Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing

[LyricalRico]

^ Yep, the amnesty can be used on any one existing contract that was on your cap before the new CBA. Wiz already used it on Blatche.

[montestewart]

Good question! Yeah, I think it had to be a player you signed yourself.

It could have been used on players on the roster at the time the new CBA was put into place, I think. And Nene came after that, right?

[bjack18]

thanks for responding fellas...no matter what we're stuck with this diva for 3 years including the current season...EG traded one problem for a much bigger problem...would've been better off letting Mcgee walk for nothing

[Zonkerbl]

I don't think he's a diva... I think he had plantar fasciitis, for which the only cure is to sit around doing nothing for a few months waiting for it to get better. So naturally he's out of shape and what happens when you get out of shape? You get injured.

Not necessarily his fault -- he's just old. That's EG's fault.

[bjack18]

I don't think he's a diva... I think he had plantar fasciitis, for which the only cure is to sit around doing nothing for a few months waiting for it to get better. So naturally he's out of shape and what happens when you get out of shape? You get injured.

Not necessarily his fault -- he's just old. That's EG's fault.

ok not a diva, how about malingerer...

[Knighthonor]

Why not tank? what is opinion on tanking now?

People need to take a deep breath. It's a long season. An 0-3 start isn't much to overcome at all. Last year, we went 4-28 and still managed to get within 5 games of the 8th place seed before tanking down the stretch.

Okafor wasn't Hakeem Olajuwon. We can certainly win with Gortat replacing him. The problem isn't a lack of talent. We're losing because this team hasn't got it's s**t together yet.

Yeah you're right. That is the immediate explanation. But the deeper problem is the FO is bad and it tells us why the team hasn't gotten it together yet. The FO sucks and the organizational culture is ruinous and the players came into the season unprepared as a result. The FO is supposed to design a set of roles that fit everyone and design a system that works for them and they've failed just like at the beginning of every year going back a while. The offense is terrible, the guys have no idea how to play together on that end. The defense is similarly a mess, hasn't come together at all.

Our leadership is the problem, it trickles all the way down from Ernie. Our medical staff is another problem. Our bad coach is still another one. We've got a handful of good players now that are capable of winning and making the playoffs. But for this team to truly come together, we need better leadership and a better culture. And I don't think we'll ever get that without making wholesale FO changes. And hopefully upgrading our medical staff to be state of the art.

ok deeep breath.

now lets see this out.

Wizards make playoffs in the lowest spot. Wont likely make it far into the playoffs.

Lose top 12 pick regardless, and still get no championship out of it.

EG will stay.

Lost Oka for Gor, which people here seem to forget how big of a rebounder Oka was for the wizards.

Nene is still stuck here. Pretty much useless player here that they now cant get rid of.

Rice is getting no time.

bench is pretty much bad.

again all in all.

Porter didnt even get any training done at all wtf!?

get nothing for Nene,Oka, Jan, Singleton, Manor,

lost top 12 pick in a loaded draft.

Still no big that can push for deep playoff talent.

there are so many problems. I just dont see why you fans have such a passion for playoff when its not going anywhere till the point that the team will just bloat and lose all the talent it gained. (aka Gil Wizards, Bucks, Hawks, Orlando, Bulls, etc)

[bjack18]

People need to take a deep breath. It's a long season. An 0-3 start isn't much to overcome at all. Last year, we went 4-28 and still managed to get within 5 games of the 8th place seed before tanking down the stretch.

Okafor wasn't Hakeem Olajuwon. We can certainly win with Gortat replacing him. The problem isn't a lack of talent. We're losing because this team hasn't got it's s**t together yet.

Yeah you're right. That is the immediate explanation. But the deeper problem is the FO is bad and it tells us why the team hasn't gotten it together yet. The FO sucks and the organizational culture is ruinous and the players came into the season unprepared as a result. The FO is supposed to design a set of roles that fit everyone and design a system that works for them and they've failed just like at the beginning of every year going back a while. The offense is terrible, the guys have no idea how to play together on that end. The defense is similarly a mess, hasn't come together at all.

