly and if they aren't productive from jump, they aren't likely to become productive because their development curve is already maxed out.

This logic is so obvious. I can't understand the negative takes I've seen on Sarr, Bub and Bilal. Granted I've seen positive ones also, but it seems some people just want to be upset or right about wanting someone else.

[DCZards]

Yup…an on target breakdown by Dat. We all want our 19, 20 and 21 yr olds to be solid and consistent game in and game out but that’s almost never the case with players that young and inexperienced.

For the time being, I’ll take the flashes I’ve seen from them.

[tontoz]

Long vid on Sarr's rookie year with some AJ talk at the end.

Watch on YouTube

[LyricalRico]

I think having a beef cake already physically ready center for Sarr to lean on when he just gets too overpowered could be useful for a couple years 'till he fills out.

This. I really hope this is the direction we go with Sarr.

Wasn't that supposed to be Valanciunas?

[gesa2]

I think having a beef cake already physically ready center for Sarr to lean on when he just gets too overpowered could be useful for a couple years 'till he fills out.

This. I really hope this is the direction we go with Sarr.

Wasn't that supposed to be Valanciunas?

Sure it was! We can cycle them through, trading them for picks at the trade deadline every year.
Realistically a defense minded big a la Steven Adams or Clint Capela would be better when we actually want to compete

[CntOutSmrtCrazy]

Was looking at some advanced statistics and found some interesting kernels:

-Of the 205 players they have TS% numbers for on Basketball Reference, Sarr is dead last. George is 6th worst, Carrington 12th worst, and Bilal 14th worst.

-The team's young core including Sarr, George, Bilal, and Carrington are all in the bottom 30 of the 563 players they have a reading for (no minutes minimum) in VORP where Carrington has the worst (-1.7), George the 10th worst (-1.0), Bilal the 12th worst (-0.9), and Sarr the 29th worst (-0.5).

-Carrington has the 3rd worst PER, George the 5th worst, and Bilal the 21st worst.

-All are bottom 20 and have negative Offensive WS with Sarr and George in top 10 worst.

-All are bottom 20 in OBPM with Carrington and George both in the bottom 5.

[The Consiglieri]

So you're telling me there's a chance! (of landing 1.01 in '26).

[AFM]

So you're telling me there's a chance! (of landing 1.01 in '26).

Need to draft Gilbert's son, if only for some sort of full circle karmic fulfillment.

Watch on YouTube

6'7 Gilbert Arenas

[nate33]

Was looking at some advanced statistics and found some interesting kernels:

-Of the 205 players they have TS% numbers for on Basketball Reference, Sarr is dead last. George is 6th worst, Carrington 12th worst, and Bilal 14th worst.

-The team's young core including Sarr, George, Bilal, and Carrington are all in the bottom 30 of the 563 players they have a reading for (no minutes minimum) in VORP where Carrington has the worst (-1.7), George the 10th worst (-1.0), Bilal the 12th worst (-0.9), and Sarr the 29th worst (-0.5).

-Carrington has the 3rd worst PER, George the 5th worst, and Bilal the 21st worst.

-All are bottom 20 and have negative Offensive WS with Sarr and George in top 10 worst.

-All are bottom 20 in OBPM with Carrington and George both in the bottom 5.

Much of this is situation dependent. With the exception of Poole, this team has no competent offensive players who can bear the scoring load and allow our rookies to have a more complementary role where they only shoot when open. One efficient first option scorer can make everyone else a lot more efficient offensively as well.

Detroit made a massive turnaround this year because Cade made the leap to a true first option scorer. Suddenly, all their role players look good and they're a winning team.

[AFM]

Was looking at some advanced statistics and found some interesting kernels:

-Of the 205 players they have TS% numbers for on Basketball Reference, Sarr is dead last. George is 6th worst, Carrington 12th worst, and Bilal 14th worst.

-The team's young core including Sarr, George, Bilal, and Carrington are all in the bottom 30 of the 563 players they have a reading for (no minutes minimum) in VORP where Carrington has the worst (-1.7), George the 10th worst (-1.0), Bilal the 12th worst (-0.9), and Sarr the 29th worst (-0.5).

-Carrington has the 3rd worst PER, George the 5th worst, and Bilal the 21st worst.

-All are bottom 20 and have negative Offensive WS with Sarr and George in top 10 worst.

-All are bottom 20 in OBPM with Carrington and George both in the bottom 5.

Much of this is situation dependent. With the exception of Poole, this team has no competent offensive players who can bear the scoring load and allow our rookies to have a more complementary role where they only shoot when open. One efficient first option scorer can make everyone else a lot more efficient offensively as well.

Detroit made a massive turnaround this year because Cade made the leap to a true first option scorer. Suddenly, all their role players look good and they're a winning team.

Yeah I'm not really worried about any of them. Even AJ Johnson I think has serious potential. Granted I am probably higher on Sarr than anyone else on this board, but I think he can be really special.

[payitforward]

Was looking at some advanced statistics and found some interesting kernels:

-Of the 205 players they have TS% numbers for on Basketball Reference, Sarr is dead last. George is 6th worst, Carrington 12th worst, and Bilal 14th worst.

-The team's young core including Sarr, George, Bilal, and Carrington are all in the bottom 30 of the 563 players they have a reading for (no minutes minimum) in VORP where Carrington has the worst (-1.7), George the 10th worst (-1.0), Bilal the 12th worst (-0.9), and Sarr the 29th worst (-0.5).

-Carrington has the 3rd worst PER, George the 5th worst, and Bilal the 21st worst.

-All are bottom 20 and have negative Offensive WS with Sarr and George in top 10 worst.

-All are bottom 20 in OBPM with Carrington and George both in the bottom 5.

All of which is predictable from the fact that we have only 16 wins in 75 games.

[J-Ves]

Was looking at some advanced statistics and found some interesting kernels:

-Of the 205 players they have TS% numbers for on Basketball Reference, Sarr is dead last. George is 6th worst, Carrington 12th worst, and Bilal 14th worst.

-The team's young core including Sarr, George, Bilal, and Carrington are all in the bottom 30 of the 563 players they have a reading for (no minutes minimum) in VORP where Carrington has the worst (-1.7), George the 10th worst (-1.0), Bilal the 12th worst (-0.9), and Sarr the 29th worst (-0.5).

-Carrington has the 3rd worst PER, George the 5th worst, and Bilal the 21st worst.

-All are bottom 20 and have negative Offensive WS with Sarr and George in top 10 worst.

-All are bottom 20 in OBPM with Carrington and George both in the bottom 5.

Do you have some conclusion you’d like to draw from this?

[dckingsfan]

Was looking at some advanced statistics and found some interesting kernels:

-Of the 205 players they have TS% numbers for on Basketball Reference, Sarr is dead last. George is 6th worst, Carrington 12th worst, and Bilal 14th worst.

-The team's young core including Sarr, George, Bilal, and Carrington are all in the bottom 30 of the 563 players they have a reading for (no minutes minimum) in VORP where Carrington has the worst (-1.7), George the 10th worst (-1.0), Bilal the 12th worst (-0.9), and Sarr the 29th worst (-0.5).

-Carrington has the 3rd worst PER, George the 5th worst, and Bilal the 21st worst.

-All are bottom 20 and have negative Offensive WS with Sarr and George in top 10 worst.

-All are bottom 20 in OBPM with Carrington and George both in the bottom 5.

Much of this is situation dependent. With the exception of Poole, this team has no competent offensive players who can bear the scoring load and allow our rookies to have a more complementary role where they only shoot when open. One efficient first option scorer can make everyone else a lot more efficient offensively as well.

Detroit made a massive turnaround this year because Cade made the leap to a true first option scorer. Suddenly, all their role players look good and they're a winning team.

This. If there is anything worrisome, it is the defense side of the ball with our rookies. I think the offense will sort itself out when we have a #1 & #2 option. I guess we could consider Poole one of those... but ugh.

[dckingsfan]

I think having a beef cake already physically ready center for Sarr to lean on when he just gets too overpowered could be useful for a couple years 'till he fills out.

This. I really hope this is the direction we go with Sarr.

Wasn't that supposed to be Valanciunas?

If you want to tank, you will tank. We intentionally didn't play our best players.

[The Consiglieri]

Was looking at some advanced statistics and found some interesting kernels:

-Of the 205 players they have TS% numbers for on Basketball Reference, Sarr is dead last. George is 6th worst, Carrington 12th worst, and Bilal 14th worst.

-The team's young core including Sarr, George, Bilal, and Carrington are all in the bottom 30 of the 563 players they have a reading for (no minutes minimum) in VORP where Carrington has the worst (-1.7), George the 10th worst (-1.0), Bilal the 12th worst (-0.9), and Sarr the 29th worst (-0.5).

-Carrington has the 3rd worst PER, George the 5th worst, and Bilal the 21st worst.