Our leadership is the problem, it trickles all the way down from Ernie. Our medical staff is another problem. Our bad coach is still another one. We've got a handful of good players now that are capable of winning and making the playoffs. But for this team to truly come together, we need better leadership and a better culture. And I don't think we'll ever get that without making wholesale FO changes. And hopefully upgrading our medical staff to be state of the art.

ok deeep breath.

now lets see this out.

Wizards make playoffs in the lowest spot. Wont likely make it far into the playoffs.

Lose top 12 pick regardless, and still get no championship out of it.

EG will stay.

Lost Oka for Gor, which people here seem to forget how big of a rebounder Oka was for the wizards.

Nene is still stuck here. Pretty much useless player here that they now cant get rid of.

Rice is getting no time.

bench is pretty much bad.

again all in all.

Porter didnt even get any training done at all wtf!?

get nothing for Nene,Oka, Jan, Singleton, Manor,

lost top 12 pick in a loaded draft.

Still no big that can push for deep playoff talent.

there are so many problems. I just dont see why you fans have such a passion for playoff when its not going anywhere till the point that the team will just bloat and lose all the talent it gained. (aka Gil Wizards, Bucks, Hawks, Orlando, Bulls, etc)

Agree...and i'll take it a step further...I don't see the passion in attending home games, one way to show displeasure is to go to games and boo or wear bags and hold signs etc but the best way and quickest way to bring about change is not going at all, as embarrassing as the former is the latter would be much much more disturbing for Leonsis ...imagine if only a couple thousand fans showed up on a regular basis...it would be the talk of the NBA

[Zonkerbl]

Yeah, see, if Nene is out for the season, and I wouldn't be at all surprised if he were, that answers the question I posed earlier: Is it possible EG's draft failures don't matter, since he's able to manufacture pretty decent trades (Nene for McGee/Young, Okafor/Ariza for Rashard Lewis, Rashard Lewis for Arenas -- if you don't blame EG for Arenas' meltdown, those are a pretty miraculous set of trades to turn garbage into playoff caliber starters when not injured)?

But those playoff caliber starters are old and often injured. So it really does matter to be able to bring in young talent in the draft, and that's where it's obvious EG has sucked, sucked, sucked.

[queridiculo]

Good question! Yeah, I think it had to be a player you signed yourself.

It could have been used on players on the roster at the time the new CBA was put into place, I think. And Nene came after that, right?

I was under the impression that you could use the amnesty clause for player contracts signed before the new CBA.

[montestewart]

Good question! Yeah, I think it had to be a player you signed yourself.

It could have been used on players on the roster at the time the new CBA was put into place, I think. And Nene came after that, right?

I was under the impression that you could use the amnesty clause for player contracts signed before the new CBA.

Yes, but they have to have been on your roster at that time, so a contract you traded for after would be ineligible. That was among criticisms of the Okariza trade (maybe the Nene trade too, can't remember).

[Nivek]

Good question! Yeah, I think it had to be a player you signed yourself.

It could have been used on players on the roster at the time the new CBA was put into place, I think. And Nene came after that, right?

I was under the impression that you could use the amnesty clause for player contracts signed before the new CBA.

Wizards already used it on Blatche.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

I didn't understand why they acquired Nene, traded Lewis for a competent big, Okafor; but then felt the need to amnesty Blatche.

If anything, they would have had depth up front by keeping Blatche.

[rockymac52]

I didn't understand why they acquired Nene, traded Lewis for a competent big, Okafor; but then felt the need to amnesty Blatche.

If anything, they would have had depth up front by keeping Blatche.

You know the answer to this. Blatche had to go. The rest of the league knew it too, so we weren't going to get anything of value for him in return (IIRC, the best we heard was rumblings of a Tyrus Thomas for Blatche swap - yuck).

But you and the rest of the fan base do have a right to be pissed that such a situation would unfold in the first place, since Blatche is clearly a somewhat talented player, and the entire situation blew up in our faces (note: not the first time this has happened to us).

[Nivek]

It's even worse when you remember that the Wizards used the amnesty provision on Blatche to get out of the bad extension they gave him BEFORE THE EXTENSION HAD EVEN BEGUN.