-All are bottom 20 and have negative Offensive WS with Sarr and George in top 10 worst.

-All are bottom 20 in OBPM with Carrington and George both in the bottom 5.

Much of this is situation dependent. With the exception of Poole, this team has no competent offensive players who can bear the scoring load and allow our rookies to have a more complementary role where they only shoot when open. One efficient first option scorer can make everyone else a lot more efficient offensively as well.

Detroit made a massive turnaround this year because Cade made the leap to a true first option scorer. Suddenly, all their role players look good and they're a winning team.

I think without question that's an undersold thing. If you don't have any superlative anything that you can rely upon, it's automatically going to create what's largely an artificial environment of suck because generally, unless you're tanking, you have reliable veteran or somewhat young players that provide a competent floor in the front court and backcourt, which is I imagine part of the reason Deni was traded, his efficiency, and high floor, would limit the fall off to some degree, like keeping a healthy Beal around would have, or say, plugging in a prime era Gortat to the front court etc.

But when all you have is injury riddled vets, and kids, you basically get no professional floor expectation anywhere.

Part of the reason Jayden Daniels was so impressive was he dealing with Jag's at RB, a catch and fall ancient TE and probably the worst WR group in the NFL and it flat out didn't matter until the NFC Championship game.

For our guys to be that much of a mess is probably, like you said, largely a product of a team competing without much of anything to speak of around them that is reliable and provides a reasonable veteran or youthful floor.

Doesn't mean they're gonna be good, but it does give them some breathing room in terms of development.

[payitforward]

Was looking at some advanced statistics and found some interesting kernels:

-Of the 205 players they have TS% numbers for on Basketball Reference, Sarr is dead last. George is 6th worst, Carrington 12th worst, and Bilal 14th worst.

-The team's young core including Sarr, George, Bilal, and Carrington are all in the bottom 30 of the 563 players they have a reading for (no minutes minimum) in VORP where Carrington has the worst (-1.7), George the 10th worst (-1.0), Bilal the 12th worst (-0.9), and Sarr the 29th worst (-0.5).

-Carrington has the 3rd worst PER, George the 5th worst, and Bilal the 21st worst.

-All are bottom 20 and have negative Offensive WS with Sarr and George in top 10 worst.

-All are bottom 20 in OBPM with Carrington and George both in the bottom 5.

Much of this is situation dependent. With the exception of Poole, this team has no competent offensive players who can bear the scoring load and allow our rookies to have a more complementary role where they only shoot when open. One efficient first option scorer can make everyone else a lot more efficient offensively as well.

Detroit made a massive turnaround this year because Cade made the leap to a true first option scorer. Suddenly, all their role players look good and they're a winning team.

Now translate this point over to the Deni trade thread, & it becomes clear that if Deni were on the team we'd have no chance at a top pick this year & no chance at a top pick next year either.

[nate33]

Was looking at some advanced statistics and found some interesting kernels:

-Of the 205 players they have TS% numbers for on Basketball Reference, Sarr is dead last. George is 6th worst, Carrington 12th worst, and Bilal 14th worst.

-The team's young core including Sarr, George, Bilal, and Carrington are all in the bottom 30 of the 563 players they have a reading for (no minutes minimum) in VORP where Carrington has the worst (-1.7), George the 10th worst (-1.0), Bilal the 12th worst (-0.9), and Sarr the 29th worst (-0.5).

-Carrington has the 3rd worst PER, George the 5th worst, and Bilal the 21st worst.

-All are bottom 20 and have negative Offensive WS with Sarr and George in top 10 worst.

-All are bottom 20 in OBPM with Carrington and George both in the bottom 5.

Much of this is situation dependent. With the exception of Poole, this team has no competent offensive players who can bear the scoring load and allow our rookies to have a more complementary role where they only shoot when open. One efficient first option scorer can make everyone else a lot more efficient offensively as well.

Detroit made a massive turnaround this year because Cade made the leap to a true first option scorer. Suddenly, all their role players look good and they're a winning team.

Now translate this point over to the Deni trade thread, & it becomes clear that if Deni were on the team we'd have no chance at a top pick this year & no chance at a top pick next year either.

You can't have it both ways. If Deni is worth 10+ wins, that makes him a superstar and you keep him, or at least hold out for a much better trade.

I disagree that he would be worth that many wins to us. Deni is a fantastic third option who attacks an off balance defense, but he's not really that great against a set defense keying on him. He wouldn't have won us a ton more games as the #1 option here