I do partially agree with CCJ. Once the team traded away their cap space for Okafor and Ariza, there wasn't much to gain from amnestying Blatche. I was in favor of doing it just to be done dealing with him. I didn't like giving him that extension in the first place.

[montestewart]

I didn't understand why they acquired Nene, traded Lewis for a competent big, Okafor; but then felt the need to amnesty Blatche.

If anything, they would have had depth up front by keeping Blatche.

I wasn't against them ditching Blatchemo, but they do seem to make dramatic, wholesale changes that sometimes have the appearance of panic on the heels of a long period of denial

[nate33]

I didn't understand why they acquired Nene, traded Lewis for a competent big, Okafor; but then felt the need to amnesty Blatche.

If anything, they would have had depth up front by keeping Blatche.

I ranted about this after the Okafor signing. Once we made the S&T for Okafor, we obliterated all of the cap room we would have generated by amnestying Blatche and buying out Lewis. Clearly, EG had NO PLAN WHATSOEVER going into that offseason. If he knew he was going to make the Okafor trade, then there was no reason to amnesty Blatche. We could have kept Blatche on the roster for the SAME EXACT MONEY that Ted was forced to pay him after amnestying him. There would have been no salary cap implications and no luxtax implications. But because EG had no plan at all, he amnestied Blatche first, and then haphazardly signed Okafor.

I get the argument that Blatche may have had to go for chemistry purposes, but we could have kept Blatche and buried him as the 15th man for spite if nothing else. It's better than paying him to play for the Nets. And maybe Blatche would have had a come to Jesus moment, gotten himself into decent shape, and contributed by the second half of the season.

It was an absolutely senseless waste of resources. Ted should have fired EG just for that.

[closg00]

I don't think he's a diva... I think he had plantar fasciitis, for which the only cure is to sit around doing nothing for a few months waiting for it to get better. So naturally he's out of shape and what happens when you get out of shape? You get injured.

Not necessarily his fault -- he's just old. That's EG's fault.

Nene has a problem with plantar fasciitis and Denver knew about it, hence the surprise contract dump as-soon as he was resigned. That's what appears to be likely anyway. Now it's our problem.

[payitforward]

I didn't understand why they acquired Nene, traded Lewis for a competent big, Okafor; but then felt the need to amnesty Blatche.

If anything, they would have had depth up front by keeping Blatche.

I ranted about this after the Okafor signing. Once we made the S&T for Okafor, we obliterated all of the cap room we would have generated by amnestying Blatche and buying out Lewis. Clearly, EG had NO PLAN WHATSOEVER going into that offseason. If he knew he was going to make the Okafor trade, then there was no reason to amnesty Blatche. We could have kept Blatche on the roster for the SAME EXACT MONEY that Ted was forced to pay him after amnestying him. There would have been no salary cap implications and no luxtax implications. But because EG had no plan at all, he amnestied Blatche first, and then haphazardly signed Okafor.

I get the argument that Blatche may have had to go for chemistry purposes, but we could have kept Blatche and buried him as the 15th man for spite if nothing else. It's better than paying him to play for the Nets. And maybe Blatche would have had a come to Jesus moment, gotten himself into decent shape, and contributed by the second half of the season.

It was an absolutely senseless waste of resources. Ted should have fired EG just for that.

He should have fired himself! The trade was something he wanted -- and he bragged about it. And it goes w/o saying that amnestying Blatche was primarily his decision.

[Nivek]

But because EG had no plan at all, he amnestied Blatche first, and then haphazardly signed Okafor.

You have the order of transactions wrong -- they traded for Okafor and Ariza in June (about a week before the draft), and amnestied Blatche in July (right at the deadline for using the amnesty provision). Not that the distinction makes any difference in assessing the moves. Just felt like clarifying.

[queridiculo]

It could have been used on players on the roster at the time the new CBA was put into place, I think. And Nene came after that, right?

I was under the impression that you could use the amnesty clause for player contracts signed before the new CBA.

Wizards already used it on Blatche.

I know that, I think monte was talking about a hypothetical scenario where we hadn't used it on Blatche.